How enforceable is a will?
Discussion
My mother passed away in Jul this year and I was the sole executor of her tiny will. I've done as she wished so no dramas but one thing that has irked me throughout the whole sorry episode was my tragically moronic brother's behaviour. He's an utter waste of skin at the best of times but he really surpassed himself this time through properly nasty emails, not calling to ask how she was doing before she died, ranting on Facebook about perceived slights from his family and so on. You know, the sort of behaviour you'd expect from a 47 year old man.
Anyway, my mother left him around £1k in the form of a half-sovereign and PO account with about £500 in it. At one point I was seriously considering not giving him the coin but selling it and giving the money to one of her favourite charities as he was being such a d
head. I didn't and it's now sat in a box in the garage along with a load of his other crap that he refuses to collect. For the avoidance of doubt (and my own sanity) I'm not going to sell it but if I did, where would I stand from a legal perspective? It got me thinking about wills in general, I could have completely ignored everything my mother wanted in her will and done something else instead as there are no checks etc? Idly curious before anyone starts berating me.
Anyway, my mother left him around £1k in the form of a half-sovereign and PO account with about £500 in it. At one point I was seriously considering not giving him the coin but selling it and giving the money to one of her favourite charities as he was being such a d
head. I didn't and it's now sat in a box in the garage along with a load of his other crap that he refuses to collect. For the avoidance of doubt (and my own sanity) I'm not going to sell it but if I did, where would I stand from a legal perspective? It got me thinking about wills in general, I could have completely ignored everything my mother wanted in her will and done something else instead as there are no checks etc? Idly curious before anyone starts berating me.Wacky Racer said:
Just give him what he is entitled to and stop being an arse, it was your mother's wishes.
Then have no further contact with him, if you feel so strongly.
Does nobody bother to read anything nowadays? Then have no further contact with him, if you feel so strongly.
The very first reply is written by a moron who can't be bothered to read even one post correctly and just replies with the first bit of garbage that comes into his head.
The OP quite clearly states: "For the avoidance of doubt (and my own sanity) I'm not going to sell it" and "Idly curious before anyone starts berating me."
WR, it is you that should stop being an arse, not the OP.
ETA I see Wacky Racer has realised he was being an arse and removed his post. Maybe there is hope yet!!!
Edited by NGee on Sunday 25th October 10:52
You are on the hook if you don't follow the will. Although not a lot of money in the big scheme of things why leave yourself looking like the baddy & leaving your self open to legal proceedings.
Your brother may be an asshole, but dont be compromised by his behaviour, give him what your mum wanted him to have and move on. If it annoys you, don't have contact with him.
Your brother may be an asshole, but dont be compromised by his behaviour, give him what your mum wanted him to have and move on. If it annoys you, don't have contact with him.
Osinjak said:
It got me thinking about wills in general, I could have completely ignored everything my mother wanted in her will and done something else instead as there are no checks etc? Idly curious before anyone starts berating me.
If you needed to apply for Probate then the Will becomes a matter of public record so anyone can look at it. If no Probate, then I imagine there must be a legal process for demanding to see it but I'm sure that would be quite costly.It was slightly awkward with my Mum's Will - she split it between three of us, but left a letter asking us to bung a couple of relatives £5K each. My brothers (one of whom is almost as bad as the OPs brother) were horrified and wanted to ignore her request. I told them to f-off.
Edited by Sheepshanks on Sunday 25th October 11:32
By making the coin availible to him You've complied with the will no? Should he choose not to avail himself of it along with all his other crap and you dispose of it that is a separate legal circumstance?
Thought of charging him rent on his crap, or send a letter to remove it or you'll flog it on his behalf, storage wars style?
Thought of charging him rent on his crap, or send a letter to remove it or you'll flog it on his behalf, storage wars style?
Thanks all. Just to park the brother thing for a sec, he lives overseas and refuses to give anyone his address. He comes back to the UK periodically but same deal, doesn't tell anyone when he does and certainly doesn't hand out the address where he stays. His stuff is in the garage and it's staying there until he comes up with a cunning plan to collect it - that's it. However, I was more interested in the legal side of things and how enforceable a will actually is? When I finally got it from her solicitor I asked her what happens next and she just said to get on with what was in her will (which I did) and to get in touch if I had any questions. I was a bit perplexed because I thought that someone would check to see that I had carried out her wishes, quite who I thought that would be is beyond me.
As said above when Probate is granted the Will becomes a public document. It is known that charities employ people to scan published Wills in case the Executors have "overlooked" a bequest to their charity. By the same means any Beneficiary who has been ignored by the Executors can see the document and demand their due.
Can be hard work being an Executor even if you do carry out the Deceased's instructions, my children won't talk to each other now because of their Grandfathers Will where one was appointed Executor and the other didn't like the way he (correctly) carried out the provisions of the Will.
Can be hard work being an Executor even if you do carry out the Deceased's instructions, my children won't talk to each other now because of their Grandfathers Will where one was appointed Executor and the other didn't like the way he (correctly) carried out the provisions of the Will.
Osinjak said:
Thanks all. Just to park the brother thing for a sec, he lives overseas and refuses to give anyone his address. He comes back to the UK periodically but same deal, doesn't tell anyone when he does and certainly doesn't hand out the address where he stays. His stuff is in the garage and it's staying there until he comes up with a cunning plan to collect it - that's it. However, I was more interested in the legal side of things and how enforceable a will actually is? When I finally got it from her solicitor I asked her what happens next and she just said to get on with what was in her will (which I did) and to get in touch if I had any questions. I was a bit perplexed because I thought that someone would check to see that I had carried out her wishes, quite who I thought that would be is beyond me.
Usually the parties that will benefit have a reasonable inkling what will be In the will. Most executors will then inform the parties what actually is in the will. If the two don’t align then that’s when issues may arise. The only real checks in general are if one of the will parties disputes the execution and starts legal proceedings. The executer is in general someone the deceased trusts to perform the duty. However if you are the executer and receive all proceeded except say £10k to charity I don’t know if any checks are performed that the donation has been made unless a third party disputes matters.OP, very large books are written about the law relating to wills, but, in very broad summary, a will is enforceable at the suit of its beneficiaries, provided that the will complies with some formal rules and that the bequests that it contains conform to some rules as to clarity and do not offend against various aspects of public policy.
An executor who failed to execute the wishes of a testator would expose him or herself to a claim by a beneficiary who thereby suffered loss. An executor owes what are known as fiduciary duties to beneficiaries. An executor can step down, but until he or she does so he or she owes those duties.
An executor who failed to execute the wishes of a testator would expose him or herself to a claim by a beneficiary who thereby suffered loss. An executor owes what are known as fiduciary duties to beneficiaries. An executor can step down, but until he or she does so he or she owes those duties.
Andeh1 said:
What would happen if the coin was never found? Or if it was lost in the house empty?
What if it was tucked away quietly, let him fight & pressure for it, then if it ever got too serious mysteriously come across it in emptying her loft. I wonder what would come of it...
This forum regularly demonstrates that at least one half of all PH'ers are dishonest chancers. Is it a car thing that causes this? What if it was tucked away quietly, let him fight & pressure for it, then if it ever got too serious mysteriously come across it in emptying her loft. I wonder what would come of it...
Certainly when wife's Godfather died, his watch and his late wife's engagement ring, which had been bequeathed to specific people, where declared to be 'lost'.
But he, as I've found is common with older people as they near the end of their life, would offer things to people who called to visit him. We always refused, then next time we'd go and there'd be a space where the item used to be.
Not talking about cash value here, but I say to people now that if there's a particular item of significant sentimental value to you, then secure it before someone else has it away.
But he, as I've found is common with older people as they near the end of their life, would offer things to people who called to visit him. We always refused, then next time we'd go and there'd be a space where the item used to be.
Not talking about cash value here, but I say to people now that if there's a particular item of significant sentimental value to you, then secure it before someone else has it away.
Wealth is a curse as well as a blessing. The poisonous attitudes that some people develop whilst awaiting the death of a relative, and the terrible behaviour that some people display after the death, show how distorting to civilised values inheritance can be. I am happy to say that nobody in my family has ever had any wealth for anyone to fight over. I sometimes get paid by people who may have more money than sense to fight for years over inheritances.
Breadvan72 said:
Wealth is a curse as well as a blessing. The poisonous attitudes that some people develop whilst awaiting the death of a relative, and the terrible behaviour that some people display after the death, show how distorting to civilised values inheritance can be. I am happy to say that nobody in my family has ever had any wealth for anyone to fight over. I sometimes get paid by people who may have more money than sense to fight for years over inheritances.
you do read and hear the same stories again and again and again don't you. Money can be so poisonous. Recent family developments have made me question the motives of someone I never, ever thought I'd think such things about.There's something extremely liberating about just saying "I don't care" over a money matter, and you don't have to be rich to do so - once you have the money to cover the essentials of life and a few luxuries, you'll never have more. I have many wealthy clients and I feel there's a step change in happiness between the ones who hawk over what they pay/what they think you're "making" and the ones who just accept it and are like "ooh pretty new things"
Osinjak said:
My mother passed away in Jul this year and I was the sole executor of her tiny will. I've done as she wished so no dramas but one thing that has irked me throughout the whole sorry episode was my tragically moronic brother's behaviour. He's an utter waste of skin at the best of times but he really surpassed himself this time through properly nasty emails, not calling to ask how she was doing before she died, ranting on Facebook about perceived slights from his family and so on. You know, the sort of behaviour you'd expect from a 47 year old man.
Anyway, my mother left him around £1k in the form of a half-sovereign and PO account with about £500 in it. At one point I was seriously considering not giving him the coin but selling it and giving the money to one of her favourite charities as he was being such a dhead. I didn't and it's now sat in a box in the garage along with a load of his other crap that he refuses to collect. For the avoidance of doubt (and my own sanity) I'm not going to sell it but if I did, where would I stand from a legal perspective? It got me thinking about wills in general, I could have completely ignored everything my mother wanted in her will and done something else instead as there are no checks etc? Idly curious before anyone starts berating me.
I've been executor for a number of relatives, normally jointly with my brother. Anyway, my mother left him around £1k in the form of a half-sovereign and PO account with about £500 in it. At one point I was seriously considering not giving him the coin but selling it and giving the money to one of her favourite charities as he was being such a d
head. I didn't and it's now sat in a box in the garage along with a load of his other crap that he refuses to collect. For the avoidance of doubt (and my own sanity) I'm not going to sell it but if I did, where would I stand from a legal perspective? It got me thinking about wills in general, I could have completely ignored everything my mother wanted in her will and done something else instead as there are no checks etc? Idly curious before anyone starts berating me.It's something that made me feel as if I'd helped them when they couldn't do it themselves. I felt a bit honoured by the trust. In all cases, it helped with the mourning as well.
I didn't tend to worry about those being stroppy; I just stuck with the instructions. I took a bit of abuse, but on the other hand I discovered some things about some of those on the list which made me feel rewarded having to deal with them. There are some lovely people out there and heard lots of stories about the dead person.
An ex wife who didn't want any money because she felt she had treated him badly had to be convinced that she should have it, if only to pass on to her kids, who also received some directly.
I didn't try to judge, although failed a couple of times whith those who seemed immoral and obnoxious, but I could teach being obstructive to masters level. Once everything was settled I felt I'd done something positive for the deceased and it helped with the fact that I'd done my bit.
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