Police LIES

Author
Discussion

Ian Geary

4,462 posts

191 months

Friday 21st September 2018
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Labradorofperception said:


As for being offended, as a former police officer I'd like to cordially invite you fk the right off, over there, yes, right over there, fk off over there.
If I may just sidestep the troll quickly, I want to give this a smile

Now, I post under my own name because I couldn't be arsed to think up umpteen different user names. Other people using different user names is not a conspiracy..maybe you can get a book about The Internet out of your local library?

I had a postman who said he had tried to deliver something, but I was in all day. He LIED.

Could I hold him to account? No.

Do I go on about hating the entire royal mail for evermore? No.

Because I am a grown up, and part of being a grown up is being able to rationalise.


I do quite like the idea of revoking the Police's emergency service status, as it would give a chance to newcomers.

If the AA get promoted to 3rd, who is going to be the 4th? Not those 4x4 response lot, surely? What about the bloke in the supermarket who comes out with a mop and bucket when someone drops a bottle on the floor?



moktabe

895 posts

104 months

Friday 21st September 2018
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paintman said:
On the basis that in humans the brain is in close proximity to the mouth we'd probably have more success shooting you in the arse.
Has my vote for "Post of the year"

carinaman

21,222 posts

171 months

Friday 21st September 2018
quotequote all
Ian Geary said:
If I may just sidestep the troll quickly, I want to give this a smile

Now, I post under my own name because I couldn't be arsed to think up umpteen different user names. Other people using different user names is not a conspiracy..maybe you can get a book about The Internet out of your local library?

I had a postman who said he had tried to deliver something, but I was in all day. He LIED.

Could I hold him to account? No.

Do I go on about hating the entire royal mail for evermore? No.

Because I am a grown up, and part of being a grown up is being able to rationalise.


I do quite like the idea of revoking the Police's emergency service status, as it would give a chance to newcomers.

If the AA get promoted to 3rd, who is going to be the 4th? Not those 4x4 response lot, surely? What about the bloke in the supermarket who comes out with a mop and bucket when someone drops a bottle on the floor?
But Postman Pat or Postman Patricia will be walking the streets or driving around in a red van trying to deliver your mail and parcels.

Postmen are not usually employed to hang around Court buildings waiting to give evidence against other people, evidence that can result in a loss of liberty and significant ongoing impacts to the lives of those accused and their families.

I think most people think that the police telling the truth goes with the job, not lying or playing technicalities.


Was it reasonably foreseeable that the latest 'Spy Cops' revelations in the OP such as that the Met has been found to have been lying about Kennedy's bosses knowing he was sleeping on the job, having sex with a female environmentalist could be harmful to the reputation of the police?

The Met could have come cleaner sooner but instead they chose to take a chance. They lost and a consequence of that gamble is the reputation of the British police taking a hit.



Edited by carinaman on Friday 21st September 22:54

Brave Fart

5,680 posts

110 months

Friday 21st September 2018
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David, I think most people would concede that the police behaved badly in this situation, and as an organisation haven't dealt with it properly. Like many large public organisations they have flaws and got it wrong in this instance. There, I've said it; the police force - the Met in this case - isn't perfect, and it might be that some wrongdoers won't get punished in the way they should be (if they are wrongdoers, that is).

OK. Now, what does someone like you do about this? Well, what you appear to do is to post on a motoring forum, which is an odd choice. Actually, you only ever start posts that are anti-police which makes you look unbalanced, to put it mildly. One might conclude that you are simply seeking a reaction, rather than doing anything useful. Now I know that expressing an opinion on, say, the latest Porsche isn't massively useful either, but it does at least a) belong on a motoring forum, and b) display behaviour that isn't obsessive.

In short, the issue you're posting about is serious, but the way you troll this forum means you'll be treated with derision. Which actually undermines the very thing you were posting about, because people respond to the poster, not the subject.

Drumroll

3,738 posts

119 months

Friday 21st September 2018
quotequote all
Brave Fart said:
David, I think most people would concede that the police behaved badly in this situation, and as an organisation haven't dealt with it properly. Like many large public organisations they have flaws and got it wrong in this instance. There, I've said it; the police force - the Met in this case - isn't perfect, and it might be that some wrongdoers won't get punished in the way they should be (if they are wrongdoers, that is).

OK. Now, what does someone like you do about this? Well, what you appear to do is to post on a motoring forum, which is an odd choice. Actually, you only ever start posts that are anti-police which makes you look unbalanced, to put it mildly. One might conclude that you are simply seeking a reaction, rather than doing anything useful. Now I know that expressing an opinion on, say, the latest Porsche isn't massively useful either, but it does at least a) belong on a motoring forum, and b) display behaviour that isn't obsessive.

In short, the issue you're posting about is serious, but the way you troll this forum means you'll be treated with derision. Which actually undermines the very thing you were posting about, because people respond to the poster, not the subject.
Totally agree

ElectricPics

761 posts

80 months

Friday 21st September 2018
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I find it quite strange that the OP is banging on about the police being liars as if the undercover operation took place last week rather than 33 years ago. Police forces then, especially the Met, were very different to those of today.

Perhaps the OP by some strange coincidence is 33 years old....

Number_Six

157 posts

102 months

Saturday 22nd September 2018
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On behalf of all expatriate Brits in Belgium I apologise for this one. As well as being unable to string an argument together parking seems to be beyond his capabilities going by the lurid red 'Rimblades' on his old TT.

g7jhp

6,959 posts

237 months

Saturday 22nd September 2018
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davidball said:
Some time ago I asked forum readers if they would be prepared to participate in the disgusting police tactics of Kettling, spying on environmental protestors and spying on the grieving family of a murdered teenager. No police officer or ex police officer who read that post was prepared to stand up and answer.

In the case of spying on environmental protestors, senior police officers sanctioned an undercover operation, using the identities of children who died in infancy, to insert a married police officer into the protest group.

One of these spies formed a close relationship with at least one of the women and fathered a child with her. Later, when the morons who sanctioned the spying operation pulled the spy out (I will not call him a man) leaving the woman with no explanation why he had suddenly disappeared from her life and the life of his child and no emotional or financial support.

Much later, when the women found out about the police operation against them they complained to the MET and National Police Chiefs Council. They received the standard dismissive “will not confirm or deny” reply.

The lack of moral compass shown by the police is astounding.

Despite police efforts to obstruct the women’s search for the truth subsequent legal action dragged it out of the police who admitted to spying on the women but categorically denied sanctioning the adulterous relationship the spy had with at least one of the women.

The police LIED.

Senior police officers did know about the sexual relationships and probably knew about the offspring too. They did sanction them. They treated the women with extreme distain, spying on them, taking advantage of them then abandoning them. The distain and lies continued for years.

Let us not forget the insensitivity of using the identities of dead infants and the pain that would cause their families.

Did the environmental protests these women were alleged to be planning justify the time, expense and degrading actions the police engaged in? The vindictive prosecution later collapsed with more tax payers money wasted.

Will the police institution of legal immunity shroud police misbehaviour in this instance?

Will those senior police officers who sanctioned an adulterous relationship, the betrayal of a wife, the desertion of a woman and child and lying to the victims of police harassment be brought to justice?

Will the liars who perpetrated and engaged in these immoral activities be sacked?

I doubt it

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-45596432
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=94...
Do you read the Guardian newspaper?

V8RX7

26,765 posts

262 months

Saturday 22nd September 2018
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They do lie as does everyone else.

My issue is that they are deemed by many never to lie and their word is frequently taken as gospel

I have no issue with the Police going undercover

I have no issue with the Officer forming a relationship and lying to a woman - the vast majority of relationships involve a degree of lying

Fathering a child was obviously a mistake and it hasn't been handled well

Using names of the dead hurts no one - people need to grow up and see the wider picture


TooMany2cvs

29,008 posts

125 months

Saturday 22nd September 2018
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carinaman said:
So nobody has been in a Magistrates Court when someone that's committed an offence due to their use of a motor vehicle on the road and the Court has been told that the defendant admitted to the offence at the earliest opportunity?
So nobody ever pleads "not guilty" to motoring offences?

carinaman said:
So nobody has read a local newspaper report about a police Misconduct hearing and it states the number of times the officer involved didn't take the opportunity to admit to their conduct?

So when the police are caught, found out why can't they put their hands up and say 'It's a fair Cop'?
Many do. Perhaps they just don't get much coverage in the papers because they don't need to go to a misconduct hearing, just like people who plead guilty to motoring offences don't go through a full court case...?

As far as the undercover coppers shagging the people they were meant to be investigating, isn't there a really, really easy way for any group to out any potential undercover infiltrants? Just lob a honey trap straight at any new members...

Vaud

50,289 posts

154 months

Saturday 22nd September 2018
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Number_Six said:
On behalf of all expatriate Brits in Belgium I apologise for this one.
singlecoil said:
If nothing else this thread gives us a glimpse into the mind of a person racked with hatred to the point of being somewhat unhinged. It's scary stuff.
From experience, I find that expats can get to more extreme views.

1) Reduced exposure to media (even in the modern world, it is a narrower channel of information available)
2) Reduction in context, especially if you have lived outside of the UK for a while
3) Less opportunity for discourse with peers in native language. Stuff gets lost in translation. If you do discuss it is with a smaller group pf people who may end up reinforcing a narrower view

So you end up with a different world view. Not necessarily wrong, but informed by different aspects.

Durzel

12,232 posts

167 months

Saturday 22nd September 2018
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Some Police officers (aka human beings) are bad eggs news at 11.

Some teachers have been done for grooming ipso facto all teachers are one misread signal away from being sexual predators themselves.
- Chapter 1, Verse 4 from the bestseller "Living with my shoulder chip" by noted literary sage David "davidhall" Hall

Durzel

12,232 posts

167 months

Saturday 22nd September 2018
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Dammit Vaud this isn't the time for eloquence!

DJFish

5,917 posts

262 months

Saturday 22nd September 2018
quotequote all
Vaud said:
From experience, I find that expats can get to more extreme views.
I’m reminded of the English pensioner living on the Costa Del Sol who was interviewed by the BBC about Brexit, she was all in favour as she hoped it might stop all the foreigners from living in our country.

Derek Smith

45,514 posts

247 months

Saturday 22nd September 2018
quotequote all
Durzel said:
Some Police officers (aka human beings) are bad eggs news at 11.

Some teachers have been done for grooming ipso facto all teachers are one misread signal away from being sexual predators themselves.
- Chapter 1, Verse 4 from the bestseller "Living with my shoulder chip" by noted literary sage David "davidhall" Hall
To be fair to the officer involved, he was placed in a situation without instructions or guidelines as to his conduct in such matters. My feeling is that the police should not be used for extended undercover work. The next question is that, if it is required in terrorist situations, and I think it is, who should do it. With a police officer there is some oversight, as in this case. If it is done by some quasi secret unit, then we'd never know who does what to whom.


davidball

Original Poster:

731 posts

201 months

Saturday 22nd September 2018
quotequote all
Number_Six said:
On behalf of all expatriate Brits in Belgium I apologise for this one. As well as being unable to string an argument together parking seems to be beyond his capabilities going by the lurid red 'Rimblades' on his old TT.
Who elected you as spokes person? Some arrogance.

creampuff

6,511 posts

142 months

Saturday 22nd September 2018
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davidball said:
Does anyone else have anything to say about the police behaviour in this case because if you do not you deserve the Met you have got.
I like the Met we have. They are my local police force. I just wish they had more funding so they could do what they are doing now, but moreso. I also think the former IPCC and now IOPC have too much power. Hope that helps.

davidball

Original Poster:

731 posts

201 months

Saturday 22nd September 2018
quotequote all
There is no statute of limitations on this and is has taken this long to drag the police kicking and screaming into the open about what they did and lied about.

I find it satisfying that such behaviour does not stay under the carpet but think the only thing the Met have learned is how not to orchestrate a cover-up.

It will be interesting to see who will be thrown under the bus.

V8RX7

26,765 posts

262 months

Saturday 22nd September 2018
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davidball said:
It will be interesting to see who will be thrown under the bus.
Do we get to vote on it ?

Will it be televised ?

creampuff

6,511 posts

142 months

Saturday 22nd September 2018
quotequote all
davidball said:
It will be interesting to see who will be thrown under the bus.
I'd say nobody as likely there has been no criminal offence. So then you are down to internal discipline procedures. But this was over 30 years ago. Everybody has likely retired and cannot be compelled to do or say anything.