Pure Rover V8 Pleasure
Discussion
ked mate 
Classic Chim said:
He's totally tickling his balls as we speak 
Not bad I suppose. Time you come set an lpg record for a Tvr or will it self ignite if you go too fast
Looking good Dave
With TPS at 97% touching over 5,800rpm and 94 kPa... injector duty reaches 90% and my perfect best power AFR of 12.8:1 becomes 13.7:1.Not bad I suppose. Time you come set an lpg record for a Tvr or will it self ignite if you go too fast
Looking good Dave
At wide open throttle at the same engine speed and 97 kPa 13.7:1 becomes 13.8:1, proof my otherwise excellent Hana LPG injectors are right on the edge of their capacity
Easily corrected by removing the 2.4mm nozzles and going with a straight through setup, but that means a remap and I'm not doing that as I've got her running sweeter than a sugar coated sweet thing. Whats the point in revving her over 5k anyway, study the dyno graph and it's blatantly obvious changing up around 4,500 - 5,000rpm will deliver the most rapid forward progress.
Swapping cogs from 3rd to 4th around 4,500 is ideal, by which time I'm already doing 67mph, back on the gas and nail in 4th to 5k, the swap to 5th occurs at healthy 100mph, from here she'll romp on to 143mph at 5,500rpm before there's any risk from a moderately lean condition as I enter the mid 13s which is still in the safe zone in my opinion.
By this time its all a bit academic as I'm seriously into license losing territory, so the way I see it... it really isn't worth removing those 2.4mm nozzles Alun
LPG.... it's not all about boring MPG figures boys
Edited by ChimpOnGas on Wednesday 19th July 00:11
So that's a yes then
See you Saturday.
But your forgetting one thing my god man, the wind and air effect on the car as you increase speed. Need to hang on to about 5300 at least to get hp or you'll not have enough torque to pull you back to where the power is ,,, I know as I've tried in a controlled environment as in the drag strip. It's not just about racing it tells you a lot about true performance.
You carry extra weight as in tanks so that's bound to have effect, possibly in a good way for about 200 yards but weights weight.
After all it'll only cost you a Tenner to get to Shakey
Enjoy your car Dave, cracking numbers
Contrary to my dyno figures which tail off drastically after about 5600 it's still faster if I hold till about 6000 revs probably 5800 would be optimum before changing into 3rd gear and onwards.
When I changed slightly earlier say 5100 it felt like it bogged slightly or more the airspeed over the car held it back until I hit 3000 revs and full power was resumed. Good fun having a few goes on the strip and you'll learn your engine intimately.
Ok I know it's not your bag but you'd enjoy the boys company I'm telling you.
See you Saturday.
But your forgetting one thing my god man, the wind and air effect on the car as you increase speed. Need to hang on to about 5300 at least to get hp or you'll not have enough torque to pull you back to where the power is ,,, I know as I've tried in a controlled environment as in the drag strip. It's not just about racing it tells you a lot about true performance.
You carry extra weight as in tanks so that's bound to have effect, possibly in a good way for about 200 yards but weights weight.
After all it'll only cost you a Tenner to get to Shakey
Enjoy your car Dave, cracking numbers
Contrary to my dyno figures which tail off drastically after about 5600 it's still faster if I hold till about 6000 revs probably 5800 would be optimum before changing into 3rd gear and onwards.
When I changed slightly earlier say 5100 it felt like it bogged slightly or more the airspeed over the car held it back until I hit 3000 revs and full power was resumed. Good fun having a few goes on the strip and you'll learn your engine intimately.
Ok I know it's not your bag but you'd enjoy the boys company I'm telling you.
Edited by Classic Chim on Tuesday 18th July 23:51
A true 143mph on my TomTom with 5,500rpm showing on the Canems software are figures that do not lie Alun,TBH that's fast enough for me in a TVR thanks
I'm leaving the injector nozzles at 2.4mm, I just need to keep slowly increasing the numbers in the red zone until the current 13.8:1 becomes 12.8:1.
I can highly recommend the Canems engine management system, it's extremely intuitive to work with
'Ol Gasbag' may not be the fastest Chimaera on the forum but my gas powered TVR is still no slouch... It's the perfect harmonious package of performance, drivability and fuel economy I set out to create.
A traditional analogue four litre V8 British sports car with modern performance combined with Nisan Micra fuel economy, it all makes for my perfect classic
Next stop.. The South of France,... again!
I'm leaving the injector nozzles at 2.4mm, I just need to keep slowly increasing the numbers in the red zone until the current 13.8:1 becomes 12.8:1.
I can highly recommend the Canems engine management system, it's extremely intuitive to work with
'Ol Gasbag' may not be the fastest Chimaera on the forum but my gas powered TVR is still no slouch... It's the perfect harmonious package of performance, drivability and fuel economy I set out to create.
A traditional analogue four litre V8 British sports car with modern performance combined with Nisan Micra fuel economy, it all makes for my perfect classic
Next stop.. The South of France,... again!
As Tvr are a Performance car, nothing else, that's it. Oh if you have a Chim then it's also practical as in boot space but it serves very little purpose other than once apon a time being very fast to 100 mph. Out dated and slow in modern terms but analog which is why us old school blokes like them.
I think you'd get a better response to LPG if you showed how fast it can go, after all that's the point of the car.
I'm stuck in my ways but I'm still wondering if you have to go down broken roads to some old farmers gaff or an industrial estate to get fuel,,, I am joking
By your own posts you say yours runs better on lpg and I have heard it remember, it's a bit special, so why not put the thing to the sword for once and show us if all this written word still adds upto a fast car. Fast and 45 mpg would open up minds.
I could never live with adding weight and loss of boot space personally but each to their own.
If my car wasn't so fast I'd have sold it long ago, it's not that fast but feels it. it's more dramatic than fast and that's about where i'm at these days
If you'd done this to a classic XJ6 4.2 Jag or something I'd be telling the world what you've achieved but on a two seat lightweight sportscar that should push onto 160 mph,,,, saying all that I'm doing silly milage in mine at the moment and it's expensive,,, but ordinarily most people are doing 2000 a year not every two months so again makes lpg seem pointless for most owners.
I'm sure everyone applauds what you've done and it's only by listening and driving it or you putting it to accurate timing tests can anyone really judge it.
If your car is slower to accelerate on lpg you've taken the heart out of the car Dave. I think other than the weight of tanks it's likely to be just as fast as standard cars on petrol so a hell of an achievement but you won't actually prove it with a simple 0-110 mph test over 1/4 mile. What's that 400 yards.
I've upgraded parts of my car, only by testing it have I found it's level.
Why are you mapping it yourself, does it need re mapping or are you fine tuning a map that is rather rare (lpg) so doesn't have the depth of knowledge say a generic petrol map possesses from all the development work carried out by the likes of Powers and MBE and Canams etc as each time I see maps being tweaked I can't help but wonder why. If the company who install your very expensive Ecu can't get it working for more than a few years without it needing mapping sessions I'm not so sure it's a good idea. My reference would be 18 year old Tvr running CUX on its original chip after 80,000 miles and still running well, ok loads probably need tweaks by now but do you get my point.
Keeping things in perspective I save a small fortune is service costs now I have no coil,cap, ign module etc etc so a road mapping session every few years wouldn't cost very much, I'm just puzzled by the need for this tweaking. Jason at Powers listens to mine and that's about all he needs to do,,,, so far it's been great. He worked with Ravenscroft if I'm correct so has a deep breadth of mapping knowledge on Tvr, maybe that's it because my map seems perfect anywhere and everywhere. What your doing with advance etc is what mines been doing all along as they've already worked it out years ago.
Powers are Expensive but you do get what you pay for.
It's actually not a fair comparison as mine runs on petrol so that knowledge base is there, as it is with Canams basrbpetrol maps, yours is a rare example (lpg) so your mapping may be far less supported with testing which is why your doing it now. Really cool your making gains with your tweaks too.
Stop being a techi weirdo and tell the public what all those numbers mean so lesser types including me gain knowledge not just witness your gloating,,, :Laugh:
I think you'd get a better response to LPG if you showed how fast it can go, after all that's the point of the car.
I'm stuck in my ways but I'm still wondering if you have to go down broken roads to some old farmers gaff or an industrial estate to get fuel,,, I am joking
By your own posts you say yours runs better on lpg and I have heard it remember, it's a bit special, so why not put the thing to the sword for once and show us if all this written word still adds upto a fast car. Fast and 45 mpg would open up minds.
I could never live with adding weight and loss of boot space personally but each to their own.
If my car wasn't so fast I'd have sold it long ago, it's not that fast but feels it.
it's more dramatic than fast and that's about where i'm at these days If you'd done this to a classic XJ6 4.2 Jag or something I'd be telling the world what you've achieved but on a two seat lightweight sportscar that should push onto 160 mph,,,, saying all that I'm doing silly milage in mine at the moment and it's expensive,,, but ordinarily most people are doing 2000 a year not every two months so again makes lpg seem pointless for most owners.
I'm sure everyone applauds what you've done and it's only by listening and driving it or you putting it to accurate timing tests can anyone really judge it.
If your car is slower to accelerate on lpg you've taken the heart out of the car Dave. I think other than the weight of tanks it's likely to be just as fast as standard cars on petrol so a hell of an achievement but you won't actually prove it with a simple 0-110 mph test over 1/4 mile. What's that 400 yards.
I've upgraded parts of my car, only by testing it have I found it's level.
Why are you mapping it yourself, does it need re mapping or are you fine tuning a map that is rather rare (lpg) so doesn't have the depth of knowledge say a generic petrol map possesses from all the development work carried out by the likes of Powers and MBE and Canams etc as each time I see maps being tweaked I can't help but wonder why. If the company who install your very expensive Ecu can't get it working for more than a few years without it needing mapping sessions I'm not so sure it's a good idea. My reference would be 18 year old Tvr running CUX on its original chip after 80,000 miles and still running well, ok loads probably need tweaks by now but do you get my point.
Keeping things in perspective I save a small fortune is service costs now I have no coil,cap, ign module etc etc so a road mapping session every few years wouldn't cost very much, I'm just puzzled by the need for this tweaking. Jason at Powers listens to mine and that's about all he needs to do,,,, so far it's been great. He worked with Ravenscroft if I'm correct so has a deep breadth of mapping knowledge on Tvr, maybe that's it because my map seems perfect anywhere and everywhere. What your doing with advance etc is what mines been doing all along as they've already worked it out years ago.
Powers are Expensive but you do get what you pay for.
It's actually not a fair comparison as mine runs on petrol so that knowledge base is there, as it is with Canams basrbpetrol maps, yours is a rare example (lpg) so your mapping may be far less supported with testing which is why your doing it now. Really cool your making gains with your tweaks too.
Stop being a techi weirdo and tell the public what all those numbers mean so lesser types
including me gain knowledge not just witness your gloating,,, :Laugh: Alan, the LPG conversion just means the following:
What's not to like?
- 0-60 in 5.5 seconds
- A sat nav confirmed 150mph
- No real loss of luggage space
- No change in engine sound
- No external indication the car is on gas
- Better idle quality and drivability than petrol
- 45-50mpg average equivalent economy
- A project that's completely paid for itself
What's not to like?
True enough
A bit like you,,, a rare beast
Now turn up at Shakey and get pissed will you. There's nothing like an ecliptic mix and as you have so kindly pointed out 23 million times now it will cost you less than a tenner to show up.
I'm terrible ain't I.
Enjoy your flying machine you mad scientist
I'm not driving, need a drinking partner
My XJ8 on gas, I seem to remember it smelt of steam out the exhausts,, was that my imagination or does yours smell similar, a bit sweet smelling like Methanol. My Tiv de cat on petrol is smelly like it used to be on CUX catted Mbe with Catt as it was mapped was an extremely clean smell at most times including starts and especially in traffic. Really clean burn on lpg when it's working well.
I paid for mine in one year on the Jag. 100 miles a day 6 days a week,,, it soon paid itself off. I also went allover the country at weekends so this south of France wind up is very real
How's your brakes, awesome by any chance. I'd love to try mine out on those French roads mate, maybe next year when I've saved up the petrol money my running fund got wiped out with a diff replacement and my sons house carpets,,, which cost 4 times the amount of the diff. Now I've got no work,,, brilliant en it. 
keep smiling through it all and I'll join you one year mate
A bit like you,,, a rare beast
Now turn up at Shakey and get pissed will you. There's nothing like an ecliptic mix and as you have so kindly pointed out 23 million times now it will cost you less than a tenner to show up.
I'm terrible ain't I.
Enjoy your flying machine you mad scientist
I'm not driving, need a drinking partner
My XJ8 on gas, I seem to remember it smelt of steam out the exhausts,, was that my imagination or does yours smell similar, a bit sweet smelling like Methanol. My Tiv de cat on petrol is smelly like it used to be on CUX catted
Mbe with Catt as it was mapped was an extremely clean smell at most times including starts and especially in traffic. Really clean burn on lpg when it's working well. I paid for mine in one year on the Jag. 100 miles a day 6 days a week,,, it soon paid itself off. I also went allover the country at weekends so this south of France wind up is very real
How's your brakes, awesome by any chance. I'd love to try mine out on those French roads mate, maybe next year when I've saved up the petrol money
my running fund got wiped out with a diff replacement and my sons house carpets,,, which cost 4 times the amount of the diff. Now I've got no work,,, brilliant en it. keep smiling through it all and I'll join you one year mate Edited by Classic Chim on Wednesday 19th July 11:26
Ages since I've been on PH, got in front with my work this week by working long hours all last weekend so thought I'd have a quick search for chat about LPG... I have converted 2 vehicles to LPG already this week, a Nissan Elgrand 3.5V6 (I've converted over a dozen of those to LPG this year alone) and a Jeep SRT8 6.4 Hemi 475bhp. This thread was the first thread that came up in my search for LPG on this forum... but I've already read all about this on LPGforum http://www.lpgforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=30&t...
If you remove nozzles from Hana injectors you'll have the equivalent of around 3.2mm nozzles, which will flow 1.77 times as much gas for the equivalent pulse period, which would lower duty cycle at idle to 5.65% at idle and 50.8% flat out at your same max rpm. So you'd want to drastically lower pressure too, or you'd lose fuelling accuracy... especially at the low load end.
Simon
If you remove nozzles from Hana injectors you'll have the equivalent of around 3.2mm nozzles, which will flow 1.77 times as much gas for the equivalent pulse period, which would lower duty cycle at idle to 5.65% at idle and 50.8% flat out at your same max rpm. So you'd want to drastically lower pressure too, or you'd lose fuelling accuracy... especially at the low load end.
Simon
SimonYorkshire said:
Ages since I've been on PH, got in front with my work this week by working long hours all last weekend so thought I'd have a quick search for chat about LPG... I have converted 2 vehicles to LPG already this week, a Nissan Elgrand 3.5V6 (I've converted over a dozen of those to LPG this year alone) and a Jeep SRT8 6.4 Hemi 475bhp. This thread was the first thread that came up in my search for LPG on this forum... but I've already read all about this on LPGforum http://www.lpgforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=30&t...
If you remove nozzles from Hana injectors you'll have the equivalent of around 3.2mm nozzles, which will flow 1.77 times as much gas for the equivalent pulse period, which would lower duty cycle at idle to 5.65% at idle and 50.8% flat out at your same max rpm. So you'd want to drastically lower pressure too, or you'd lose fuelling accuracy... especially at the low load end.
Simon
Cheers Simon, great to hear you're still busy converting and the demand for switching to this excellent fuel remains good, I'm still amazed by the ignorance and negative prejudice people carry for LPG and why more people don't go dual fuel? Now the true picture of dirty diesel has been revealed I believe low carbon LPG should be promoted by the government as the stopgap fuel before we're all forced to buy an electric car, LPG also represents a brilliant solution to cleaning up polluting classics so they can be enjoyed with a clean conscience for years to come.If you remove nozzles from Hana injectors you'll have the equivalent of around 3.2mm nozzles, which will flow 1.77 times as much gas for the equivalent pulse period, which would lower duty cycle at idle to 5.65% at idle and 50.8% flat out at your same max rpm. So you'd want to drastically lower pressure too, or you'd lose fuelling accuracy... especially at the low load end.
Simon
The thirsty TVR Chimaera with its LPG friendly Rover V8 engine and huge boot is a perfect candidate in my opinion, as proven by my no compromise conversion which contrary to the doubters and naysayers comments when I started the project over four years ago has not removed the unique charm and character of this very visceral and analog sports car but has actually improved it's idle quality and drivability over any standard Chimaera running the 14CUX/distributor and burning solely petrol.
Forgetting the massive fuel savings and lower emissions LPG brings for a minute, with the perfect and optimised for 110ron LPG 3D ignition map the car is actually way nicer to drive on gas!
For the record I'm only moving one tiny area on the map by one point of AFR so nozzle removal was never really the plan, it would be an absolutely daft way to tweak a tiny area on the map by such a small amount and would force a completely unnecessary remap. With my Canems system all I need do is simply increase four numbers right in the top right corner of my fuel table slightly until 13.7:1 becomes 12.8:1 (red area shown above).
It's literally 4 cells at the split second moment I visit full load at WOT right in the top right corner, the rest of the map is absolutely spot on, infinitely better than any standard 14CUX TVR meters petrol in fact. Removing nozzles is way too radical for what is a tiny change needed in one even smaller seldom visited area of the map, ultimately it's solvable in seconds with a few key strokes. Indeed it's already done so I just need to conduct one WOT full load pull to prove I've added sufficient fuel to hit my 12.8:1 target, although anything from 12.5 to 12.8:1 will be fine.
You can see more here......
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1aNpk1lPUEA
Beyond the very tempting idea of going to liquid injection there's nothing more to be done but continue to drive and enjoy my wonderful driving and super cheap to fuel four litre V8 TVR.
Theres more on my project here if you're interested Simon?
https://www.pistonheads.com/gassing/topic.asp?t=12...
Edited by ChimpOnGas on Thursday 20th July 08:52
Gassing Station | Chimaera | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff