Rejecting a 18 month old car after 3 gearbox changes?
Discussion
One for the more legally minded...
Clearly there have been some daft requests for rejection and I am borderline on this but it's for my dad and I do have some sympathy with his position.
Bought a brand new diesel Nissan Qashqai (yes I know I should have stopped him!) around Xmas 2015. He only tootles around the local village so has no end of DPF filter/sensor issues but all dealt with under warranty. Annoyingly the service manager told him he should have not bought a diesel and I agree but hindsight is a wonderful thing. He was probably mis-sold given his mileage and driving style but no proper evidence on that.
Now over Summer this year the car developed a judder in the transmission - it has only done 12k miles in 18 months and most of those have been back and forth to the dealer for the DPF issues. The dealer agrees and replaces the gearbox. Fault still present.
They order and replace another gearbox - a second new box together with some hardware/software module - fault still present and now actual loss of speed - car undriveable.
Nissan approve a third gearbox which was fitted this week but no change - car still undriveable. Nissan have now said they will send one of their Technicians to help install the fourth gearbox but this will take a few weeks to organise. They have now had the car for over a month with a further 2 weeks at least with no guarantee of resolution.
Nissan corporate has offered a Family discount off a new car but with the poor dealer PX it's still almost £10k to swap in a new petrol Qashqai - I don't mind trading up but we do object to having to shell out £10k for the pleasure. It's an automatic and they cannot find any used models where to cost to change would be lower.
Now to be fair they have provided him with a decent courtesy car over this extended period but at what point to we say enough is enough and what options does he have in terms of bringing the situation to a conclusion.
Thanks in advance.
Clearly there have been some daft requests for rejection and I am borderline on this but it's for my dad and I do have some sympathy with his position.
Bought a brand new diesel Nissan Qashqai (yes I know I should have stopped him!) around Xmas 2015. He only tootles around the local village so has no end of DPF filter/sensor issues but all dealt with under warranty. Annoyingly the service manager told him he should have not bought a diesel and I agree but hindsight is a wonderful thing. He was probably mis-sold given his mileage and driving style but no proper evidence on that.
Now over Summer this year the car developed a judder in the transmission - it has only done 12k miles in 18 months and most of those have been back and forth to the dealer for the DPF issues. The dealer agrees and replaces the gearbox. Fault still present.
They order and replace another gearbox - a second new box together with some hardware/software module - fault still present and now actual loss of speed - car undriveable.
Nissan approve a third gearbox which was fitted this week but no change - car still undriveable. Nissan have now said they will send one of their Technicians to help install the fourth gearbox but this will take a few weeks to organise. They have now had the car for over a month with a further 2 weeks at least with no guarantee of resolution.
Nissan corporate has offered a Family discount off a new car but with the poor dealer PX it's still almost £10k to swap in a new petrol Qashqai - I don't mind trading up but we do object to having to shell out £10k for the pleasure. It's an automatic and they cannot find any used models where to cost to change would be lower.
Now to be fair they have provided him with a decent courtesy car over this extended period but at what point to we say enough is enough and what options does he have in terms of bringing the situation to a conclusion.
Thanks in advance.
Once a new car is over 6 months old, you're going to,have a hard time trying to reject it based on our appalling experience with VW and VWFS. Our new Golf Cab bought new in March 2016 has been the worst car I've known. It's back in tomorrow - 11th time in its 18 month life, it has been in more times than my 3 Jags have over 5 years. VW are crap to deal with, and think their products are always trouble free.
With respect what is your father's driving style? Has it deteriorated over time? How old is he?
Abit of a coincidence that three new gearboxes fail.
Get him to drive you round his normal route. Is the cars size causing him to fluster?
Is a Micra automatic or Jazz automatic a better choice?
A salesman can't tell someone to buy a car. If a customer wants diesel he/she will have a diesel so you can't blame dpf clogging on them.
Abit of a coincidence that three new gearboxes fail.
Get him to drive you round his normal route. Is the cars size causing him to fluster?
Is a Micra automatic or Jazz automatic a better choice?
A salesman can't tell someone to buy a car. If a customer wants diesel he/she will have a diesel so you can't blame dpf clogging on them.
Sa Calobra said:
With respect what is your father's driving style? Has it deteriorated over time? How old is he?
Abit of a coincidence that three new gearboxes fail.
Get him to drive you round his normal route. Is the cars size causing him to fluster?
Is a Micra automatic or Jazz automatic a better choice?
A salesman can't tell someone to buy a car. If a customer wants diesel he/she will have a diesel so you can't blame dpf clogging on them.
He is currently driving around quite comfortably in a Navara having downsized from a X-Trail to get the Qashqai. Don't think the size of the car is really relevant to the discussion - maybe you would feel more comfortable in a Micra or Jazz but not him. He just doesn't do many dual carriageway/motorway miles. Given the size of the local roads he is more experienced to drive a larger car than most!Abit of a coincidence that three new gearboxes fail.
Get him to drive you round his normal route. Is the cars size causing him to fluster?
Is a Micra automatic or Jazz automatic a better choice?
A salesman can't tell someone to buy a car. If a customer wants diesel he/she will have a diesel so you can't blame dpf clogging on them.
All very interesting but the point is the gearbox issues and the inability of Nissan to repair and whether that is cause for rejection or what other route can be taken.
Sa Calobra said:
With respect what is your father's driving style? Has it deteriorated over time? How old is he?
Abit of a coincidence that three new gearboxes fail.
Get him to drive you round his normal route. Is the cars size causing him to fluster?
Is a Micra automatic or Jazz automatic a better choice?
A salesman can't tell someone to buy a car. If a customer wants diesel he/she will have a diesel so you can't blame dpf clogging on them.
It's not like his dad is killing the boxes, 1st one developed a fault, and the 2 replacements have not fixed the issue from when they were fitted. Abit of a coincidence that three new gearboxes fail.
Get him to drive you round his normal route. Is the cars size causing him to fluster?
Is a Micra automatic or Jazz automatic a better choice?
A salesman can't tell someone to buy a car. If a customer wants diesel he/she will have a diesel so you can't blame dpf clogging on them.
CarbonV12V said:
Bought a brand new diesel Nissan Qashqai (yes I know I should have stopped him!) around Xmas 2015. He only tootles around the local village so has no end of DPF filter/sensor issues but all dealt with under warranty. Annoyingly the service manager told him he should have not bought a diesel and I agree but hindsight is a wonderful thing. He was probably mis-sold given his mileage and driving style but no proper evidence on that.
Was he "sold" a diesel, or did he walk in and say "I want a diesel because it's cheap to tax/run"?CarbonV12V said:
Now over Summer this year the car developed a judder in the transmission - it has only done 12k miles in 18 months and most of those have been back and forth to the dealer for the DPF issues. The dealer agrees and replaces the gearbox. Fault still present.
They order and replace another gearbox - a second new box together with some hardware/software module - fault still present and now actual loss of speed - car undriveable.
Nissan approve a third gearbox which was fitted this week but no change - car still undriveable. Nissan have now said they will send one of their Technicians to help install the fourth gearbox but this will take a few weeks to organise. They have now had the car for over a month with a further 2 weeks at least with no guarantee of resolution.
That's pretty sThey order and replace another gearbox - a second new box together with some hardware/software module - fault still present and now actual loss of speed - car undriveable.
Nissan approve a third gearbox which was fitted this week but no change - car still undriveable. Nissan have now said they will send one of their Technicians to help install the fourth gearbox but this will take a few weeks to organise. They have now had the car for over a month with a further 2 weeks at least with no guarantee of resolution.
t, but it's their problem under warranty.CarbonV12V said:
Nissan corporate has offered a Family discount off a new car but with the poor dealer PX it's still almost £10k to swap in a new petrol Qashqai - I don't mind trading up but we do object to having to shell out £10k for the pleasure.
I presume the "poor PX" is ignoring the maladies, and is based simply on age/spec/mileage? If so, is it really "poor" compared to WBAC/other guide or buy prices - or is it simply poor compared to what he paid 18mo ago...? It's not really their fault that his car has depreciated heavily in the first 18mo from new. It's kinda what they do...CarbonV12V said:
It's an automatic and they cannot find any used models where to cost to change would be lower.
<shrug> Few people bought petrol automatics new, not least because they looked expensive on tax/fuel...CarbonV12V said:
Now to be fair they have provided him with a decent courtesy car over this extended period but at what point to we say enough is enough and what options does he have in terms of bringing the situation to a conclusion.
Forget any kind of legal comeback because of an issue that appeared nearly 18mo into the car's life. Ain't going to happen. They're dealing with the issue under warranty, and are already offering him an above-and-beyond solution to close it all down, via a favourable deal to chop it in. It's not really their problem that he can't find anything used he likes and doesn't want to spend out on covering the depreciation.You do need to push hard with Nissan directly.
Opposite to what has been said, I had a brand new 8 month old VW replaced via Vwfs and vwcs with no problem at all due to various failures of the vehicle.
In fact, I came out better off as i specced a few more extras which was agreed to under a gesture of good will.
Firm but polite.
Opposite to what has been said, I had a brand new 8 month old VW replaced via Vwfs and vwcs with no problem at all due to various failures of the vehicle.
In fact, I came out better off as i specced a few more extras which was agreed to under a gesture of good will.
Firm but polite.
Alucidnation said:
You do need to push hard with Nissan directly.
Opposite to what has been said, I had a brand new 8 month old VW replaced via Vwfs and vwcs with no problem at all due to various failures of the vehicle.
Consumer Rights Act 2015 states that any faults within the first six months are deemed to have been present at purchase, unless the vendor can show otherwise. After that, the onus changes. These faults didn't appear until 18mo.Opposite to what has been said, I had a brand new 8 month old VW replaced via Vwfs and vwcs with no problem at all due to various failures of the vehicle.
B'sides, Nissan are trying to fix the faults under warranty - above and beyond legal recourse - and are offering a favourable trade-in as a goodwill gesture - above and beyond legal recourse.
If he tries to reject the vehicle now, then it's unlikely he'll succeed. Even if he does, his refund will make allowance for the use he's had, which is likely to put it in line with the good-condition PX value. Trouble is, he's in denial about heavy initial depreciation on a car that's just been replaced with a facelifted version.
(I'm assuming the PX being offered is the normal good-condition figure, which the OP hasn't confirmed.)
CarbonV12V said:
One for the more legally minded...
Clearly there have been some daft requests for rejection and I am borderline on this but it's for my dad and I do have some sympathy with his position.
Bought a brand new diesel Nissan Qashqai (yes I know I should have stopped him!) around Xmas 2015. He only tootles around the local village so has no end of DPF filter/sensor issues but all dealt with under warranty. Annoyingly the service manager told him he should have not bought a diesel and I agree but hindsight is a wonderful thing. He was probably mis-sold given his mileage and driving style but no proper evidence on that.
Now over Summer this year the car developed a judder in the transmission - it has only done 12k miles in 18 months and most of those have been back and forth to the dealer for the DPF issues. The dealer agrees and replaces the gearbox. Fault still present.
They order and replace another gearbox - a second new box together with some hardware/software module - fault still present and now actual loss of speed - car undriveable.
Nissan approve a third gearbox which was fitted this week but no change - car still undriveable. Nissan have now said they will send one of their Technicians to help install the fourth gearbox but this will take a few weeks to organise. They have now had the car for over a month with a further 2 weeks at least with no guarantee of resolution.
Nissan corporate has offered a Family discount off a new car but with the poor dealer PX it's still almost £10k to swap in a new petrol Qashqai - I don't mind trading up but we do object to having to shell out £10k for the pleasure. It's an automatic and they cannot find any used models where to cost to change would be lower.
Now to be fair they have provided him with a decent courtesy car over this extended period but at what point to we say enough is enough and what options does he have in terms of bringing the situation to a conclusion.
Thanks in advance.
The shudder you speak of is known as a harmonic tingle and is almost certainly a problem with the driveshafts to the front wheels. This seems to be a more common problem in Japanese vehicles, ( don't ask me why, but it is). The modern C/V joint they now fit in front wheel driveshafts that allows you a taxi like turning circle is prone to winding up on itself, causing this type of shudder.Clearly there have been some daft requests for rejection and I am borderline on this but it's for my dad and I do have some sympathy with his position.
Bought a brand new diesel Nissan Qashqai (yes I know I should have stopped him!) around Xmas 2015. He only tootles around the local village so has no end of DPF filter/sensor issues but all dealt with under warranty. Annoyingly the service manager told him he should have not bought a diesel and I agree but hindsight is a wonderful thing. He was probably mis-sold given his mileage and driving style but no proper evidence on that.
Now over Summer this year the car developed a judder in the transmission - it has only done 12k miles in 18 months and most of those have been back and forth to the dealer for the DPF issues. The dealer agrees and replaces the gearbox. Fault still present.
They order and replace another gearbox - a second new box together with some hardware/software module - fault still present and now actual loss of speed - car undriveable.
Nissan approve a third gearbox which was fitted this week but no change - car still undriveable. Nissan have now said they will send one of their Technicians to help install the fourth gearbox but this will take a few weeks to organise. They have now had the car for over a month with a further 2 weeks at least with no guarantee of resolution.
Nissan corporate has offered a Family discount off a new car but with the poor dealer PX it's still almost £10k to swap in a new petrol Qashqai - I don't mind trading up but we do object to having to shell out £10k for the pleasure. It's an automatic and they cannot find any used models where to cost to change would be lower.
Now to be fair they have provided him with a decent courtesy car over this extended period but at what point to we say enough is enough and what options does he have in terms of bringing the situation to a conclusion.
Thanks in advance.
This is a known fault on many of these kinds of vehicles and I am seriously surprised that Nissan, it would appear, don't know this.
The sooner diesel cars are banned from production the better. Utterly ludicrous, dreadful engineering design in the modern diesel. Brutally not fit for purpose and highly toxic. I would ditch it and take the deal for the petrol.
J
Thanks all - some great feedback.
I obviously agree that replacing the gearbox 3 times suggests the fault is elsewhere and thanks jjth for your insight. You should be able to rely on Nissan to have the technical expertise to resolve the issue so I will update in due course.
The PX option was my suggestion to get my father out of the lemon he has bought. As for the PX value/cost to change - yes the PX value we have been told is the top value assuming no workshop time is required to prepare the car so again fair. We have no issue with how the amount has been calculated and fully understand the depreciation curve.
My (Yorkshire) father just objects to being asked to pay it when he already has a reasonably new/high spec. car albeit not on the road! He also has a load of extras covering a 3 year period which will be lost such as the invoice value and tyre insurances and Winter/service packs. Even thought there is still 18 months left on these the dealer is not interested and wants full value to replace them.
The dealer principal has not been helpful at all - the service guys are fine (but being paid quite nicely for the warranty work) and only Nissan head office seem to trying to help resolve the situation.
I have made a formal complaint and will have another discussion with Nissan HQ and see if I can get the cost of change down to a level we can all agree on whilst at the same time seeing if or how quickly they can actually repair his current car.
I obviously agree that replacing the gearbox 3 times suggests the fault is elsewhere and thanks jjth for your insight. You should be able to rely on Nissan to have the technical expertise to resolve the issue so I will update in due course.
The PX option was my suggestion to get my father out of the lemon he has bought. As for the PX value/cost to change - yes the PX value we have been told is the top value assuming no workshop time is required to prepare the car so again fair. We have no issue with how the amount has been calculated and fully understand the depreciation curve.
My (Yorkshire) father just objects to being asked to pay it when he already has a reasonably new/high spec. car albeit not on the road! He also has a load of extras covering a 3 year period which will be lost such as the invoice value and tyre insurances and Winter/service packs. Even thought there is still 18 months left on these the dealer is not interested and wants full value to replace them.
The dealer principal has not been helpful at all - the service guys are fine (but being paid quite nicely for the warranty work) and only Nissan head office seem to trying to help resolve the situation.
I have made a formal complaint and will have another discussion with Nissan HQ and see if I can get the cost of change down to a level we can all agree on whilst at the same time seeing if or how quickly they can actually repair his current car.
CarbonV12V said:
One for the more legally minded...
Clearly there have been some daft requests for rejection and I am borderline on this but it's for my dad and I do have some sympathy with his position.
Bought a brand new diesel Nissan Qashqai (yes I know I should have stopped him!) around Xmas 2015. He only tootles around the local village so has no end of DPF filter/sensor issues but all dealt with under warranty. Annoyingly the service manager told him he should have not bought a diesel and I agree but hindsight is a wonderful thing. He was probably mis-sold given his mileage and driving style but no proper evidence on that.
Now over Summer this year the car developed a judder in the transmission - it has only done 12k miles in 18 months and most of those have been back and forth to the dealer for the DPF issues. The dealer agrees and replaces the gearbox. Fault still present.
They order and replace another gearbox - a second new box together with some hardware/software module - fault still present and now actual loss of speed - car undriveable.
Nissan approve a third gearbox which was fitted this week but no change - car still undriveable. Nissan have now said they will send one of their Technicians to help install the fourth gearbox but this will take a few weeks to organise. They have now had the car for over a month with a further 2 weeks at least with no guarantee of resolution.
Nissan corporate has offered a Family discount off a new car but with the poor dealer PX it's still almost £10k to swap in a new petrol Qashqai - I don't mind trading up but we do object to having to shell out £10k for the pleasure. It's an automatic and they cannot find any used models where to cost to change would be lower.
Now to be fair they have provided him with a decent courtesy car over this extended period but at what point to we say enough is enough and what options does he have in terms of bringing the situation to a conclusion.
Thanks in advance.
I understood that 'Harmonic Tingle' was a term coined by Honda in connection with an engine related vibration in CRVs? Clearly there have been some daft requests for rejection and I am borderline on this but it's for my dad and I do have some sympathy with his position.
Bought a brand new diesel Nissan Qashqai (yes I know I should have stopped him!) around Xmas 2015. He only tootles around the local village so has no end of DPF filter/sensor issues but all dealt with under warranty. Annoyingly the service manager told him he should have not bought a diesel and I agree but hindsight is a wonderful thing. He was probably mis-sold given his mileage and driving style but no proper evidence on that.
Now over Summer this year the car developed a judder in the transmission - it has only done 12k miles in 18 months and most of those have been back and forth to the dealer for the DPF issues. The dealer agrees and replaces the gearbox. Fault still present.
They order and replace another gearbox - a second new box together with some hardware/software module - fault still present and now actual loss of speed - car undriveable.
Nissan approve a third gearbox which was fitted this week but no change - car still undriveable. Nissan have now said they will send one of their Technicians to help install the fourth gearbox but this will take a few weeks to organise. They have now had the car for over a month with a further 2 weeks at least with no guarantee of resolution.
Nissan corporate has offered a Family discount off a new car but with the poor dealer PX it's still almost £10k to swap in a new petrol Qashqai - I don't mind trading up but we do object to having to shell out £10k for the pleasure. It's an automatic and they cannot find any used models where to cost to change would be lower.
Now to be fair they have provided him with a decent courtesy car over this extended period but at what point to we say enough is enough and what options does he have in terms of bringing the situation to a conclusion.
Thanks in advance.
Doesn't sound like this issue at all but your drive shaft theory could be on the mark. It's hard to see how they'd get 3 faulty gearboxes in a row.
Gassing Station | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff