Discussion
An engine needs fuel, air, compression and spark to fire up.
Accepting that it was running OK last time you tried it, it's unlikely to have lost compression. Other than the exhaust, was anything else moved / changed / tampered with ?
Does it have [clean] fuel ?
Does it spark ?
Are the spark plugs clean ?
Check the obvious before investigating other avenues.
Accepting that it was running OK last time you tried it, it's unlikely to have lost compression. Other than the exhaust, was anything else moved / changed / tampered with ?
Does it have [clean] fuel ?
Does it spark ?
Are the spark plugs clean ?
Check the obvious before investigating other avenues.
If it is the older "thing" 2.8 .....amongst other 'challenges', I have a similar problem with an engine that had been left for a long time......
I was told the flap and needles mechanism can stick up through lack of use and old fuel gum and if the flap does not open initially the fuel is sent back to the tank not to the injectors.
I tried this one ...... I took off the air filter box cover and filter....carefully (and I was told very carefully so as not to damage the flap or 'Venturi') lifted the air flap and held it up a few millimetres with a screw driver or similar and tried to fire it up. It worked
....It worked for me . No liability accepted
)
not sure what the long term solution is yet but at least I have isolated a cause
I was told the flap and needles mechanism can stick up through lack of use and old fuel gum and if the flap does not open initially the fuel is sent back to the tank not to the injectors.
I tried this one ...... I took off the air filter box cover and filter....carefully (and I was told very carefully so as not to damage the flap or 'Venturi') lifted the air flap and held it up a few millimetres with a screw driver or similar and tried to fire it up. It worked
....It worked for me . No liability accepted
) not sure what the long term solution is yet but at least I have isolated a cause
I totally agree that you must take a systematic approach, however the 2.8 will be harder to diagnose as it is a mechanical injection system with a number of mechanical devices which are hard to check. As a 2.8 owner I would however make a few points.
DO NOT under any circumstances try messing with the fuel mixture. There is a screw between the fuel meter head and the air control valve, only accessible with a long allen key. DONT mess with it until you have sorted everything else out. It is likely the mixture was good enough to enable to car to run before, upset the mixture now and you will have the devil of a job later.
If the engine was running and there was a sudden bad misfire and it stopped then what caused the misfire must be your starting point.
If you do a standard check and there is no spark (I would expect no spark at all rather than some cylinders not sparking, if some were sparking you would expect some rough reaction from the engine) then what failed? If it hasn't run for a long time, what state are wire connectors and terminals in? On one car a corroded terminal under a rubber cover just broke off with the vibration. Does the coil king lead spark to the engine, if so the fault is 'downstream' of that, if not you are checking back from the coil. Sorry but there are lots of possibilities and it may take time but you must work systematically or you will create more problems.
Did it suddenly stop getting fuel and run very weak, pop back and stop? As it had been lying a long time, disturbing muck in the fuel system is very probable. Fairly easy staring point is to take off the 7th injector, put it into a bottle (to protect yourself) and get a friend to try to start the engine, there should be a steady spray into the bottle. If it is a dribble or nothing then you are not getting the fuel through.
The trick of lifting the air valve flap would be a last resort for me. If it ran before then it is unlikely the mixture is suddenly out. What you are doing there is temporarily drastically altering the mixture. That alone will not change anything and you will still have the problem to resolve. However one further thought does occur to me. Again it comes back to the backfire you heard. Under certain circumstances a backfire can result in a sudden pulse of pressure on the inlet side of the engine. I suspect you had the throttle open at the time. In that case the pressure pulse went into the air intake system. Just check that the air control valve cover (black rubber over the air valve) hasn't been popped up, it isnt very well held in place, a backfire under mixture adjustment in a garage did just that!. Check the cover rubber hasn't been split (common problem, and can easily weaken the mixture by a massive amount). Check that no other part of the inlet tubing hasn't been blown loose or split.
Because a backfire seems to have caused the problem, as an S1 owner, I would be inclined to check that no part of the indication has been blown loose or split. That would be easy to do with old parts and might well be fairly obvious.
Good luck, let us know how you get on.
DO NOT under any circumstances try messing with the fuel mixture. There is a screw between the fuel meter head and the air control valve, only accessible with a long allen key. DONT mess with it until you have sorted everything else out. It is likely the mixture was good enough to enable to car to run before, upset the mixture now and you will have the devil of a job later.
If the engine was running and there was a sudden bad misfire and it stopped then what caused the misfire must be your starting point.
If you do a standard check and there is no spark (I would expect no spark at all rather than some cylinders not sparking, if some were sparking you would expect some rough reaction from the engine) then what failed? If it hasn't run for a long time, what state are wire connectors and terminals in? On one car a corroded terminal under a rubber cover just broke off with the vibration. Does the coil king lead spark to the engine, if so the fault is 'downstream' of that, if not you are checking back from the coil. Sorry but there are lots of possibilities and it may take time but you must work systematically or you will create more problems.
Did it suddenly stop getting fuel and run very weak, pop back and stop? As it had been lying a long time, disturbing muck in the fuel system is very probable. Fairly easy staring point is to take off the 7th injector, put it into a bottle (to protect yourself) and get a friend to try to start the engine, there should be a steady spray into the bottle. If it is a dribble or nothing then you are not getting the fuel through.
The trick of lifting the air valve flap would be a last resort for me. If it ran before then it is unlikely the mixture is suddenly out. What you are doing there is temporarily drastically altering the mixture. That alone will not change anything and you will still have the problem to resolve. However one further thought does occur to me. Again it comes back to the backfire you heard. Under certain circumstances a backfire can result in a sudden pulse of pressure on the inlet side of the engine. I suspect you had the throttle open at the time. In that case the pressure pulse went into the air intake system. Just check that the air control valve cover (black rubber over the air valve) hasn't been popped up, it isnt very well held in place, a backfire under mixture adjustment in a garage did just that!. Check the cover rubber hasn't been split (common problem, and can easily weaken the mixture by a massive amount). Check that no other part of the inlet tubing hasn't been blown loose or split.
Because a backfire seems to have caused the problem, as an S1 owner, I would be inclined to check that no part of the indication has been blown loose or split. That would be easy to do with old parts and might well be fairly obvious.
Good luck, let us know how you get on.
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