Nottingham Council Traffic Department pro cyclists gone mad

Nottingham Council Traffic Department pro cyclists gone mad

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The Mean Machine

67 posts

92 months

Thursday 20th October 2016
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Nottingham has a proud tradition of car hating- does anybody remember the white elephant that was the 'collar scheme and lilac leopard buses' from the 1970's .
If there is a decent road they must remove the parking put in unnecessarily wide pavements and reduce the road width to a single lane to restrict traffic flow and put many sets of traffic lights on it.
The Council must also inflict an unnecessary tram system on the City when it already has an excellent bus system. Now city covered with ugly pylons, wires and tram tracks and then make businesses ( and the employees who end up paying) suffer the workplace parking levy.
So let's discourage businesses locating in Nottingham. There really is a self destruct gene in Nottingham City Council.

Mick50NCD

Original Poster:

90 posts

103 months

Friday 21st October 2016
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Since the road junction alterations that is give way to cyclists I notice that many more cyclists seem to be bombing across the junctions on the Ring Road without slowing or looking. A national drivers organization with most of the 30 odd million drivers as members is essential.
Not the weak as Naffi tea organizations that are at present trying to do their best for motorists but it needs an organization with clout that
represent the motorists. How is it that the minority organizations =Brake etc etc and the minority cycle groups have decimated the driving pleasure in the UK ??????? And they all tell lies and get away with it. Keith Peat could not do it all with the few admirers he had.

Boosted LS1

21,167 posts

259 months

Friday 21st October 2016
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I've just driven along castle Boulevard. Not one bike was using the 6 ft wide cycle lane. What a waste of money.

Mick50NCD

Original Poster:

90 posts

103 months

Friday 21st October 2016
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Keith Peat advises all motorists to obtain a dash cam which I have done.. The word seems to have got out to cyclists since the give way to
them at junctions right along the Ring Road. Yesterday I noticed two go straight across a junction and on the opposite side of the road another red jacketed cyclist went over two that I saw & when I hooted him he let go of both handlebars in a 'what did I do gesture'.
Dash Cam is a must have as I believe a lot of cyclists have them to prove liability if there is an accident or video of others doings/behavior.

rich888

2,610 posts

198 months

Saturday 22nd October 2016
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Mick50NCD said:
Keith Peat advises all motorists to obtain a dash cam which I have done.. The word seems to have got out to cyclists since the give way to
them at junctions right along the Ring Road. Yesterday I noticed two go straight across a junction and on the opposite side of the road another red jacketed cyclist went over two that I saw & when I hooted him he let go of both handlebars in a 'what did I do gesture'.
Dash Cam is a must have as I believe a lot of cyclists have them to prove liability if there is an accident or video of others doings/behavior.
Surely councils can't override UK road traffic laws which have always stipulated that traffic approaching on side roads has to give way to traffic already driving along the main road. I thought this was originally made for safety reasons. Seems the clowns in Nottingham Council are going down the same stupid route as the car hating idiots in Cardiff.

So in the scenario that the cyclist doesn't stop at the entrance to a main road and rides straight out into the path of a 32 ton articulated lorry travelling at below the posted speed limit and gets crushed to death, surely the liability is on the council for allowing such a stupid scenario to happen in the first place. The cyclist is merely complying with the regulations as is the lorry driver who has no chance whatsoever of stopping due to the pure mass of his or her lorry being able to decelerate in time due to simple laws of physics which the council numpties are fully aware of. In terms of liability it is the council officials that signed off the change of road priorities that are at fault, and they really should be held personally accountable and fined for any injuries or deaths that subsequently occur. Any half decent risk assessment would have identified this change of priorities as a major health hazard to all concerned.

Mick50NCD

Original Poster:

90 posts

103 months

Saturday 22nd October 2016
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It has transpired that a Keith Morgam (23 y o) is the senior traffic officer who designed it. When asked if the alterations had a Safety Audit he said the final one would happen when the works were completed. The ladies at the meeting said ---you mean you shut the door after the horse had bolted===== asrshole upards so to speak..........
See him and his ideology on You Tube 2015 safety conference re pro cycling and what goes with it! He is young and inexperienced & yet he has a licence to crap on drivers who ever they are & yet he says they the Council are not anti car which is of course a blatant lie because if they were not anti car the give way double lines would not be there and also if they are as they say not anti car they would do what is right and the lines would be removed /obliterated.
I have it in black and white over the years letters from that Nottingham Traffic/Safety department that proves beyond reasonable doubt
that department as a whole are anti car and in one very old letter anti road safety too.

rich888

2,610 posts

198 months

Sunday 23rd October 2016
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Mick50NCD said:
It has transpired that a Keith Morgam (23 y o) is the senior traffic officer who designed it. When asked if the alterations had a Safety Audit he said the final one would happen when the works were completed. The ladies at the meeting said ---you mean you shut the door after the horse had bolted===== asrshole upards so to speak..........
See him and his ideology on You Tube 2015 safety conference re pro cycling and what goes with it! He is young and inexperienced & yet he has a licence to crap on drivers who ever they are & yet he says they the Council are not anti car which is of course a blatant lie because if they were not anti car the give way double lines would not be there and also if they are as they say not anti car they would do what is right and the lines would be removed /obliterated.
I have it in black and white over the years letters from that Nottingham Traffic/Safety department that proves beyond reasonable doubt
that department as a whole are anti car and in one very old letter anti road safety too.
What I don't understand is why people who are clearly not fit for purpose for the task are given jobs of such importance. I'm sure he is a good lad, means well and enjoys the perks of the job such as a high salary and a gold-plated pension, but his grasp of day to day driving is shockingly poor. Does he actually own a car and drive on a daily basis?

These kind of road planning decisions should be left to experienced and non biased road planners/traffic police/motorists, rather than jumped up inexperienced idiots. People may well die from the decisions he has made and that isn't a joke. In a nutshell this guy needs sacking before someone dies.

kev b

2,708 posts

165 months

Sunday 23rd October 2016
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I sometimes have to drive in Nottingham for work, it is a nightmare; poorly signed, slow, confusing and ever changing for the worse.

I earned a £100 ticket by driving into a bus and taxi lane in a taxi registered out of the area, no amount of protesting could get them to cancel it., rules are rules.

There are concerts, sports, attractions etc in Nottingham I would be keen to attend but it is easier to go somewhere else,

Shopping? It is quicker and easier to drive further to Meadowhall, and listening to conversations it seems most people around here feel the same, you cannot just "pop to the shops" in Nottingham, peoples time is too valuable to be spent navigating a stupid traffic scheme.

The planners want to reduce cars in the city centre, they are killing business at the same time so their wishes may come true..

rich888

2,610 posts

198 months

Monday 24th October 2016
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kev b said:
I sometimes have to drive in Nottingham for work, it is a nightmare; poorly signed, slow, confusing and ever changing for the worse.

I earned a £100 ticket by driving into a bus and taxi lane in a taxi registered out of the area, no amount of protesting could get them to cancel it., rules are rules.

There are concerts, sports, attractions etc in Nottingham I would be keen to attend but it is easier to go somewhere else,

Shopping? It is quicker and easier to drive further to Meadowhall, and listening to conversations it seems most people around here feel the same, you cannot just "pop to the shops" in Nottingham, peoples time is too valuable to be spent navigating a stupid traffic scheme.

The planners want to reduce cars in the city centre, they are killing business at the same time so their wishes may come true..
The lanes for use state for Buses and Taxis only, I would be sorely tempted to go to court over this one and bloody their noses.

You are quite right about shoppers using alternative venues such as Meadowhall in Sheffield which offers plentiful and FREE parking.

I'm wondering whether the screw-up of the roads in Nottingham coincided with the employment of this individual. I do remember chatting to a colleague a few years ago and her swearing and announcing that the one-way traffic flow around Victoria centre had been reversed for no good reason. She was driving at the time.

The tram system should be a success but due to hikes in the charges and a change in management in their quest for money has resulted in a transformation of friendly helpful ticket conductors to obnoxious inspectors handing out draconian fines, end result being that the trams tend to trundle around half empty nowadays at what cost to the Nottingham taxpayers. To any visitors to Nottingham considering using the tram please be aware that you now have to buy your tickets before you hop on the tram which has caught out no end of people and resulted in many fines being issued. Is short term greed in my opinion.

We can't be bothered with all this and no longer use the tram and tend to do our shopping elsewhere. Meadowhall offers much more for less grief. All we need is a John Lewis store to open and we're sorted for Christmas.

kev b

2,708 posts

165 months

Monday 24th October 2016
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Thanks for your input Rich, shamefully I have to admit that it was easier and cheaper to pay the fine than risk wasting money and time fighting.

With solicitors charging more per hour than the penalty Iam ashamed to report we just put it down to experience, this is not the way it should be done but it did not make sense to continue protesting.

However the shopping trip/hen party/concert trips we run will only use Nottingham as a destination when forced.

I know it will not make a significant difference but ten trips a year, eight passengers a time are now using shops, hotels and clubs elsewhere.

Anyhow, fine not withstanding, Nottingham is an unpleasant place to drive in, so for days out, motorbike runs and gigs I avoid where possible.

rich888

2,610 posts

198 months

Monday 24th October 2016
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kev b said:
Thanks for your input Rich, shamefully I have to admit that it was easier and cheaper to pay the fine than risk wasting money and time fighting.

With solicitors charging more per hour than the penalty Iam ashamed to report we just put it down to experience, this is not the way it should be done but it did not make sense to continue protesting.

However the shopping trip/hen party/concert trips we run will only use Nottingham as a destination when forced.

I know it will not make a significant difference but ten trips a year, eight passengers a time are now using shops, hotels and clubs elsewhere.

Anyhow, fine not withstanding, Nottingham is an unpleasant place to drive in, so for days out, motorbike runs and gigs I avoid where possible.
This is all so wrong on so many levels, you drive a taxi in a marked taxi lane and you get fined by the petty jobsworths in Nottingham. Hopefully someone will read this post and kick a few backsides for being so damn stupid. You shouldn't have to contest it, you were driving a taxi. What the hell did they expect you to drive?

Apparently a great many drivers are getting fined when turning left from the main A60 (opposite the cemetery) onto Mapperley Road due to the fact that there is a bus lane on the way up the hill near the traffic light junction and the council in their infinite wisdom have positioned a camera to catch all drivers daring to cross over the line a few metres early so that they can indeed turn left. Ironically they have provided a 6ft length of cycle lane which should be interesting when bus meets bike.

Like you have said the revenue lost will mount up as ever more drivers avoid the city centre because it's so much hassle to drive in and find somewhere to park, and this is the reason why supermarkets are located out of cities and towns offering hassle free parking, yet the councils don't seem to be learning and just carry on regardless.

I feel this draconian attitude toward cars will indeed backfire longer term as motorists simply choose to order online instead of driving into town, or go elsewhere such as Meadowhall which isn't such good news for the shops and stores located in Nottingham. Last weekend I chose to order a few items via Amazon because I just couldn't be bothered with the hassle of driving into town, the prices were the same and delivery was free and next day. As it happened the items were delivered before I would have even set off to Nottingham.

As for using the bus or tram, well I would consider this if the prices weren't so expensive. Bear in mind that many bus services only run once per hour or less once you are outside of the Notts City boundary, and on Sundays there is no service through many villages in Nottinghamshire. Yet they want us to abandon the car and use public transport - as for riding on a push-bike, have you seen the weather lately!

It's a great shame, but turning the city into a bike friendly environment at the cost of alienating the car driving and shopping public will result in a bankrupt Nottingham County Council - oh wait, they are selling off assets - is the rumour true they are selling the Rufford Mill which is one of the most popular wedding venues in Nottinghamshire?

kev b

2,708 posts

165 months

Tuesday 25th October 2016
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It was the wrong type of taxi, end of argument.

Mick50NCD

Original Poster:

90 posts

103 months

Monday 31st October 2016
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The Wollaton Park Residents Association thought that the Council would not have the temerity to paint each and every road junction surface a bright green colour because the area is a 'conservation area'. Not so think the council because the finishing touch to the give way to cyclists is now there for all to see in technicolour with a FU attitude to anyone who thinks they should adhere to rules so that the area should look as per the existing which is 90 years old. As for road safety all the lot of them are road safety bankrupt but there may be just the odd one that has a bit of common sense which is not taken notice of.
There will be accidents due to the thoughtless and irresponsible designs but as of the last few years the names of these so called road safety planning officers are faceless and it is difficult to say the least who is who. That is why it is essential that there must be an organization far more powerful than Pepipoo and the like who mean well but do not have the members and the clout that comes from the old saying there is strength in numbers.
It may not happen in my lifetime but as sure as eggs is eggs drivers will one day, wake up to the fact that they are being screwed and resent it.

tigger1

8,402 posts

220 months

Friday 4th November 2016
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Mick50NCD said:
The Main Ring Road = Middleton Boulevard Nottingham City 90 years old major dual carriageway all 'side' roads onto this ring road have been designated cycle lane priority by the Traffic department who are pro cycle......
Sorry - late to the party here.

Are you saying that cyslists using the (shared) cycling-path now has prioirty over cars trying to joing the main road (ring-road) from the side road? That seems emminently sensible. The side roads are narrow, and traffic volumes on them are quiet (straight into quiet housing estates). The ring road, conversely, is very quiet.

I used to cycle along there a lot (Arnold to Queen's Drive), and it was always easier / safer to use the road rather than deal with people driving on the pavement (reversing out of driveways etc) and turning into / out of side roads. Didn't need to worry about traffic speed because at 8am cycling was miles quicker (10 mile commute).

The only real danger* is from cars turning OFF the ring road. At that point I can see cars and bikes coming into conflict.

Nottingham is a terrible place to drive though, partly through poor road design, but also because of volume of traffic and utterly woeful standards of driving in the city centre itself (there's a higher than average number of red mk2 Micras on the roads).



[*(presumably - because I'm ignoring your no-handed-cycling everywhere claims, this just isn't my experience of cyclists in the area, I'm not saying it doesn't happen, just that I've not seen it to any extent)]

Mick50NCD

Original Poster:

90 posts

103 months

Monday 7th November 2016
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Tigger As I said earlier I have nothing whatsoever against cyclists on the proviso that they ride in a sensible manner but some do not but expect full no claim status. I haven't earned my 54 years No Claim Bonuses for nothing because through the years driving has become
more unpleasant and stressful and some of this is down to very bad road engineering. When mistakes are made re road engineering
all reasonable experienced drivers would expect that such mistakes would be rectified immediately but they are not in the case of the
junctions that go onto the ring road. It seems too obvious to have to mention that all road users should observe the utmost care at all junctions but due I think to the designers ideology in that he has tunnel vision re cyclists are No 1 in his opinion he has let this ideology
cloud his vision in that the road junctions are not safe for all vehicles using them.I must add that cyclists are in danger too by incitement.
I have lived in Wollaton Park Estate 64 years and it's not the first time the Nottingham Traffic Department have dropped a clanger locally.
I have a letter that is a refusal of common sense from a person near the top job now ( Nottm Traffic Dept) in that traffic used to drive any direction it wished on Farndon Green which was unsafe. A few years later someone with road safety acumen, after 1989
installed keep left arrows.Before that there were accidents but after none.
Some cyclist are seen regularly riding no hands. Radio Nottingham Andy will confirm this truth. While this is evident the no blame rule should not happen ------ever.

heebeegeetee

28,596 posts

247 months

Monday 7th November 2016
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Mick50NCD is there any chance you could use paragraphs? If you think you're not getting a good response it may because your posts are not easy to read.

From what I've skim rad though, I'm not finding much to agree with.

Vergis: I reckon just about every statement you've made is 100% wrong.

Mick50NCD

Original Poster:

90 posts

103 months

Monday 7th November 2016
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Heegeebeetee I haven't used paragraphs as I normally use in a formal letter. There may also be the odd mistake but I can read
the overall meaning of my writings. What I can confirm is that the whole of my posts are the truth unlike most of the ideologist's tripe which in the main are lies. The reason behind the ideologists lies is to reinforce a load of nonsense.

I'll start a new paragraph here to say that I notice there has been alterations to the give way lines as mentioned in the first post of the matter about the Council saying improvements are to be carried out within a week or so when that was nothing of the sort (lies) and the detrimental target was again drivers. The lines are further towards the cycle lane but still there is no direct line of vision to see a cyclist that does not slow at these junctions.
The Council in their wisdom which seems scant on close inspection of these junctions regarding road safety will 'have blood on their hands' when an accident occurs.

You are fully entitled to your opinion as we all are but I note you would rather pick the bones out of my paragraph setting out instead of
challenging me where I am wrong about the road junction design along the 90 year + Middleton Boulevard

heebeegeetee

28,596 posts

247 months

Monday 7th November 2016
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Mick50NCD said:
Heegeebeetee I haven't used paragraphs as I normally use in a formal letter. There may also be the odd mistake but I can read
the overall meaning of my writings. What I can confirm is that the whole of my posts are the truth unlike most of the ideologist's tripe which in the main are lies. The reason behind the ideologists lies is to reinforce a load of nonsense.

I'll start a new paragraph here to say that I notice there has been alterations to the give way lines as mentioned in the first post of the matter about the Council saying improvements are to be carried out within a week or so when that was nothing of the sort (lies) and the detrimental target was again drivers. The lines are further towards the cycle lane but still there is no direct line of vision to see a cyclist that does not slow at these junctions.
The Council in their wisdom which seems scant on close inspection of these junctions regarding road safety will 'have blood on their hands' when an accident occurs.

You are fully entitled to your opinion as we all are but I note you would rather pick the bones out of my paragraph setting out instead of
challenging me where I am wrong about the road junction design along the 90 year + Middleton Boulevard
There wasn't any spacings between letters either, in the links you posted. I don't know if others have seen them but I can't get them to work. (Btw paragraphs is nothing to do with formal, it's about making something easy to read. They're widely used, there's nothing wrong with them).

Can't comment on Nottingham, I may or may not agree, but if you make your posts easy to read I'll be happy to read them.

Vergis's comments though were just plain wrong, UK isn't the wettest, as I always say we're a bog-standard northern European country and there aren't any good or valid reason why cycling rates are at 10, 20 or 30% of our neighbours.

The 'war' is against anyone who doesn't want to travel by car imo.

rich888

2,610 posts

198 months

Tuesday 8th November 2016
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heebeegeetee said:
Mick50NCD said:
Heegeebeetee I haven't used paragraphs as I normally use in a formal letter. There may also be the odd mistake but I can read
the overall meaning of my writings. What I can confirm is that the whole of my posts are the truth unlike most of the ideologist's tripe which in the main are lies. The reason behind the ideologists lies is to reinforce a load of nonsense.

I'll start a new paragraph here to say that I notice there has been alterations to the give way lines as mentioned in the first post of the matter about the Council saying improvements are to be carried out within a week or so when that was nothing of the sort (lies) and the detrimental target was again drivers. The lines are further towards the cycle lane but still there is no direct line of vision to see a cyclist that does not slow at these junctions.
The Council in their wisdom which seems scant on close inspection of these junctions regarding road safety will 'have blood on their hands' when an accident occurs.

You are fully entitled to your opinion as we all are but I note you would rather pick the bones out of my paragraph setting out instead of
challenging me where I am wrong about the road junction design along the 90 year + Middleton Boulevard
There wasn't any spacings between letters either, in the links you posted. I don't know if others have seen them but I can't get them to work. (Btw paragraphs is nothing to do with formal, it's about making something easy to read. They're widely used, there's nothing wrong with them).

Can't comment on Nottingham, I may or may not agree, but if you make your posts easy to read I'll be happy to read them.

Vergis's comments though were just plain wrong, UK isn't the wettest, as I always say we're a bog-standard northern European country and there aren't any good or valid reason why cycling rates are at 10, 20 or 30% of our neighbours.

The 'war' is against anyone who doesn't want to travel by car imo.
This isn't a lesson in writing, it's about decisions made by people that ought to know better that will endanger road users. Road planning should be left to competent road planners not biased council officials.

Anyone who has driven into Nottingham will understand quite clearly that many of the road layouts and traffic light junctions are what is causing the congestion and the sheer grief of travelling into the city.

Latest screw up in road design has to be the new mini central reservation that has appeared on Mapperley Top to allow users to turn right into the new KFC (where the lawnmower centre used to be), so now we have two lanes abruptly changing into one lane, now this is going to cause quite a few accidents, and judging by the recent damage caused to the two bollards it looks like several motorists have had accidents caused by this very silly design. Once again, some idiot from the council must have signed this off as being safe, except that it's not and the road is now more dangerous than before for everyone concerned and that includes pedestrians who are crossing on this central reservation. Anyone who drives along this stretch of the road will note that the road planners could have quite easily left this side of the road as two lanes simply by nudging the centre area over by a few feet, this wouldn't have affected traffic travelling out of Nottingham because that lane is a single lane.

Now where a pedestrian crossing is needed is the traffic light junction on Huntingdon Street and the exit from Victoria Centre car park, except there is none, so as a pedestrian you just have to make a run for it. Council officials obviously don't walk!

The list goes on and on, yet all they seem to care about is endangering lives by forcing through changes to road layouts that don't seem to have an ounce of common-sense or indeed comply with the highway code, which as far as I'm aware is what motorists are taught to obey.

One more for the road, the main road out of Hucknall to Bulwell is two lanes where it meets the outer bypass roundabout which is good, so why the hell did they put a gigantic pinch point on two lanes into one just after the roundabout as it approaches the train station just before the next roundabout, then open it out to two lanes again just before the roundabout towards Bulwell, just what were they thinking, and once again this road layout pinch point causes grief for no good reason to all concerned especially at rush hour!

The though pattern of the Nottingham County Council towards decent road planning is truly shocking, my 6 year old lad could do a better job. Like I have said previously, leave the road planning to competent road planners with an understanding of safe traffic flow, rather than council officials with not an ounce of common-sense between them.

Perhaps a few traffic police should arrest the council officials involved with the design of these shockingly poor road layouts and charge them with reckless or dangerous road planning in the same way as drivers are arrested and charged for reckless or dangerous driving. Put a few of them behind bars along with a few hefty fines might focus their attentions on improving road layouts instead of endangering lives.

Ultimately reckless/dangerous road planning costs lives and there is no need for it!

Boosted LS1

21,167 posts

259 months

Tuesday 8th November 2016
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I've noticed the increase in traffic lights especially along Highfield/University Boulevard now the tram routes arrived. It's a very painful stop/start journey some days.