CV19 - Cure Worse Than The Disease? (Vol 19)

"unvaccinated (those with no vaccination or who were vaccinated with a first dose less than 21 days ago)"

How many people got jabbed and then got covid anyway a few days later because the jab lowered their immunity?

Plus it's modelled data - it's most likely out by several Fergusons!

Also iirc the count of total unvaccinated was estimated at 10m when it was closer to 20m thus skewing the figures towards effectiveness.

On the first two points - if someone takes the jab and therefore becomes more likely to contract covid it is reasonable to class them as unvaccinated? in what world can that be ok?

The original data is not modelled obviously but the count of unvaccinated has massive margins for error -

ONS use vaccination data from their public surveys and then multiply up to population size it's not from medical data.

https://fullfact.org/health/expose-england-populat...

The Office for National Statistics’ (ONS) latest estimate for 2020, puts the population at 55.6 million. This would leave about 12.3 million people who have not received a first dose, either because they are not eligible, or have otherwise not received a vaccine.

But the UKHSA uses data extracted from the National Immunisation Management Service (NIMS) which counts 62,724,319 people in England registered with the NHS. This would mean 19.5 million people haven’t received a first dose.

So the original base figures can't be trusted (23% versus 32% unvaccinated) and that's before the modelling is applied.

I think your numbers are wrong. You state UK, but the graph is England and Wales and that is what the ONS records:

Total deaths in England and Wales in 2018 was 541,589

Total deaths in England and Wales in 2020 was 607,922

I spent a fair bit of time looking at the ONS numbers during the pandemic, creating my own version of their graphs to see what was happening.

This one looks at actual deaths from Jan 2020 to Dec 2022 compared to the 5 year average from 2015-2019. COVID deaths are shown in orange and non COVID deaths are shown in blue. You can see a number of things:

1. Deaths in the winter of 2019/20 were lower than average.
2. The first wave of the pandemic was massively unusual. Well above the 'upper bound' of 3 standard deviations from the mean.
3. The second wave was also significant, but less unusual given that it happened in winter
4. Deaths in the first half of 2022 were below average in the second half they were above average.

In summary, there can be no doubt that what happened in 2020 was significant.



When I shared this a couple of years ago I was asked what would happen if I looked back further, so I made this version for 20 years. What you see then is that Spring 2020 is still well beyond anything we had seen before and that winter 2020/21 was well above average, but not the worst winter for that timescale. However, the context for this is that, prior to 2020, mortality had steadily reduced over the preceding 20 years as healthcare improved.



You are obviously hoping to see evidence that vaccines reduces deaths in the data. You can see that the spikes associated with the first two waves never repeated. One thing you can also see is that most of the deaths happened before vaccination:



Of course millions of us went on to catch COVID after those vaccinations, but less of the oldies that caught it died. A lot of those infections happened in the exit wave at the end of 2021 and it's easy to see that the mortality that winter was very different to the one before.

Apologies for spamming the thread, but this has to be shared:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2024/05/02/im-not...

That thread is an endless source of chuckles and irony. This one earlier today for example :

Go look up Norman Fenton and his study on this, the statistics surrounding unvaccinated vs vaccinated is totally absurd.

Right, so why are you pushing any narrative that supports the “vaccine”? There is no data at all that supports it

There is plenty of evidence that Covid vaccines greatly reduced mortality for its recipients, especially in the elderly where the risk was at its highest to begin with. It is baffling how anyone can peddle the notion otherwise.

Or, to put it more bluntly, James: you are wrong.

Not the surviving ones, anyway

Sorry I was travelling so difficult to have a proper meaningful discussion on this yesterday.

Indeed, from that data out of the 5788 people that died, nearly 40% more died after taking the vaccine (2440 unvaccinated people vs 3348 with one dose or more), which means the “vaccine” did nothing to improve overall mortality, which is surely the only thing people should be bothered about. So what if it stops them dying “with Covid” if it kills them by some other means. Of course that is also a bit of a misleading argument because you’d hazard a guess that most unvaccinated people would be much fitter and healthier and much more unlikely to die,

As I keep saying, the stats are all meaningless really. Since the vaccine has overall health and mortality improved in the nation? That is a resounding no, especially in the younger age groups, so for me it’s providing zero benefit to our health and I’d be totally ignoring it now as a treatment and find something else.