Jaguar Land Rover tech to avoid red lights

[Vaud]

craigjm said:

Wozy68 said:

JLR especially should be focusing on more to save money.,They are heading for serious trouble in my mind, with a model line up that seems to make less sense each time they bring a new model out (Where does the Velar sit in it for example), warehouses full of thousands of new engines merrily rusting away as they have no sales for them, Jaguar employees building LRs as there is no sales for Jaguar . Jaguar building a 4x4 .... why try and take sales away from your own company LR? ........ and don't get me started on their inability of getting the foundation of the whole company, Defender to market.

No doubt they will blame it all on Brexit.,.,,, rather than having a damn good look in their own back yard.

Where is your evidence for either of the claims in bold? Why would they be building engines they don’t need? Their production doesn’t work on stockpiling. They also don’t have flexible production lines which is part of their problem so they can’t build LR vehicles on just any line. If they could do that they would be building Epace and Ipace on house. They are years away from lot size one

Do modern engines rust in warehouses? I would have thought a valuable supply chain asset, well oiled and crated would be good for years. The engine in my Volvo sits outside all year and isn't rusting.

[akirk]

OverSteery said:

Oh wake up luddites.

Have you watched a car advert aimed at the yoof? Its all about tech.

We are dinosaurs. Safety and toys sells, maybe not to us, but I suspect most manufacturers really don't care.

Most people will love it, just like ABS, traction control, air bags, keyless, bluetooth, (adaptive) cruise control etc etc ... Personally I hate the idea, which is why car doesn't have any of these.

Wake up!
This is neither safety nor toys...
It will make driving more dangerous, it is technology for headlines sake, not because it brings any genuine improvement...

[craigjm]

This will probably never happen. Remember the technology they previewed a couple of years ago where it “removed” the A and B pillars through the use of cameras when the driver turned their heads? I’ve not seen that on a production car yet

[vikingaero]

OK I'll bite. What sort of world do JLR live in? Do they expect every set of traffic lights and the roads approaching them to be utterly devoid of other traffic that the lone F-Pace can swan up and motor past the lights towards utopia?

Fact is that the F-Pace will be sitting 20 car lengths from the lights, creeping forward with every other bugger. It may connect with street furniture to know that the lights will change in 30 seconds, but Kevin in front will be on his phone, Louise will be a nervous driver and take an extra 5 seconds to move off, and then Piotr the Polish lorry driver will have blocked the lights anyway.

[Jasandjules]

Oh good, we need more 4*4s accelerating to get through lights.... That won't at all be dangerous to other road users.

[drdel]

They should try making a reliable car.

[poo at Paul's]

fatboy b said:

poo at Paul's said:

Sounds like Jag are so far up their own aholes they cant see the utter pointlessness in such a plan.

As a Jag owner, I should be calling you a complete tt for that comment. But I agree.

I have a 1985 XJS!!!

[anonymous-user]

No ideas for a name said:

REALIST123 said:

Well, I quite agree that this sort of thing is quite pointless but what I’m hearing elsewhere Jaguars latest tech is pretty good.

It’s supposedly fast, has over the air updates, apps such as Apple Play working well, WhatsApp with voice messages etc

Here’s what someone who’s got the latest update say on another forum:

“I have just had my 2017 F-Pace ICTP updated to version 4.5 and it is awesome! Apple CarPlay works straight on connection. The Jaguar functions are more streamlined, much faster and look much better. At last I think we have the Infotainment system we have all deserved for a long time! Needless to say I'll need some days with the new software but I have already used voice control for navigation, sent a WhatsApp message by voice, and streamed music through Amazon Prime. Brilliant!”

I’ll be having my XF updated early December, I’ll see then.

I had to read this twice as I initialy thought it was sarcasm.

The IntouchPro in my XF looks good but has serious functionality issues. Yes it is the latest, updated a few weeks ago.
It won't update the maps, though it inducates they are available, it won't connect to 'HERE' (Jaguar's map provider) from the car. The SIM data connection has died. The DAB radio drops out...
Along with all the other electronics not being reliable - like the adaptive cruise brake checking the guy behind when there is NOTHING in front of me.
I could go on. Booked in AGAIN for fixing.. eariest appointment - three weeks.

So, no I wouldn't trust any JLR software that looks or listens for traffic lights!

Well, that’s two opinions I have!!

[anonymous-user]

Vaud said:

craigjm said:

Wozy68 said:

JLR especially should be focusing on more to save money.,They are heading for serious trouble in my mind, with a model line up that seems to make less sense each time they bring a new model out (Where does the Velar sit in it for example), warehouses full of thousands of new engines merrily rusting away as they have no sales for them, Jaguar employees building LRs as there is no sales for Jaguar . Jaguar building a 4x4 .... why try and take sales away from your own company LR? ........ and don't get me started on their inability of getting the foundation of the whole company, Defender to market.

No doubt they will blame it all on Brexit.,.,,, rather than having a damn good look in their own back yard.

Where is your evidence for either of the claims in bold? Why would they be building engines they don’t need? Their production doesn’t work on stockpiling. They also don’t have flexible production lines which is part of their problem so they can’t build LR vehicles on just any line. If they could do that they would be building Epace and Ipace on house. They are years away from lot size one

Do modern engines rust in warehouses? I would have thought a valuable supply chain asset, well oiled and crated would be good for years. The engine in my Volvo sits outside all year and isn't rusting.

Especially when they’re mostly aluminium......

[craigjm]

REALIST123 said:

Vaud said:

craigjm said:

Wozy68 said:

JLR especially should be focusing on more to save money.,They are heading for serious trouble in my mind, with a model line up that seems to make less sense each time they bring a new model out (Where does the Velar sit in it for example), warehouses full of thousands of new engines merrily rusting away as they have no sales for them, Jaguar employees building LRs as there is no sales for Jaguar . Jaguar building a 4x4 .... why try and take sales away from your own company LR? ........ and don't get me started on their inability of getting the foundation of the whole company, Defender to market.

No doubt they will blame it all on Brexit.,.,,, rather than having a damn good look in their own back yard.

Where is your evidence for either of the claims in bold? Why would they be building engines they don’t need? Their production doesn’t work on stockpiling. They also don’t have flexible production lines which is part of their problem so they can’t build LR vehicles on just any line. If they could do that they would be building Epace and Ipace on house. They are years away from lot size one

Do modern engines rust in warehouses? I would have thought a valuable supply chain asset, well oiled and crated would be good for years. The engine in my Volvo sits outside all year and isn't rusting.

Especially when they’re mostly aluminium......

They wouldn’t be sitting in warehouses because they are only built on demand these days

[Wozy68]

craigjm said:

REALIST123 said:

Vaud said:

craigjm said:

Wozy68 said:

JLR especially should be focusing on more to save money.,They are heading for serious trouble in my mind, with a model line up that seems to make less sense each time they bring a new model out (Where does the Velar sit in it for example), warehouses full of thousands of new engines merrily rusting away as they have no sales for them, Jaguar employees building LRs as there is no sales for Jaguar . Jaguar building a 4x4 .... why try and take sales away from your own company LR? ........ and don't get me started on their inability of getting the foundation of the whole company, Defender to market.

No doubt they will blame it all on Brexit.,.,,, rather than having a damn good look in their own back yard.

Where is your evidence for either of the claims in bold? Why would they be building engines they don’t need? Their production doesn’t work on stockpiling. They also don’t have flexible production lines which is part of their problem so they can’t build LR vehicles on just any line. If they could do that they would be building Epace and Ipace on house. They are years away from lot size one

Do modern engines rust in warehouses? I would have thought a valuable supply chain asset, well oiled and crated would be good for years. The engine in my Volvo sits outside all year and isn't rusting.

Especially when they’re mostly aluminium......

They wouldn’t be sitting in warehouses because they are only built on demand these days

The engines are being stored, and have not been 'built on demand'. The assumption must be, they haven't a sale to install these engines into. I can't really say more on this, I could give facts but If I did go into more detail on the matter I may get someone unintentionally in trouble so I wont. But it is thousands.

In reference to Jag guys working on the LR line. A close friend works on remedial at LR, ie fixing cockups that have happened on the line ...….. As they are not used to assembling LRs, there is far more faults being found since the Jaguar guys came on steam, which is understandable initially. Its hardly a company secret that Jaguar employees have been shipped over to LR to keep them busy.

You can believe all or part or none of the above. Absolutely no issue with me if you think I'm making it all up.

Edited by Wozy68 on Saturday 17th November 23:49

[lyonspride]

drdel said:

They should try making a reliable car.

They don't need to, as long it doesn't fail in the first 2 years, their main customer base will keep coming back every time the lease is up.

As for this tech, basically tech to stop owners jumping red lights, tech to help them find parking spaces instead of parking in disabled bays, tech to warn them of emergency vehicles because they're blind as a bat and can't hear a damn thing inside their huge metal box.

[Graveworm]

littleredrooster said:

^ ^ This is the crux of all this 'lane departure assist', 'collision avoidance system' et al crap, IMO. The very basis of driving should be the driver having responsibility, accountability and sufficient skills to make driving safe.

I get that but, if the car intervenes, if the driver does not its safer for all other road users. I have cars that apparently will stop me crashing into cars or pedestrians with much better reaction time than I have. I have managed for decades without them but given how many accidents do happen, that these would have prevented, and how many fewer accidents cars equipped with them have, I can't see any reason not to have them.

[otolith]

I can see why someone might say “I don’t care about that, I’m not paying for it”. I really don’t see why someone would object to having something that tells them what speed to do in order to catch the traffic lights. It just extends the capability of what a good driver does anyway.

[akirk]

Graveworm said:

littleredrooster said:

^ ^ This is the crux of all this 'lane departure assist', 'collision avoidance system' et al crap, IMO. The very basis of driving should be the driver having responsibility, accountability and sufficient skills to make driving safe.

I get that but, if the car intervenes, if the driver does not its safer for all other road users. I have cars that apparently will stop me crashing into cars or pedestrians with much better reaction time than I have. I have managed for decades without them but given how many accidents do happen, that these would have prevented, and how many fewer accidents cars equipped with them have, I can't see any reason not to have them.

I will disagree, the expectation of the technology leads to a de-skilled driver group, who may then get in a car without and mess up / not bother focusing - leading to accidents...
there are plenty of examples of the technology not working - leading to issues...
if there are drivers who 'need' this technology to be safer, then perhaps a better solution would be to remove their licences?! I can't see any reason to have them

[Graveworm]

akirk said:

I will disagree, the expectation of the technology leads to a de-skilled driver group, who may then get in a car without and mess up / not bother focusing - leading to accidents...
there are plenty of examples of the technology not working - leading to issues...
if there are drivers who 'need' this technology to be safer, then perhaps a better solution would be to remove their licences?! I can't see any reason to have them

I agree that better drivers is an easy win but no government has shown any interest in promoting, let alone compelling further driver training despite it reducing accidents by about 40 percent.
Where is the evidence that driver aids it leads to a de-skilled driver group? In any event, if de-skilled + driver aids = less accidents, then they are still the safer group. There is pretty compelling evidence that drivers of cars with safety aids have fewer accidents.

[Vaud]

akirk said:

I will disagree, the expectation of the technology leads to a de-skilled driver group, who may then get in a car without and mess up / not bother focusing - leading to accidents...
there are plenty of examples of the technology not working - leading to issues...
if there are drivers who 'need' this technology to be safer, then perhaps a better solution would be to remove their licences?! I can't see any reason to have them

Stats disagree.
I have the driver aid pack on my Volvo (lane warning, blindspot, etc) and it reduces my premium vs not fitted.

I also find it makes me a better driver, especially for keeping the right distances.

Edited by Vaud on Monday 19th November 06:56

[jagnet]

fatboy b said:

poo at Paul's said:

Sounds like Jag are so far up their own aholes they cant see the utter pointlessness in such a plan.

As a Jag owner, I should be calling you a complete tt for that comment. But I agree.

Well I'm glad to see that I'm not alone in thinking that.

As for this tech, rolling up to a set of lights from some distance away at at 5mph in order to avoid coming to a stop is fine in light traffic with no one following, but with other drivers behind it's a sure fire way to generate rage in others.

[rdjohn]

As a theoretical exercise this is all well and good - the internet of everything will save mankind - right?

But the headline suggests that “Jaguar Land Rover launches pioneering tech to avoid red lights”, this is very unlikely to happen in a city near you, anytime soon.

Network capacity is the limiting factor. Below about 90% of capacity delays are predictable and computer control can marshal platoons of traffic reasonably well. Above 90%, random elements become prevalent and delays become unpredictable. Communication between the lights and vehicles cannot increase capacity - it is just a matter of how much time you spend queuing, rather than driving.

But hey, if JLR can convince a few people that it has the technology to plait sand, then we might all rush out and buy one. But, more cars will only increase demand at junctions, so expect to be delayed a little longer on your morning commute.

[anonymous-user]

Vaud said:

akirk said:

I will disagree, the expectation of the technology leads to a de-skilled driver group, who may then get in a car without and mess up / not bother focusing - leading to accidents...
there are plenty of examples of the technology not working - leading to issues...
if there are drivers who 'need' this technology to be safer, then perhaps a better solution would be to remove their licences?! I can't see any reason to have them

Stats disagree.
I have the driver aid pack on my Volvo (lane warning, blindspot, etc) and it reduces my premium vs not fitted.

I also find it makes me a better driver, especially for keeping the right distances.

Edited by anonymous-user on Monday 19th November 06:56

Your insurer asked you about those things? I have never been asked about anything like that.