TVR Chimaera 450S Turbo 2000 W176EOL

[phazed]

It is just into Fulham. Not far from the riverbank in the newly revamped area.

Full of overpriced riverside flats, people who don't live in our real world and and just about overpriced everything!

[rockits]

Classic Chim said:

Yeah, what a nightmare.

Really disappointed for you but in the car world cash is king and loyalty rather lacking, many people pull out of deals with dealers too I suppose so it must work both ways. A mate of mine only cares when money is in the bank and before that deals are in principle only.

Salesmen are very clever, let him get back to you now.

Well it is disappointing but not life or death so in perspective I'll survive.

I like to look after people and do the right think whenever I can. I have made some mistakes in my business life and some bad judgements but I would never do something like this. I have also learnt from these situations and rarely make the same mistake twice. In my book to this is a moral issue and we all know people have varying degrees of morality.

I don't think salesman are very clever though. Very much the opposite in my experience. Some rare exceptions to the rule though.

I had offered to transfer cash but not been furnished with the bank details to send the payment. I suspect there was a 2nd deal bubbling in the back ground either all along or after we had agreed a deal but before James was due to visit me.

I am a rare old school person in the minority it seems naively. When I say I'm going to do something pretty much 99% of the time I am a man of my word.

Whatever....it is what it is. Maybe Karma should be king.......

Edited by rockits on Wednesday 14th August 21:34

[Andy665]

Must be really frustrating but until money is paid over I don't think a deal is a deal anymore.

I had to started to research Tuscans and let it be known to people that if they had a car they might be looking to sell late this year / early next then I could be interested - I was contacted by someone who said my timescale was perfect for him, viewed the car etc but I was nervous until I had transferred a deposit to secure the car

Even though we now have a document in place there is still a risk he could sell to someone else and simply return my deposit - I doubt that it will happen as the seller is a really nice bloke who I trust but I will not rest fully until the balance is paid and I have the V5

[rockits]

I think your are right. The old ways and people are a dying bread....literally....well I hope not in my/our cases! Not for a couple of years yet!!

I made a decision many years ago once and once only to give a supplier a contract that was on balance better for me than the company I was working for at the time. I am not proud of it and it wasn't right. However I did this once, haven't done it since and would never do it again.

I don't do things for personal gain and need to put my head on the pillow at night each night and sleep well. As long as I can do that I am content. I don't want to live my life looking over my should or waiting for a knock on my door.

I suspect some people these days don't have such a nice sleep and have to worry about a knock on the door at some point or keep looking over their shoulder. Are they happy? Who knows.

[rockits]

Well I have not heard anything back yet from James @ Greenside Cars.

I dropped him an e-mail this morning just to see if he could respond to let me know if the sale was/is/had gone through with the other buyer. I just wanted to know as I have other cars on my shortlist I would like to pursue before they were sold as well.

I followed this up with a second message just before 5pm to chase and ask to confirm please. Nothing yet. Maybe he has been busy handing over the car or something. I will give him a phone call in the morning.

Just really want to confirm if the deal is completely off or possibly still on really.

[TJC46]

rockits said:

I think your are right. The old ways and people are a dying bread....literally....well I hope not in my/our cases! Not for a couple of years yet!!

I made a decision many years ago once and once only to give a supplier a contract that was on balance better for me than the company I was working for at the time. I am not proud of it and it wasn't right. However I did this once, haven't done it since and would never do it again.

I don't do things for personal gain and need to put my head on the pillow at night each night and sleep well. As long as I can do that I am content. I don't want to live my life looking over my should or waiting for a knock on my door.

I suspect some people these days don't have such a nice sleep and have to worry about a knock on the door at some point or keep looking over their shoulder. Are they happy? Who knows.

Do not get too down hearted, this thread if nothing else as done James@ Greenside cars no favours at all in advertising his business, and i suspect no one

on here will be doing business with this company in the foreseeable future.

If he came back to me now, with the other deal not going through, i would tell him to stick it.

To get my business now, he would have to reduce the price, or offer a better deal. [Then i might pull out at the last minute, just for spite]

[rockits]

Thanks. I'm OK just little disappointed. They say time is a great healer so I'm sure I'll be fine in a few days. I'm going to Festival Italia @ Brands Hatch on Sunday in the 4200 with my son so that should be the perfect tonic. Maybe I'll add some Gin to that when I get home

I'll try not to get personal or talk anybody down. I don't want to lower myself to other people's levels. Rise above it all I say.

[robsco]

Evening all,

I have just read this thread having bought this Chimaera, having set off from Yorkshire at 4.30am to collect. Dean I am very very sorry to find that you were in the midst of doing a deal on this car before I enquired. I can assure you that I had no prior knowledge of this; I didn't need to research the car on the forums as I recognised it as Macdeb's old car. Although James mentioned another customer with a Chimaera and a 4200, it didn't appear to me that the deal was almost done. I called him on Monday late afternoon, told him the terms that I wanted to purchase the car, and if he could meet them then I would buy and collect Wednesday.

It's difficult to know what to say here as I would not knowingly tread on another forum member's toes. What I would say is that I was very forthright in my expectations of the deal, perhaps this appealed to James' nature as he appears to be a "to the point" character, no flannel. For the record, and to defend James (I'm in the same business as him and have been in these situations before), I was impressed with the way he handled the transaction.

Dean, if you truly want the car then I would come to some sort of agreement with you in lieu of this situation, as long as it didn't penalise me financially.

Edited by robsco on Wednesday 14th August 20:03

[Andy665]

robsco said:

Evening all,

I have just read this thread having bought this Chimaera, having set off from Yorkshire at 4.30am to collect. Dean I am very very sorry to find that you were in the midst of doing a deal on this car before I enquired. I can assure you that I had no prior knowledge of this; I didn't need to research the car on the forums as I recognised it as Macdeb's old car. Although James mentioned another customer with a Chimaera and a 4200, it didn't appear to me that the deal was almost done. I called him on Monday late afternoon, told him the terms that I wanted to purchase the car, and if he could meet them then I would buy and collect Wednesday.

It's difficult to know what to say here as I would not knowingly tread on another forum member's toes. What I would say is that I was very forthright in my expectations of the deal, perhaps this appealed to James' nature as he appears to be a "to the point" character, no flannel. For the record, and to defend James (I'm in the same business as him and have been in these situations before), I was impressed with the way he handled the transaction.

Dean, if you truly want the car then I would come to some sort of agreement with you in lieu of this situation, as long as it didn't penalise me financially.

Edited by robsco on Wednesday 14th August 20:03

Wow, very generous gesture

[rockits]

Rob, thanks very much for the post and your honesty. Something I think that is lacking in some people it seems.

I enquired with James about the car late on Friday night. He replied first thing on Saturday morning and after some discussions on Saturday I agreed in writing on Sunday to take the car. James acknowledged and accepted this.

It was just a question of how it was going to be paid for in my mind as I could use either my Chimaera + cash, or my Chimaera + 4200 + cash or if not a straight cash sale. Either were fine but James wanted to see my cars first which was fine. He gave me a price subject to seeing the cars if they were going to be used as part payment which I said i was happy with.

He mentioned on Saturday that he was travelling to London on Weds, staying over then could pop into me on the way out of London up to Norfolk on Thursday morning. I gave him my address my address and contact number and we arranged a time of circa 10am-11am. I confirmed on Sunday when I agreed to take the car that was all fine. I asked if he wanted me to send a deposit over to secure the car and his bank details and he ignored this.

He confirmed all of this on Monday morning and I was looking forward to his visit on Thursday morning. As far I was concerned at that point the car was mine, a deal was done and there was just a question of how I was going to pay for it.

I cannot blame you and have no issue at with you. I really appreciate you coming on here and saying how it went from your side. I don't think James has been clear with you that a deal was already done on the car. Maybe he felt a deal wasn't done I don't know. It seemed pretty clear to me and this was all confirmed in writing by e-mail.

For me it was a kind of once in a lifetime/car opportunity I guess for me so that is the most disappointing thing. Something like this is unlikely to appear again or certainly any time soon I expect. If James had been honest and upfront this all could have been avoided and dealt with correctly. The first I heard of anything different to what I had agreed with James on Sat/Sun/Mon Am was when he called me late on Tuesday night to tell me he was sorry but he had sold the car to someone else.

I'll drop you a PM with my number/details and maybe we can have a chat. I realise you have had a very long day after a very earlier start so tonight or tomorrow is fine. I certainly don't want to upset you or your ownership of the car. Or tarnish what I am sure is a very lovely moment for you.

Edited by rockits on Wednesday 14th August 21:35

[robsco]

I’m going to turn in for the night, I’ll catch up with your PM tomorrow. Unfortunately the transaction isn’t quite as straightforward as it seems as there was a part exchange I’ve taken a loss on. We can chat anyway Dean, I’ll talk you through it then and we can see where we stand.

[rockits]

robsco said:

I’m going to turn in for the night, I’ll catch up with your PM tomorrow. Unfortunately the transaction isn’t quite as straightforward as it seems as there was a part exchange I’ve taken a loss on. We can chat anyway Dean, I’ll talk you through it then and we can see where we stand.

Of course no problem at all and much appreciated. I hope I haven't upset your nights sleep but I suspect after a 4:30am start you'll be away with the fairies soon enough

[N7GTX]

Hope this works out well for you both.

BTW, having looked at both your garages, are you identical twins?

[rockits]

N7GTX said:

Hope this works out well for you both.

BTW, having looked at both your garages, are you identical twins?

Thanks, I am not sure it can now but we shall see.

Not that I know of.....Rob has a very nice Chimaera 450 Turbo which is something lacking in my garage at the moment

[rockits]

Quick update. I've had some contact kindly from Rob this morning and also just spoken with James @ Greenside Cars.

Rob has kindly offered me the car for £10k more than I had already done a deal for with Greenside. Obviously a gesture......but not one that is going to work as the car is just not worth that kind of money. It would be hard to spend 40% more on the same car just for the sake of a few days. It seems Rob is losing money on the Sagaris he traded in to Greenside so would like to offset that if I took the car. It means I'm effectively taking Rob's hit on the Sagaris which just isn't going to work.

It seems James @ Greenside cars has misinterpreted, misunderstand or presumed some things that aren't quite accurate. Instead of picking up the phone and clarifying he chose not to. There is not much I could have done about this as I didn't know there was an issue and had no idea Rob was now enquiring on the car. I was blissfully unaware whilst believing all was progressing and hoping to be the owner of a very nice TVR in the next week.

Rob was very quick to do a deal then collect the car from James. That appealed to Greenside even though he has had to take in an expensive car maybe £50k more than the car he was selling. Seems odd to me but that is what it is.

Even James commented that he found it odd that he had hardly any interest in the 450 for ages. Then all of a sudden I come along to buy the car then a 2nd person comes along only a day later suddenly to buy the car quickly. He would have been happy to continue with our deal if Rob had not have come along.

I think I have possibly been a bit too naive, trusting and too slow although not sure how much quicker I could have been. I don't know what else to think or say. Things happen for a reason just not sure what this one is yet.

Edited by rockits on Thursday 15th August 18:02

[robsco]

Hi Dean, for the purposes of clarification can I just state that I didn't expect (nor want) you to have to fund the shortfall; as I stated in my initial post, the gesture was intended purely as a chance for you to still purchase the car if you were desperate for it. Naturally I wouldn't take a sting on the Sagaris and then finish up with no car 24 hours later, nor should I!

I'm quite an impulsive character, I think it's easy to overanalyse things to a certain extent. I got up on Monday morning, decided that I wanted the Chimaera, prepared myself for the hit on the Sag and jumped in. Had you have done this, the car would have been sold and I wouldn't have made the call.

Only James knows why he agreed to my deal and not yours. Perhaps he sees more opportunity in the Sag than he did in the two cars you had, I also drove to his doorstep and presented the car rather than him having to come to me. It's a shame for you, and I do feel sympathy that you lost out on the car having come to terms with buying it.

[Belle427]

I think the orange s/c chim is calling you, it's destiny. Jump in the car and make the journey, I'm sure it will be worth it and you have also saved yourself over £10k.

[rockits]

You might be right to look at the SC car but it would only save me £6k compared to what I had agreed on Mac's 450 😉

[Classic Chim]

If your after saving money I’m not sure a SC FI Tvr of any description is a good idea at all

You constantly hear people saying there’s loads of Tvr for sale etc but if you have particular requirements not often much of a pool to chose from in reality.

Fully sorted cars at this time nearly always cost way more than people will be prepared to pay for them so two things will happen
1 less cars will be restored or fully looked after,,,even scrapped!
2 the cars that are fully looked after will be sort after

[rockits]

I'm not a fan of the under bonnet installation of the SC as it looks a little busy and untidy.

Maybe I'll just keep what I have for a while until something interesting or wortgwhile comes along. Just temporarily lost my TVR for the moment.

I've lost a lot of time on cars this week with the 450 debacle, a 4200 I'm selling and scanning all my Chin's history took ages.

Got to save and reorganise it all as a PDF now. Just seems silly to sell my Chimaera as I like it, it drives well and to sell at circa 12k seems hardly worth it if I have nothing to replace it with.

I think you are right that the not so good ones will get worse and the better ones will stay that way. I don't see any of them moving north though price wise any time soon. Just currently seems to be too much supply and less demand. We all know what that means.

Need to sleep on it.