Fraudulant Card Payment

[anonymous-user]

What is the process for taking a card payment over the phone where the customer then appears in person to collect?

Does it involve seeing the card at the point of collection?

[megaphone]

DannyScene said:

megaphone said:

DannyScene said:

megaphone said:

I don't understand, if you take a payment over the phone then it needs to be authorised by the CC company, once done surely it's their responsibility?

Did it get shipped to an alternative address?

They actually came in store to collect the parts

So that is the mistake. Protection does not kick in if you don't send the items, you should have taken a card payment in store. All this is basic stuff, what is the company policy re online/phone payments and collections?

We will not take phone payments or online payments and allow collection, unless we know the customer. Been caught out before.

It's something we do quite a lot, someone will ring up order some parts then say their partner will be coming in to collect them

Looks like I might just have to swallow this one

Why should you have to swallow? If it's common practice then it is the companies fault for allowing this, again you need to find out what the procedure is for taking card payments, if you have not followed the correct procedure then you are somewhat to blame.

Have you ever been given any training or info on how to take payments?

[silentbrown]

JPJPJP said:

What is the process for taking a card payment over the phone where the customer then appears in person to collect?

Does it involve seeing the card at the point of collection?

It *should* involve taking payment at point of collection, and not before. Looking at the card won't tell you if the 'holder' actually knows the PIN.

[Jakg]

Would the deductions take you under minimum wage?

[Drew106]

Last time I ordered something from Screwfix for collection, I had to enter my PIN when collecting. Even though I had already paid.

Not sure if that's in anyway helpful, just know these two stores operate in similar ways.

[DannyScene]

Drew106 said:

Last time I ordered something from Screwfix for collection, I had to enter my PIN when collecting. Even though I had already paid.

Not sure if that's in anyway helpful, just know these two stores operate in similar ways.

There is no way for a customer to enter their pin as way of confirmation on our machines or if there is it has never been enabled

[Saleen836]

When I have ordered stuff for collection from ECP and paid online I have never been asked for any proof/ID before being handed the goods, all I give is the ref. number

[DannyScene]

JPJPJP said:

What is the process for taking a card payment over the phone where the customer then appears in person to collect?

Does it involve seeing the card at the point of collection?

It doesn't

They ring up we set the job up under their reg, they pay over the phone then quote their reg on collection so we can identify their order

[DannyScene]

megaphone said:

DannyScene said:

megaphone said:

DannyScene said:

megaphone said:

I don't understand, if you take a payment over the phone then it needs to be authorised by the CC company, once done surely it's their responsibility?

Did it get shipped to an alternative address?

They actually came in store to collect the parts

So that is the mistake. Protection does not kick in if you don't send the items, you should have taken a card payment in store. All this is basic stuff, what is the company policy re online/phone payments and collections?

We will not take phone payments or online payments and allow collection, unless we know the customer. Been caught out before.

It's something we do quite a lot, someone will ring up order some parts then say their partner will be coming in to collect them

Looks like I might just have to swallow this one

Why should you have to swallow? If it's common practice then it is the companies fault for allowing this, again you need to find out what the procedure is for taking card payments, if you have not followed the correct procedure then you are somewhat to blame.

Have you ever been given any training or info on how to take payments?

I've taken probably 1000s of card payments since I started here 4/5 years ago and never had anything flag up in audit or anything until this one

[codenamecueball]

The employer should be reporting the person to the police and using the CCTV and call records to help with that instead of pursuing their staff for their problems.

[anonymous-user]

Yes, you have the card details, house number, postcode and reg details.. that could be enough for the police to have a look surely? CCTV even better.

Is the address quite local to your branch?

If you have followed the card payment process (or if there isn't one documented), then there is no way you should be paying personally

If there is a documented process that doesn't meet the security needs of the payment processor and, therefore, allows such fraud (i.e. without the pin), then there is no way you should be paying personally

[DannyScene]

Jakg said:

Would the deductions take you under minimum wage?

thankfully not but it would likely take me close

[DannyScene]

codenamecueball said:

The employer should be reporting the person to the police and using the CCTV and call records to help with that instead of pursuing their staff for their problems.

I believe the police have contacted us to let us know the card was fraudulent

[DannyScene]

JPJPJP said:

Yes, you have the card details, house number, postcode and reg details.. that could be enough for the police to have a look surely? CCTV even better.

Is the address quite local to your branch?

If you have followed the card payment process (or if there isn't one documented), then there is no way you should be paying personally

If there is a documented process that doesn't meet the security needs of the payment processor and, therefore, allows such fraud (i.e. without the pin), then there is no way you should be paying personally

We didn't have CCTV at the time

What I've been told is very vague, I was called into a mangers office and the conversation literally went like this

'Danny you've taken a payment off a fraudulent card so you're liable for the £447 we'll be taking it off your next wage'

I argued they could split it over the next 3 months which they've agreed to do and made it clear they were doing me a favour

[captain_cynic]

Order66 said:

This is illegal. It is an "unlawful deduction from wages" for which you have statutory protection under the Employment Rights Act 1996.

Tell them to get fcked. If they sack you haul them over the coals for wrongful dismissal.

This.

Willing to be this is a fly by night operation that's hoping that no-one actually knows their rights.

[Bumblebee7]

My old employer did this to a couple of colleagues. This is completely unlawful and there is insurance to protect the company from this anyway. As an employee your company becomes vicariously liable for your actions.

I would speak to ACAS and ask them for advice. I would not be prepared to pay the employer a penny. And where do they draw the line, what if it was an order for £10,000, would they still expect you to cover it?

[DannyScene]

I'm going to check my contract when I get home and see if there is anything in there that means I am liable before I try and take this any further

It was a hell of a shock when they told me I would be paying as I always assumed they'd have insurance to cover themselves or that they'd at least want to try look after a member of staff

[7795]

Your employer is just a c**. Nothing more to add apart from as long as you did exactly what the have asked you to do, you should not pay the money back to them (in reality, they are just going to nick/steal/rob it from your wages).

W*****s.

[megaphone]

Who made the decision to deduct the amount from your wages? Branch manager or has it come from higher? Maybe the branch manager is trying it on so he does not have the loss against his account. Maybe he is not aware of the law.

[Bumblebee7]

DannyScene said:

I'm going to check my contract when I get home and see if there is anything in there that means I am liable before I try and take this any further

It was a hell of a shock when they told me I would be paying as I always assumed they'd have insurance to cover themselves or that they'd at least want to try look after a member of staff

By all means check your contract but even if such a clause exists it would surely fall under the Unfair Contract Terms Act as a completely unfair and unenforceable standard term in a contract. They categorically cannot hold you liable for your actions, especially as what you did does not fall outside of the standard practices of the company.

Companies rarely look after their employees when push comes to shove, a company will not put the staff's needs before its own, if circumstances change etc. most companies will look at their staff as a number on a page and act accordingly.