Accused of assault
Discussion
I'm not a teacher and can't really advise, but to let you know similar things happen in other work environments too.
Embellished complaints are a feature of the offices I visit, and "formal grievances" are commonplace when they should be a last resort.
Especially difficult to rebut when they are raised by someone "protected" by the equality act;. I wish I could name and shame on here, but he would take me to court for it.
Embellished complaints are a feature of the offices I visit, and "formal grievances" are commonplace when they should be a last resort.
Especially difficult to rebut when they are raised by someone "protected" by the equality act;. I wish I could name and shame on here, but he would take me to court for it.
OP try not to worry, I know that is easy for me to say but you need to stay focused.
Some kids in today’s world have absolutely no respect for anyone including the police, parents and teachers to name a few.
The fact that you have laid hands on could technically be seen as an assault. However in the real world it should go nowhere.
CCTV will work in your favour to show you didn’t overreact but will also go against you in showing the actual hands on.
The thing is that you need to challenge bad behaviour to keep some sort of order in the school but sadly without any physical interaction.
You could say that you felt that his behaviour was threatening to yourself and more so the good order and discipline of the school which ultimately could have led to bigger issues and the potential to leave other pupils well-being in a dangerous position.
You tried to communicate with the pupil verbally but were ignored so you tried to usher him to one side to discuss his behaviour.
Hope you get sorted and to a satisfactory conclusion.
Some kids in today’s world have absolutely no respect for anyone including the police, parents and teachers to name a few.
The fact that you have laid hands on could technically be seen as an assault. However in the real world it should go nowhere.
CCTV will work in your favour to show you didn’t overreact but will also go against you in showing the actual hands on.
The thing is that you need to challenge bad behaviour to keep some sort of order in the school but sadly without any physical interaction.
You could say that you felt that his behaviour was threatening to yourself and more so the good order and discipline of the school which ultimately could have led to bigger issues and the potential to leave other pupils well-being in a dangerous position.
You tried to communicate with the pupil verbally but were ignored so you tried to usher him to one side to discuss his behaviour.
Hope you get sorted and to a satisfactory conclusion.
There was a video doing the rounds on ge local Facebook pages this week of a teacher shouting at a pupil, calling him a scumbag and ordering him out of the class. The 'offended' pupil's mother initially shared it, but according to the other pupils the teacher is a good one and snapped when whatever it was the pupil had thrown at him hit him in the face.
It didn't quite go the way the mother was expecting it to on Facebook, the video has been pulled, the school are investigating and the teacher has NOT been suspended.
Hope everything goes OK for you OP, I couldn't work in a school.
It didn't quite go the way the mother was expecting it to on Facebook, the video has been pulled, the school are investigating and the teacher has NOT been suspended.
Hope everything goes OK for you OP, I couldn't work in a school.
Ex police SLT here. Left a few years to ago to concentrate on my business so I’m not old and out of touch yet.
Your account of the circumstances don’t amount to a crime and appear to show a large degree of tolerance on your part. The witness testimony (expected to be biased toward the student) and cctv support that.
The reaction from the school and the police appears to be balanced and sensible. Based on what you’ve written I expect the officers to meet with the head and then take no further action. The meeting is a sensible approach to review evidence and ensure nothing is missed due to the school environment. I think that’s sensible too.
If in the unlikely event things progress, speak with a solicitor at the earliest opportunity. You can request a duty solicitor for free if things go that way. I highly doubt that but know your options just in case. Join a union or similar.
I really couldn’t do your job. Utmost respect for teachers and education staff now expected to raise kids as well as educate them.
Your account of the circumstances don’t amount to a crime and appear to show a large degree of tolerance on your part. The witness testimony (expected to be biased toward the student) and cctv support that.
The reaction from the school and the police appears to be balanced and sensible. Based on what you’ve written I expect the officers to meet with the head and then take no further action. The meeting is a sensible approach to review evidence and ensure nothing is missed due to the school environment. I think that’s sensible too.
If in the unlikely event things progress, speak with a solicitor at the earliest opportunity. You can request a duty solicitor for free if things go that way. I highly doubt that but know your options just in case. Join a union or similar.
I really couldn’t do your job. Utmost respect for teachers and education staff now expected to raise kids as well as educate them.
king useless. Short answer - hope it goes well.it does make you think "why bother" with some of our country's population.
Longer version
Frankly, the money you'd have to spend on "unmaking" and "remaking" their personality is an utter waste.
Best way to remake them would be to chuck them into the forces and send them to fight a pointless war, or some hard physical type job to wear them out to an early death.
Fortunately, the UK doesn't do those sort of things much any more. We just need a workable alternative.
In addition to mainstream schools are "special" schools, and pupil referral units (prus)
Special schools cater mostly for specific disabilities: physical handicapped, blind, deaf etc. But increasingly for those with autism and severe behavioural issues.
Prus are more for behaviour, those at risk of being expelled, and somewhere to "put" kids for a bit. I don't think prus educate anywhere near as well... it's more therapy and trying to get the kid able to back into mainstream. They have locks on the door etc.
So, mainstream: a certain government following a certain austerity policy decided in its wisdom to make maintained schools "carry" low level Sen in their day to day budgets, and only fund Sen upon a statement (ehcp)
Thus an industry was created by sharp elbowed parents to either get their kid to a massively expensive private school, or a statement to say " well, it's not my fault because..."
As you can imagine, this has crippled schools funding, with a number of councils now spending way more on high needs schooling than they're given.
(Oh yeah, massive funding shortage for education psychology assessments too. Like the justice system, unless you come across it you just don't notice how badly it's funded)
Note: schools funding comes from general tax via a dedicated grant: not from council tax.
Getting a kid out of mainstream school is virtually writing them off educationally, as many "private schools" are just daycare for the parents (especially as it runs to age 25)
But at every stage you're up against the problem that some kids just don't have a moral compass built into them at home.
I grew up being scared about a bad school report at home. We had one kid with sen - she was blind. But there were the "naughty" kids, the "lazy/slow" kids who didn't concentrate, and the "odd" kids who were socially awkward.
These days they'd probably all get send of some sort.
I used to manage schools funding at a council, and my wife is a teacher, so I have some fairly close knowledge.
Our personal view is just to support our kids 100% through school, and make damn sure they're on track. We can't afford private schooling, but I think they'll do alright being above average academically.
There is a sizeable minority (not that sort) though where you just think: why bother? They're never going to pay back the cost of their education in national productivity.
I is possibly a bit cynical this morning.
Longer version
Tony1963 said:
The child needs his education. Where do you think he learned his attitude and actions?
But it's all learnt at home, and baked into the kid. Teachers can only do so much, and they have the curriculum and 29 other kids to think about too.Frankly, the money you'd have to spend on "unmaking" and "remaking" their personality is an utter waste.
Best way to remake them would be to chuck them into the forces and send them to fight a pointless war, or some hard physical type job to wear them out to an early death.
Fortunately, the UK doesn't do those sort of things much any more. We just need a workable alternative.
Tony1963 said:
Do we still have schools for difficult kids? Just get them out of mainstream schooling and try to sort them out properly?
Even more expensive than extra support in mainstream.In addition to mainstream schools are "special" schools, and pupil referral units (prus)
Special schools cater mostly for specific disabilities: physical handicapped, blind, deaf etc. But increasingly for those with autism and severe behavioural issues.
Prus are more for behaviour, those at risk of being expelled, and somewhere to "put" kids for a bit. I don't think prus educate anywhere near as well... it's more therapy and trying to get the kid able to back into mainstream. They have locks on the door etc.
So, mainstream: a certain government following a certain austerity policy decided in its wisdom to make maintained schools "carry" low level Sen in their day to day budgets, and only fund Sen upon a statement (ehcp)
Thus an industry was created by sharp elbowed parents to either get their kid to a massively expensive private school, or a statement to say " well, it's not my fault because..."
As you can imagine, this has crippled schools funding, with a number of councils now spending way more on high needs schooling than they're given.
(Oh yeah, massive funding shortage for education psychology assessments too. Like the justice system, unless you come across it you just don't notice how badly it's funded)
Note: schools funding comes from general tax via a dedicated grant: not from council tax.
Getting a kid out of mainstream school is virtually writing them off educationally, as many "private schools" are just daycare for the parents (especially as it runs to age 25)
But at every stage you're up against the problem that some kids just don't have a moral compass built into them at home.
I grew up being scared about a bad school report at home. We had one kid with sen - she was blind. But there were the "naughty" kids, the "lazy/slow" kids who didn't concentrate, and the "odd" kids who were socially awkward.
These days they'd probably all get send of some sort.
I used to manage schools funding at a council, and my wife is a teacher, so I have some fairly close knowledge.
Our personal view is just to support our kids 100% through school, and make damn sure they're on track. We can't afford private schooling, but I think they'll do alright being above average academically.
There is a sizeable minority (not that sort) though where you just think: why bother? They're never going to pay back the cost of their education in national productivity.
I is possibly a bit cynical this morning.
Assuming your account is accurate (no suggestion otherwise), I would hope the police charge the child and mother for wasting police time and even possibly PTCoJ, something that they like to use these days. This type of nonsense needs to be stopped.
One of the joys of life in Japan, Hong Kong and Singapore is how lovely and polite the school kids are: all dressed smartly and behaving like “people” as opposed to the feral creatures that I see in London these days.
All started with Toby Blair and his policies of zero repercussions for bad behaviour if my recollection is correct.
One of the joys of life in Japan, Hong Kong and Singapore is how lovely and polite the school kids are: all dressed smartly and behaving like “people” as opposed to the feral creatures that I see in London these days.
All started with Toby Blair and his policies of zero repercussions for bad behaviour if my recollection is correct.
@Ian Geary
I wondered how long it would be before someone mentioned ‘get em in the army’ lol.
I did my time in the RAF and have worked alongside the armed forces since I left in 1990. I work with the army now.
There is no place for the people of which you speak in the forces, it wouldn’t teach them anything useful, and it would hinder an already stretched armed forces.
A very outdated view on the issue. I didn’t bother reading anything after that.
Tony1963 said:
@Ian Geary
I wondered how long it would be before someone mentioned ‘get em in the army’ lol.
I did my time in the RAF and have worked alongside the armed forces since I left in 1990. I work with the army now.
There is no place for the people of which you speak in the forces, it wouldn’t teach them anything useful, and it would hinder an already stretched armed forces.
A very outdated view on the issue. I didn’t bother reading anything after that.
Except that a huge number of SF folks, booties and paras come from exactly this background. I wondered how long it would be before someone mentioned ‘get em in the army’ lol.
I did my time in the RAF and have worked alongside the armed forces since I left in 1990. I work with the army now.
There is no place for the people of which you speak in the forces, it wouldn’t teach them anything useful, and it would hinder an already stretched armed forces.
A very outdated view on the issue. I didn’t bother reading anything after that.
Good luck to the Op, sounds like the witnesses and ccrv will help, but I understand the worry and concern.
Iwas investigated for assault when I grabbed hold of a lad we were fostering, to stop him from throwing himself down the stairs.
No case to answer, but it still took plod 3 months to decide, by which time we'd decided fostering wasn't worth the stress
Iwas investigated for assault when I grabbed hold of a lad we were fostering, to stop him from throwing himself down the stairs.
No case to answer, but it still took plod 3 months to decide, by which time we'd decided fostering wasn't worth the stress
I don't know anything about how the law works here, but surely it would be beneficial for students and teachers to simply exclude this awful boy?
Perhaps that is too complex and is kicking the can down the road - but it's infuriating to read of decent teachers having to put up with this crap.
Perhaps that is too complex and is kicking the can down the road - but it's infuriating to read of decent teachers having to put up with this crap.
take-good-care-of-the-forest-dewey said:
Except that a huge number of SF folks, booties and paras come from exactly this background.
But they volunteered. And that’s crucial. And you’ve made a big mistake in your statement: not everyone from “this background” is capable of commiting to the life of an out and out killer.
Tony1963 said:
But they volunteered. And that’s crucial.
And you’ve made a big mistake in your statement: not everyone from “this background” is capable of commiting to the life of an out and out killer.
I think perhaps you underestimate that choice. I'm from exactly that background, and have many mates who signed up because it was either that or nothing...most likely the petty theft turned into career theft and institutional life thereafter. Military life suited them. It certainly made them better human beings. And you’ve made a big mistake in your statement: not everyone from “this background” is capable of commiting to the life of an out and out killer.
My father did his national service in the Durham Light Infantry and most of his mates were 'wrong uns' as he put it. A period of being away from a toxic family, being replaced by one which generally has a strong moral compass (unless pissed and on close proximity to another regiment) helped them too - and they didn't have a choice.
You're right... Not everyone is suited to a military life. But your point was there is NO place... And that's incorrect. There is a place for a lot of kids from that background.
Gassing Station | Speed, Plod & the Law | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff