The End of a Stolen Golf R story

The End of a Stolen Golf R story

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Discussion

Sa Calobra

36,957 posts

210 months

Tuesday 16th July 2019
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Pica-Pica said:
Really? Locking him up will cost a helluva lot more to tax-payers. 12 months suspended sentence is no holiday, nor 150 hours unpaid community service, which will probably have to be completed by a certain date.
Before the week is out he will be reoffending then caught for whatever not long after.

These people see prison not like you or me. They are non stop. Nothing bit I'll health will eventually stop them. That's when our healthcare system takes over looking after them for a couple of decades until they die.

JeremyBearimy

192 posts

227 months

Tuesday 16th July 2019
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I am really sorry to hear that, long story short but we had a van stolen and the police dropped the case despite it being a cut and dry case (he was going to prison for another offence so they decided not to prosecute the van as well).
It feels a huge injustice that these thieving scum just get away with it. As you say it seems to be there is no incentive to "do the right thing".
I look at my son and how he's always been taught not to push in, wait your turn, say please and thank you. Yet the kids that do push in, demand and don't mind their p's and q's seem to get everything whilst the good ones are side lined, i look and often think I've done him a disservice by teaching him to treat others well, when its becoming clearer and clearer that those who piss on others are rising to the top with no consequences.

Id recommend you read The Secret Barrister: Stories of the Law and How It's Broken. Its an unfortunate tale about the state of the law. Cuts, cuts and more cuts have got us to this point.

Countdown

39,607 posts

195 months

Tuesday 16th July 2019
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La Liga said:
common but false belief is that harsh conditions prohibit crime.
Makes the victims feel better though.

Johnnytheboy

24,498 posts

185 months

Tuesday 16th July 2019
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Property crime is treated far too leniently by comparison to other crimes IMO.

It's just stuff, apparently.

ging84

8,789 posts

145 months

Tuesday 16th July 2019
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I think to be honest people like this are career criminals stealing for money, not joy riders doing it for fun. If you toughen the sentences for car crime disproportionately sure they wouldn't do it, but they'd go find some other crimes that are just as lucrative. As crimes go car theft is one with relatively low levels of violence and high levels of insurance. I'd rather someone stole my car's off my drive than the jewellery out my bedroom, despite the cars being worth significantly more.

Sa Calobra

36,957 posts

210 months

Tuesday 16th July 2019
quotequote all
Countdown said:
La Liga said:
common but false belief is that harsh conditions prohibit crime.
Makes the victims feel better though.
We are here to serve the public and should not care plan/worry about the offenders rights/fund his growing family.

Lock em up. Keep them there for eternity. There's a massive strain on society both to the public purse and to the public for each prolific offender who over decades reoffends constantly.

The cycle continues, they breed whilst on drink and drugs and the result has no chance. Liberal attitudes are slowly destroying our society.

anonymous-user

53 months

Tuesday 16th July 2019
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We've had less 'liberal' attitudes towards putting people in prison since the early 1990s.

Are they working out?

JeS10

Original Poster:

375 posts

165 months

Tuesday 16th July 2019
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Some very interesting replies and debate. I should say, in the interest of said debate, I work with offenders - albeit in a limited capacity. I work with criminal justice social workers, sit in meetings with the ‘type’ of men that nicked my car and listen to how they struggle, how they take it out on their girlfriend, how they can’t support their kids, how they’re struggling with drink and drugs, how they can’t get a job. If there’s a sympathetic ear, it’s mine. Yet I still don’t feel justice. The sentence was merely for property theft and seems not to consider how massively something so (in the scheme of things) minor has affected my family so much. I don’t how it could though. The system is so stretched. I do get it.

Other points of note, which will hopefully demonstrate just how woeful the state of affairs really are:


- The car was recovered by me. I happened upon it (sounds hard to believe but I found it after a ‘tip off’ from one of those aforementioned undesirable sorts).

- It didn’t ping any ANPR but I since found out that’s because there wasn’t any ANPR to have been pinged and the police just used it as a stock response and could never actually check ANPR because it didn’t exist.

- His DNA was left on a weapon left in my house. I presume he’d have got a harsher sentence had he been found with said weapon in public than what he received for leaving it behind. Probably why he did it.

- They couldn’t track the thief down and so just waited until he was due in court for something else (low and behold he turned up) and they got him there.

- Another five cars were stolen in the town in the week preceding and week after my car getting stolen.

- According the the guy’s Instagram (yep, I looked) he likes to pose in his Stone Island tracksuit beside quite specific cars in a grey-looking council estate: Jag F-Types, RS4, S3, M3s.

- According to his Facebook (I had to check - sorry) he’s now a porter in an NHS hospital. He wasn’t when I first checked his name out a year ago.

- The gang are known to the police. A woman nearby where my car was found reported someone acting suspiciously, hanging about the car park, endlessly looping it and ultimately having an animated phone call when he must’ve discovered the car was recovered. According to the police, they knew who this man was ‘just can’t do anything about it’

- It took 9 months for him to be charged to being sentenced.





Sa Calobra

36,957 posts

210 months

Tuesday 16th July 2019
quotequote all
La Liga said:
We've had less 'liberal' attitudes towards putting people in prison since the early 1990s.

Are they working out?
Maybe you live in a more forceful area. In mine people are out in months and straight back on the horse.



For every one that we stop there's at least another released and at it again.

I don't share your optimistic view on offenders.

On a wider note: It's about time we thought about the voters. Purely about them before justice and police reform means horribly changes. It's not working.

Edited by Sa Calobra on Tuesday 16th July 23:39

PorkInsider

5,876 posts

140 months

Wednesday 17th July 2019
quotequote all
Pica-Pica said:
Kawasicki said:
Seems unreasonably lenient.
Really? Locking him up will cost a helluva lot more to tax-payers. 12 months suspended sentence is no holiday, nor 150 hours unpaid community service, which will probably have to be completed by a certain date.
By the same logic, not bothering with a justice system at all would be even cheaper.

I don't give a flying fk about the cost, personally. In fact, as I've said before on PH, I'd happily pay more tax to build and fund more prisons. Regardless of prison's effectiveness regarding deterrence or recidivism, if a scumbag is locked up he's not offending, and that suits me fine.

anonymous-user

53 months

Wednesday 17th July 2019
quotequote all
Sa Calobra said:
La Liga said:
We've had less 'liberal' attitudes towards putting people in prison since the early 1990s.

Are they working out?
Maybe you live in a more forceful area. In mine people are out in months and straight back on the horse.
Sentencing is consistent as it's driven by guidelines

See the data from the early 90s to early 2010s.

More people in prison for longer. The opposite of 'liberal attitudes'.


Sa Calobra

36,957 posts

210 months

Wednesday 17th July 2019
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KAgantua

3,835 posts

130 months

Wednesday 17th July 2019
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Retroman said:
This isn't about a Golf R but a long tale about a stolen car and weak punishment that ruined my friends life for a while.

Friend and his girlfriend lived in Scotland. Both worked fully time.
My friend was told his job was in jeopardy. He could apply for a lower position in Scotland and continue to work with the company or if he wanted to keep his position he would need to relocate to a place of work in England.
He done the latter and moved to Manchester with his girlfriend (she was lucky and got a transfer)

After a short while she fell pregnant and shortly after that my friend had to go off on the sick from his work due to an old injury on his achilles tendon.
She at the time had a brand new Astra with all the bells and whistles.
He had a Corsa 1.3CDTI and fairly modern.

She was using his car to drive him to the hospital for his appointment but when they returnedd (still daylight) they noticed her Astra gone and broken class everywhere.
Called the police and reported it stolen.
Checked CCTV with neighbours etc and video had captured a recovery vehicle pull up, smash the window, load it on and drive away.

My friend realised his spare key for the Corsa was also in the Astra so his neighbours were nice enough to park thier cars in a way that jammed the Corsa into the parking area so it couldn't be moved without moving their cars. Police / insurance co were advised of all of this as well but offered no suggestions / help

Police caught up with the recovery driver who had advised he had a phone call from someone telling him they lost the keys and to go pick up the car and drop it off so he could get the garage to make a new key. Recovery driver didn't question this apparently.
When he dropped the car off he was paid cash and he gave the police all the details about the person who paid him.

Person who paid him was quickly traced by and found by police but they didn't charge him straight away due to gathering more evidence and further investigation.
During this time there were groups of young guys who no one recognized asking people in the street about the Corsa and my friend etc.
Neighbours and my friends heard cars outside, but when they opened the curtains the cars just tore away.

My friend and his girlfriend were stressed out their heads. She was still having to pay finance on the car due to insurance waiting for the police to come to a conclusion with the case. Both getting next to no sleep. Both were worried the stress might cause them to lose the unborn baby so they moved back to Scotland and he lost his job.

Eventually the gentleman was pulled in and question by police. He claimed he ran up a coke debt with some people who "forced him" to deliver them this Astra to clear off his debt.
He was ordered to pay back a huge sum of money to my friends girlfriend and her insurance and gap insurance eventually paid out. The guy who stole the car was actually living with and dating a school teacher and using her and some other nonsense good will / caught up with the wrong people statements he didn't get any jail time at all.

This was all about 3 years ago and so far my friend's girlfriend is still waiting on a payment. He claims he can't pay as has no money but both him and his girlfriend seem to be enjoying the high life with lots of expensive holidays, cars etc looking at their recent public FB posts.

TL;DR?

Guy stole my friends girlfriends car. Made their life hell, got caught and essentially got let off.
Mate this is what gets me - having had something similar, he didnt pay either. I dont think I have ever heard a story where the criminal has paid the compensation to the victim. What is the point of setting up these charges if they are not enforced? Really its another way to rub the victims nose in it.

richs2891

895 posts

252 months

Wednesday 17th July 2019
quotequote all
OK so reading most of the thread, jail doe not seem to deter or ultimately stop offending,
Should we say follow the countries that chop the offenders right hand off ? And no disability for them in regards to the arm.

Would the social stigma of a missing right hand reduce crimes ?

anonymous-user

53 months

Wednesday 17th July 2019
quotequote all
La Liga said:
Sa Calobra said:
La Liga said:
We've had less 'liberal' attitudes towards putting people in prison since the early 1990s.

Are they working out?
Maybe you live in a more forceful area. In mine people are out in months and straight back on the horse.
Sentencing is consistent as it's driven by guidelines

See the data from the early 90s to early 2010s.

More people in prison for longer. The opposite of 'liberal attitudes'.
Does that data take population growth and demographic change into account?

So what do you think needs to be done? Turn a blind eye? That would, statistically, reduce crime.

Retroman

961 posts

132 months

Wednesday 17th July 2019
quotequote all
richs2891 said:
OK so reading most of the thread, jail doe not seem to deter or ultimately stop offending,
Should we say follow the countries that chop the offenders right hand off ? And no disability for them in regards to the arm.

Would the social stigma of a missing right hand reduce crimes ?
Unlikely.

USA has some very harsh punishments for even small crimes, yet it has some of the highest violent crime rates in the west.
Harder punishments breed hardened criminals.

pavarotti1980

4,822 posts

83 months

Wednesday 17th July 2019
quotequote all
is there not a country in the Commenwealth whereabouts we can send these criminals so they dont infest our waters?

I dont know, maybe somewhere on the other side of the world.....smile

snobetter

1,141 posts

145 months

Wednesday 17th July 2019
quotequote all
pavarotti1980 said:
is there not a country in the Commenwealth whereabouts we can send these criminals so they dont infest our waters?

I dont know, maybe somewhere on the other side of the world.....smile
Myself, wife and children committed a crime worthy of 2 - 3 months of said punishment.

irc

7,113 posts

135 months

Wednesday 17th July 2019
quotequote all
La Liga said:
entencing is consistent as it's driven by guidelines

See the data from the early 90s to early 2010s.

More people in prison for longer. The opposite of 'liberal attitudes'.
And it is working. A higher prison population has resulted in less crime.

"Robust policing protects the honest poor – and the poor want more police. Tougher sentencing is popular across the income spectrum – but it would help the poor most of all.It is easy to underestimate the effect of locking up the average criminal even for as little as a year, but each prison sentence means no one outside that prison can be victimised by them for the duration of the time they serve. The numbers of crimes prevented appear to be very large indeed. In 2000, the Home Office concluded that the average offender committed 140 crimes every year. The average drug offender was estimated to commit 257 crimes a year. The graph below shows that, since 1980, every extra criminal in prison was associated with an average of 176 fewer crimes a year. The result was statistically significant and the correlation was 0.78, implying that more than 60% of the variation in crime rates was attributable to how many criminals were in prison, rather than free to commit crimes."







https://www.civitas.org.uk/content/files/povertyan...


Zetec-S

5,816 posts

92 months

Wednesday 17th July 2019
quotequote all
Retroman said:
richs2891 said:
OK so reading most of the thread, jail doe not seem to deter or ultimately stop offending,
Should we say follow the countries that chop the offenders right hand off ? And no disability for them in regards to the arm.

Would the social stigma of a missing right hand reduce crimes ?
Unlikely.

USA has some very harsh punishments for even small crimes, yet it has some of the highest violent crime rates in the west.
Harder punishments breed hardened criminals.
That's the trouble. I read somewhere that the "Three Strikes Law" in the USA can actually increase the level of violence. So if you're on your last chance and committing armed robbery, knowing if you get caught it'll be a mandatory life sentence, then shooting that person as well is not going to make any difference to the punishment (and arguably reduces your chances of getting caught if it means there are no witnesses).