New TVR still under wraps! (Vol. 2)
Discussion
bullittmcqueen said:
skwdenyer said:
dvs_dave said:
I wasn’t responding to your post/question, hence the lack of quotations... 
Anyway, the Welsh govt already owned the site, regardless of, and well before any involvement with TVR. I’m sure they will gladly lease/sell it to someone else with the funds if the TVR deal falls through.
Do they own it? I was fairly certain the WG had entered into a lease on the premises, with the landlord chipping in for some of the refurb costs.Anyway, the Welsh govt already owned the site, regardless of, and well before any involvement with TVR. I’m sure they will gladly lease/sell it to someone else with the funds if the TVR deal falls through.
Edited by dvs_dave on Tuesday 20th August 08:18
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-wales-south-east-wales...
dvs_dave said:
Whatever the term “acquired” means in relation ownership status is not all that important. The WG are certainly acting as landlord as far as anyone is concerned. They’re appointing refurb contractors, offering the space for lease, etc. I’m doubtful any of that is contingent upon a deal with TVR. The current place needs to be done up anyway if they want any sort of hope of getting anyone in there, and not necessarily TVR.
Although they'll only enter a multi-million refurbishment if there's a solid chance of the building being used immediately afterwards. If not, it's just money down the drain as it will start to rot right away just like it did before. So unless they don't have any other prospective candidate or at least a plan to get one (or more), they'll just let it rot or at least keep refurbishment to an absolute minimum to prevent further decay.The fact that refurbishment has not started by now is telling. As anyone who's reading my posts knows, i'm a great fan of the project and i have expected to witness some serious progress by now. That has not happened, as almost all other things have not happened and with the Brexit-train heading for the cliffs, i'm strongly considering pulling out.
bullittmcqueen said:
with the Brexit-train heading for the cliffs, i'm strongly considering pulling out.
Don't worry about Brexit ending the the whole thing ,electric cars have basically already done a much better job already,they're even discussing paying passers by on the street to shop you for leaving your engine running as happens in some US cities apparently.....I can soon envisage mothers grabbing their kids on the pavement and giving you a dirty look for driving a petrol car
twold said:
Don't worry about Brexit ending the the whole thing ,electric cars have basically already done a much better job already,they're even discussing paying passers by on the street to shop you for leaving your engine running as happens in some US cities apparently.....I can soon envisage mothers grabbing their kids on the pavement and giving you a dirty look for driving a petrol car
Only the mothers and daughters, boys are still gonna love it 
twold said:
Don't worry about Brexit ending the the whole thing ,electric cars have basically already done a much better job already,they're even discussing paying passers by on the street to shop you for leaving your engine running as happens in some US cities apparently.....I can soon envisage mothers grabbing their kids on the pavement and giving you a dirty look for driving a petrol car
I reckon 1 kid over a lifetime = 12million miles CO2 emissions equivalent in my TVR (this was a very rough calculation based on numbers that I can't really remember where I got them from, but there's got to be a good basis for an argument back to the dirty looks there somewhere )^^^^ yes, heard similar that if people are really concerned about climate change etc, then they should have one less child as one child multiplies the parents damage by 20 fold. So, I don't have any kids and I therefore think I'll stick with the ICE for as long as I can. (currently an Aston Martin) 
bullittmcqueen said:
dvs_dave said:
Whatever the term “acquired” means in relation ownership status is not all that important. The WG are certainly acting as landlord as far as anyone is concerned. They’re appointing refurb contractors, offering the space for lease, etc. I’m doubtful any of that is contingent upon a deal with TVR. The current place needs to be done up anyway if they want any sort of hope of getting anyone in there, and not necessarily TVR.
Although they'll only enter a multi-million refurbishment if there's a solid chance of the building being used immediately afterwards. If not, it's just money down the drain as it will start to rot right away just like it did before. So unless they don't have any other prospective candidate or at least a plan to get one (or more), they'll just let it rot or at least keep refurbishment to an absolute minimum to prevent further decay.The fact that refurbishment has not started by now is telling. As anyone who's reading my posts knows, i'm a great fan of the project and i have expected to witness some serious progress by now. That has not happened, as almost all other things have not happened and with the Brexit-train heading for the cliffs, i'm strongly considering pulling out.
Land Registry (another source of public info apart from Companies House, Google, and here) shows a search protecting a pending acquisition of part of a title comprising (broadly one third of) part of the Techboard site by Welsh Ministers having been made the day I posed my question.
There was a reason I bothered asking.
So, keep up; or keep focusing on taking the pee out of perhaps poorly executed, but probably well-loved by their creators, homages of supercars.
Maybe deposit holders can sit a tad comfier... maybe?
Pupp said:
At last.
Land Registry (another source of public info apart from Companies House, Google, and here) shows a search protecting a pending acquisition of part of a title comprising (broadly one third of) part of the Techboard site by Welsh Ministers having been made the day I posed my question.
There was a reason I bothered asking.
So, keep up; or keep focusing on taking the pee out of perhaps poorly executed, but probably well-loved by their creators, homages of supercars.
Maybe deposit holders can sit a tad comfier... maybe?
I’m sure that deposit holders will at last sleep soundly in the knowledge that Welsh Gov are doing something with part of the site but you’ll need to explain how it has any relevancy to progress of TVR !Land Registry (another source of public info apart from Companies House, Google, and here) shows a search protecting a pending acquisition of part of a title comprising (broadly one third of) part of the Techboard site by Welsh Ministers having been made the day I posed my question.
There was a reason I bothered asking.
So, keep up; or keep focusing on taking the pee out of perhaps poorly executed, but probably well-loved by their creators, homages of supercars.
Maybe deposit holders can sit a tad comfier... maybe?
V6 Pushfit said:
I’m sure that deposit holders will at last sleep soundly in the knowledge that Welsh Gov are doing something with part of the site but you’ll need to explain how it has any relevancy to progress of TVR !
Er, 'need'? Nope, no need to do anything here.However; the PH keyboard pundits have been arguing no production or pre-production testing occurring, after the refurb procurement announcement, equates to dead project.
The assumption underpinning that conclusion was that the necessary property rights existed for the refurb to be done (and pre-production etc to commence).
What the snippet I mention suggests is that, for whatever reason, only now is the purchase of the 'acquired' site (or a part of it) crystallising such that the refurb etc can follow. But, crystallising, it seems to be.
It could be the 'acquistion' previously reported and considered to be the starting post against which progress (or perceived lack of) is being measured here, was simply the taking of an option or conditional contract that has only now been triggered to complete by whatever other eventuality it turned on.
If conveyancing resulting in title changes is now occurring, that is significant IMO.
Edited by Pupp on Wednesday 21st August 07:17
macdeb said:
^^^^ yes, heard similar that if people are really concerned about climate change etc, then they should have one less child as one child multiplies the parents damage by 20 fold.
Haha, I imagine all the old people trying to put a horse in front of their plough, because they live again like in the Middle Ages and there are no young people to help them. Oh no, that's all we do with electrically driven robots...Pupp said:
V6 Pushfit said:
I’m sure that deposit holders will at last sleep soundly in the knowledge that Welsh Gov are doing something with part of the site but you’ll need to explain how it has any relevancy to progress of TVR !
Er, 'need'? Nope, no need to do anything here.However; the PH keyboard pundits have been arguing no production or pre-production testing occurring, after the refurb procurement announcement, equates to dead project.
The assumption underpinning that conclusion was that the necessary property rights existed for the refurb to be done (and pre-production etc to commence).
What the snippet I mention suggests is that, for whatever reason, only now is the purchase of the 'acquired' site (or a part of it) crystallising such that the refurb etc can follow. But, crystallising, it seems to be.
It could be the 'acquistion' previously reported and considered to be the starting post against which progress (or perceived lack of) is being measured here, was simply the taking of an option or conditional contract that has only now been triggered to complete by whatever other eventuality it turned on.
If conveyancing resulting in title changes is now occurring, that is significant IMO.
Edited by Pupp on Wednesday 21st August 07:17
Is that what you have said?
If so, that still doesn't equate to NewCo building anything at all soon. And I believe they were going to need the whole site for 2500 cars a year, not part of it.
Tyre Smoke said:
I think what you have tried to say, with an appalling lack of punctuation and grammar, is that part of the proposed TVR factory site in Wales has applied for planning permission for something?
Is that what you have said?
If so, that still doesn't equate to NewCo building anything at all soon. And I believe they were going to need the whole site for 2500 cars a year, not part of it.
No, that’s not what was said Is that what you have said?
If so, that still doesn't equate to NewCo building anything at all soon. And I believe they were going to need the whole site for 2500 cars a year, not part of it.
Somebody (unknown, but presumed to be the WG) has done something (what that is is not important) at the Land Registry. That “something” is a preparatory step to acquiring an interest (leasehold or freehold, doesn’t matter) in part of the site.
The interpretation is that the WG is about to acquire that part of the site. The assumption is that it is for TVR. The further assumption is that the WG wouldn’t do so if TVR had not secured the funding required to move forward.
From all this good news is inferred.
Pupp said:
Er, 'need'? Nope, no need to do anything here.
However; the PH keyboard pundits have been arguing no production or pre-production testing occurring, after the refurb procurement announcement, equates to dead project.
The assumption underpinning that conclusion was that the necessary property rights existed for the refurb to be done (and pre-production etc to commence).
What the snippet I mention suggests is that, for whatever reason, only now is the purchase of the 'acquired' site (or a part of it) crystallising such that the refurb etc can follow. But, crystallising, it seems to be.
It could be the 'acquistion' previously reported and considered to be the starting post against which progress (or perceived lack of) is being measured here, was simply the taking of an option or conditional contract that has only now been triggered to complete by whatever other eventuality it turned on.
If conveyancing resulting in title changes is now occurring, that is significant IMO.
Yes there was a ‘need’ as your original post was opaque. However; the PH keyboard pundits have been arguing no production or pre-production testing occurring, after the refurb procurement announcement, equates to dead project.
The assumption underpinning that conclusion was that the necessary property rights existed for the refurb to be done (and pre-production etc to commence).
What the snippet I mention suggests is that, for whatever reason, only now is the purchase of the 'acquired' site (or a part of it) crystallising such that the refurb etc can follow. But, crystallising, it seems to be.
It could be the 'acquistion' previously reported and considered to be the starting post against which progress (or perceived lack of) is being measured here, was simply the taking of an option or conditional contract that has only now been triggered to complete by whatever other eventuality it turned on.
If conveyancing resulting in title changes is now occurring, that is significant IMO.
Edited by Pupp on Wednesday 21st August 07:17
So there’s no good news then just information that could be as irrelevant to the same extent as your thinking its relevant.
At the beginning of the year (following the protracted 7 month tender process) Les announced that the preferred bidder had been selected by the WG. He obviously hoped that work would start asap. So if all this title business is holding everything up including the refurb, surely he must have been informed by the said WG?
It seems odd to me that the WG appointed the project manager in January 2018 or did they themselves not know just how long this whole process would take? Or is it still the case the funding of £5.5m has not been finalised? Who knows?
I would have thought TVR would have been quick to pass on the reasons for the delays if they were due to the WG ownership issue, as they have previously been quick to express frustration over delays. Even so, Les said they would look to start production in another unit if there were problems with the factory.
It seems odd to me that the WG appointed the project manager in January 2018 or did they themselves not know just how long this whole process would take? Or is it still the case the funding of £5.5m has not been finalised? Who knows?
I would have thought TVR would have been quick to pass on the reasons for the delays if they were due to the WG ownership issue, as they have previously been quick to express frustration over delays. Even so, Les said they would look to start production in another unit if there were problems with the factory.
I've kept my own counsel until now. I was an early investor, and I'm somewhere below 100 in the production list, I'm on my third TVR (2000 Tuscan). The excitement was palpable, going down to GMD in Surrey to see the mock-up, getting Goodwood tickets so I could be there at the reveal and even blagging my way onto the stand (but sadly, not into the cabin), more time spent with it at the NEC.
Since then the excitement has become frustration. I get "if there is nothing to say, say nothing" in the modern business world, but then silence also implies there is nothing to say. So what is happening? I recall doing a survey at the beginning of the year - does it take 6 months to compile the results? The last communication was about a factory that looked good, but nothing since.
I wrote to TVR last week and requested my deposit back, which I have no reason to doubt will come. Frankly, I am angry as I so much wanted it to be real - I don't think the design is stunning (it needs more curves), but I get why it is the way it is and I wanted it. I don't believe any more because no timescale has been kept, comms with depositors is poor, and production is way off if it ever happens. And no-one was calling and trying to convince me to stay, to give me reasons not to withdraw. That was the final nail in the coffin.
I will use the money to improve the Tuscan, and perhaps find something else for the garage as well. Apparently there is a message coming this month - as said, I don't believe any more. Sad.
Since then the excitement has become frustration. I get "if there is nothing to say, say nothing" in the modern business world, but then silence also implies there is nothing to say. So what is happening? I recall doing a survey at the beginning of the year - does it take 6 months to compile the results? The last communication was about a factory that looked good, but nothing since.
I wrote to TVR last week and requested my deposit back, which I have no reason to doubt will come. Frankly, I am angry as I so much wanted it to be real - I don't think the design is stunning (it needs more curves), but I get why it is the way it is and I wanted it. I don't believe any more because no timescale has been kept, comms with depositors is poor, and production is way off if it ever happens. And no-one was calling and trying to convince me to stay, to give me reasons not to withdraw. That was the final nail in the coffin.
I will use the money to improve the Tuscan, and perhaps find something else for the garage as well. Apparently there is a message coming this month - as said, I don't believe any more. Sad.
Tyre Smoke said:
I think what you have tried to say, with an appalling lack of punctuation and grammar, is that part of the proposed TVR factory site in Wales has applied for planning permission for something?
Is that what you have said?
If so, that still doesn't equate to NewCo building anything at all soon. And I believe they were going to need the whole site for 2500 cars a year, not part of it.
Seems my punctuation and grammar is a tad ahead of your comprehension skills, so don't be so pompous.Is that what you have said?
If so, that still doesn't equate to NewCo building anything at all soon. And I believe they were going to need the whole site for 2500 cars a year, not part of it.
I hoped the real information I described would be of interest to those with at least some grasp of how commercial property transactions are structured; I clearly over-estimated the capacity of part of the potential audience in this regard however.
No wonder TVR have ceased communicating
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