Declasm's E36 328i Sport budget track / drag project
Discussion
Subject: 328i project
20/08/2010
E36 328i coupe - standard 1/4 mile 15.0, 0-60 6.4
Aim: get into the 13s (13.99 or better) on the quarter-mile but retain civilised drive and interior and stay street-legal - all on a budget!
Brief: Inspired by legendary Internet build threads like Turbotoaster's £10K, 200mph RX-7 and PEI330Ci's 330ci N/A drag/track car I would like to go under 14s on the 1/4 mile in my as yet unbought E36 328i
Turbotoaster: http://www.mazdarotaryclub.com/forums/showthread.p...
PEI330ci http://www.my335i.com/forum/showthread.php?s=270ea...
Why an E36 328i?
I love old BMWs. I have owned three E30s and an E34 540i. I love the subtle, pretty styling and the big engines. BMWs look like how my mind thinks a car should look. I also have a need for rear wheel drive - fwd to me always feels like something is missing - like some vital part of the experience is left out. I like cheap, easy to fix cars. I could have started looking for another E30 but they've doubled in price since I had my last one, also even with a supposed 170bhp my last one still only managed a 16.1s 1/4, the out of the box performance - although still sprightly on the street isn't enough to satisfy my desires. Also E30s rust. All three I've had have had rust issues. With the newest being 20 years old this is a real problem and I doubt I could find a cheap one without a rust problem.
First out let me state that I never really liked the look of the E36. I always found something incongruous about the size, shape and squared off edges - cheapening the BMW brand I always thought. Recently something clicked about it for me though. For a start, as I browsed the classifieds I realised that there were two distinct body styles - the saloon and the coupe. Also not all cars had those awful uncoordinated skirts and bumpers. In fact with the sports kit and coupe body the E36 really can be a head-turner without perhaps the confrontational, in-you-face style that can afflict kitted japs from the same period. I set in my mind the image of the car I wanted to own.
A 328i starts with 193bhp at the crank of its M52 engine with a fat torque curve to boot, but they have a secret! BMW hobbled the output of the E36 328i to keep it under a certain German tax band (although some claim it was to keep it from biting at the heels of the E36 M3?), in fact it was rated at only 1bhp more than the M50 engine in the E36 325i what this means is that with a few bolt-ons the un-tapped potential of the engine can be unleashed. In fact there are gains of up to 30 bhp to be had just from a few relatively simple mods. I'm also certain that 1 German horsepower has got more oomph than 1 Japanese horsepower so that's something I want to explore.
So to re-cap:
I used to own a twin-turbo Mazda RX-7 FD. I bought it for £4K. I spent £1200 tuning it and sold it for £5.2K. I suffered no depreciation on it but I still had over £5K locked up in that car. As bought the car ran a 14.1s 1/4 mile after the tuning I ran a 13.5s. The times are respectable but now I don't have that money floating about - I'm thinking about upsizing the house and looking after the family so car money is minimal but I like a challenge. After selling the RX-7 I allocated myself £1500 to buy another car. Straight away I thought BMW but my requirements weren't so refined - seeing myself as a grown-up Dad - why would I want to go racing again? I bought the 540i and all was well until after three months down the line I need something a little sportier, a little more connected - and a big engine on its own doesn't quite cut-it and being an auto the 540i doesn't fare too well on the 1/4 mile (as I proved to myself a couple of months ago). The plan then was to swap the 540i for something that was a midway point between the 540i and my old RX-7 and that, as described above, is an E36 328i! Now in standard form a 328i should run a 15.0 1/4 mile, with some healthy examples possibly reaching 14.6 or 14.7. I do enjoy working and modifying cars so cutting a second off the 1/4 mile time is a reasonable goal and it's similar to what I did with RX-7 before although this time around I'm going to have to be a little bit smarter and a little bit more creative because as I said, I don't have the cash to splash on this.
As I see it, getting good times on a drag strip is all about optimising 4 things:
1. The driver - launch and gearchange technique
2. Grip - the more the better
3. Weight - less weight, less work the car has to do for the same result
4. Power!
I reckon it's possible (with minimal outlay) to effect some part of each of these and hopefully cut a second off the ET overall
The plan:
Ideally my 540i would morph into a fully modded 328i but that's unlikely to happen therefore I've been planning a number of mods for when I do find myself a car.
Suspension:
Ideally I'd like to fit a set of adjustable coilovers but failing that new spings / dampers to eliminate any sagginess that will have accumulated through the years.
Also I've heard that bushes can take a pounding so polyurethane is the way to go.
Grip:
It's all about tyres but a good road / sports tyre should get me a 2.0-2.1 60' and that should be enough for the goal I have in mind but If I can find some smaller wheels with some high profile sports tyres then we're on to a winner.
LSD - replacing the standard open 2.93 diff on a 328i with a 3.15 LSD will have two effects, firstly the limited-slip will mean maximising grip on the launch. Secondly a higher ratio will mean closer gearing (approx.10%) I'm hoping however than shortening the gearing won't mean that I run out of revs at the top of 3rd coming to the end of the 1/4 - I guess we'll see.
Power:
As mentioned above, BMW strangled the 2.8 M52 engine for various reasons so with a few bolt-ons there's gains to be had.
Firstly there's the M50 (E36 325i) inlet manifold swap. This manifold flows more air so that means more potential for power higher up the rev band - there's a slight sacrifice of a few lbft of torque at low rpm due to slower air, but when drag racing, esp with a higher ratio diff we'll be keeping it buzzing. Then there's the big bore throttle body or BBTB which once again improves our air-pump (engine) with a larger throttle/butterfly. Another bolt-on would be a cold air intake which should be DIY able with a little time / patience and cold air means denser/more air.
There's more than can be done for example on the exhaust side there's back-boxes, de-cats / sports cats, headers etc. but they are going to most likely be out of budget for this project. Likewise then engine itself is tuneable with high performance cams and lightened flywheels / pulleys and fan deletes but most of this is off limits as it's diminishing returns on the money spent.
Weight:
First off this is a road car and it will still be used to occasionally to drive my wife and daughter around - also it will be driven by my wife too so it's not going to be a stripped-out track-only car. Any removal of weight is going to be carefully planned while keeping it civilised. So far, without having bought the car yet, I'm not sure how this is going to pan out.
01/09/2010
Ok so not a Herculean task but one requiring a little bit of thought and planning. First I needed insurance. Footman James have been very good to me before so I called them again. easy - wife and I are insured fully-comp from 6pm that day. Next I had to coordinate with the seller. I decided that the smoothest way to do it would be to ask him to meet me off the train in Wokingham, where he was, 15 miles from my home (another bonus was that the train ride was free as my season ticket for Brookwood got me on), then I could checkout the car in the daylight and if it was good - pop home for the money. From talking to the seller over the phone he sounded nice but maybe a bit young / chavvy but to be fair he was really nice and accomodating. He picked me up from the station and let me test drive the car on my own and look at everything including the loads of history and he was very honest about problems he'd had with the car although none were manifested on the test drive. I was convinced. I bought it and we were all done and dusted before 9pm including me driving back home in the car and picking up the cash and driving back to meet again where I got the V5. A smooth operation.
So what did I buy?
It's an August '96 P reg E36 328i Sport with BMW Individual trim.
Options:
All the sport differences
LSD (YES!)
Air-con (it works!)
No sunroof
Individual bits - Aqua paint and Champagne leather sports seats (which needs a bit of tlc!)
From Barons computer:
Limited Slip Diff (25%)
0255 Sports Steering Wheel with Airbag
0337 M Sports Pack
0428 Warning Triangle and First Aid Kit
0431 Auto-Dimming Interior Mirror
0481 Sport Seats
0498 Rear Headrests
0534 Automatic Air Conditioning
0687 Radio preparation
0704 M-Sports Suspension
0767 330i Sport
0806 3.BREMSLEUCHTE (brake lights?)
0812 GB Specification
0850 Additional Fuel for Export Vehicles
0940 BMW Individual Option
0962 Front licence plate support omitted
Also I asked about any recall work and they said:
E36 RHD steering spindle corrosion enhancement has been carried out.
Mods:
Headunit with sub amp in the boot.
AC Scnitzer gear knob (think the original is going back on!)
Strut brace
Lowering springs - not sure how low though, needs measuring?
Remus Cat-back exhaust
After market air filter
At some point the 17" BBS split rims had been sold on so now on BMW 16s with 225-50s - probably best for the ride though.
Black kidney grills and I think some of the lights are aftermarket but not sure which.
In total I have driven it approx. 20 miles on a variety of roads. and on first impressions it's seems pretty good. The ride and handling feel really confidence inspiring - the lowering springs giving a good, low sporty feel and the steering is quite quick and direct in comparison to other BMWs I have driven. The engine definitely feels torquey low down and the gearing is long. It will pull nicely from 30 to 100 in third (and I think it had the legs on a new Golf GTi who seemed to want to race me??) although I can see where it would benefit from the M50 manifold as it does feel a little strangled above 6K rpm but the aftermarket backbox sounds nice when it's there. At parking speeds the steering is a little heavy - I put that down to the altered geometry with the new springs - also the rack is a little noisy so could probably do with a fluid change. The car feels much smaller and lighter than my E34 and driving position, looking down the bonnet is spot-on.
In terms of finding a better car to match my requirements - especially for the price I paid I think I'd have a pretty hard job. This one ticks all the boxes I set out for myself - first track outing at the new Silverstone will tell me whether there are any immediate jobs but for now I just want to drive it for a while as it is maybe give it a wash and tidy up. 13s qtrs here we come!
08/09/2010
In advance I checked the car over as best I could - fluid levels, brake discs / pads and general listening out for any tell-tale signs that the car might not be up to the job as it was still very much and unknown quantity. Nothing was setting any alarm bells ringing I even found an empty bit of NSL road to test the LSD lockup and reassuringly all was good
I managed to get my insurance company to fax (fax!) me my insurance cerificate so that I could tax the car for the drive up on Sunday and on Friday it was all road legal and ready to go. So 6:45 on Sunday I jump in the car, pick up my mate Nick and off we go up the motorway to Silverstone! 90 miles later we're there and now I'm thinking maybe I bought an alright car after all!
So this is now my 6th track drive but it's still new enough to me that I'm completely wired with adrenaline but I focus enough to make sure I absorb the driver's briefing and remind myself it's not a race and it's much better to remain in one piece than to push my limits and break the car!
Down in the pitlane in the minutes before we start I wandered up and down to have a chat to my fellow drivers. It seems the organisers had done a reasonable job of making sure the cars were quite well matched - the only anomaly being the 680bhp Evo which snuck in to join us. It was a pretty large group too so a bit of traffic to avoid but hopefully we'd spread out over the 3.5 mile track. Everyone I talked to was friendly and that set the tone for the track session.
Soon enough we were in the car and setting off. From here I'll let the video explain how it went (Filmed by my mate Nick on his first trackday experience, doing a lot of the commentary):
part 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rsjAFI8W7Pw
part 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8lsVXDVTpAA
As you can see - we survived! Sounds good too doesn't it? We even got an extra lap at the end because we followed the two cars in front who neglected to turn into the pits after the chequered flag. It was drizzling during the session but the track was dry. (The window steaming up at the end was because I was getting too hot!)
I managed to keep my head throughout and don't think I did anything silly. I kept on the safe side of grip and had a hugely rewarding drive.
So what about the car? I was very wary of my cold tyres at the start but after 3 minutes they seemed to be doing what they should. brakes needed a little warming too - I think the previous owner did mention something about uprated (greenstuff?) pads so they were effective for the majority of the drive, fading a little in the last two laps. An oddity was the clutch though - try as I might there was just no chance of hurrying it and there was a distinct clutchy smell going on when we pulled in at the end of the drive. I have since uncovered the reason however. BMW in their infinite wisdom decided that end-users couldn't modulate their clutch engagement smoothly enough so introduced a restriction into the hydraulic clutch line to slip the clutch at the same speed no matter how fast you lift your foot off the pedal. This is the infamous CDV or Clutch Delay Valve. My next mod will be to remove the CDV completely as it bothers me. alot.
I was really pleased and felt quite vindicated in my car choice when we parked up and went off to enjoy the rest of the show.
The drive home showed-up no new problems either (as we cruised in climate-controlled luxury) so all in all a success! Even the fuel economy was pretty good - I think I used approx. 1/4 of a tank during the track session but for the £50 I put in I got over 250 miles out. I would imagine that without a track session this could be well over 300 - massively more efficient than my 540i.
So how does this affect my plan? Obviously I'm eager to change a few bits and pieces in preparation for the next track outing (most likely North Weald in November) but I'm torn as this is very much a budget project. I do think I need a couple of rear tyres (Kumhos from Camskill http://www.camskill.co.uk/products.php?plid=m62b0s... as they're skirting around the legal limits and I'd love to add some larger vented / grooved brake discs ( http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&am... and braided brake hoses ( http://www.brake-lines.co.uk/bmw-3-series-e36-328i... to sure-up the feel. Other than that as I said it's got to be the CDV removal. I'm not in a hurry to tune up the engine as I'd like to get a baseline drag time and maybe a dyno run before I make any changes there. I am definitely interested in some budget coilovers and top mounts as although the lowering springs on standard bilsteins felt really great on the track I want something adjustable and this feels like a stop-gap solution. I'm not really too fussed about losing weight from the car - my mate Nick added approx. 100kg of ballast around Silverstone and to be honest I couldn't tell much difference to acceleration compared to just me in the car - I like the comfy seats and sound deadening! The amplifier in the boot is crying out for a sub so if I can find a cheap secondhand one I will (anyone?)!
20/08/2010
E36 328i coupe - standard 1/4 mile 15.0, 0-60 6.4
Aim: get into the 13s (13.99 or better) on the quarter-mile but retain civilised drive and interior and stay street-legal - all on a budget!
Brief: Inspired by legendary Internet build threads like Turbotoaster's £10K, 200mph RX-7 and PEI330Ci's 330ci N/A drag/track car I would like to go under 14s on the 1/4 mile in my as yet unbought E36 328i
Turbotoaster: http://www.mazdarotaryclub.com/forums/showthread.p...
PEI330ci http://www.my335i.com/forum/showthread.php?s=270ea...
Why an E36 328i?
I love old BMWs. I have owned three E30s and an E34 540i. I love the subtle, pretty styling and the big engines. BMWs look like how my mind thinks a car should look. I also have a need for rear wheel drive - fwd to me always feels like something is missing - like some vital part of the experience is left out. I like cheap, easy to fix cars. I could have started looking for another E30 but they've doubled in price since I had my last one, also even with a supposed 170bhp my last one still only managed a 16.1s 1/4, the out of the box performance - although still sprightly on the street isn't enough to satisfy my desires. Also E30s rust. All three I've had have had rust issues. With the newest being 20 years old this is a real problem and I doubt I could find a cheap one without a rust problem.
First out let me state that I never really liked the look of the E36. I always found something incongruous about the size, shape and squared off edges - cheapening the BMW brand I always thought. Recently something clicked about it for me though. For a start, as I browsed the classifieds I realised that there were two distinct body styles - the saloon and the coupe. Also not all cars had those awful uncoordinated skirts and bumpers. In fact with the sports kit and coupe body the E36 really can be a head-turner without perhaps the confrontational, in-you-face style that can afflict kitted japs from the same period. I set in my mind the image of the car I wanted to own.
A 328i starts with 193bhp at the crank of its M52 engine with a fat torque curve to boot, but they have a secret! BMW hobbled the output of the E36 328i to keep it under a certain German tax band (although some claim it was to keep it from biting at the heels of the E36 M3?), in fact it was rated at only 1bhp more than the M50 engine in the E36 325i what this means is that with a few bolt-ons the un-tapped potential of the engine can be unleashed. In fact there are gains of up to 30 bhp to be had just from a few relatively simple mods. I'm also certain that 1 German horsepower has got more oomph than 1 Japanese horsepower so that's something I want to explore.
So to re-cap:
- cheap (buy/own/modify/fix)
- RWD
- not too old (and not too new that I can't work in it myself)
- A bit of power out of the box
- Not too bad to look at!
I used to own a twin-turbo Mazda RX-7 FD. I bought it for £4K. I spent £1200 tuning it and sold it for £5.2K. I suffered no depreciation on it but I still had over £5K locked up in that car. As bought the car ran a 14.1s 1/4 mile after the tuning I ran a 13.5s. The times are respectable but now I don't have that money floating about - I'm thinking about upsizing the house and looking after the family so car money is minimal but I like a challenge. After selling the RX-7 I allocated myself £1500 to buy another car. Straight away I thought BMW but my requirements weren't so refined - seeing myself as a grown-up Dad - why would I want to go racing again? I bought the 540i and all was well until after three months down the line I need something a little sportier, a little more connected - and a big engine on its own doesn't quite cut-it and being an auto the 540i doesn't fare too well on the 1/4 mile (as I proved to myself a couple of months ago). The plan then was to swap the 540i for something that was a midway point between the 540i and my old RX-7 and that, as described above, is an E36 328i! Now in standard form a 328i should run a 15.0 1/4 mile, with some healthy examples possibly reaching 14.6 or 14.7. I do enjoy working and modifying cars so cutting a second off the 1/4 mile time is a reasonable goal and it's similar to what I did with RX-7 before although this time around I'm going to have to be a little bit smarter and a little bit more creative because as I said, I don't have the cash to splash on this.
As I see it, getting good times on a drag strip is all about optimising 4 things:
1. The driver - launch and gearchange technique
2. Grip - the more the better
3. Weight - less weight, less work the car has to do for the same result
4. Power!
I reckon it's possible (with minimal outlay) to effect some part of each of these and hopefully cut a second off the ET overall
The plan:
Ideally my 540i would morph into a fully modded 328i but that's unlikely to happen therefore I've been planning a number of mods for when I do find myself a car.
Suspension:
Ideally I'd like to fit a set of adjustable coilovers but failing that new spings / dampers to eliminate any sagginess that will have accumulated through the years.
Also I've heard that bushes can take a pounding so polyurethane is the way to go.
Grip:
It's all about tyres but a good road / sports tyre should get me a 2.0-2.1 60' and that should be enough for the goal I have in mind but If I can find some smaller wheels with some high profile sports tyres then we're on to a winner.
LSD - replacing the standard open 2.93 diff on a 328i with a 3.15 LSD will have two effects, firstly the limited-slip will mean maximising grip on the launch. Secondly a higher ratio will mean closer gearing (approx.10%) I'm hoping however than shortening the gearing won't mean that I run out of revs at the top of 3rd coming to the end of the 1/4 - I guess we'll see.
Power:
As mentioned above, BMW strangled the 2.8 M52 engine for various reasons so with a few bolt-ons there's gains to be had.
Firstly there's the M50 (E36 325i) inlet manifold swap. This manifold flows more air so that means more potential for power higher up the rev band - there's a slight sacrifice of a few lbft of torque at low rpm due to slower air, but when drag racing, esp with a higher ratio diff we'll be keeping it buzzing. Then there's the big bore throttle body or BBTB which once again improves our air-pump (engine) with a larger throttle/butterfly. Another bolt-on would be a cold air intake which should be DIY able with a little time / patience and cold air means denser/more air.
There's more than can be done for example on the exhaust side there's back-boxes, de-cats / sports cats, headers etc. but they are going to most likely be out of budget for this project. Likewise then engine itself is tuneable with high performance cams and lightened flywheels / pulleys and fan deletes but most of this is off limits as it's diminishing returns on the money spent.
Weight:
First off this is a road car and it will still be used to occasionally to drive my wife and daughter around - also it will be driven by my wife too so it's not going to be a stripped-out track-only car. Any removal of weight is going to be carefully planned while keeping it civilised. So far, without having bought the car yet, I'm not sure how this is going to pan out.
01/09/2010
- update*
Ok so not a Herculean task but one requiring a little bit of thought and planning. First I needed insurance. Footman James have been very good to me before so I called them again. easy - wife and I are insured fully-comp from 6pm that day. Next I had to coordinate with the seller. I decided that the smoothest way to do it would be to ask him to meet me off the train in Wokingham, where he was, 15 miles from my home (another bonus was that the train ride was free as my season ticket for Brookwood got me on), then I could checkout the car in the daylight and if it was good - pop home for the money. From talking to the seller over the phone he sounded nice but maybe a bit young / chavvy but to be fair he was really nice and accomodating. He picked me up from the station and let me test drive the car on my own and look at everything including the loads of history and he was very honest about problems he'd had with the car although none were manifested on the test drive. I was convinced. I bought it and we were all done and dusted before 9pm including me driving back home in the car and picking up the cash and driving back to meet again where I got the V5. A smooth operation.
So what did I buy?
It's an August '96 P reg E36 328i Sport with BMW Individual trim.
Options:
All the sport differences
LSD (YES!)
Air-con (it works!)
No sunroof
Individual bits - Aqua paint and Champagne leather sports seats (which needs a bit of tlc!)
From Barons computer:
Limited Slip Diff (25%)
0255 Sports Steering Wheel with Airbag
0337 M Sports Pack
0428 Warning Triangle and First Aid Kit
0431 Auto-Dimming Interior Mirror
0481 Sport Seats
0498 Rear Headrests
0534 Automatic Air Conditioning
0687 Radio preparation
0704 M-Sports Suspension
0767 330i Sport
0806 3.BREMSLEUCHTE (brake lights?)
0812 GB Specification
0850 Additional Fuel for Export Vehicles
0940 BMW Individual Option
0962 Front licence plate support omitted
Also I asked about any recall work and they said:
E36 RHD steering spindle corrosion enhancement has been carried out.
Mods:
Headunit with sub amp in the boot.
AC Scnitzer gear knob (think the original is going back on!)
Strut brace
Lowering springs - not sure how low though, needs measuring?
Remus Cat-back exhaust
After market air filter
At some point the 17" BBS split rims had been sold on so now on BMW 16s with 225-50s - probably best for the ride though.
Black kidney grills and I think some of the lights are aftermarket but not sure which.
In total I have driven it approx. 20 miles on a variety of roads. and on first impressions it's seems pretty good. The ride and handling feel really confidence inspiring - the lowering springs giving a good, low sporty feel and the steering is quite quick and direct in comparison to other BMWs I have driven. The engine definitely feels torquey low down and the gearing is long. It will pull nicely from 30 to 100 in third (and I think it had the legs on a new Golf GTi who seemed to want to race me??) although I can see where it would benefit from the M50 manifold as it does feel a little strangled above 6K rpm but the aftermarket backbox sounds nice when it's there. At parking speeds the steering is a little heavy - I put that down to the altered geometry with the new springs - also the rack is a little noisy so could probably do with a fluid change. The car feels much smaller and lighter than my E34 and driving position, looking down the bonnet is spot-on.
In terms of finding a better car to match my requirements - especially for the price I paid I think I'd have a pretty hard job. This one ticks all the boxes I set out for myself - first track outing at the new Silverstone will tell me whether there are any immediate jobs but for now I just want to drive it for a while as it is maybe give it a wash and tidy up. 13s qtrs here we come!
08/09/2010
- update*
In advance I checked the car over as best I could - fluid levels, brake discs / pads and general listening out for any tell-tale signs that the car might not be up to the job as it was still very much and unknown quantity. Nothing was setting any alarm bells ringing I even found an empty bit of NSL road to test the LSD lockup and reassuringly all was good
I managed to get my insurance company to fax (fax!) me my insurance cerificate so that I could tax the car for the drive up on Sunday and on Friday it was all road legal and ready to go. So 6:45 on Sunday I jump in the car, pick up my mate Nick and off we go up the motorway to Silverstone! 90 miles later we're there and now I'm thinking maybe I bought an alright car after all!So this is now my 6th track drive but it's still new enough to me that I'm completely wired with adrenaline but I focus enough to make sure I absorb the driver's briefing and remind myself it's not a race and it's much better to remain in one piece than to push my limits and break the car!
Down in the pitlane in the minutes before we start I wandered up and down to have a chat to my fellow drivers. It seems the organisers had done a reasonable job of making sure the cars were quite well matched - the only anomaly being the 680bhp Evo which snuck in to join us. It was a pretty large group too so a bit of traffic to avoid but hopefully we'd spread out over the 3.5 mile track. Everyone I talked to was friendly and that set the tone for the track session.
Soon enough we were in the car and setting off. From here I'll let the video explain how it went (Filmed by my mate Nick on his first trackday experience, doing a lot of the commentary):
part 1 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rsjAFI8W7Pw
part 2 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8lsVXDVTpAA
As you can see - we survived! Sounds good too doesn't it? We even got an extra lap at the end because we followed the two cars in front who neglected to turn into the pits after the chequered flag. It was drizzling during the session but the track was dry. (The window steaming up at the end was because I was getting too hot!)
I managed to keep my head throughout and don't think I did anything silly. I kept on the safe side of grip and had a hugely rewarding drive.
So what about the car? I was very wary of my cold tyres at the start but after 3 minutes they seemed to be doing what they should. brakes needed a little warming too - I think the previous owner did mention something about uprated (greenstuff?) pads so they were effective for the majority of the drive, fading a little in the last two laps. An oddity was the clutch though - try as I might there was just no chance of hurrying it and there was a distinct clutchy smell going on when we pulled in at the end of the drive. I have since uncovered the reason however. BMW in their infinite wisdom decided that end-users couldn't modulate their clutch engagement smoothly enough so introduced a restriction into the hydraulic clutch line to slip the clutch at the same speed no matter how fast you lift your foot off the pedal. This is the infamous CDV or Clutch Delay Valve. My next mod will be to remove the CDV completely as it bothers me. alot.
I was really pleased and felt quite vindicated in my car choice when we parked up and went off to enjoy the rest of the show.
The drive home showed-up no new problems either (as we cruised in climate-controlled luxury) so all in all a success! Even the fuel economy was pretty good - I think I used approx. 1/4 of a tank during the track session but for the £50 I put in I got over 250 miles out. I would imagine that without a track session this could be well over 300 - massively more efficient than my 540i.
So how does this affect my plan? Obviously I'm eager to change a few bits and pieces in preparation for the next track outing (most likely North Weald in November) but I'm torn as this is very much a budget project. I do think I need a couple of rear tyres (Kumhos from Camskill http://www.camskill.co.uk/products.php?plid=m62b0s... as they're skirting around the legal limits and I'd love to add some larger vented / grooved brake discs ( http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&am... and braided brake hoses ( http://www.brake-lines.co.uk/bmw-3-series-e36-328i... to sure-up the feel. Other than that as I said it's got to be the CDV removal. I'm not in a hurry to tune up the engine as I'd like to get a baseline drag time and maybe a dyno run before I make any changes there. I am definitely interested in some budget coilovers and top mounts as although the lowering springs on standard bilsteins felt really great on the track I want something adjustable and this feels like a stop-gap solution. I'm not really too fussed about losing weight from the car - my mate Nick added approx. 100kg of ballast around Silverstone and to be honest I couldn't tell much difference to acceleration compared to just me in the car - I like the comfy seats and sound deadening! The amplifier in the boot is crying out for a sub so if I can find a cheap secondhand one I will (anyone?)!
Hi, I was out on the same Track session as your self last Sunday and enjoyed the experience of Silverstone also!
There was a fair few BMW's out on track iirc, some quicker than others.
I was in a Toyota Celica st165 GT-Four (Red)having only done a 15 min session at Castle combe and an afternoon at Brands last year, silverstone is quite daunting imo.
The lack of regulated noise limit suited my car, although i think they measure sound around the track?
Look forward to seeing how your car progesses....
There was a fair few BMW's out on track iirc, some quicker than others.
I was in a Toyota Celica st165 GT-Four (Red)having only done a 15 min session at Castle combe and an afternoon at Brands last year, silverstone is quite daunting imo.
The lack of regulated noise limit suited my car, although i think they measure sound around the track?
Look forward to seeing how your car progesses....
**BETSY** said:
Hi, I was out on the same Track session as your self last Sunday and enjoyed the experience of Silverstone also!
There was a fair few BMW's out on track iirc, some quicker than others.
I was in a Toyota Celica st165 GT-Four (Red)having only done a 15 min session at Castle combe and an afternoon at Brands last year, silverstone is quite daunting imo.
The lack of regulated noise limit suited my car, although i think they measure sound around the track?
Look forward to seeing how your car progesses....
Yeah - I saw your video on YouTube too - the stills in my writeup are screenshots from it!There was a fair few BMW's out on track iirc, some quicker than others.
I was in a Toyota Celica st165 GT-Four (Red)having only done a 15 min session at Castle combe and an afternoon at Brands last year, silverstone is quite daunting imo.
The lack of regulated noise limit suited my car, although i think they measure sound around the track?
Look forward to seeing how your car progesses....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=juS5IA2zhQg
(hope you don't mind me linking!)
A friend of mine on Facebook recognised your car from the forums as he used to have an st165 too.
I really enjoyed Silverstone. I found my car relatively easy to drive there and much less of a handful than my old RX-7. Yes I was one of quite a few BMWs - There was a Yellow E36 M3, what appeared to be a very slow E36 316i, an Alpina B10 3.2 who was far slower than I expected and couple of quick and daring stripped out E30s - one was a touring!
Edited by declasm on Thursday 9th September 09:17
13/09/2010
A couple of things to report from this weekend. Firstly due to a process of elimination the 328i was drawn into service this weekend as family transport for a 300 mile round-trip to Staffordshire. It was my wife's third choice after the fiesta (blocked in) and the 540i (broken windscreen wiper in the rain). I had driven the car to Silverstone the previous week and it was fine but one thing I really didn't expect was such fantastic fuel economy on this trip - after the RX-7 and 540i this was a real shock to me. After covering more than 300 miles, starting with a full tank I still had over 1/3 left whereas my other cars would each have cost £20 more to fill and be running on fumes after 300 miles! How far do other E36 328i owners get from a full tank?
The second thing to report is my first modification to the car. When I got my 328i the other week it drove fine but the clutch feel was a bit 'off' - fine when pulling away gently but it wouldn't be hurried and this was particularly evident on Silverstone where it almost seemed the clutch was slipping on some quick upchanges.
Anyway I did a bit of research and found out that BMW built a restrictor into the hydraulic clutch lines to slow the flow of fluid to prevent quick engagement of the clutch (they didn't trust their customers to be able to pull away quickly / not stall the car!).
I saw a few DIY guides online and decided to have a go this weekend - the only free time I had was the hour before it got dark last night but it was very useful to have my neighbour give me a hand (he's an Aston Martin engine builder / mechanic who works as part of a GT3 team)
me on the right, competent mechanic Andy on the left
I basically did this:
http://www.bimmerforums.co.uk/forum/f3/e46-clutch-...
-although it says it's an E46 DIY guide it's *exactly* the same on the E36. I clamped the line to the slave cylinder, undid the connectors and removed the restrictor (also known as the clutch delay valve or CDV) then connected the hose back up and with the help of my local race mechanic Andy, bled the system.
I ended up with this bit removed:
In fact the hardest part was finding an appropriate tool to turn the bleed nipple on the slave cylinder when we bled the system afterwards!
I went for a quick test-drive afterwards and the clutch engagement is much more positive now and feels more like my previous hydraulic clutch cars (and it will be way better for drag / track driving too!). If you have a modern manual BMW (E36, E46, E39 and Z and M cars) I urge you to do this mod straight away so you can see what you've been missing
This was my first go at any DIY on a hydraulic system and has given me confidence for when I upgrade the brakes / braided brake lines when funds allow.
A couple of things to report from this weekend. Firstly due to a process of elimination the 328i was drawn into service this weekend as family transport for a 300 mile round-trip to Staffordshire. It was my wife's third choice after the fiesta (blocked in) and the 540i (broken windscreen wiper in the rain). I had driven the car to Silverstone the previous week and it was fine but one thing I really didn't expect was such fantastic fuel economy on this trip - after the RX-7 and 540i this was a real shock to me. After covering more than 300 miles, starting with a full tank I still had over 1/3 left whereas my other cars would each have cost £20 more to fill and be running on fumes after 300 miles! How far do other E36 328i owners get from a full tank?
The second thing to report is my first modification to the car. When I got my 328i the other week it drove fine but the clutch feel was a bit 'off' - fine when pulling away gently but it wouldn't be hurried and this was particularly evident on Silverstone where it almost seemed the clutch was slipping on some quick upchanges.
Anyway I did a bit of research and found out that BMW built a restrictor into the hydraulic clutch lines to slow the flow of fluid to prevent quick engagement of the clutch (they didn't trust their customers to be able to pull away quickly / not stall the car!).
I saw a few DIY guides online and decided to have a go this weekend - the only free time I had was the hour before it got dark last night but it was very useful to have my neighbour give me a hand (he's an Aston Martin engine builder / mechanic who works as part of a GT3 team)
me on the right, competent mechanic Andy on the left
I basically did this:
http://www.bimmerforums.co.uk/forum/f3/e46-clutch-...
-although it says it's an E46 DIY guide it's *exactly* the same on the E36. I clamped the line to the slave cylinder, undid the connectors and removed the restrictor (also known as the clutch delay valve or CDV) then connected the hose back up and with the help of my local race mechanic Andy, bled the system.
I ended up with this bit removed:
In fact the hardest part was finding an appropriate tool to turn the bleed nipple on the slave cylinder when we bled the system afterwards!
I went for a quick test-drive afterwards and the clutch engagement is much more positive now and feels more like my previous hydraulic clutch cars (and it will be way better for drag / track driving too!). If you have a modern manual BMW (E36, E46, E39 and Z and M cars) I urge you to do this mod straight away so you can see what you've been missing
This was my first go at any DIY on a hydraulic system and has given me confidence for when I upgrade the brakes / braided brake lines when funds allow.
Sharkbite73 said:
Hey buddy I got to admit you have me looking at BMWs now. Saw a nice 540 V8 for 1400, but I'm going to finish of my Prelude first :
Haha - I'll turn you round to RWD eventually! Have a look on Youtube - lots of inspirational BMWs there - this is a particular favourite:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJB8BtkSEHM
Did you see a manual 540i for £1400? that's pretty good - even better if it has the 6 speed box and LSD
From my recent experience tho the 5-series feels a lot less sporty than than the 3-series.Before I bought this E36 I wrote a couple of threads asking people to help me decide which model would suit me best:
http://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?h=0&a...
and the same with some slightly different view on Bimmerforums:
http://www.bimmerforums.co.uk/forum/f74/which-old-...
Go on get one - You know you want to!
Driving 1.5 miles to the supermarket -
Over a bump: *CLONK*
Turning right: *CLONK* *CLONK* *CLONK*
Hmmm. Well maybe the honeymoon is over? I started hearing mysterious noises from the driver's side front suspension. My first thoughts were: top-mount / droplinks?
Sunday afternoon I took the car over to Sharkbite's and we took the wheel off and had a look. We shook the wheel, wiggled the bushes, jacked and ramped things up but all was pretty tight with no apparent movement that could be responsible for such an audible clonk...until I look at the top of the spring and realise that it has completely disconnected itself from seat and the noise is it occasionally pinging against the top-mount / seat and bodywork! Cue an hour and a half of swearing / yanking and levering to get it back in position although perhaps the cheap lowering springs the car is currently sat on should probably replaced with some coilovers sooner rather than later to stop it happening again!
Over a bump: *CLONK*
Turning right: *CLONK* *CLONK* *CLONK*
Hmmm. Well maybe the honeymoon is over? I started hearing mysterious noises from the driver's side front suspension. My first thoughts were: top-mount / droplinks?
Sunday afternoon I took the car over to Sharkbite's and we took the wheel off and had a look. We shook the wheel, wiggled the bushes, jacked and ramped things up but all was pretty tight with no apparent movement that could be responsible for such an audible clonk...until I look at the top of the spring and realise that it has completely disconnected itself from seat and the noise is it occasionally pinging against the top-mount / seat and bodywork! Cue an hour and a half of swearing / yanking and levering to get it back in position although perhaps the cheap lowering springs the car is currently sat on should probably replaced with some coilovers sooner rather than later to stop it happening again!
Part of the process to improve my car is to de-chav and remove some of the previous owner's additions. First up was swapping the gearnob - the original was an unsightly thing with "AC Schnitzer Short Shift" enscribed across it (pretty sure the nob and linkage are no such thing) I replaced it with the spare that came with the car - a chrome-plastic MSport thing which is a slight improvement (considering it's still far too bling) one day I'll find something a little more conservative. I still have to swap the plastic-chrome door-pins for the originals but I'm trying to work out an effective way to secure them first. A new gear-gaiter is on the list for eventual replacement too. The one thing that really stuck out on the dash was the stereo. A disgusting mid-90's panasonic effort - CD with no MP3 and no AUX in and the worst interface I've ever used. the sound was poor and difficult to adjust and it had this really tacky, extra tinny, built-in, fold-out speaker. I was quickly onto ebay and I replaced it with this:
Panasonic CQ-C1465N MP3/CD player - much newer, much better and only £18! (Did I mention this was a budget project?)
After my 'dislocated spring' incident the hunt for replacement suspension heated up. I scoured ebay and the forums for something suitable. quite unbelievably it's possible to buy height adjustable, coilover suspension for the E36 for under £200! I didn't want to go with Jamex or Hottuning as they seemed a bit too budget but I found that Venom Motorsport sell FK suspension kits (hopefully good quality, German TUV approved) for ridiculously low prices. I bought the FK AK Street kit for £191 all-in. There was one disadvantage to the 'too good to be true' deal - they took over a month to ship
unfortunately that meant that I didn't have them fitted for my North Weald activity day on Friday but sometime soon and then I'll see what the quality is like (they look good in the box...)
So on Friday it was my first time taking the BMW to North Weald airfield for an activity day. I knew what was in store for me having done one back in March when I still had my RX-7. It meant an early start so my co-driver Chris agreed to get to mine for 7:00 in order to get half-way round the M25 before 9:00. It was devilishly cold and all the prep I did to the car was scraping the ice off before driving away! Part of my plan for the day was to convince Chris or the benefits of rwd (he's been a Citroen driver for a while).
We arrived at 8:45 and the airfield was deserted - I started to worry that the day had been cancelled due to the weather or if I'd got the wrong day! A little after 9:00. Andy Walsh arrived in his Subaru and slowly the rest of the attendees turned up. It was so cold I almost couldn't sign my name on the indemnity form.
As with my previous trip to North Weald, the first activity was the 'high speed bend' - basically launching the car down a 1/4 mile of access road through the equivalent of a 10ft gate, resisting the urge to brake and then steering hard left at the end and keeping the car from rolling / spinning / falling-apart! I bottled my first run and managed mid-fifties, I gripped the wheel too hard on the second run and nearly held the drift before the back-end swung back the other way sending us into a smoky spin. I took it easier and gentler on the 3rd run and got into the 60s and then for my 4th and final go I hit the magic 70mph - putting me third on the list behind the Noble (76mph) and the mk3 MR2 (74mph). I was very pleased (especially having beaten the E46 330i and M3!)
Next up was the short sprint circuit. I remembered this one well from my time with the RX-7. I quickly learnt that two cars differ greatly in terms of handling on the a tight sprint course - where the RX-7 would oversteer at will, the big, heavy lump at the front of the BMW means much more neutral handling and a tendency to understeer until a little lock is wound off and the weight is in the right place. The timing lady kept giving me good advice and times toppled from 58s to 55s after a few runs. This was better than I managed in the slidey RX-7 last time where my best had been only a 57.
In-car 56s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_vdow5rNUY
Outside car 55s run!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dn-FUk_AXXE
After that it was time for lunch and after getting a little lost we got to the pub and talked moustaches and Alpine adventures (neither were mine!) and saw the campest man in the world (you'll know the one if you've been to that pub)! Soon after we were back at the airfield and onto the 2nd sprint course. I didn't get too many goes at this one but I enjoyed it a lot, getting some lovely opposite-lock slides in so next time I expect I'll try to spend the morning session on this one. after a couple of runs my engine started ticking but Andy Walsh was quick to diagnose a lack of oil (remember how I didn't prep the car in the morning?) 1/2 a litre added and the ticking soon cleared. I managed a 1:10 but there was a lot more to be had - watching some of the others on this course was a pleasure too as the Noble and Porsche Turbo were both awesome.
Finally activity for the day was the longer sprint circuit (basically a combination of the high-speed bend and two shorter circuits) I think I was in the zone for this one and after three runs I netted a best time of 1:19 - putting me above some more powerful cars in the list and 1s better than I did in March. I decided to quit while I was ahead and take some photos and watch the other cars (and before I broke something!).
All in all the car performed brilliantly, I've learnt its limits in a safe fun environment. tyre wear was minimal and my friend Chris is now shopping for an E36 328i Sport too.
Panasonic CQ-C1465N MP3/CD player - much newer, much better and only £18! (Did I mention this was a budget project?)
After my 'dislocated spring' incident the hunt for replacement suspension heated up. I scoured ebay and the forums for something suitable. quite unbelievably it's possible to buy height adjustable, coilover suspension for the E36 for under £200! I didn't want to go with Jamex or Hottuning as they seemed a bit too budget but I found that Venom Motorsport sell FK suspension kits (hopefully good quality, German TUV approved) for ridiculously low prices. I bought the FK AK Street kit for £191 all-in. There was one disadvantage to the 'too good to be true' deal - they took over a month to ship
unfortunately that meant that I didn't have them fitted for my North Weald activity day on Friday but sometime soon and then I'll see what the quality is like (they look good in the box...)So on Friday it was my first time taking the BMW to North Weald airfield for an activity day. I knew what was in store for me having done one back in March when I still had my RX-7. It meant an early start so my co-driver Chris agreed to get to mine for 7:00 in order to get half-way round the M25 before 9:00. It was devilishly cold and all the prep I did to the car was scraping the ice off before driving away! Part of my plan for the day was to convince Chris or the benefits of rwd (he's been a Citroen driver for a while).
We arrived at 8:45 and the airfield was deserted - I started to worry that the day had been cancelled due to the weather or if I'd got the wrong day! A little after 9:00. Andy Walsh arrived in his Subaru and slowly the rest of the attendees turned up. It was so cold I almost couldn't sign my name on the indemnity form.
As with my previous trip to North Weald, the first activity was the 'high speed bend' - basically launching the car down a 1/4 mile of access road through the equivalent of a 10ft gate, resisting the urge to brake and then steering hard left at the end and keeping the car from rolling / spinning / falling-apart! I bottled my first run and managed mid-fifties, I gripped the wheel too hard on the second run and nearly held the drift before the back-end swung back the other way sending us into a smoky spin. I took it easier and gentler on the 3rd run and got into the 60s and then for my 4th and final go I hit the magic 70mph - putting me third on the list behind the Noble (76mph) and the mk3 MR2 (74mph). I was very pleased (especially having beaten the E46 330i and M3!)
Next up was the short sprint circuit. I remembered this one well from my time with the RX-7. I quickly learnt that two cars differ greatly in terms of handling on the a tight sprint course - where the RX-7 would oversteer at will, the big, heavy lump at the front of the BMW means much more neutral handling and a tendency to understeer until a little lock is wound off and the weight is in the right place. The timing lady kept giving me good advice and times toppled from 58s to 55s after a few runs. This was better than I managed in the slidey RX-7 last time where my best had been only a 57.
In-car 56s
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o_vdow5rNUY
Outside car 55s run!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dn-FUk_AXXE
After that it was time for lunch and after getting a little lost we got to the pub and talked moustaches and Alpine adventures (neither were mine!) and saw the campest man in the world (you'll know the one if you've been to that pub)! Soon after we were back at the airfield and onto the 2nd sprint course. I didn't get too many goes at this one but I enjoyed it a lot, getting some lovely opposite-lock slides in so next time I expect I'll try to spend the morning session on this one. after a couple of runs my engine started ticking but Andy Walsh was quick to diagnose a lack of oil (remember how I didn't prep the car in the morning?) 1/2 a litre added and the ticking soon cleared. I managed a 1:10 but there was a lot more to be had - watching some of the others on this course was a pleasure too as the Noble and Porsche Turbo were both awesome.
Finally activity for the day was the longer sprint circuit (basically a combination of the high-speed bend and two shorter circuits) I think I was in the zone for this one and after three runs I netted a best time of 1:19 - putting me above some more powerful cars in the list and 1s better than I did in March. I decided to quit while I was ahead and take some photos and watch the other cars (and before I broke something!).
All in all the car performed brilliantly, I've learnt its limits in a safe fun environment. tyre wear was minimal and my friend Chris is now shopping for an E36 328i Sport too.
disco!!!! said:
Renn Sport said:
I was also thinking about an LSD but don't want to lose the lower rpm cruising speed.
you wont the early 328 sports came with an lsd as standard and they have the same ratio as the normal 328 diff
declasm said:
disco!!!! said:
Renn Sport said:
I was also thinking about an LSD but don't want to lose the lower rpm cruising speed.
you wont the early 328 sports came with an lsd as standard and they have the same ratio as the normal 328 diff
I have yet to come across a early 328 LSD on ebay and the M3 versions are retailing around the £300 mark. So its an added expense.
I really like this thread and the whole ethos of building a cost effective track machine.
How do you rate the suspension set up you went for? Price vs quality? Is the suspension unduly harsh?
How is the body roll? Did you upgrade the roll bars? I saw some Eibach jobs on eBay which seem to be a good quality set up.
Renn Sport said:
How do you rate the suspension set up you went for? Price vs quality? Is the suspension unduly harsh?
How is the body roll? Did you upgrade the roll bars? I saw some Eibach jobs on eBay which seem to be a good quality set up.
Thanks for your comments! I haven't yet fitted the FK suspension kit but when I do I'll do a write-up of the fitting and then review the effect it has on feel and handling.How is the body roll? Did you upgrade the roll bars? I saw some Eibach jobs on eBay which seem to be a good quality set up.
So far for both Silverstone and North Weald I have run the car on the suspension it came with when I bought it - cheap lowering springs from GSF (Boge apparently) and an aftermarket front strut-brace as the only modifications
I have to say I have been really impressed with the handling - definitely more understeer than my old RX-7 (to be expected) but very feelsome. body roll isn't bad but could always do with less (see picture below)Ride is currently very good. I am really looking forward to comparing the FK suspension setup to the current one.
Hello all, long time no post!
As with all good things, time with this car is soon to come to an end as I've put her up for sale! I'm probably going to resist selling for quite some time however as currently the 328 is our only car and having air-con is a great boon with the summer months looming and spring currently being particularly warm!
Some new pics in the ad too
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2744701.htm
So what's been going on with the car?
Ice and snow over the winter + LSD = super low speed drifting fun!
At the end of February tax and MOT ran out and the car sat lonely on the drive while I considered options. The option I eventually went with (time, money and family permitting) was to get hold of some bigger wheels, get the coilover suspension fitted and put the car in for MOT.
Car passed MOT once after a few fixes - it needed one new rear top-mount and seal replaced on the power steering.
We then sold our other car and have been using this as the everyday car which even with the new suspension is a joy! We took it on a family holiday down to Devon covering 400 miles and the car was a pleasure to drive, I've even got my (very reluctant and anti-E36) wife to use it. The only reason we're not going to keep it is because we need something a little bigger when baby no.2 makes an appearance so I'm looking at E34 525i tourings now.
So verdict on the FK AK suspension: car handles like new, sits very low but hasn't yet found a speed bump it can't get over, and did great on some of the windier Devon backroads. I'd recommend them for a budget project like mine.
As with all good things, time with this car is soon to come to an end
as I've put her up for sale! I'm probably going to resist selling for quite some time however as currently the 328 is our only car and having air-con is a great boon with the summer months looming and spring currently being particularly warm!Some new pics in the ad too
http://www.pistonheads.com/sales/2744701.htm
So what's been going on with the car?
Ice and snow over the winter + LSD = super low speed drifting fun!
At the end of February tax and MOT ran out and the car sat lonely on the drive while I considered options. The option I eventually went with (time, money and family permitting) was to get hold of some bigger wheels, get the coilover suspension fitted and put the car in for MOT.
Car passed MOT once after a few fixes - it needed one new rear top-mount and seal replaced on the power steering.
We then sold our other car and have been using this as the everyday car which even with the new suspension is a joy! We took it on a family holiday down to Devon covering 400 miles and the car was a pleasure to drive, I've even got my (very reluctant and anti-E36) wife to use it. The only reason we're not going to keep it is because we need something a little bigger when baby no.2 makes an appearance so I'm looking at E34 525i tourings now.
So verdict on the FK AK suspension: car handles like new, sits very low but hasn't yet found a speed bump it can't get over, and did great on some of the windier Devon backroads. I'd recommend them for a budget project like mine.
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