Fraud as a career path

Author
Discussion

Deva Link

26,934 posts

244 months

Sunday 14th October 2012
quotequote all
Mojooo said:
anyone who has worked in the criminal justice system knows crime pays

thats why the proceeds of crime act is so good.

i know of a case recently where someone got fined £500 (5 offences) for selling fake goods but got a £70,000 proceeds of crime order against them! i bet they would rather do a couple of months inside than give up 70k.
Is it still costing more in fees than they collect? I think it's a bit better now, but it's taken 10 years to get going.

Mojooo

12,668 posts

179 months

Sunday 14th October 2012
quotequote all
Deva Link said:
Is it still costing more in fees than they collect? I think it's a bit better now, but it's taken 10 years to get going.
That was SOCA I believe. I think the problem for SOCA is that the kinds of cases they take on might be very lengthy and very expensive (i.e might involve lots of surveillance) which might explain why they were not making 'profit' relative to their expense.

This case was done by local Police/Trading Standards I believe.

Deva Link

26,934 posts

244 months

Sunday 14th October 2012
quotequote all
Mojooo said:
Deva Link said:
Is it still costing more in fees than they collect? I think it's a bit better now, but it's taken 10 years to get going.
That was SOCA I believe. I think the problem for SOCA is that the kinds of cases they take on might be very lengthy and very expensive (i.e might involve lots of surveillance) which might explain why they were not making 'profit' relative to their expense.

This case was done by local Police/Trading Standards I believe.
This is a bit old now, but it's what I was thinking of: http://news.bbc.co.uk/panorama/hi/front_page/newsi...

Ari

19,328 posts

214 months

Sunday 14th October 2012
quotequote all
Chaps, I don't think you get to keep the money like its some kind of game show prize! biggrin

green944

138 posts

145 months

Sunday 14th October 2012
quotequote all
Is a year in prison a cheap price to pay for a boob job?

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2174742/Ra...

Mojooo

12,668 posts

179 months

Sunday 14th October 2012
quotequote all
Deva Link said:
Mojooo said:
Deva Link said:
Is it still costing more in fees than they collect? I think it's a bit better now, but it's taken 10 years to get going.
That was SOCA I believe. I think the problem for SOCA is that the kinds of cases they take on might be very lengthy and very expensive (i.e might involve lots of surveillance) which might explain why they were not making 'profit' relative to their expense.

This case was done by local Police/Trading Standards I believe.
This is a bit old now, but it's what I was thinking of: http://news.bbc.co.uk/panorama/hi/front_page/newsi...
I believe there are a few cases on POCA in the appeal courts. The courts/Judges appear to wanting to reign in the power POCA gives, so I daresay any money taken in will decrease.

As always, the ones that can hire smart legal people can come up with ways of circumventing the Act.

That being said, I know of a number of cases where people who had made a lot of money from crime have had to pay back large sums - their traditional sentence is usually piddly.


gradderszx10r

374 posts

143 months

Tuesday 16th October 2012
quotequote all
Ari said:
Chaps, I don't think you get to keep the money like its some kind of game show prize! biggrin
If you can't remember where you put it what they gunna do? Trust me on this lol

Rollcage

11,327 posts

191 months

Tuesday 16th October 2012
quotequote all
Crazy Torque said:
What if you declared yourself bankrupt (presumably you'd have no titled assets like car/house, just the embezzeled £500k in a shoebox or two hidden in the loft of your insane grandmothers.

Could you then start your new life without worrying about the past and all this compensation order bullst?

('Course you'd still need to launder the cash as needed, but that's a problem for another day.)
No, you couldn't.

New POD

3,851 posts

149 months

Tuesday 16th October 2012
quotequote all
jas xjr said:
i would not want to go to jail for any amount of money . i do know people who see it as an occupational hazard but it is not for me .
Apparently, it's only a deterant if you've never been. For 50% of those who have been, it holds no fear, and does not stop them commiting crime again.



OdramaSwimLaden

1,971 posts

168 months

Wednesday 17th October 2012
quotequote all
I knew several guys that were trading computers and phones a few years ago.

In fact as it now transpires they were caught up in carousel fraud / MTIC fraud (google MTIC fraud) whether knowingly or otherwise.

4 guys went from living in rented accommodation, or small houses, to fast cars (i'm not talking Golf GTI's but Lamborghini's and Bugatti's) big houses and flash holidays. We are talking making millions and millions a year here and not just a few thousand.

Having found out a bit more about it they were either knowingly involved or on the fringes and sucked into it seeing all of the money being made. 2 of the 4 ended up in jail for 5 & 6 years and the other 2 had no problems at all yet!! All 4 guys were operating seperate companies. There were / are literally 1000's and 1000's of companies in this "industry" raping the VAT man for literally £Bn's a year in the UK and Europe.

The 2 guys in jail recieved confiscation orders against them. Both orders were less than £1m. They had cars worth over a million, not to mention the properties owned outright here and overseas!!!! They'll be out in max 3 years. Walk into a bank and make an unauthourised withdrawl of £10k with a shooter and you get 20 years.....

Fraud as a career path? If you're any good at it; yes.

3 years in jail for £10m; there's a lot of people who would, and have, taken that.

tyrewrecker

6,419 posts

153 months

Wednesday 17th October 2012
quotequote all
OdramaSwimLaden said:
I knew several guys that were trading computers and phones a few years ago.

In fact as it now transpires they were caught up in carousel fraud / MTIC fraud (google MTIC fraud) whether knowingly or otherwise.

4 guys went from living in rented accommodation, or small houses, to fast cars (i'm not talking Golf GTI's but Lamborghini's and Bugatti's) big houses and flash holidays. We are talking making millions and millions a year here and not just a few thousand.

Having found out a bit more about it they were either knowingly involved or on the fringes and sucked into it seeing all of the money being made. 2 of the 4 ended up in jail for 5 & 6 years and the other 2 had no problems at all yet!! All 4 guys were operating seperate companies. There were / are literally 1000's and 1000's of companies in this "industry" raping the VAT man for literally £Bn's a year in the UK and Europe.

The 2 guys in jail recieved confiscation orders against them. Both orders were less than £1m. They had cars worth over a million, not to mention the properties owned outright here and overseas!!!! They'll be out in max 3 years. Walk into a bank and make an unauthourised withdrawl of £10k with a shooter and you get 20 years.....

Fraud as a career path? If you're any good at it; yes.

3 years in jail for £10m; there's a lot of people who would, and have, taken that.
Yep, you just need to google Mike Boparan to see they got away with similar who was on here with Enzo, Veyron, Phantom etc etc

jshell

11,006 posts

204 months

Wednesday 17th October 2012
quotequote all
tyrewrecker said:
OdramaSwimLaden said:
I knew several guys that were trading computers and phones a few years ago.

In fact as it now transpires they were caught up in carousel fraud / MTIC fraud (google MTIC fraud) whether knowingly or otherwise.

4 guys went from living in rented accommodation, or small houses, to fast cars (i'm not talking Golf GTI's but Lamborghini's and Bugatti's) big houses and flash holidays. We are talking making millions and millions a year here and not just a few thousand.

Having found out a bit more about it they were either knowingly involved or on the fringes and sucked into it seeing all of the money being made. 2 of the 4 ended up in jail for 5 & 6 years and the other 2 had no problems at all yet!! All 4 guys were operating seperate companies. There were / are literally 1000's and 1000's of companies in this "industry" raping the VAT man for literally £Bn's a year in the UK and Europe.

The 2 guys in jail recieved confiscation orders against them. Both orders were less than £1m. They had cars worth over a million, not to mention the properties owned outright here and overseas!!!! They'll be out in max 3 years. Walk into a bank and make an unauthourised withdrawl of £10k with a shooter and you get 20 years.....

Fraud as a career path? If you're any good at it; yes.

3 years in jail for £10m; there's a lot of people who would, and have, taken that.
Yep, you just need to google Mike Boparan to see they got away with similar who was on here with Enzo, Veyron, Phantom etc etc
tbops?

ZOLLAR

19,908 posts

172 months

Wednesday 17th October 2012
quotequote all
OdramaSwimLaden said:
I knew several guys that were trading computers and phones a few years ago.

In fact as it now transpires they were caught up in carousel fraud / MTIC fraud (google MTIC fraud) whether knowingly or otherwise.

4 guys went from living in rented accommodation, or small houses, to fast cars (i'm not talking Golf GTI's but Lamborghini's and Bugatti's) big houses and flash holidays. We are talking making millions and millions a year here and not just a few thousand.

Having found out a bit more about it they were either knowingly involved or on the fringes and sucked into it seeing all of the money being made. 2 of the 4 ended up in jail for 5 & 6 years and the other 2 had no problems at all yet!! All 4 guys were operating seperate companies. There were / are literally 1000's and 1000's of companies in this "industry" raping the VAT man for literally £Bn's a year in the UK and Europe.

The 2 guys in jail recieved confiscation orders against them. Both orders were less than £1m. They had cars worth over a million, not to mention the properties owned outright here and overseas!!!! They'll be out in max 3 years.[b] Walk into a bank and make an unauthourised withdrawl of £10k with a shooter and you get 20 years.....

Fraud as a career path? If you're any good at it; yes.[/b]

3 years in jail for £10m; there's a lot of people who would, and have, taken that.
Reminds me of Layer Cake

XXXX said:
There were villains, locked away for twelve years for robbing a bank of ten grand, doing time with drippy hippies who were doing twelve months for smuggling two million quid's worth of puff. I mean, work it out, mate. We're in the wrong fking game
Substitute drugs with Fraud

tyrewrecker

6,419 posts

153 months

Wednesday 17th October 2012
quotequote all
jshell said:
tbops?
tbops and his brother both posted pics of them with the cars, I believe tbops attended meets in the cars, but it was a Michael Boparan who made the news.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/2681035.stm

jshell

11,006 posts

204 months

Wednesday 17th October 2012
quotequote all
tyrewrecker said:
jshell said:
tbops?
tbops had the car, but it was a Michael Boparan who made the news.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/2681035.stm
Must've been a differnt case Jim, tbops fall was much later than that article...

tyrewrecker

6,419 posts

153 months

Wednesday 17th October 2012
quotequote all
jshell said:
Must've been a differnt case Jim, tbops fall was much later than that article...
Yeah he left here 2010 or so, but I never seen any news articles re: tbops. Mystery.

I am sure there are people on here who know. He used to mention on here about his security and had a huge knowledge of fake cigs/booze and credit card machines...

jshell

11,006 posts

204 months

Wednesday 17th October 2012
quotequote all
Just found this again: http://jalopnik.com/5525486/drug-kingpins-own-secr...

Wee mention for PH!

tyrewrecker

6,419 posts

153 months

Wednesday 17th October 2012
quotequote all
jshell said:
Just found this again: http://jalopnik.com/5525486/drug-kingpins-own-secr...

Wee mention for PH!
Yeah, the alias "Alexander Surin' seems to be somewhat of a mystery.