Anyone else concerned about ULEZ
Discussion
AC43 said:
I'm talking about a residential area with loads of cars on the school run (presumably).
The Euro VI diesels seem a lot better but there are loads of much much older ones being used daily out there.
I cycle to work and often get a lung/faceful from an old diesel being booted past me.
I could also smell it when opening my front door. No buses in sight.
Glad I've moved away from a busy main road after that experience.
Although having said that now I have a neighbour on one side with a small fleet of 10+ year old diesels used for endless short journeys. Sigh.
Put your personal bias aside & ask yourself do diesel cars have a place on our road network?The Euro VI diesels seem a lot better but there are loads of much much older ones being used daily out there.
I cycle to work and often get a lung/faceful from an old diesel being booted past me.
I could also smell it when opening my front door. No buses in sight.
Glad I've moved away from a busy main road after that experience.
Although having said that now I have a neighbour on one side with a small fleet of 10+ year old diesels used for endless short journeys. Sigh.
When you're trying to encourage less use of diesels do you not think that there are other things TFL could be spending 800 million on?
As I have said before there needs to be a complete rethink on our transport policies.
For example there's a report citing that Manston should be turned into an air freight hub taking all the flights that currently land at Heathrow/Gatwick apparently this would open up over 100 slots per day that 100 less planes circulating over London waiting to land.
It also cites that if the next river crossing was to go from around Gravesend to Tilbury (which would link it to the Super dock)
then freight traffic on the Dartford river crossing would be significantly reduced, as well as reductions in freight traffic between Heathrow & Gatwick
The added bonus being that normal workers would be introduced to housing stock at a very sensible price.
Inside London lets reduce the number of traffic lights as brake dust along with acceleration & deceleration actually add to the pollution as does the 20 mph limits so they should go too.
On the major A Roads out of London where the Average Speed Cameras are set a 50 they should be reset to 65 I say this because the average speed in these zones is nearer to 40mph in order to get this figure nearer to 55 (which is a speed where a lot of cars are running at their most efficient emissions & running cost wise) which again is a help to the environment.
A big crusade on getting the right information to the public so they choose the right car is crucial, as well as taxing all the AC units that are pumping out rubbish into the atmosphere.
Every apartment that is built should have a levy place on it & this levy is to go to the local council to help with local infrastructure for example if there are 1000 new apartments being built (I'm using Lewisham as an example) then surely these builders should have to contribute to the communities they're impacting on. There should be a Creche/Doctor/dental surgery in these new builds so people don't have to get in their cars to access these facilities.
You could do a lot of effective & positive things for Londoners with 800 million, instead it's been spent on cameras!
ZX10R NIN said:
Put your personal bias aside & ask yourself do diesel cars have a place on our road network?
When you're trying to encourage less use of diesels do you not think that there are other things TFL could be spending 800 million on?
As I have said before there needs to be a complete rethink on our transport policies.
For example there's a report citing that Manston should be turned into an air freight hub taking all the flights that currently land at Heathrow/Gatwick apparently this would open up over 100 slots per day that 100 less planes circulating over London waiting to land.
It also cites that if the next river crossing was to go from around Gravesend to Tilbury (which would link it to the Super dock)
then freight traffic on the Dartford river crossing would be significantly reduced, as well as reductions in freight traffic between Heathrow & Gatwick
The added bonus being that normal workers would be introduced to housing stock at a very sensible price.
Inside London lets reduce the number of traffic lights as brake dust along with acceleration & deceleration actually add to the pollution as does the 20 mph limits so they should go too.
On the major A Roads out of London where the Average Speed Cameras are set a 50 they should be reset to 65 I say this because the average speed in these zones is nearer to 40mph in order to get this figure nearer to 55 (which is a speed where a lot of cars are running at their most efficient emissions & running cost wise) which again is a help to the environment.
A big crusade on getting the right information to the public so they choose the right car is crucial, as well as taxing all the AC units that are pumping out rubbish into the atmosphere.
Every apartment that is built should have a levy place on it & this levy is to go to the local council to help with local infrastructure for example if there are 1000 new apartments being built (I'm using Lewisham as an example) then surely these builders should have to contribute to the communities they're impacting on. There should be a Creche/Doctor/dental surgery in these new builds so people don't have to get in their cars to access these facilities.
You could do a lot of effective & positive things for Londoners with 800 million, instead it's been spent on cameras!
Probably 10,000 new flats in the borough of Lewisham over the last 10 years. I must find the actual figure. I don't know how the roads cope TBH. Maybe the new 1-way system is actually efficient, or few of the new residents have cars.When you're trying to encourage less use of diesels do you not think that there are other things TFL could be spending 800 million on?
As I have said before there needs to be a complete rethink on our transport policies.
For example there's a report citing that Manston should be turned into an air freight hub taking all the flights that currently land at Heathrow/Gatwick apparently this would open up over 100 slots per day that 100 less planes circulating over London waiting to land.
It also cites that if the next river crossing was to go from around Gravesend to Tilbury (which would link it to the Super dock)
then freight traffic on the Dartford river crossing would be significantly reduced, as well as reductions in freight traffic between Heathrow & Gatwick
The added bonus being that normal workers would be introduced to housing stock at a very sensible price.
Inside London lets reduce the number of traffic lights as brake dust along with acceleration & deceleration actually add to the pollution as does the 20 mph limits so they should go too.
On the major A Roads out of London where the Average Speed Cameras are set a 50 they should be reset to 65 I say this because the average speed in these zones is nearer to 40mph in order to get this figure nearer to 55 (which is a speed where a lot of cars are running at their most efficient emissions & running cost wise) which again is a help to the environment.
A big crusade on getting the right information to the public so they choose the right car is crucial, as well as taxing all the AC units that are pumping out rubbish into the atmosphere.
Every apartment that is built should have a levy place on it & this levy is to go to the local council to help with local infrastructure for example if there are 1000 new apartments being built (I'm using Lewisham as an example) then surely these builders should have to contribute to the communities they're impacting on. There should be a Creche/Doctor/dental surgery in these new builds so people don't have to get in their cars to access these facilities.
You could do a lot of effective & positive things for Londoners with 800 million, instead it's been spent on cameras!
Typical polarised politics really. Large infrastructure projects are either bad for the environment except obviously for the Cycle Superhighway or good for the economy. No one can open their eyes to the most basic environmental and economic benefit of having cars actually moving rather than emitting CO2 and particulate while stationary.
ZX10R NIN said:
Put your personal bias aside & ask yourself do diesel cars have a place on our road network?
When you're trying to encourage less use of diesels do you not think that there are other things TFL could be spending 800 million on?
As I have said before there needs to be a complete rethink on our transport policies.
For example there's a report citing that Manston should be turned into an air freight hub taking all the flights that currently land at Heathrow/Gatwick apparently this would open up over 100 slots per day that 100 less planes circulating over London waiting to land.
It also cites that if the next river crossing was to go from around Gravesend to Tilbury (which would link it to the Super dock)
then freight traffic on the Dartford river crossing would be significantly reduced, as well as reductions in freight traffic between Heathrow & Gatwick
The added bonus being that normal workers would be introduced to housing stock at a very sensible price.
Inside London lets reduce the number of traffic lights as brake dust along with acceleration & deceleration actually add to the pollution as does the 20 mph limits so they should go too.
On the major A Roads out of London where the Average Speed Cameras are set a 50 they should be reset to 65 I say this because the average speed in these zones is nearer to 40mph in order to get this figure nearer to 55 (which is a speed where a lot of cars are running at their most efficient emissions & running cost wise) which again is a help to the environment.
A big crusade on getting the right information to the public so they choose the right car is crucial, as well as taxing all the AC units that are pumping out rubbish into the atmosphere.
Every apartment that is built should have a levy place on it & this levy is to go to the local council to help with local infrastructure for example if there are 1000 new apartments being built (I'm using Lewisham as an example) then surely these builders should have to contribute to the communities they're impacting on. There should be a Creche/Doctor/dental surgery in these new builds so people don't have to get in their cars to access these facilities.
You could do a lot of effective & positive things for Londoners with 800 million, instead it's been spent on cameras!
This is pretty much exactly how I feel.When you're trying to encourage less use of diesels do you not think that there are other things TFL could be spending 800 million on?
As I have said before there needs to be a complete rethink on our transport policies.
For example there's a report citing that Manston should be turned into an air freight hub taking all the flights that currently land at Heathrow/Gatwick apparently this would open up over 100 slots per day that 100 less planes circulating over London waiting to land.
It also cites that if the next river crossing was to go from around Gravesend to Tilbury (which would link it to the Super dock)
then freight traffic on the Dartford river crossing would be significantly reduced, as well as reductions in freight traffic between Heathrow & Gatwick
The added bonus being that normal workers would be introduced to housing stock at a very sensible price.
Inside London lets reduce the number of traffic lights as brake dust along with acceleration & deceleration actually add to the pollution as does the 20 mph limits so they should go too.
On the major A Roads out of London where the Average Speed Cameras are set a 50 they should be reset to 65 I say this because the average speed in these zones is nearer to 40mph in order to get this figure nearer to 55 (which is a speed where a lot of cars are running at their most efficient emissions & running cost wise) which again is a help to the environment.
A big crusade on getting the right information to the public so they choose the right car is crucial, as well as taxing all the AC units that are pumping out rubbish into the atmosphere.
Every apartment that is built should have a levy place on it & this levy is to go to the local council to help with local infrastructure for example if there are 1000 new apartments being built (I'm using Lewisham as an example) then surely these builders should have to contribute to the communities they're impacting on. There should be a Creche/Doctor/dental surgery in these new builds so people don't have to get in their cars to access these facilities.
You could do a lot of effective & positive things for Londoners with 800 million, instead it's been spent on cameras!
Drop the deliberate poorly phased lights, drop the blanket 20 limits and s
tty humps (keep them near schools)Up the A40 /A406 /A13 average cameras to a more respectable limit.
Traffic will flow, congestion bottlenecks will reduce and emissions from idling and stop starting will reduce.
Will Khan’t do anything sensible? will he f
k.jfire said:
Probably 10,000 new flats in the borough of Lewisham over the last 10 years. I must find the actual figure. I don't know how the roads cope TBH. Maybe the new 1-way system is actually efficient, or few of the new residents have cars.
Typical polarised politics really. Large infrastructure projects are either bad for the environment except obviously for the Cycle Superhighway or good for the economy. No one can open their eyes to the most basic environmental and economic benefit of having cars actually moving rather than emitting CO2 and particulate while stationary.
The traffic hasn't coped that's why I moved away it got ridiculous the one way system is beyond funny, I ride through there now & I really wouldn't want drive through that everyday.Typical polarised politics really. Large infrastructure projects are either bad for the environment except obviously for the Cycle Superhighway or good for the economy. No one can open their eyes to the most basic environmental and economic benefit of having cars actually moving rather than emitting CO2 and particulate while stationary.
ZX10R NIN said:
Put your personal bias aside & ask yourself do diesel cars have a place on our road network?
Yes, I've always said they have a place for someone who lives in the country and drives a lot. Or for someone who ploughs up and down the motorways all day long.But for someone who lives in a city and predominantly drives short distances in a Euro 4/5 or before then it's a really bad idea. And, in my view, selfish.
Edited by AC43 on Sunday 2nd September 09:39
AC43 said:
Yes, I've always said they have a place for someone who lives in the country and drives a lot. Or for someone who ploughs up and down the motorways all day long.
But for someone who lives in a city and predominantly drives short distances in a Euro 4/5 or before then it's a really bad idea. And, in my view, selfish.
So pushing those cars to skirt around Ulez on its fringes, isn't selfish?But for someone who lives in a city and predominantly drives short distances in a Euro 4/5 or before then it's a really bad idea. And, in my view, selfish.
Some boroughs pushing this further. I hope it includes taxis and buses but I very much doubt it.
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/transport/petrol-a...
I wonder if this also impacts residents or if it’s only visitors into the borough.
Can’t see all residents being pleased about this and being able to all afford new hybrids or EVs
https://www.standard.co.uk/news/transport/petrol-a...
I wonder if this also impacts residents or if it’s only visitors into the borough.
Can’t see all residents being pleased about this and being able to all afford new hybrids or EVs
It's alright having the countryside full of Defenders because it's not hideously overpopulated. Ironically those concerned about the environment don't want houses built there and the very same Mayor of London has blocked development in suburban London just outside the North and South Circular.
Mark300zx said:
AC43 said:
Yes, I've always said they have a place for someone who lives in the country and drives a lot. Or for someone who ploughs up and down the motorways all day long.
But for someone who lives in a city and predominantly drives short distances in a Euro 4/5 or before then it's a really bad idea. And, in my view, selfish.
So pushing those cars to skirt around Ulez on its fringes, isn't selfish?But for someone who lives in a city and predominantly drives short distances in a Euro 4/5 or before then it's a really bad idea. And, in my view, selfish.
Why not try to keep people away from pollution by allowing development on suburban London brown field sites, or by building walkways, or demanding that developments do not instruct footpaths sending people on to main roads?
What the Mayor Of London has actually just signed off is rerouting the South Circular in such a way that the greatest number of flats can be built in Catford alongside it.
What the Mayor Of London has actually just signed off is rerouting the South Circular in such a way that the greatest number of flats can be built in Catford alongside it.
Mark300zx said:
AC43 said:
Well I'm not massively keen of having them pumping out their stuff out in any congested urban environment. But the closer in and the more congested the worse they are.
Any more anecdotal things you would like to change about London?We've seen NOx and particulates soar in London and other cities in recent years and it's down to diesels.
Euro 6's are the only ones that are in any way comparable to petrols in those regards.
Mark300zx said:
AC43 said:
But they're still going to get nailed.
And anyway there there are still far too many people using cars for short urban trips. Especially diesels. They are the real menace. You really can smell them.
Assuming you can't get people's arses out of cars at least get them back out of unsuitable soot chuckers and into hybrids, EV's or modern petrols.
Better still on foot, tubes or bikes although that doesn't work for a lot of people.
If this is the case, can you explain how the pollution targets were met during the bus strike, when the number of cars on the road on the road increased and TFL buses were severely reduced?And anyway there there are still far too many people using cars for short urban trips. Especially diesels. They are the real menace. You really can smell them.
Assuming you can't get people's arses out of cars at least get them back out of unsuitable soot chuckers and into hybrids, EV's or modern petrols.
Better still on foot, tubes or bikes although that doesn't work for a lot of people.
Richmond are one of the councils who want to adopt the standard to avoid older vehicles using the borough to skirt the zone. But no plans yet to consult on it or any implementation dates. I guess they want to get 20 mph done before they stir up any more controversy.
Reality is it won't be until October 2021 at the earliest and they're up for re election in 2022. At which point they'll likely be kicked out. It was CPZ permits charged on emissions and bus lanes that did for them last time (2010).
Reality is it won't be until October 2021 at the earliest and they're up for re election in 2022. At which point they'll likely be kicked out. It was CPZ permits charged on emissions and bus lanes that did for them last time (2010).
hyphen said:
Hoofy said:
If I'm bumming around Richmond, Wimbledon and Kingston most of the time, I don't have to worry about buying a diesel do I?
Sounds like you don't much mileage, so no you don't need to worry, as you will be buying petrol 
2gins said:
Richmond are one of the councils who want to adopt the standard to avoid older vehicles using the borough to skirt the zone. But no plans yet to consult on it or any implementation dates. I guess they want to get 20 mph done before they stir up any more controversy.
Reality is it won't be until October 2021 at the earliest and they're up for re election in 2022. At which point they'll likely be kicked out. It was CPZ permits charged on emissions and bus lanes that did for them last time (2010).
Hm. Good point.Reality is it won't be until October 2021 at the earliest and they're up for re election in 2022. At which point they'll likely be kicked out. It was CPZ permits charged on emissions and bus lanes that did for them last time (2010).
Thankyou4calling said:
Hoofy said:
If I'm bumming around Richmond, Wimbledon and Kingston most of the time, I don't have to worry about buying a diesel do I?
If you want to go bumming then either Hampstead or Brighton.As for Diesel? Parts of where you are lie within the ULEZ so be aware.
I'm aware. Just not sure how much I need to worry about. I guess if I want to sell the car in a few years' time, I might be better off trading it in with a dealer in, say, Guildford, rather than Putney.
From https://www.wandsworth.gov.uk/news/article/14307/p...
The Mayor wants to make the change in 2021 meaning it would affect anyone driving a car, van or motorcycle within a zone whose southernmost boundary was marked by the Upper Richmond Road, Wandsworth High Street, East Hill, Wandsworth Common Northside, Battersea Rise, The Avenue Clapham Common West Side and Clapham Common Southside.
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