It's not about the money (yeah, right)!

It's not about the money (yeah, right)!

Author
Discussion

Davidonly

Original Poster:

1,080 posts

193 months

Sunday 22nd October 2017
quotequote all
SAC's (bribes for police waivers): Small sums to Gov't big to the parasites that run this scam. Some folk get rich we get ..... more speed cameras with zero data to justify the whole thing. ZERO!

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/10/20/police-...


paintman

7,678 posts

190 months

Sunday 22nd October 2017
quotequote all
Perhaps you would prefer to go back to the old way.
Points and a fine every time you get caught.

You don't have to accept an SAC, you can always opt to take the points & fine.

Edited by paintman on Sunday 22 October 12:03

cmaguire

3,589 posts

109 months

Sunday 22nd October 2017
quotequote all
paintman said:
Perhaps you would prefer to go back to the old way.
Points and a fine every time you get caught.
That is not any 'old way' I remember.

And I had plenty of experience.

I would take the 'old way' any day of the week.

paintman

7,678 posts

190 months

Sunday 22nd October 2017
quotequote all
When I was in the job the SAC wasn't an option.
IIRC wasn't introduced until 2002.
Fixed penalty tickets were introduced during my service, I can't recall the year, but prior to that it was report for summons & a date with the magistrates although depending on how much you had got on your licence & the level of speed you could plead guilty by post.

I believe the Prosecutions Dept had the option to mark NFA and advise the offender for lower speeds, but I never bothered reporting - or later ticketing - for less than 10mph over the posted limit in a 30 & 15mph in a 40. Stopping & a few 'words of advice' to the driver were my preferred option for lower speeds.

I was trained in vascar, muniquip and pro-laser plus those we caught by following with a vehicle with calibrated speedometer.

ETA In my driving teens - early 1970s - I did get caught once for speeding & that was an endorsement & IIRC £25 fine (which for me was a week's take home pay). In those days it was 3 endorsements = a ban.


Edited by paintman on Sunday 22 October 13:04

anonymous-user

54 months

Sunday 22nd October 2017
quotequote all
paintman said:
Perhaps you would prefer to go back to the old way.
Points and a fine every time you get caught.

You don't have to accept an SAC, you can always opt to take the points & fine.

Edited by anonymous-user on Sunday 22 October 12:03
The implication is that, were it not for the incentive of revenue from SACs, police forces wouldn't spend so much time monitoring the roads for speeding motorists.

That could well be beneficial for those who occasionally break limits safely and also free up resources for more important work.

SantaBarbara

3,244 posts

108 months

Sunday 22nd October 2017
quotequote all
REALIST123 said:
The implication is that, were it not for the incentive of revenue from SACs, police forces wouldn't spend so much time monitoring the roads for speeding motorists.

That could well be beneficial for those who occasionally break limits safely and also free up resources for more important work.
Most police forces do not operate the best course themselves though, do they?

paintman

7,678 posts

190 months

Sunday 22nd October 2017
quotequote all
Bearing in mind this was before the existence of the camera vans the majority of time we spent on speed detection was a direct result of complaints from residents & local councillors.
Not unusual to be approached by residents with 'About time you did something about the speeding here'.

Sometimes you'd catch lots & sometimes nothing. I do recall one site only resulted in one capture - which turned out to be the main complainant. He was rather philosophical about it smile

A common misconception on roads that saw a lot of HGVs was their believed speed - possibly due to the noise - & on occasion we would invite the complainant to be with us so they could see the actual speed of the HGV against what they estimated it to be.

768

13,651 posts

96 months

Sunday 22nd October 2017
quotequote all
Just think of all the accidents not happening because of these courses.

I reckon it's about zero.

cmaguire

3,589 posts

109 months

Sunday 22nd October 2017
quotequote all
paintman said:
When I was in the job the SAC wasn't an option.
IIRC wasn't introduced until 2002.
Fixed penalty tickets were introduced during my service, I can't recall the year, but prior to that it was report for summons & a date with the magistrates although depending on how much you had got on your licence & the level of speed you could plead guilty by post.

I believe the Prosecutions Dept had the option to mark NFA and advise the offender for lower speeds, but I never bothered reporting - or later ticketing - for less than 10mph over the posted limit in a 30 & 15mph in a 40. Stopping & a few 'words of advice' to the driver were my preferred option for lower speeds.

I was trained in vascar, muniquip and pro-laser plus those we caught by following with a vehicle with calibrated speedometer.

ETA In my driving teens - early 1970s - I did get caught once for speeding & that was an endorsement & IIRC £25 fine (which for me was a week's take home pay). In those days it was 3 endorsements = a ban.


Edited by paintman on Sunday 22 October 13:04
That's more akin to the 'old way' I remember, not vonhosen's version.

paintman

7,678 posts

190 months

Sunday 22nd October 2017
quotequote all
I can't find any vonhosen posts on this thread?

768

13,651 posts

96 months

Sunday 22nd October 2017
quotequote all
Small mercies.

cmaguire

3,589 posts

109 months

Sunday 22nd October 2017
quotequote all
paintman said:
I can't find any vonhosen posts on this thread?
There aren't any.

His line is basically that all the automated non-discretionary enforcement now merely frees up the Police to do other things, but he dished out tickets in a similar way back in the day as they are now (and the 'under 85 on a Motorway and we'll turn a blind eye generally' is made-up and never happened).

TwigtheWonderkid

43,317 posts

150 months

Sunday 22nd October 2017
quotequote all
Davidonly said:
SAC's (bribes for police waivers): Small sums to Gov't big to the parasites that run this scam.
The one I did had 2 guys for 4 hours, plus hire of the hotel facilities where they held it. Plus admin in sending out notices, organising the course etc. 15 people paying £100 so £1500 to cover it. Obviously they make a profit, and as it's a private firm running it who shouldn't they, but I'm not convinced it's the get rich quick scheme you describe.

Funk

26,266 posts

209 months

Sunday 22nd October 2017
quotequote all
paintman said:
Perhaps you would prefer to go back to the old way.
Points and a fine every time you get caught.

You don't have to accept an SAC, you can always opt to take the points & fine.
Given that one must declare a SAC in lieu of points to an insurer, do premiums get loaded the same way anyway?

If so, I'd rather not bother with the SAC and just take the points rather than having to sit in faux contrition and repeat the 'speed kills' mantra to be allowed to leave...

Bigends

5,414 posts

128 months

Sunday 22nd October 2017
quotequote all
paintman said:
When I was in the job the SAC wasn't an option.
IIRC wasn't introduced until 2002.
Fixed penalty tickets were introduced during my service, I can't recall the year, but prior to that it was report for summons & a date with the magistrates although depending on how much you had got on your licence & the level of speed you could plead guilty by post.

I believe the Prosecutions Dept had the option to mark NFA and advise the offender for lower speeds, but I never bothered reporting - or later ticketing - for less than 10mph over the posted limit in a 30 & 15mph in a 40. Stopping & a few 'words of advice' to the driver were my preferred option for lower speeds.

I was trained in vascar, muniquip and pro-laser plus those we caught by following with a vehicle with calibrated speedometer.

ETA In my driving teens - early 1970s - I did get caught once for speeding & that was an endorsement & IIRC £25 fine (which for me was a week's take home pay). In those days it was 3 endorsements = a ban.
Likewise - never punished a speeder less than 10mph over - we had speed offence cards or the good old process book. I do remember when the tickets came in - made life a bit easier

Edited by paintman on Sunday 22 October 13:04

SantaBarbara

3,244 posts

108 months

Sunday 22nd October 2017
quotequote all
Funk said:
Given that one must declare a SAC in lieu of points to an insurer, do premiums get loaded the same way anyway?

If so, I'd rather not bother with the SAC and just take the points rather than having to sit in faux contrition and repeat the 'speed kills' mantra to be allowed to leave...
Why do you need to declare attendance at a SAC?

Some debate about that.

Davidonly

Original Poster:

1,080 posts

193 months

Sunday 22nd October 2017
quotequote all
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Davidonly said:
SAC's (bribes for police waivers): Small sums to Gov't big to the parasites that run this scam.
The one I did had 2 guys for 4 hours, plus hire of the hotel facilities where they held it. Plus admin in sending out notices, organising the course etc. 15 people paying £100 so £1500 to cover it. Obviously they make a profit, and as it's a private firm running it who shouldn't they, but I'm not convinced it's the get rich quick scheme you describe.
ANY profit associated with the prosecution of UK citizens for a technical offence ought to raise alarm

cmaguire

3,589 posts

109 months

Sunday 22nd October 2017
quotequote all
Most times I was stopped 'back then' it was a brief chat and told to 'ease off a bit' or something similar, and then off we go or there might also be a 'producer' chucked in with a visit to the station within 7 days.

SantaBarbara

3,244 posts

108 months

Sunday 22nd October 2017
quotequote all
Davidonly said:
ANY profit associated with the prosecution of UK citizens for a technical offence ought to raise alarm
Who makes the profit though?

cmaguire

3,589 posts

109 months

Sunday 22nd October 2017
quotequote all
I need a time machine.........now.