Ask a plumber/heating ‘engineer’ anything

[Monkeylegend]

sinbaddio said:

Have you ever had a major disaster on-site?

.

Probably not but I bet he's had a few Colonel Sanders.

[Jambo85]

Ostaf said:

Jambo85 said:

Correct, counter clockwise is open.

Thank you very much for help! This worked.

[LookAtMyCat]

ro250 said:

Why do some tradesman say they'll come back to you but never do?

Honestly? It's usually either that we just don't like you or think you'll be trouble to work for. There's a reason we bend over backwards for some people, and don't get back to others.
I turn down 50-60% of all the work that comes my way. If I just don't like you then it's an easy way to filter through all the work coming in but me personally i'm pretty straight with people; i'll just tell them on the spot I don't want the job.These days a phone call is usually enough for me to suss you out.

[Monkeylegend]

LookAtMyCat said:

ro250 said:

Why do some tradesman say they'll come back to you but never do?

Honestly? It's usually either that we just don't like you or think you'll be trouble to work for. There's a reason we bend over backwards for some people, and don't get back to others.
I turn down 50-60% of all the work that comes my way. If I just don't like you then it's an easy way to filter through all the work coming in but me personally i'm pretty straight with people; i'll just tell them on the spot I don't want the job.These days a phone call is usually enough for me to suss you out.

You must be a freemason.

[Trustmeimadoctor]

LookAtMyCat said:

ro250 said:

Why do some tradesman say they'll come back to you but never do?

Honestly? It's usually either that we just don't like you or think you'll be trouble to work for. There's a reason we bend over backwards for some people, and don't get back to others.
I turn down 50-60% of all the work that comes my way. If I just don't like you then it's an easy way to filter through all the work coming in but me personally i'm pretty straight with people; i'll just tell them on the spot I don't want the job.These days a phone call is usually enough for me to suss you out.

I think this is what's happened with me with 2 boiler quotes nothing back

I think they were put off because I know somewhat I'm talking about and want a decent job not a chuck it up on the wall and run

[GasEngineer]

Trustmeimadoctor said:

I think this is what's happened with me with 2 boiler quotes nothing back

I think they were put off because I know somewhat I'm talking about and want a decent job not a chuck it up on the wall and run

Would you be watching over their shoulder and pointing out things that you thought they had done wrongly?

[Trustmeimadoctor]

GasEngineer said:

Trustmeimadoctor said:

I think this is what's happened with me with 2 boiler quotes nothing back

I think they were put off because I know somewhat I'm talking about and want a decent job not a chuck it up on the wall and run

Would you be watching over their shoulder and pointing out things that you thought they had done wrongly?

I'd check in to make sure it's going as discussed but if it is then I'd happily keep away been burnt too many times to leave a "pro" alone

[LookAtMyCat]

Trustmeimadoctor] said:

I think this is what's happened with me with 2 boiler quotes nothing back

I think they were put off because I know somewhat I'm talking about and want a decent job not a chuck it up on the wall and run

That’s probably your problem. You almost certainly don’t. There’s really nothing worse than someone who thinks they know more about it than you do because they spent a couple of hours on the internet and I’ve spent 20-years self employed, doing it for a living.
Don’t get me wrong I’ve got a couple of customers that know an incredible amount about gas / heating for people that don’t work in the field, but they were generally clever enough to keep that fairly quiet when I first met them and now we’ve built a decent enough friendship where I quite like it.

[Trustmeimadoctor]

This is the thing I know what I want and I'm willing to pay for a good job. If a pro isn't willing to do the job properly I'm not going to hire them. It swings both way. In the last few weeks I had one pro company breaching data protection too

I will have to show you the pics that the pro did in our kitchen it was marvelous (he was removed from site) and the pro that cut through the top of a I beam joist and thought that was all hunky dory then thought you know what holes through the waterproof tile board are fine don't need to seal them

[dhutch]

Trustmeimadoctor said:

GasEngineer said:

Trustmeimadoctor said:

I think this is what's happened with me with 2 boiler quotes nothing back

I think they were put off because I know somewhat I'm talking about and want a decent job not a chuck it up on the wall and run

Would you be watching over their shoulder and pointing out things that you thought they had done wrongly?

I'd check in to make sure it's going as discussed but if it is then I'd happily keep away been burnt too many times to leave a "pro" alone

Absolutely this.

[GJL]

Apologies, I started a new thread asking the question, then noticed this one above it.

Looking for some guidance on UFH.

Can you install electric underfloor heating mats and a wet system together?

My wife is opening a small boarding cattery which is 9m x 4m and we decided on underfloor heating to keep the cats cosy in the cooler months. My initial thoughts were to install some electrically heated mats to keep the installation simple and initial outlay costs down.
My original calculations and planning were nearly 2 years ago the cost of everything has rocketed, including electric. I know that the running costs are more with electric UFH than a wet system so I am having a rethink.
The building is a new build so I have incorporated 80mm floor insulation and I will be putting 70mm of screed over that. Before I commit to putting down screed I wondered if I should lay the pipe for a wet system rather than wishing I had done it when I see the electric bill!
The pipework could go in and be left redundant for now and then I would have the choice of which system I use. I have already bought the electric mats and as they are designed to get hot I can't see why it would be a problem to fit them in tandem at the outset.
If I go with a wet system it means installing a new oil fired boiler to heat the water as we won't be able to plumb into our existing domestic central heating. We have to use oil as we live in a rural part of Ireland and mains gas or other sources of fuel are not readily available.
The way I see it the government will start to tax fossil fuels heavily in the near future so if I have the option I can decide to use the most effective and economical between oil or electricity.
Any thoughts or advice would be gratefully received.

[Sheepshanks]

LookAtMyCat said:

Honestly? It's usually either that we just don't like you or think you'll be trouble to work for. There's a reason we bend over backwards for some people, and don't get back to others.
I turn down 50-60% of all the work that comes my way. If I just don't like you then it's an easy way to filter through all the work coming in but me personally i'm pretty straight with people; i'll just tell them on the spot I don't want the job.These days a phone call is usually enough for me to suss you out.

Do you think it's true that tradesmen respond better to women?

[M11rph]

Trustmeimadoctor said:

I think this is what's happened with me with 2 boiler quotes nothing back

I think they were put off because I know somewhat I'm talking about and want a decent job not a chuck it up on the wall and run

The reality is that most trades will do whatever is quickest and easiest for them to get paid and out of the door.

Obviously any "tradies" on PH don't fit into that category, but after 20 years of employing various trades it's hard to come to any other conclusion. All my poor experiences have been with trade body certified and recommended workmen, never the cheapest quote etc.

You'll get word of mouth recommendations and most of these seem to be based on "turned up on time and vacuumed a bit before leaving" along with not knowing what an acceptable job is.

Just one example below. Thermostatic shower valve install, looked ok (all hidden) worked ok for a couple of years before obviously letting go





Got bored and tidied it up myself.

I've had one good plumber out of 9. The one above obviously flooded the house (£5k insurance and all the disruption). It's not difficult and soldering isn't required any longer, either poly or crimped copper so do it yourself.
Sparkies have been better ime, probably because getting a zap makes them pay attention more than a few drips?

[Trustmeimadoctor]

Nice

Agree 100% they seem to be like garages ooh your brakes are worn look they are yellow on a piece of paper we have printed out you should replace them

Because the end user pretty much never knows them self how to check or what is actually ok.

If there is any chance you know what your looking at they aren't interested as they cant pull things over you and hide them behind plasterboard

Another example plumber putting in our water softner plumed the outlet into the sink trap and put the overflow down the gully outside (no real airgap) so supprise surprise when drain gas and dirty water started making their way into the bine tank both totally against the instructions that they disposed of so I didn't check untill we had the issue.

The worst trades Ive had issues with plumbers/bathroom fitters, roofers. And flooring contrators. The best sparkies and plasterers and now I've found 2 heating engineers that actually seem to care about the boiler being more efficient than the one they are replacing. I don't need Instagram plumbing I want a well designed and setup system.

[dmsims]

Comments ?

[Trustmeimadoctor]

this was the one that got chucked off site and yes this was his finished article mains down to 15m with a nice dent in the first pipe where he likely bent it on his knee or a brick or something




thats 10-15mm i asked for the rads to be done in 15mm there is only a few ft of the 10mm as the T's are just out of sight. it was also supposed to be chased into the Grey wall where the rad was going, but he was going to clip it to the surface coming out from beside the integrated fridge! we ended up with it in 10mm as they didnt want to make holes in the freshly plastered ceiling by this point




this was the one that did the bathroom. this came about as we asked for the tray to be as low to the floor as possible. yeah no thinking about maybe we could alter the flow of the waste pipe or say look it really cant be done swap the tray or waste. thankfully it was only a small span and its now sistered

Edited by Trustmeimadoctor on Sunday 2nd October 09:50

[shambolic]

dhutch said:

cavey76 said:

I have a 3k sq ft Victorian detached, 4 public rooms, a kitchen, 6 bedroom with a shower off the gas. We have a 35kw Combi today.

A couple of mates have similar sized houses, one is a builder and swears by the fact I am stretching a combi too much. He has just completely refitted his gaff and has went for what, I think, is a system boiler, tank looks about 5ft tall? The other mate has something similar which is supported by a solar system.

My combi is coming to end of life, are my mates wallopers(likely) or for a big ass old Victorian with 7 people in it should I look elsewhere for heating tech?

Almost certainly, talking nonsense. (disclaimer, I am not a plumber, but a mechanical engineer who read up about it for their own house)

Combi boilers are sized for the hot water heating demand, you need 35kw to run a shower or two, but in a smaller house they will be putting far less than 35kW into the radiators, and or cycling on and off quickly. Hence if you are only running a shower or two off it, even with a much larger house, its likely still well within its capabilities to run the rads.

Boilers like working hard, so if the house at water is hot when you need it, happy days.

That said, I am not a huge fan of combi boilers in larger houses and if there is space for a hot water tank, it certainly could be an option to fit a 35kW system boiler and 250l unvented hot water tank.

You say 'a shower off the gas' how many showers are there, and what are the others running off? Do the showers work as you want?

You do know that it won’t put 35kw to the heating? All our boilers 24/30/35 kw are for hw output. They all give 24kw to heating. And modulate down to 7kw

[B'stard Child]

Trustmeimadoctor said:

this was the one that got chucked off site and yes this was his finished article mains down to 15m with a nice dent in the first pipe where he likely bent it on his knee or a brick or something




thats 10-15mm i asked for the rads to be done in 15mm there is only a few ft of the 10mm as the T's are just out of sight. it was also supposed to be chased into the Grey wall where the rad was going, but he was going to clip it to the surface coming out from beside the integrated fridge! we ended up with it in 10mm as they didnt want to make holes in the freshly plastered ceiling by this point




this was the one that did the bathroom. this came about as we asked for the tray to be as low to the floor as possible. yeah no thinking about maybe we could alter the flow of the waste pipe or say look it really cant be done swap the tray or waste. thankfully it was only a small span and its now sistered

Jesus Christ - I'm not a plumber but I'd be fking ashamed to put my name to any of that...........

[Trustmeimadoctor]

Exactly why I will check the work that's going on!

[dhutch]

shambolic said:

You do know that it won’t put 35kw to the heating? All our boilers 24/30/35 kw are for hw output. They all give 24kw to heating. And modulate down to 7kw

Yes, aware almost all combis won't put the full power into the heating, and that almost all can modulate down with varying levels of success.

However the point still stands that the heating requirements of most homes are grossly less than even 24kW, and that if the posters house and hot water is hot when he needs it then the system is working ok. Especially if you want to get the efficiency out of a condensing boiler, fitting something absolutely huge and turning the flow temperature to 70 is unlikely to be the best route forward!

Our house is a leaky 250sqm Edwardian build, and the best plumber we've had on site to date was a adamant we needed a larger boiler, citing '45kw would be a minimum, some people would fit two boilers ' however we didn't replace it and even with resizing the rads good and large, the only time it runs other than pretty much tickover is the first 3-4mintues during initial heat up.