Morrisons £50 parking charge, enforcable or not?
Discussion
Hi, hopefully someone can help, my van was parked in Morrisons, we did some shopping, had coffee, visited other places in the ind estate and returned to find a ticket under the wiper.
It requests a payment of £50 but if paid early then £30. It says that if not paid then Registered Keeper details may be requested from the DVLA and passed onto a debt control agency, eek!
Should I pay, seems a bit steep, can it be enforced?
Opinions welcomed, cheers.
It requests a payment of £50 but if paid early then £30. It says that if not paid then Registered Keeper details may be requested from the DVLA and passed onto a debt control agency, eek!
Should I pay, seems a bit steep, can it be enforced?
Opinions welcomed, cheers.
Is the ticket from the Council or a Private Parking Company (PPC) contracted to the supermarket?
If its Council they can prise money from the Registered Keeper.
If it's a PPC send me the ticket + £10 and I'll sort it out for you.
Or you could have a look here
http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=4697...
http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php...
http://www.pistonheads.com/GASSING/topic.asp?h=0&a...
If its Council they can prise money from the Registered Keeper.
If it's a PPC send me the ticket + £10 and I'll sort it out for you.
Or you could have a look here
http://forums.pepipoo.com/index.php?showtopic=4697...
http://forums.moneysavingexpert.com/showthread.php...
http://www.pistonheads.com/GASSING/topic.asp?h=0&a...
Edited by Red Devil on Friday 4th February 02:15
If headed Penalty Charge Notice - either appeal or pay up. Such notices are enforceable. You can appeal on any grounds, but success is most likely if the parking restrictions are not set out in accordance with the law - e.g. yellow lines painted improperly or (very) badly maintained - or the PCN has been issued incorrectly. Note that the de minimus 'rule' applies, whereby minor issues may be ignored when assessing an appeal. The Council (for they are the most common issuers of proper PCNs, albeit sometimes by a company they employ) is likely reject an initial appeal (but remember that the penalty is frozen at the lower amount as soon as you appeal - within the time limit given). Threatening to appeal, and in necessary appealing, to the Parking Adjudicator may result in the Council cancelling the penalty (but possibly only at the eleventh hour).
If headed: Parking Charge Notice - ignore, and ignore all subsequent correspondence, including threats of court action and demands to identify the driver. Such notices are not enforceable except under contract law and:
1) the contract is between the driver and the parking operator;
2) the parking operator cannot demand that the RK reveal the name of the driver (despite what they might claim in letters);
3) only 'damages/losses' can be claimed for. Such 'damages/losses' amount to the charge made for parking, if such charges are made. For example, if parking is free up to 90 minutes but no charge is made thereafter (often the case with 'superstore' parking), there can be no "loss" caused by a driver overstaying the (90 minute) time limit. If a parking charge is applied, the "loss" is at most the minimum charge that would have been made for the additional time the vehicle was parked.
The succession of ever-more threatening letters, from the parking company, a solicitor, a debt collector and even a firm of bailiffs usually have one thing in common ... they are all (associated with) the same company/individuals.
Note that any 'PCN' falsely issued as a 'Penalty' could result in criminal charges against the issuer.
And in the latter case of a 'PCN', let your BP return to normal by reading what has become known as "Streaky's Letter" (reproduced just over half-way down. No apologies for the shameless self-promotion
). The general advice, with which I concur, is not to reply to any correspondence. Me? I'm just an ornery cuss.].
Streaky
If headed: Parking Charge Notice - ignore, and ignore all subsequent correspondence, including threats of court action and demands to identify the driver. Such notices are not enforceable except under contract law and:
1) the contract is between the driver and the parking operator;
2) the parking operator cannot demand that the RK reveal the name of the driver (despite what they might claim in letters);
3) only 'damages/losses' can be claimed for. Such 'damages/losses' amount to the charge made for parking, if such charges are made. For example, if parking is free up to 90 minutes but no charge is made thereafter (often the case with 'superstore' parking), there can be no "loss" caused by a driver overstaying the (90 minute) time limit. If a parking charge is applied, the "loss" is at most the minimum charge that would have been made for the additional time the vehicle was parked.
The succession of ever-more threatening letters, from the parking company, a solicitor, a debt collector and even a firm of bailiffs usually have one thing in common ... they are all (associated with) the same company/individuals.
Note that any 'PCN' falsely issued as a 'Penalty' could result in criminal charges against the issuer.
And in the latter case of a 'PCN', let your BP return to normal by reading what has become known as "Streaky's Letter" (reproduced just over half-way down. No apologies for the shameless self-promotion
). The general advice, with which I concur, is not to reply to any correspondence. Me? I'm just an ornery cuss.].Streaky
Rollseyes at FAQ discussion thread.... 
Morrisons do seem to be employing a particularly stupid parking enforcement company.
They never learn. A local DIY chain had a particularly embarrassing episode partly documented in these forums, and the publicity was so bad and the loss of trade so noticeable that the parking enforcement company were sacked.
Now Morrisons just round the corner have started the same, and the same problems have arisen. People making two visits have been invoiced on the basis of the first arrival time and second departure time. Even an arrival time on one day, and a departure time from a completely different visit the next day. Even invoices for parking at a future date.
They don't learn, and they deserve to fail.
Of course none of it would happen if people didn't take the piss with abuse of parking spaces and there's the rub. Not suggesting OP did or did not, it all depends on T&Cs in place and devil in the detail as usual.
Morrisons do seem to be employing a particularly stupid parking enforcement company.
They never learn. A local DIY chain had a particularly embarrassing episode partly documented in these forums, and the publicity was so bad and the loss of trade so noticeable that the parking enforcement company were sacked.
Now Morrisons just round the corner have started the same, and the same problems have arisen. People making two visits have been invoiced on the basis of the first arrival time and second departure time. Even an arrival time on one day, and a departure time from a completely different visit the next day. Even invoices for parking at a future date.
They don't learn, and they deserve to fail.
Of course none of it would happen if people didn't take the piss with abuse of parking spaces and there's the rub. Not suggesting OP did or did not, it all depends on T&Cs in place and devil in the detail as usual.
Whilst the contract is unenforceable, there are several points which may help you better understand quite how unenforceable it is.
The parking company say that the driver has a contract with the land owner that he/she agrees to by parking.
The driver and the registered keeper can be two different people, and the registered keeper is under no obligation to grass the driver up.
I drive my Dad's car on occasionally. He has once had an 'invoice' for parking when he had not parked. Obviously he does not pay invoices that he hasn't agreed to pay. The registered keeper is under no obligation to inform the company of the name of the driver, (me). This makes it impossible for the contract to be enforced, as the company have no idea who I am, just who the registered keeper is.
The parking company say that the driver has a contract with the land owner that he/she agrees to by parking.
The driver and the registered keeper can be two different people, and the registered keeper is under no obligation to grass the driver up.
I drive my Dad's car on occasionally. He has once had an 'invoice' for parking when he had not parked. Obviously he does not pay invoices that he hasn't agreed to pay. The registered keeper is under no obligation to inform the company of the name of the driver, (me). This makes it impossible for the contract to be enforced, as the company have no idea who I am, just who the registered keeper is.
Thanks everyone for your helpful words...
The ticket has been issued by Euro car parks, there are warning signs about parking but as I very rarely use that car park I thought it was more for people staying overnight etc.
I will follow advice and completely ignore, I was just worried that it could escalate up to county court judgement if ignored.
I did do a search for help regarding the ticket and could not find anything suitable so a permanent post may be helpful as I am not the first and probably not that last to suffer this problem, thanks again everyone, cheers.
The ticket has been issued by Euro car parks, there are warning signs about parking but as I very rarely use that car park I thought it was more for people staying overnight etc.
I will follow advice and completely ignore, I was just worried that it could escalate up to county court judgement if ignored.
I did do a search for help regarding the ticket and could not find anything suitable so a permanent post may be helpful as I am not the first and probably not that last to suffer this problem, thanks again everyone, cheers.
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