Burglary at remote Peak District farm, murder arrest
Discussion
I live in the area this shooting happened. Well, ten minutes away. Lots of isolated farms, lots of scum down from Lpool/Manchester after LRs, quadbikes etc. A couple of years ago here in Rainow thieves broke into a farm house and tortured the family for their valuables. They didn't have any. Lives ruined.
gotoPzero said:
Looks like it's ok to keep my swords in the freezer at the top of the stairs with the sausages.PurpleTurtle said:
Even though I'm generally a tofu-munching, left-leaning wokeist Guradianista, I've always been of the view that once you break into someone's property you've overstepped the line of what then happens to you.
Get slotted by a 12-bore? Oops, occupational hazard. I have zero sympathy for the burglars, I hope the homeowner gets off.
For context, I've been the victim of burglary three times at two different addresses, nobody apprehended on any occasion.
Bit of both.Get slotted by a 12-bore? Oops, occupational hazard. I have zero sympathy for the burglars, I hope the homeowner gets off.
For context, I've been the victim of burglary three times at two different addresses, nobody apprehended on any occasion.
I doubt anyone would have too much sympathy if that happened but there's a world of difference between protecting your property and acting in the moment and catching someone breaking in and marching them into the living room and shooting them in the back.
I'm sure some people would have no problem with the latter but I'm not sure it's where we should want the law to be.
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hstewie said:
hstewie said:PurpleTurtle said:
Even though I'm generally a tofu-munching, left-leaning wokeist Guradianista, I've always been of the view that once you break into someone's property you've overstepped the line of what then happens to you.
Get slotted by a 12-bore? Oops, occupational hazard. I have zero sympathy for the burglars, I hope the homeowner gets off.
For context, I've been the victim of burglary three times at two different addresses, nobody apprehended on any occasion.
Bit of both.Get slotted by a 12-bore? Oops, occupational hazard. I have zero sympathy for the burglars, I hope the homeowner gets off.
For context, I've been the victim of burglary three times at two different addresses, nobody apprehended on any occasion.
I doubt anyone would have too much sympathy if that happened but there's a world of difference between protecting your property and acting in the moment and catching someone breaking in and marching them into the living room and shooting them in the back.
I'm sure some people would have no problem with the latter but I'm not sure it's where we should want the law to be.
Burglary, like rape, has life changing effects on victims and is not punished harshly enough. Inadequate punishments are one the biggest reasons that citizen justice is applauded.
fttm said:
Hopefully the home owner isn't charged . I'm with the majority of decent people on this one , feral low life scum break into your property then their rights are left at the door , no ifs no buts .
I hope the circumstances are thoroughly investigated and that the home owner is or isn't charged depending on what evidence is discovered. While I agree to some extent with your viewpoint, as someone who might inadvertently wander into private land during hikes or trail runs, I'd hate to think i could be shot without repercussions for a simple map reading error.ConnectionError said:
19 year old local called Marcus Smith is the chap who died.
"A former pupil at Chapel-en-the-Frith High School, Mr Smith was a footballer who had played for Chapel Town FC"
A brief bit of Facestalking leads one to his mother's FB profile where she's already posted a picture of her and her offspring. Multiple people fawning over how "he was the loveliest boy" blah blah blah. "A former pupil at Chapel-en-the-Frith High School, Mr Smith was a footballer who had played for Chapel Town FC"
All of them seemingly overlooking that he was out at night at a farm in the middle of nowhere committing aggravated burglary.
Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
Edited by PurpleTurtle on Thursday 2nd May 14:48
boyse7en said:
fttm said:
Hopefully the home owner isn't charged . I'm with the majority of decent people on this one , feral low life scum break into your property then their rights are left at the door , no ifs no buts .
I hope the circumstances are thoroughly investigated and that the home owner is or isn't charged depending on what evidence is discovered. While I agree to some extent with your viewpoint, as someone who might inadvertently wander into private land during hikes or trail runs, I'd hate to think i could be shot without repercussions for a simple map reading error.Of course the difficulty is the grey areas in between and I think once this over, justice will probably be served.
PurpleTurtle said:
ConnectionError said:
19 year old local called Marcus Smith is the chap who died.
"A former pupil at Chapel-en-the-Frith High School, Mr Smith was a footballer who had played for Chapel Town FC"
A brief bit of Facestalking leads one to his mother's FB profile where she's already posted a picture of her and her offspring. Multiple people fawning over how "he was the loveliest boy" blah blah blah. "A former pupil at Chapel-en-the-Frith High School, Mr Smith was a footballer who had played for Chapel Town FC"
All of them seemingly overlooking that he was out at night at a farm in the middle of nowhere committing aggravated burglary.
Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.
Edited by PurpleTurtle on Thursday 2nd May 14:48
brave soldya wiv da anglez.
Otispunkmeyer said:
If its a remote farm, how can it be an opportunist burglary? Not the kind of place you're walking by with your criminal mates and think, lets turn it over. Surely its more of a deliberate, pre-meditated burglary. And it went spectacularly wrong. Diddums.
From the latest on the BBC website: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-derbyshire-6...Derbyshire Police was called to reports of a burglary in Eccles Road, in Whaley Bridge, at 01:20 BST on Wednesday.Officers found a man in his late teens with fatal gunshot wounds and another teen with a gunshot wound nearby. A man in his 50s was held on suspicion of murder and attempted murder. The force said it was keeping an open mind about whether the incident was linked to a reported burglary at the property at about 15:30 BST on Tuesday
Sounds like they've had a go during the day then come back under cover of darkness.
Which could be a problem for the farmer, if he has sat in wait for them with his shooter, just like Tony Martin did.
This is the problem of burglary and hardly anyone ever being caught for it. The invasion of your property drives you absolutely nuts.
Police will predictably say "don't go vigilante, leave it to us" when we all know that they're totally incapable of dealing with rural crime due to being spread so thinly.
Meanwhile, the residents of High Peak will continue to vote for Robert Largan as their Tory MP.
bhstewie said:
hstewie said: I thought it was generally accepted that stopping burglars with reasonable force is fine whilst murdering them regardless of the circumstances isn't.
Female pensioner who's house is being burgled by three twenty year old males with an attitude.She threatens them with a (legally held) gun - is that reasonable force?
PurpleTurtle said:
From the latest on the BBC website: https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-derbyshire-6...
Derbyshire Police was called to reports of a burglary in Eccles Road, in Whaley Bridge, at 01:20 BST on Wednesday.Officers found a man in his late teens with fatal gunshot wounds and another teen with a gunshot wound nearby. A man in his 50s was held on suspicion of murder and attempted murder. The force said it was keeping an open mind about whether the incident was linked to a reported burglary at the property at about 15:30 BST on Tuesday
Sounds like they've had a go during the day then come back under cover of darkness.
Which could be a problem for the farmer, if he has sat in wait for them with his shooter, just like Tony Martin did.
This is the problem of burglary and hardly anyone ever being caught for it. The invasion of your property drives you absolutely nuts.
Police will predictably say "don't go vigilante, leave it to us" when we all know that they're totally incapable of dealing with rural crime due to being spread so thinly.
Meanwhile, the residents of High Peak will continue to vote for Robert Largan as their Tory MP.
Yeah that sounds like it could be a bit tricky in the old court. Could be Tony Martin MkII. Sounds like 1 lad dead, 1 lad injured and another was picked up somewhere else. Whether he was there at the time or waiting down the road as the getaway could be interesting as it could boil down to his word against theirs, and if their stories match and it paints a picture of an old man lying in wait to gun them down, it might not go favourably.Derbyshire Police was called to reports of a burglary in Eccles Road, in Whaley Bridge, at 01:20 BST on Wednesday.Officers found a man in his late teens with fatal gunshot wounds and another teen with a gunshot wound nearby. A man in his 50s was held on suspicion of murder and attempted murder. The force said it was keeping an open mind about whether the incident was linked to a reported burglary at the property at about 15:30 BST on Tuesday
Sounds like they've had a go during the day then come back under cover of darkness.
Which could be a problem for the farmer, if he has sat in wait for them with his shooter, just like Tony Martin did.
This is the problem of burglary and hardly anyone ever being caught for it. The invasion of your property drives you absolutely nuts.
Police will predictably say "don't go vigilante, leave it to us" when we all know that they're totally incapable of dealing with rural crime due to being spread so thinly.
Meanwhile, the residents of High Peak will continue to vote for Robert Largan as their Tory MP.
Perhaps the best solution here would have been to leave no witnesses!
As an aside, I met a man from Texas whilst in Venice. He said if you trespass on someone's property there and if you don't turn around and leave when asked, then you're fair game for whatever you get shot with. The police will just come cart you away in a bag. Apparently.
Edited by Otispunkmeyer on Thursday 2nd May 15:21
fttm said:
Hopefully the home owner isn't charged . I'm with the majority of decent people on this one , feral low life scum break into your property then their rights are left at the door , no ifs no buts .
That isn't the view of a decent person who has thought their position through.Having had 2 elderly Uncles suffer a home invasion, which ruined their old age, by similar scum, I'd be keen to implement the Florida solution which one Sheriff proposed.
'If you are in fear of your home being invaded, shoot first, then call the cops, don't be afraid'.
After a pond life stopped breathing due to lead poisoning, the number of home invasions in the following year in the County.
Zero....
'If you are in fear of your home being invaded, shoot first, then call the cops, don't be afraid'.
After a pond life stopped breathing due to lead poisoning, the number of home invasions in the following year in the County.
Zero....
100SRV said:
bhstewie said:
hstewie said: I thought it was generally accepted that stopping burglars with reasonable force is fine whilst murdering them regardless of the circumstances isn't.
Female pensioner who's house is being burgled by three twenty year old males with an attitude.She threatens them with a (legally held) gun - is that reasonable force?
What isn't reasonable is shooting them in the back if they start to run away or marching them outside and shooting them anyway.
You get the idea.
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