E Scooters soon to be allowed on UK roads?
Discussion
Lord Marylebone said:
Fatball said:
Not sure I’m interested in them if they restrict the speed 
You honestly think they would allow people to ride electric scooters on public roads at speeds like 30mph, 40mph etc?I'm as interested in seeing privately owned e-scooters legalised as anyone, but allowing them to exceed a fairly limited speed is just bonkers and unrealistic.
I've had a go on one, and from personal experience, 16mph is more than fast enough for use in urban environments and on public roads for commuting.
If you want to go faster on two wheels and still be powered by batteries, then 'Speed Pedelec Bicycles' and electric motorcycles are freely available to you.
Fatball said:
Nah, keep the electric motorcycles and pedelec stuff, the one I’m looking at is rated at 24mph and available in the U.K.
No one is stopping you buying anything and riding it, but what you are proposing is exactly the same offence as you going out and buying a motorcycle and riding it without a licence, insurance, or MOT.It doesn’t bother me what other people do, but it amazes me that someone would risk their driving licence, six points, and a whopping fine just to do 24mph on an electric scooter.
Your occupation is listed as ‘legal’ which amazes me even more that the risk doesn’t worry you.
I wanted to go a bit faster on two wheels, so I just went out and passed my motorcycle test.
When e scooters become legal for private usage on the roads, I’ll certainly buy one, but I’ll happily leave it set to the legal standard.
Edited by anonymous-user on Thursday 15th October 21:18
MB140 said:
Abbott said:
RizzoTheRat said:
Abbott said:
Just seen an article in The Times this morning explaining that Link will introduce scooters that switch off if you move to the pavement
Latest e-scooter turns itself off the second riders leave the road
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/latest-e-scoote...
Article's paywalled, but I'd be interested to see how they achieve that, I can see that maybe GPS could be used to keep them out of large pedestrian areas but no way it's accurate or reliable enough to keep them off pavements.Latest e-scooter turns itself off the second riders leave the road
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/latest-e-scoote...
https://www.link.city/#geofencing
It is suggesting that it does have the technology to distinguish the Go No Go to 0.5 metre
Current GPS systems (non military) with optimal satellite coverage in an open area with no interference from buildings etc is about 5m (radius) at best and you will be exceptionally lucky to get it that accurate.
Edited by MB140 on Tuesday 6th October 16:10
what area do you work in ?
ruggedscotty said:
MB140 said:
Abbott said:
RizzoTheRat said:
Abbott said:
Just seen an article in The Times this morning explaining that Link will introduce scooters that switch off if you move to the pavement
Latest e-scooter turns itself off the second riders leave the road
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/latest-e-scoote...
Article's paywalled, but I'd be interested to see how they achieve that, I can see that maybe GPS could be used to keep them out of large pedestrian areas but no way it's accurate or reliable enough to keep them off pavements.Latest e-scooter turns itself off the second riders leave the road
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/latest-e-scoote...
https://www.link.city/#geofencing
It is suggesting that it does have the technology to distinguish the Go No Go to 0.5 metre
Current GPS systems (non military) with optimal satellite coverage in an open area with no interference from buildings etc is about 5m (radius) at best and you will be exceptionally lucky to get it that accurate.
Edited by MB140 on Tuesday 6th October 16:10
what area do you work in ?
Lord Marylebone said:
Fatball said:
Nah, keep the electric motorcycles and pedelec stuff, the one I’m looking at is rated at 24mph and available in the U.K.
No one is stopping you buying anything and riding it, but what you are proposing is exactly the same offence as you going out and buying a motorcycle and riding it without a licence, insurance, or MOT.It doesn’t bother me what other people do, but it amazes me that someone would risk their driving licence, six points, and a whopping fine just to do 24mph on an electric scooter.
Your occupation is listed as ‘legal’ which amazes me even more that the risk doesn’t worry you.
I wanted to go a bit faster on two wheels, so I just went out and passed my motorcycle test.
When e scooters become legal for private usage on the roads, I’ll certainly buy one, but I’ll happily leave it set to the legal standard.
Edited by Lord Marylebone on Thursday 15th October 21:18
I have slightly different reservation with e-scooters for the following reason.
Whilst commuting to work this morning on my legal(ish) e-bike, I rode over some appalling sections of broken up road that I struggled to see detail of in the dark. Having big wheels meant that I just clattered over the holes and carried on.
Some holes were probably big enough to halt the progress of a tiny scooter wheel causing the rider to faceplant.
Until now there's not been much in the way of powered vehicles on the roads with such tiny wheels.
So do cash strapped councils now have to maintain billiard table flat smooth roads lest they face increased compo claims from scooter riders who've crashed on potholes that would not bother most other vehicles?
I'd love the roads to be in better condition but we'll all have to pay for that and it's just not always possible, especially on the lesser used quieter routes that are more popular with bikes and potentially these scooters.
Am not against them and can see the positives (apart from the inevitable idiot use), but helmets, lights, and hi viz, and keep off the FFing pavement at anything over 4mph please, all like you SHOULD on a bike.
Whilst commuting to work this morning on my legal(ish) e-bike, I rode over some appalling sections of broken up road that I struggled to see detail of in the dark. Having big wheels meant that I just clattered over the holes and carried on.
Some holes were probably big enough to halt the progress of a tiny scooter wheel causing the rider to faceplant.
Until now there's not been much in the way of powered vehicles on the roads with such tiny wheels.
So do cash strapped councils now have to maintain billiard table flat smooth roads lest they face increased compo claims from scooter riders who've crashed on potholes that would not bother most other vehicles?
I'd love the roads to be in better condition but we'll all have to pay for that and it's just not always possible, especially on the lesser used quieter routes that are more popular with bikes and potentially these scooters.
Am not against them and can see the positives (apart from the inevitable idiot use), but helmets, lights, and hi viz, and keep off the FFing pavement at anything over 4mph please, all like you SHOULD on a bike.
georgezippy said:
I have slightly different reservation with e-scooters for the following reason.
Whilst commuting to work this morning on my legal(ish) e-bike, I rode over some appalling sections of broken up road that I struggled to see detail of in the dark. Having big wheels meant that I just clattered over the holes and carried on.
Some holes were probably big enough to halt the progress of a tiny scooter wheel causing the rider to faceplant.
Until now there's not been much in the way of powered vehicles on the roads with such tiny wheels.
So do cash strapped councils now have to maintain billiard table flat smooth roads lest they face increased compo claims from scooter riders who've crashed on potholes that would not bother most other vehicles?
I'd love the roads to be in better condition but we'll all have to pay for that and it's just not always possible, especially on the lesser used quieter routes that are more popular with bikes and potentially these scooters.
Am not against them and can see the positives (apart from the inevitable idiot use), but helmets, lights, and hi viz, and keep off the FFing pavement at anything over 4mph please, all like you SHOULD on a bike.
See my earlier post about small wheels, bumps, and inadequate gyroscopic stability.Whilst commuting to work this morning on my legal(ish) e-bike, I rode over some appalling sections of broken up road that I struggled to see detail of in the dark. Having big wheels meant that I just clattered over the holes and carried on.
Some holes were probably big enough to halt the progress of a tiny scooter wheel causing the rider to faceplant.
Until now there's not been much in the way of powered vehicles on the roads with such tiny wheels.
So do cash strapped councils now have to maintain billiard table flat smooth roads lest they face increased compo claims from scooter riders who've crashed on potholes that would not bother most other vehicles?
I'd love the roads to be in better condition but we'll all have to pay for that and it's just not always possible, especially on the lesser used quieter routes that are more popular with bikes and potentially these scooters.
Am not against them and can see the positives (apart from the inevitable idiot use), but helmets, lights, and hi viz, and keep off the FFing pavement at anything over 4mph please, all like you SHOULD on a bike.
Do gyroscopic forces really provide much stability? On a bicycle the wheels don't turn fast enough and have too little mass to really have much of an effect. When you hold a bicycle wheel by the spindle and spin it fast, you can feel some gyroscopic forces but only by spinning the wheel much faster than typical road speeds of 15-20mph. And even then those forces are miniscule compared with the mass of the rider and bicycle. Perhaps on a motorcycle at much higher speeds, the more massive wheels and tyres probably do generate significant forces, but I think most stability in two-wheeled machines comes from steering trail which provides a self-centring force and even a countersteering effect if the vehicle flops from side to side.
Edited to add that I've just googled it and it seems that the Department of Engineering at Cambridge University agree:
http://www2.eng.cam.ac.uk/~hemh1/gyrobike.htm
As does this linked article:
https://theconversation.com/how-does-a-bike-stay-u...
Edited to add that I've just googled it and it seems that the Department of Engineering at Cambridge University agree:
http://www2.eng.cam.ac.uk/~hemh1/gyrobike.htm
As does this linked article:
https://theconversation.com/how-does-a-bike-stay-u...
Edited by LunarOne on Saturday 17th October 13:26
Well, the trial is off to a good start--> Peaky Dippers On BBC News - 27th October 2020
Laurel Green said:
Well, the trial is off to a good start--> Peaky Dippers On BBC News - 27th October 2020
Wow. THREE scooters have gone missing? How will the companies survive?Laurel Green said:
Well, the trial is off to a good start--> Peaky Dippers On BBC News - 27th October 2020
How bizarre.An entire news article dedicated to people not finding any e scooters in a canal.
I live in Milton Keynes.
Apart from being nearly collected as I walked around a corner in the shopping centre by a scooter going flat out, there are lots of abandoned scooters scattered in the outskirts. I guess they have run out of credit/puff, but must be a nightmare to find and collect as most are some way off the road and on the large 'redway' cycle paths.
Must cost a fortune to recover them.
Not sure of their safety as young loonies seem to have little awareness of their speed in a pavement/urban setting. They are not the most agile of contraptions.
Apart from being nearly collected as I walked around a corner in the shopping centre by a scooter going flat out, there are lots of abandoned scooters scattered in the outskirts. I guess they have run out of credit/puff, but must be a nightmare to find and collect as most are some way off the road and on the large 'redway' cycle paths.
Must cost a fortune to recover them.
Not sure of their safety as young loonies seem to have little awareness of their speed in a pavement/urban setting. They are not the most agile of contraptions.
Zed 44 said:
I must be the only remaining petrolhead on here. If these e-scooterists want to use the road, let them pay tax, display a large number plate and have insurance. They and cyclists are nothing short of a public nuisance. God help us.
Quite bemused by this comment. In my opinion the last thing that anyone who thinks like this is, is a petrolhead. There is no celebration of freedom and the joys of the open road here, are there? 🙂With an attitude like that you’re not a petrolhead at all Zed, you’re a curmudgeon, and there are tens of millions of curmudgeons out there, clogging the roads up, being miserable and complaining about anyone enjoying themselves.
andygo said:
I live in Milton Keynes.
Apart from being nearly collected as I walked around a corner in the shopping centre by a scooter going flat out, there are lots of abandoned scooters scattered in the outskirts. I guess they have run out of credit/puff, but must be a nightmare to find and collect as most are some way off the road and on the large 'redway' cycle paths.
Must cost a fortune to recover them.
Not sure of their safety as young loonies seem to have little awareness of their speed in a pavement/urban setting. They are not the most agile of contraptions.
Such is one of the flaws of rental trials determining policy. If you ride one you own, you don't leave it lying around willy nilly.Apart from being nearly collected as I walked around a corner in the shopping centre by a scooter going flat out, there are lots of abandoned scooters scattered in the outskirts. I guess they have run out of credit/puff, but must be a nightmare to find and collect as most are some way off the road and on the large 'redway' cycle paths.
Must cost a fortune to recover them.
Not sure of their safety as young loonies seem to have little awareness of their speed in a pavement/urban setting. They are not the most agile of contraptions.
andygo said:
I live in Milton Keynes.
Apart from being nearly collected as I walked around a corner in the shopping centre by a scooter going flat out, there are lots of abandoned scooters scattered in the outskirts. I guess they have run out of credit/puff, but must be a nightmare to find and collect as most are some way off the road and on the large 'redway' cycle paths.
Must cost a fortune to recover them.
Not sure of their safety as young loonies seem to have little awareness of their speed in a pavement/urban setting. They are not the most agile of contraptions.
Apart from being nearly collected as I walked around a corner in the shopping centre by a scooter going flat out, there are lots of abandoned scooters scattered in the outskirts. I guess they have run out of credit/puff, but must be a nightmare to find and collect as most are some way off the road and on the large 'redway' cycle paths.
Must cost a fortune to recover them.
Not sure of their safety as young loonies seem to have little awareness of their speed in a pavement/urban setting. They are not the most agile of contraptions.
- sigh* another one who doesn't understand they are supposed to be hop on, hop off, the idea is you ride to where you are going and end the ride and leave it there for the next person to collect. They only get rounded up when they need charging. I live in MK as well and the number of people who totally miss this is astounding!
Trials of E Scooters to be greatly expanded in London:
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/transport/london-h...
https://www.cityam.com/transport-for-london-to-beg...
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/transport/london-h...
https://www.cityam.com/transport-for-london-to-beg...
Lord Marylebone said:
Trials of E Scooters to be greatly expanded in London:
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/transport/london-h...
https://www.cityam.com/transport-for-london-to-beg...
Whilst I welcome this move I'm concerned about the continual ban of private ownership. `It smacks of "controlling the pheasants". https://www.standard.co.uk/news/transport/london-h...
https://www.cityam.com/transport-for-london-to-beg...
Once they've decided how successful and profitable the scheme is don't be surprised if other new transport schemes follow. Self driving cars, rental only, at the same time private vehicles are banned in cities.
And look at the cost.£1 usage then 15p/minute. A round trip (2 mile each way) 4mile commute at say an average of 6mph (traffic lights etc)is going to cost £8 so £40 week. The only current scheme at the Olympic park is 23p/ minute. Let's keep those miserable workers going down a drain underground out of site whilst we extract ever more cash from them.
There's loads of scooters in use already, people are just getting on with it and it's fine. Once these trials start you watch them clamp down on privateers. Pay, pay pay.
Harry H said:
Whilst I welcome this move I'm concerned about the continual ban of private ownership. `It smacks of "controlling the pheasants".
Once they've decided how successful and profitable the scheme is don't be surprised if other new transport schemes follow. Self driving cars, rental only, at the same time private vehicles are banned in cities.
And look at the cost.£1 usage then 15p/minute. A round trip (2 mile each way) 4mile commute at say an average of 6mph (traffic lights etc)is going to cost £8 so £40 week. The only current scheme at the Olympic park is 23p/ minute. Let's keep those miserable workers going down a drain underground out of site whilst we extract ever more cash from them.
There's loads of scooters in use already, people are just getting on with it and it's fine. Once these trials start you watch them clamp down on privateers. Pay, pay pay.
I am willing to bet my own money that the endgame here is private ownership being allowed.Once they've decided how successful and profitable the scheme is don't be surprised if other new transport schemes follow. Self driving cars, rental only, at the same time private vehicles are banned in cities.
And look at the cost.£1 usage then 15p/minute. A round trip (2 mile each way) 4mile commute at say an average of 6mph (traffic lights etc)is going to cost £8 so £40 week. The only current scheme at the Olympic park is 23p/ minute. Let's keep those miserable workers going down a drain underground out of site whilst we extract ever more cash from them.
There's loads of scooters in use already, people are just getting on with it and it's fine. Once these trials start you watch them clamp down on privateers. Pay, pay pay.
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