Lorry drivers who think the are the Police
Discussion
matjk said:
Actually I'm talking about something different,(my bad) what grinds my gears is when a motorway splits like say on the M25 , you get the idiots that effectively get off the blocked or heavy M25 use the new free flowing lane (lets say its going to the M4) to shot past all the traffic then try to squeeze back in right at the very last opportunity, often they cant get in right away as people sit tail to bumper to stop them, then they sit in a live motorway lane with hazards on waiting for someone to let them in and hopping an Artic doesn't wipe then out form behind at 60mph. The merge at point thing is still a bit annoying.
I have seen in the states 6 lanes go down to 2 in fairly moderate traffic and everyone manages to get over way before the merge and it all keeps flowing,(i was staggered) this will NEVER EVER happen here as a good 25% of cars will bomb up the empty lanes and nip in 10 ft before they hit the cones causing a big tail back until all the lanes are full. Its very antisocial, if you did it at a supermarket checkout (ran to the front and nipped in the queue) you would probably get a black eye. IMHO most UK drivers have good manners until they get behind a wheel, and then its f
k everyone 
But it isn't a queue at the supermarket. It's a road and we pay to use ALL the open lanes.I have seen in the states 6 lanes go down to 2 in fairly moderate traffic and everyone manages to get over way before the merge and it all keeps flowing,(i was staggered) this will NEVER EVER happen here as a good 25% of cars will bomb up the empty lanes and nip in 10 ft before they hit the cones causing a big tail back until all the lanes are full. Its very antisocial, if you did it at a supermarket checkout (ran to the front and nipped in the queue) you would probably get a black eye. IMHO most UK drivers have good manners until they get behind a wheel, and then its f
k everyone In the same way, if you do slow down a little and let the car to your right pull in front of you at the merge point it doesn't diminish your masculinity or imply that in some way you've "lost", it just shows that you have care and consideration for other road users.
This is what we're ALL supposed to show. And that IS in the Highway Code. It's drivers exhibiting your kind of attitude who deliberately speed up to prevent other road users from overtaking you, presumably because you're more important than them or have a "better" car.
It's time we all took a deep breath, grew up and realised that we owe it to each other to make sure everyone gets to their destination alive and roughly on time.
OddCat said:
Am up for merging when both lanes of traffic are moving at roughly the same speed.
But if the lane into which everyone is merging is virtually stationary (due to congestion after the merge point), and is backed up to well before the merge point, then all drivers should be joining end of the queue in main lane knowing full well that the other lane ends and merging ain't happening. Anyone zipping past everyone down the empty lane is simply queue jumping......
It's like Groundhog Day in here, it really is. But if the lane into which everyone is merging is virtually stationary (due to congestion after the merge point), and is backed up to well before the merge point, then all drivers should be joining end of the queue in main lane knowing full well that the other lane ends and merging ain't happening. Anyone zipping past everyone down the empty lane is simply queue jumping......
If everyone was using both lanes right up to the ACTUAL merge point, then would there be any space for people to "jump the queue"...?
Here's a picture of some utter cretins playing "Road Captain":
This is the approach to the above image. At the end of this queue is a roundabout which gets pretty busy all on it's own, but when these fkwits decide everyone should merge miles away from the cones then it gets blocked and everyone else using that roundabout gets held up even if they're not coming down this dual carriageway.
And again, here's the link that explains why cretinous behaviour is cretinous.
Then I guess if you can't see why you're wrong already, even videos from people that actually understand the dynamics of traffic flow aren't going to help.
This is the approach to the above image. At the end of this queue is a roundabout which gets pretty busy all on it's own, but when these f
kwits decide everyone should merge miles away from the cones then it gets blocked and everyone else using that roundabout gets held up even if they're not coming down this dual carriageway.And again, here's the link that explains why cretinous behaviour is cretinous.
Then I guess if you can't see why you're wrong already, even videos from people that actually understand the dynamics of traffic flow aren't going to help.
What people should do and what people do do can and often are very different things.
I'd like it off everyone used "lose" and "loose" properly, but it's never going to happen and getting irritated about is entirely self-defeating.
Merging in turn is the correct thing to do, but it's not what most people (almost everyone) does. What people do is join the queue and demonise everyone who doesn't. Asking people to behave in exactly the opposite way that they would in other situations where they have to wait (queuing) is probably never going to work.
They have a bit of a point - since what usually happens is one lane ends up as a queue with the merge point much further down the road absolutely everyone involved - including the people making a one man stand, fighting the good fight on behalf of the Highway Code - knows exactly what it means to drive past everyone and try and get in at the end.
Yes, it's the correct thing to do. It's also the anti-social, selfish thing to do, regardless of the "right" to do it. Since almost everyone else isn't "merging like a zip", and never will, you're not making things easier by doing what you're doing, you're not changing people's opinions, you are jumping the queue.
I'd like it off everyone used "lose" and "loose" properly, but it's never going to happen and getting irritated about is entirely self-defeating.
Merging in turn is the correct thing to do, but it's not what most people (almost everyone) does. What people do is join the queue and demonise everyone who doesn't. Asking people to behave in exactly the opposite way that they would in other situations where they have to wait (queuing) is probably never going to work.
They have a bit of a point - since what usually happens is one lane ends up as a queue with the merge point much further down the road absolutely everyone involved - including the people making a one man stand, fighting the good fight on behalf of the Highway Code - knows exactly what it means to drive past everyone and try and get in at the end.
Yes, it's the correct thing to do. It's also the anti-social, selfish thing to do, regardless of the "right" to do it. Since almost everyone else isn't "merging like a zip", and never will, you're not making things easier by doing what you're doing, you're not changing people's opinions, you are jumping the queue.
Durzel said:
What people should do and what people do do can and often are very different things.
I'd like it off everyone used "lose" and "loose" properly, but it's never going to happen and getting irritated about is entirely self-defeating.
Merging in turn is the correct thing to do, but it's not what most people do. What people do is join the queue and demonise everyone who doesn't. Asking people to behave in exactly the opposite way that they would in other situations where they have to wait (queuing) is probably never going to work.
They have a bit of a point - since what usually happens is one lane ends up as a queue with the merge point much further down the road absolutely everyone involved - including the people making a one man stand, fighting the good fight on behalf of the Highway Code - knows exactly what it means to drive past everyone and try and get in at the end.
Yes, it's the correct thing to do. It's also the anti-social, selfish thing to do, regardless of the "right" to do it. Since almost everyone else isn't "merging like a zip", and never will, you're not making things easier by doing what you're doing, you're not changing people's opinions, you are jumping the queue.
The problem is that the people merging early are doing so because that's what they think they're supposed to do - see this thread featuring numerous 'driving enthusiasts' for evidence. It would take one brief campaign involving social media and a public information film on TV to fix it. Piece of cake, frankly. Alternatively you could have annual retests on drivers' knowledge of the HC and solve a few more issues at the same time...I'd like it off everyone used "lose" and "loose" properly, but it's never going to happen and getting irritated about is entirely self-defeating.
Merging in turn is the correct thing to do, but it's not what most people do. What people do is join the queue and demonise everyone who doesn't. Asking people to behave in exactly the opposite way that they would in other situations where they have to wait (queuing) is probably never going to work.
They have a bit of a point - since what usually happens is one lane ends up as a queue with the merge point much further down the road absolutely everyone involved - including the people making a one man stand, fighting the good fight on behalf of the Highway Code - knows exactly what it means to drive past everyone and try and get in at the end.
Yes, it's the correct thing to do. It's also the anti-social, selfish thing to do, regardless of the "right" to do it. Since almost everyone else isn't "merging like a zip", and never will, you're not making things easier by doing what you're doing, you're not changing people's opinions, you are jumping the queue.
IroningMan said:
The problem is that the people merging early are doing so because that's what they think they're supposed to do - see this thread featuring numerous 'driving enthusiasts' for evidence. It would take one brief campaign involving social media and a public information film on TV to fix it. Piece of cake, frankly. Alternatively you could have annual retests on drivers' knowledge of the HC and solve a few more issues at the same time...
I don't disagree, but the likelihood of that happening is slim as well. I'm pragmatic about this issue really. I'll normally drive a reasonable distance down the merge lane, then meekly try and merge in, acting like I didn't realise that was the lane I needed to be in. That way I feel like I've got a bit further, don't feel like I'm a dick, and everyone in a 1 mile radius doesn't hate my guts. You could say that I'm therefore part of the problem.
I think we have to deal with the way things are rather than the way they should be. On this issue merging right at the end - whilst technically correct - is seen as selfish and anti-social and it would take a massive sustained amount of education to change that.
There's two roundabouts near me, York A1237/A19 & A1237/A59 roundabouts if anyone knows them, both have merging lanes and the amount of times the roundabouts are blocked up because of everyone queuing in lane 1 is ridiculous. If everyone used both lanes without being worried about offending somebody. It's particularly annoying if you're not even intending on using the exit with the merge but can't enter the roundabout because everyone in lane 1 has blocked it. I've seen every exit on the A19 roundabout blocked because of all the cars just using lane 1, and in typical "merging in turn is selfish" people fashion nobody lets you out onto the roundabout, if you're not an assertive driver you can quite simply become stuck because of all the lemmings.
OddCat said:
You can't merge into a stationary queue of traffic. If you come to the end of your lane and you stop alongside a solid queue of cars in the remaining lane you are screwed.
True, but people are far more forgiving if it looks like you've just realised you're in the wrong lane (ie by slowing to a crawl and indicating). Obviously this only works if you're a good distance from the merge point.Obviously if you go past the start of the queue and it's not moving at all then yeah you're boned.
Edited by Durzel on Wednesday 22 November 21:17
Durzel said:
What people should do and what people do do can and often are very different things.
I'd like it off everyone used "lose" and "loose" properly, but it's never going to happen and getting irritated about is entirely self-defeating.
Merging in turn is the correct thing to do, but it's not what most people (almost everyone) does. What people do is join the queue and demonise everyone who doesn't. Asking people to behave in exactly the opposite way that they would in other situations where they have to wait (queuing) is probably never going to work.
They have a bit of a point - since what usually happens is one lane ends up as a queue with the merge point much further down the road absolutely everyone involved - including the people making a one man stand, fighting the good fight on behalf of the Highway Code - knows exactly what it means to drive past everyone and try and get in at the end.
Yes, it's the correct thing to do. It's also the anti-social, selfish thing to do, regardless of the "right" to dsnao it. Since almost everyone else isn't "merging like a zip", and never will, you're not making things easier by doing what you're doing, you're not changing people's opinions, you are jumping the queue.
The logic which states that it is the the correct thing to do and simultaneously anti-social and selfish beggars belief.I'd like it off everyone used "lose" and "loose" properly, but it's never going to happen and getting irritated about is entirely self-defeating.
Merging in turn is the correct thing to do, but it's not what most people (almost everyone) does. What people do is join the queue and demonise everyone who doesn't. Asking people to behave in exactly the opposite way that they would in other situations where they have to wait (queuing) is probably never going to work.
They have a bit of a point - since what usually happens is one lane ends up as a queue with the merge point much further down the road absolutely everyone involved - including the people making a one man stand, fighting the good fight on behalf of the Highway Code - knows exactly what it means to drive past everyone and try and get in at the end.
Yes, it's the correct thing to do. It's also the anti-social, selfish thing to do, regardless of the "right" to dsnao it. Since almost everyone else isn't "merging like a zip", and never will, you're not making things easier by doing what you're doing, you're not changing people's opinions, you are jumping the queue.
It's no surprise that with such a twisted perspective that we suffer from ever longer traffic jams.
It would greatly benefit the economy if people actually learned how to do the correct thing (as you have conceded it is).
Get people to use both lanes and there wouldn't be an empty space for people to 'fly down' or a 'queue to jump'.
I'll bet the vast majority of drivers have a garment fitted with a zip. How it works is not a difficult concept to grasp.
Likewise what a clusterf
k it can be when the teeth become misaligned or they become unpicked behind the pull tab.I can't honestly say I was a fan of this chap but he did have a point - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yRloeL9Zpt8
Like I said - how it should work and how it does work are often, and especially in this case, completely different things.
You're preaching to the choir in terms of convincing me of the correct thing to do, but nothing will change the animosity held towards people who do the correct thing.
Either you make peace with that and accept everyone in the queue will hate you, will probably obstruct you or make it hard for you to merge, or you follow the crowd for an easy life. It's a self-reinforcing system really - people don't want to be isolated, don't want to be public enemy number 1, so they do the socially conscious thing - the incorrect thing.
You're preaching to the choir in terms of convincing me of the correct thing to do, but nothing will change the animosity held towards people who do the correct thing.
Either you make peace with that and accept everyone in the queue will hate you, will probably obstruct you or make it hard for you to merge, or you follow the crowd for an easy life. It's a self-reinforcing system really - people don't want to be isolated, don't want to be public enemy number 1, so they do the socially conscious thing - the incorrect thing.
Still got happy memories of the time some gorilla did this on the A31 over the New Forest in front of me. When we got to where the merge point was meant to be, the cones had gone, the road workers just hadn't quite taken the signs away yet.
So this lorry driver had basically held me and a load of others up for no reason. His face, as I passed him, was purple.
So this lorry driver had basically held me and a load of others up for no reason. His face, as I passed him, was purple.
Interesting that, at airport check in, it is now more common to make everyone queue in a single snaking line. Splitting between check in desks at the end. presumably more efficient. That way there is none if the "oh bugger we chose the wrong queue" malarkey. And check in desk usage is optimised.
Perhaps it's more efficient for everyone to form a single queue as quickly (early) as possible, and then move smoothly through the slow moving pinch point as one line, rather than a log jam at the pinch point with people jamming on brakes to let others merge. When I say "perhaps" I mean "obviously"....
If you got 100 drivers of mixed ability on a long dual carriageway that goes into one lane I bet everyone would get through more quickly if they organized themselves into a singe line way before the pinch point. They could go through at 70 no probs. Try getting people of varying skill to merge at that speed.
Perhaps it's more efficient for everyone to form a single queue as quickly (early) as possible, and then move smoothly through the slow moving pinch point as one line, rather than a log jam at the pinch point with people jamming on brakes to let others merge. When I say "perhaps" I mean "obviously"....
If you got 100 drivers of mixed ability on a long dual carriageway that goes into one lane I bet everyone would get through more quickly if they organized themselves into a singe line way before the pinch point. They could go through at 70 no probs. Try getting people of varying skill to merge at that speed.
Lopey said:
Wow some people like to complicate an easy situation. How about as car 1 goes through the merge point, and is past the hazard, it increases its speed, therefore maintaining the gap between it and car 2? It's still not difficult. All it requires is a bit of planning, patience and consideration for others.
How do they increase their speed when there is someone in front of them?OddCat said:
Interesting that, at airport check in, it is now more common to make everyone queue in a single snaking line. Splitting between check in desks at the end. presumably more efficient. That way there is none if the "oh bugger we chose the wrong queue" malarkey. And check in desk usage is optimised.
Perhaps it's more efficient for everyone to form a single queue as quickly (early) as possible, and then move smoothly through the slow moving pinch point as one line, rather than a log jam at the pinch point with people jamming on brakes to let others merge. When I say "perhaps" I mean "obviously"....
If you got 100 drivers of mixed ability on a long dual carriageway that goes into one lane I bet everyone would get through more quickly if they organized themselves into a singe line way before the pinch point. They could go through at 70 no probs. Try getting people of varying skill to merge at that speed.
Perhaps it's more efficient for everyone to form a single queue as quickly (early) as possible, and then move smoothly through the slow moving pinch point as one line, rather than a log jam at the pinch point with people jamming on brakes to let others merge. When I say "perhaps" I mean "obviously"....
If you got 100 drivers of mixed ability on a long dual carriageway that goes into one lane I bet everyone would get through more quickly if they organized themselves into a singe line way before the pinch point. They could go through at 70 no probs. Try getting people of varying skill to merge at that speed.
Centurion07 said:
How long will a lane of 50 cars be versus two lanes of 25 cars each?
As has been mentioned, IT IS NOT ABOUT THE SPEED OF THE TRAFFIC THROUGH THE PINCH POINT.
Whats the relevance of the length of the queue? It might be of relevance to traffic managers etc but drivers will want to be through the obstruction as quickly as possibly, therefore surely as a driver you want the speed through the pinchpoint as fast as possible?As has been mentioned, IT IS NOT ABOUT THE SPEED OF THE TRAFFIC THROUGH THE PINCH POINT.
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