Inheritance question.....
Discussion
TTmonkey said:
Amazing, could barely recognise herself in the mirror but was sharp enough to think about a new will...... ha.
If that's true, and given the amount of money involved, I would think it worth at least a preliminary chat with a solicitor to discuss whether there might be any possibility of challenging it on the grounds that she lacked mental capacity to make the new will. Assuming that's a route you and your wife would want to go down of course (it does sound like you're not best pleased). rsbmw said:
If she was not of sound mind, it's possible she was coerced into that by the surviving daughter. Worth a challenge.
Certainly worth speaking to a "specialist" for £250 or so.Have a read of this:
http://holbech.co.uk/probate-claims-grounds-of-inv...
Aretnap said:
TTmonkey said:
Amazing, could barely recognise herself in the mirror but was sharp enough to think about a new will...... ha.
If that's true, and given the amount of money involved, I would think it worth at least a preliminary chat with a solicitor to discuss whether there might be any possibility of challenging it on the grounds that she lacked mental capacity to make the new will. Assuming that's a route you and your wife would want to go down of course (it does sound like you're not best pleased). The recent new will means she now doesn't have to share the estate with her niece which she would previously have to have done per Section 33(1).
Somewhat convenient if it was drawn up and witnessed after Belinda died...
TTmonkey said:
Belinda had spent the last 15 years looking after Elsie, whilst Barbara spent her time travelling the world and spending a lot of money that she had previously got from insurance payouts enjoying life.
£700k will pay for quite a bit more of the lifestyle she seems to have accustomed herself to.Certainly worth looking into if you think it’s not legit. It does happen. I know one family that was torn apart over a will that was changed to benefit one person as opposed to being shared between 3. That was a £450k estate. Went all the way to court with handwriting experts etc. Who all said the new will was bulls
t but it didn’t change anything in the end so guess you need some hefty proof
t but it didn’t change anything in the end so guess you need some hefty proofI'm going to go against the tide here and say that, given the situation, I'd be more inclined to let it lie.
It may seem unfair, but the challenging the will will be a long, drawn out, stressful and expensive process - and there is a very good chance that you will get nothing at the end and just destroy any relationship between you/your wife and her aunt/cousins/etc for ever and leave yourself with £thousands in solicitors bills to pay.
You may not approve of your aunt-in-law's lifestyle, but it seems that her mother didn't see any problem with it.
It may seem unfair, but the challenging the will will be a long, drawn out, stressful and expensive process - and there is a very good chance that you will get nothing at the end and just destroy any relationship between you/your wife and her aunt/cousins/etc for ever and leave yourself with £thousands in solicitors bills to pay.
You may not approve of your aunt-in-law's lifestyle, but it seems that her mother didn't see any problem with it.
boyse7en said:
I'm going to go against the tide here and say that, given the situation, I'd be more inclined to let it lie.
It may seem unfair, but the challenging the will will be a long, drawn out, stressful and expensive process - and there is a very good chance that you will get nothing at the end and just destroy any relationship between you/your wife and her aunt/cousins/etc for ever and leave yourself with £thousands in solicitors bills to pay.
You may not approve of your aunt-in-law's lifestyle, but it seems that her mother didn't see any problem with it.
I can see your point but me personally, I would at least speak to a contentious probate solicitor, possibly make a Larke v Nugus enquiry (costs nothing) and see the circumstances it was drafted / amended under..........at 94 I would suggest the "Golden Rule" should have been followed and why change her Will just before she died? It may seem unfair, but the challenging the will will be a long, drawn out, stressful and expensive process - and there is a very good chance that you will get nothing at the end and just destroy any relationship between you/your wife and her aunt/cousins/etc for ever and leave yourself with £thousands in solicitors bills to pay.
You may not approve of your aunt-in-law's lifestyle, but it seems that her mother didn't see any problem with it.
Getting medical records etc can all be done before getting fully legal and committing to big legal bills (cost about £60 IIRC)........... Only issue I can see is that he may need to be quick if probate has already been granted.
Sounds wrong, but really enjoying this thread.
I knew of a guy that pushed his dying father into changing his will, preventing his 2 brothers from getting anything. When the father died all 3 brothers went to court to argue. Family wasn't particularly close but god did these brothers argue / get nasty. The guy eventually managed to argue that his dad was sane and the will was decided to be legit, he then got his house, However, afterwards he told me on the quiet that he had pushed / got his dad to change the will to favour him. From that moment I decided to call it quits on our friendship. I see this was a rotten core quality of a man.
Sounds like there was quite an estate, which `could` help your daughter / MIL granddaughter in life. Therefore I would accept that the relationship between your wife's family will change and go for it. Money always causes arguments but if you do nothing then I doubt you will ever look at your sister inlaw in the same way again anyway, so have nothing to loose.
Best of luck.
OP, keep us updated.
I knew of a guy that pushed his dying father into changing his will, preventing his 2 brothers from getting anything. When the father died all 3 brothers went to court to argue. Family wasn't particularly close but god did these brothers argue / get nasty. The guy eventually managed to argue that his dad was sane and the will was decided to be legit, he then got his house, However, afterwards he told me on the quiet that he had pushed / got his dad to change the will to favour him. From that moment I decided to call it quits on our friendship. I see this was a rotten core quality of a man.
Sounds like there was quite an estate, which `could` help your daughter / MIL granddaughter in life. Therefore I would accept that the relationship between your wife's family will change and go for it. Money always causes arguments but if you do nothing then I doubt you will ever look at your sister inlaw in the same way again anyway, so have nothing to loose.
Best of luck.
OP, keep us updated.
alfie2244 said:
I can see your point but me personally, I would at least speak to a contentious probate solicitor, possibly make a Larke v Nugus enquiry (costs nothing) and see the circumstances it was drafted / amended under..........at 94 I would suggest the "Golden Rule" should have been followed and why change her Will just before she died?
Getting medical records etc can all be done before getting fully legal and committing to big legal bills (cost about £60 IIRC)........... Only issue I can see is that he may need to be quick if probate has already been granted.
"why change her Will just before she died? "Getting medical records etc can all be done before getting fully legal and committing to big legal bills (cost about £60 IIRC)........... Only issue I can see is that he may need to be quick if probate has already been granted.
That's a simple one - one of her daughters had just died which would be a very strong reason for changing a will. Maybe grandma wanted her daughter to inherit but realised that when she died that the money would automatically pass onto grandaughters who she felt didn't need/deserve it (no offence OP, just postulating alternative scenarios)
Grandma may have been 94 but she can still be rational and perfectly in charge of her mental faculties
If the grant of probate has not been issued then enter a caveat with the probate office, this will be in place for six months and give you time to review matters. The cost is £15.
If you do intend to go down the route of contentious probate then you need specific grounds and evidence, you are looking at £80k upwards in legal costs.
If you do intend to go down the route of contentious probate then you need specific grounds and evidence, you are looking at £80k upwards in legal costs.
Edited by Tumbler on Thursday 17th January 10:35
boyse7en said:
"why change her Will just before she died? "
That's a simple one - one of her daughters had just died which would be a very strong reason for changing a will. Maybe grandma wanted her daughter to inherit but realised that when she died that the money would automatically pass onto grandaughters who she felt didn't need/deserve it (no offence OP, just postulating alternative scenarios)
Grandma may have been 94 but she can still be rational and perfectly in charge of her mental faculties
Exactly this. That's a simple one - one of her daughters had just died which would be a very strong reason for changing a will. Maybe grandma wanted her daughter to inherit but realised that when she died that the money would automatically pass onto grandaughters who she felt didn't need/deserve it (no offence OP, just postulating alternative scenarios)
Grandma may have been 94 but she can still be rational and perfectly in charge of her mental faculties
My grandmother was adamant at the end that her money was going to her daughters and not grandkids. Despite us growing up under a threat of 'not getting our share' if we misbehaved (6 grandkids - 3 per daughter) I didn't have much to do with them after I turned about 14 but my brother lived with them for a long while to look after them. He was given my grandad's car when he died and expected something when my grandmother died - He was pretty shocked and angry at the end of it all. Everyone expected something to go to him. Interesting neither our mother or his aunty offered him any of it though, both saying 'we'd hate to go against your grandmother's wishes' - money does weird things to people!!
For context, I know my grandmother's will;
Estate is split four ways between the four children, 25% each.
If any child passes away before she does (my Dad, aunt, uncles), then their share goes back into the pot, unless they are married (like my Dad and Aunt in which case 12.5% goes back to the pot and 12.5% to the surviving spouse, 0 for the Grandchildren in any event.
A bit harsh I think when my parents have been married 30+ years and my Dad is the main earner ...
When my other grandparents passed away, even split between the 4 children zero for he grandkids (although this didn't stop my cousin stealing all of the jewelry but that's another story).
Estate is split four ways between the four children, 25% each.
If any child passes away before she does (my Dad, aunt, uncles), then their share goes back into the pot, unless they are married (like my Dad and Aunt in which case 12.5% goes back to the pot and 12.5% to the surviving spouse, 0 for the Grandchildren in any event.
A bit harsh I think when my parents have been married 30+ years and my Dad is the main earner ...
When my other grandparents passed away, even split between the 4 children zero for he grandkids (although this didn't stop my cousin stealing all of the jewelry but that's another story).
Why does anyone consider that the mere accident of birth entitles them to anything? Also, if you want to be paid for caring for someone, train as a medic or carer. My brother and I look after our old mum. We do not do so in the hope of reward after her death.
Edited by anonymous-user on Thursday 17th January 11:56
Breadvan72 said:
Why does anyone consider that the mere accident of birth entitles them to anything? Also, if you want to be paid for caring for someone, train as a medic or cater. My brother and I look after our old mum. We do not do so in the hope of reward after her death.
QuiteMy mother in law looked after both her parents (one with cancer & the other dementia) in her home own home for a decade until they died. They left everything to her & her brothers contested the will all fighting over a pretty modest cottage in Ireland. She had no interest in it & said they can have it, it was a pleasure/privilege to look after her parents & had given her comfort & joy to know they had been cared for. The brothers who were all considerably wealthier than her (in simple monetary terms at least) ended up with nothing after the legal costs from in fighting. When my wife enquired of her mother 'how can you ever forgive them' her mother said 'Nothing to forgive. I didn't have it, I didn't want it, so I didn't lose it.'
Wont be contesting it. Old lady and her husband before her had a history of changing their will every time someone upset them.
I've seen the signature and I don't believe its faked.
We are not surprised by the outcome, we only hoped that a new will hadn't been drafted and that they would have had the decency to share the proceeds with the memory of my wife's mother in mind. Fortunately 'belinda' she was cremated not buried, she would be spinning in her grave with the knowledge that her sister was the only one getting anything.
Good luck to her, hope she does something nice with it.,
I've seen the signature and I don't believe its faked.
We are not surprised by the outcome, we only hoped that a new will hadn't been drafted and that they would have had the decency to share the proceeds with the memory of my wife's mother in mind. Fortunately 'belinda' she was cremated not buried, she would be spinning in her grave with the knowledge that her sister was the only one getting anything.
Good luck to her, hope she does something nice with it.,
V sensible, OP. Litigation over inheritance is a folly best left to the super rich (and I write this as a commercial litigator who occasionally acts in what are in reality family disputes over business empires).
Someone above made a comment to the effect of writing off xxxxxxx pounds. This shows the wrongheadedness associated with the culture of expectations . You do not write off something you have never had.
Someone above made a comment to the effect of writing off xxxxxxx pounds. This shows the wrongheadedness associated with the culture of expectations . You do not write off something you have never had.
TTmonkey said:
Mystery over. The 94 year old wrote a new will dated a couple of months before her death leaving everything to surviving daughter.
Grand daughters got nothing.
Amazing, could barely recognise herself in the mirror but was sharp enough to think about a new will...... ha.
It's amazing isnt it. Same happened to me. We cared for my nan and did everything while my auntie lived the high life overseas. My dad passed away suddenly and then my nan passed away. In this time the will was changed to leave it all to my auntie shock horror.Grand daughters got nothing.
Amazing, could barely recognise herself in the mirror but was sharp enough to think about a new will...... ha.
She did give myself £1000 for everything I did, the driving 100 miles round trip to clear the house deal with funerals etc (out of £500k+) but I didnt bother contesting. If she wanted to piss the family off she can choke on it, I know I helped my nan and did what I could so it was a honour to clear her house and arrange the funeral. The £1000 just went to wards my wedding.
I'd just move on and not think about it, Only think of the good memories with the person who passed away.
TTmonkey said:
Wont be contesting it. Old lady and her husband before her had a history of changing their will every time someone upset them.
I've seen the signature and I don't believe its faked.
We are not surprised by the outcome, we only hoped that a new will hadn't been drafted and that they would have had the decency to share the proceeds with the memory of my wife's mother in mind. Fortunately 'belinda' she was cremated not buried, she would be spinning in her grave with the knowledge that her sister was the only one getting anything.
Good luck to her, hope she does something nice with it.,
Absolutely the right approach. I can neither abide nor understand people who believe themselves entitled to anything from anyone's estate. I have no idea what my father intends to do with his estate. I suspect that he'll leave almost everything to my eldest brother to retain the assets and capital intact and that is fine by me; his property/his choice - he could leave it all to charity for all the business it is of mine.I've seen the signature and I don't believe its faked.
We are not surprised by the outcome, we only hoped that a new will hadn't been drafted and that they would have had the decency to share the proceeds with the memory of my wife's mother in mind. Fortunately 'belinda' she was cremated not buried, she would be spinning in her grave with the knowledge that her sister was the only one getting anything.
Good luck to her, hope she does something nice with it.,
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