Insurance - Recovery of total loss
Discussion
kestral said:
So the car you own is nothing to do with them at all and they have no control over what happens to your car even if they (they being the third party via his insurance) pay you the full market value.
Any offer from a tp insurer of full market value would be subject to them retaining the salvage. You can then ask for a reduced valuation based on you keeping the salvage. But you can't have full market value and the salvage, unless the person who you are dealing with at the tp insurer is some kind of idiot who likes throwing money away. TooMany2cvs said:
The car is worth £10k.
The salvage is worth £3k.
If they pay you out in full AND you keep the salvage, you have had £13k of benefit from the claim.
Certainly didn't work that way with me when a truck decided to squish the front of my parked Merc - albeit 10 years ago, but I guess the principles haven't changed.The salvage is worth £3k.
If they pay you out in full AND you keep the salvage, you have had £13k of benefit from the claim.
Using your simple numbers (although my numbers were much lower):
Direct negotiation with the 3rd party. I could have had the £10k and they kept the car - I chose to keep the salvage at 3k, and they gave me the 7k difference. It cost £2k to fix it myself. Car was not recorded as being damaged, as it was cash in lieu, and I had 5k in my pocket.
Generally,
If your own insurance write the car off, they pay you out the full value and they buy title to the vehicle (salvage), to dispose of as they see fit.
If the third party insurers pay you direct, they pay the nett total loss value after deducting the salvage value from the vehicles full pre-accident value. You keep title to the vehicle and therefore the salvage. Should you decide to sell the salvage but secure less than the salvage value then the third party or their insurers are obliged to make you, the innocent party, whole and pay whatever shortfall you have.
If your own insurance write the car off, they pay you out the full value and they buy title to the vehicle (salvage), to dispose of as they see fit.
If the third party insurers pay you direct, they pay the nett total loss value after deducting the salvage value from the vehicles full pre-accident value. You keep title to the vehicle and therefore the salvage. Should you decide to sell the salvage but secure less than the salvage value then the third party or their insurers are obliged to make you, the innocent party, whole and pay whatever shortfall you have.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
Any offer from a tp insurer of full market value would be subject to them retaining the salvage. You can then ask for a reduced valuation based on you keeping the salvage. But you can't have full market value and the salvage, unless the person who you are dealing with at the tp insurer is some kind of idiot who likes throwing money away.
The issue of a salvag fee is pertinent which I did not mention as it was far from the main point I was making.However in my case there was no deduction for the salavage. The full market value was paid to me. So the third parties insurers must have liked throwing the £200 the salvage was worth away. Bless them.
kestral said:
The issue of a salvag fee is pertinent which I did not mention as it was far from the main point I was making.
However in my case there was no deduction for the salavage. The full market value was paid to me. So the third parties insurers must have liked throwing the £200 the salvage was worth away. Bless them.
There may have been other considerations for a TP insurer - like their saving on hire charges more than offsetting the potential "salavage" value. Or perhaps they felt it was beneficial to forego any deduction to avoid a loss of use/loss of earnings claim.However in my case there was no deduction for the salavage. The full market value was paid to me. So the third parties insurers must have liked throwing the £200 the salvage was worth away. Bless them.
I had the misfortune many years ago of handling motor claims, and I really don't miss it! A total nightmare.
anniesdad said:
Generally,
If your own insurance write the car off, they pay you out the full value and they buy title to the vehicle (salvage), to dispose of as they see fit.
If the third party insurers pay you direct, they pay the nett total loss value after deducting the salvage value from the vehicles full pre-accident value. You keep title to the vehicle and therefore the salvage. Should you decide to sell the salvage but secure less than the salvage value then the third party or their insurers are obliged to make you, the innocent party, whole and pay whatever shortfall you have.
No I do not think that is correct actually.If your own insurance write the car off, they pay you out the full value and they buy title to the vehicle (salvage), to dispose of as they see fit.
If the third party insurers pay you direct, they pay the nett total loss value after deducting the salvage value from the vehicles full pre-accident value. You keep title to the vehicle and therefore the salvage. Should you decide to sell the salvage but secure less than the salvage value then the third party or their insurers are obliged to make you, the innocent party, whole and pay whatever shortfall you have.
James TiT said:
anniesdad said:
Generally,
If your own insurance write the car off, they pay you out the full value and they buy title to the vehicle (salvage), to dispose of as they see fit.
If the third party insurers pay you direct, they pay the nett total loss value after deducting the salvage value from the vehicles full pre-accident value. You keep title to the vehicle and therefore the salvage. Should you decide to sell the salvage but secure less than the salvage value then the third party or their insurers are obliged to make you, the innocent party, whole and pay whatever shortfall you have.
No I do not think that is correct actually.If your own insurance write the car off, they pay you out the full value and they buy title to the vehicle (salvage), to dispose of as they see fit.
If the third party insurers pay you direct, they pay the nett total loss value after deducting the salvage value from the vehicles full pre-accident value. You keep title to the vehicle and therefore the salvage. Should you decide to sell the salvage but secure less than the salvage value then the third party or their insurers are obliged to make you, the innocent party, whole and pay whatever shortfall you have.
The process is normally the same, regardless of claiming for a total loss off your own or tp's policy. They will make you an offer based on market value, and they will keep the salvage. You can of course negotiate with either to retain the salvage, in return for the appropriate deduction in your payout.
The only difference is that you have a contract with your own insurer, but no contract with a tp insurer. So your own insurer can refuse to sell you back the salvage, if it states in the contract that they will retain the salvage in the event of a total loss claim. A tp insurer doesn't have that power, because you have no contract with them, and you can insist you retain the salvage.
That's about it.
TwigtheWonderkid said:
James TiT said:
anniesdad said:
Generally,
If your own insurance write the car off, they pay you out the full value and they buy title to the vehicle (salvage), to dispose of as they see fit.
If the third party insurers pay you direct, they pay the nett total loss value after deducting the salvage value from the vehicles full pre-accident value. You keep title to the vehicle and therefore the salvage. Should you decide to sell the salvage but secure less than the salvage value then the third party or their insurers are obliged to make you, the innocent party, whole and pay whatever shortfall you have.
No I do not think that is correct actually.If your own insurance write the car off, they pay you out the full value and they buy title to the vehicle (salvage), to dispose of as they see fit.
If the third party insurers pay you direct, they pay the nett total loss value after deducting the salvage value from the vehicles full pre-accident value. You keep title to the vehicle and therefore the salvage. Should you decide to sell the salvage but secure less than the salvage value then the third party or their insurers are obliged to make you, the innocent party, whole and pay whatever shortfall you have.
The process is normally the same, regardless of claiming for a total loss off your own or tp's policy. They will make you an offer based on market value, and they will keep the salvage. You can of course negotiate with either to retain the salvage, in return for the appropriate deduction in your payout.
The only difference is that you have a contract with your own insurer, but no contract with a tp insurer. So your own insurer can refuse to sell you back the salvage, if it states in the contract that they will retain the salvage in the event of a total loss claim. A tp insurer doesn't have that power, because you have no contract with them, and you can insist you retain the salvage.
That's about it.
anniesdad said:
KevinCamaroSS said:
You guys do realise AnniesDad actually works in the industry don't you?
Haha, I’ve probably only dealt with a few thousand claims that have been dealt with just like that. 
Look at it this way,
When you pay your insurance you enter into a contract, you are forced to do as that contract says as you agreed too it.
When a third party hits you, that doesn't automatically enter you into a contract, you can discuss and tell the the 3rd partys insurer what you want, and negotiate an outcome that both you and the insurer are happy with, if you want to keep the car negotiate it, if its beyond economical repair tell them you are happy for them to make you a cash offer in lieu of getting it repaired. The car is yours.
When you pay your insurance you enter into a contract, you are forced to do as that contract says as you agreed too it.
When a third party hits you, that doesn't automatically enter you into a contract, you can discuss and tell the the 3rd partys insurer what you want, and negotiate an outcome that both you and the insurer are happy with, if you want to keep the car negotiate it, if its beyond economical repair tell them you are happy for them to make you a cash offer in lieu of getting it repaired. The car is yours.
Foliage said:
Look at it this way,
When you pay your insurance you enter into a contract, you are forced to do as that contract says as you agreed too it.
Yup.When you pay your insurance you enter into a contract, you are forced to do as that contract says as you agreed too it.
Foliage said:
When a third party hits you, that doesn't automatically enter you into a contract, you can discuss and tell the the 3rd partys insurer what you want, and negotiate an outcome that both you and the insurer are happy with, if you want to keep the car negotiate it, if its beyond economical repair tell them you are happy for them to make you a cash offer in lieu of getting it repaired. The car is yours.
Yup. But let's not forget that you have to negotiate to a point where both sides agree. And, if both sides can't agree - say, because you want the full £10k pre-collision value AND to keep the £3k-worth-at-Copart salvage - then it's going to the ombudsman. And they ain't going to say you're being reasonable and order the insurer to pay out... Which leaves you where? On the way to court?TwigtheWonderkid said:
I don't see how anyone in their right mind would think they are entitled to the full market value of their car, and to keep the salvage. Are people really that unreasonable? If you want the salvage, then the salvage value is deducted from your payout.
Agreed. They’re not. The defendants responsibility is to make the claimant whole again that’s all. Gassing Station | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff