Is it Possible GT6 Question

Is it Possible GT6 Question

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Snapper7

Original Poster:

990 posts

204 months

Tuesday 27th May 2008
quotequote all
OK some of you might think that I am made to even think this. But I love the style of the Triumph GT6 but don't want to own a car of that age with all the problems that tends to come with them.

So here is the big question. is it possible to get a GT6 in need of restoration, strip it down. Sort out the body work and then rebuild it with modern running gear? IE; suspension wheels and an up to date engine and gearbox. I was wondering if a powerful Ford Zetec or Duratec could be installed.

This way you bet the best of both worlds, a classic car the the power and reliability of a modern car with much better handling.

Has anyone done this or knows of a company that does? I know that there is a company that does this with the Lotus Elan +2.

mybrainhurts

89,437 posts

200 months

Tuesday 27th May 2008
quotequote all
Can't answer your questions, but I saw two beautifully restored examples in one day last week...

I always worried about that Triumph Herald back suspension...negative to (very) positive camber in a blink.

Edited by mybrainhurts on Tuesday 27th May 14:17

//j17

3,282 posts

168 months

Tuesday 27th May 2008
quotequote all
Short answer - yes.

Personally if I was going to new running gear I wouldn't bother buying/restoring a car, I'd buy a full fiberglass shell and mate it to a custom chassis or customised kit car chassis. Track seems to be the main issue - not like I've considered this my self smile

http://panelcraft-trailers.com/

GT6 front/rear track is 1244mm but something like a Caterham is 1505/1465

Yertis

14,787 posts

211 months

Tuesday 27th May 2008
quotequote all
You know if you build up a GT6 properly you wouldn't (IMO) need to muck about too much with new engines, gearboxes and so on. Certainly rebuild the suspension with some decent bushes and dampers, possibly some uprated front springs and anti-roll bars. The original 2000cc 6-cyl engine is part of the charm of the GT6, it would be a shame to lose that lovely Merlin-esque exhaust. Properly tuned it's quite powerful and responsive.

The gearbox could, on reflection, benefit from replacing.

Snapper7

Original Poster:

990 posts

204 months

Tuesday 27th May 2008
quotequote all
Yertis said:
You know if you build up a GT6 properly you wouldn't (IMO) need to muck about too much with new engines, gearboxes and so on. Certainly rebuild the suspension with some decent bushes and dampers, possibly some uprated front springs and anti-roll bars. The original 2000cc 6-cyl engine is part of the charm of the GT6, it would be a shame to lose that lovely Merlin-esque exhaust. Properly tuned it's quite powerful and responsive.

The gearbox could, on reflection, benefit from replacing.
I am coming from being a Lotus Elise & Exige owner and I am much more akin to the power, performance and handling that these cars have, as well as the reliability that modern running gear & engines provide. But would like a car with older looks. The fiberglass body shell and roll cage mentioned earlier makes great sense.

I would like to have a classic looking car with say a 2lt 190-230bhp engine. 5 or possible 6 speed close ratio gear box. With good suspension, wheels and tyre setup and AP 4pot brakes.



//j17

3,282 posts

168 months

Tuesday 27th May 2008
quotequote all
Why would you want to use a stock modern 200BHP/30MPG engine for a few hundred quid from the scrap yard when you can have an expensive tuned classic 120BHP/30MPG one...

Edited by //j17 on Tuesday 27th May 14:19

Yertis

14,787 posts

211 months

Tuesday 27th May 2008
quotequote all
//j17 said:
Why would you want to use a stock modern 200BHP/30MPG engine for a few hundred quid from the scrap yard when you can have an expensive tuned classic 120BHP/30MPG one...

Edited by //j17 on Tuesday 27th May 14:19
Because it sounds nicer? I understand your point though.

Snapper7

Original Poster:

990 posts

204 months

Tuesday 27th May 2008
quotequote all
//j17 said:
Why would you want to use a stock modern 200BHP/30MPG engine for a few hundred quid from the scrap yard when you can have an expensive tuned classic 120BHP/30MPG one...

Edited by //j17 on Tuesday 27th May 14:19
You might lose some of the nice straight 6 sound. but a GT6 with a fiberglass bodyshell, plus a modern 200-230bhp engine would go like the clappers and with a nice sports exhaust it would still sound great. It would also be very reliable as well

Combover

3,009 posts

172 months

Tuesday 27th May 2008
quotequote all
Why not fit a BMW Straight Six instead? Staying relatively in keeping with the orginal layout but with BMW power and relability...

Snapper7

Original Poster:

990 posts

204 months

Tuesday 27th May 2008
quotequote all
Combover said:
Why not fit a BMW Straight Six instead? Staying relatively in keeping with the orginal layout but with BMW power and relability...
HMMM

Do you know if anyone is doing a straight conversion kit for the BMW engine? Mind you ford engines esspecially the Zetecs are as cheap as hell at the moment

SpitBang

14 posts

144 months

Tuesday 27th May 2008
quotequote all
There are many possible engine swaps for the GT6 and other small chassis Triumphs.
Rover K series http://crazyspitfire.blogspot.com/
Ford Zetec 2L http://lonnylonsdalesjunk.blogspot.com/
Volvo T5 http://triumphgt6.blogspot.com/
3L 6CYL Supra Engine http://www.spit6.co.uk/index.html

Has been said many times before, getting the engine to fit in the car is the easy bit, getting all the ancillaries plumbed in neatly and correctly can take the time
http://www.sideways-technologies.co.uk/forum/Blah....

Jonny_uk

305 posts

150 months

Tuesday 27th May 2008
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Loads of space under bonnet, weak point is trans and rear diff, not to mention rotoflex! Do the Canley classics CV conversion then get a sierra diff in there. Bolt anything to a type 9 box, custom prop, and zetec 2.0 under the bonnet (130bhp) Fit throttle bodies or webbers and make it 150bhp, custom exhaust, hotter cams and youve got more than enough power fr the chassis!

Combover

3,009 posts

172 months

Wednesday 28th May 2008
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If you're going to all tha effort, surely you'd want more power than 150bhp. You'd get that from a breathed on TR6 engine which, as long as you looked after it, can be as reliable as you like (admittedly given better cooling).

I reckon BMW straight Six should be the way forward, something nice like a standard 330 lump. I'll have a look to see if anyone has done the conversion before.

Incidentally, I know of a couple of K-Series Spitfires (as per Spit-Bang's post) so the Ford conversion is certainly do-able.

smile

Edited by Combover on Wednesday 28th May 08:10

//j17

3,282 posts

168 months

Wednesday 28th May 2008
quotequote all
All this talk of 4 and 6-pots - pussies! You KNOW it wants a V8 (but make it a good one, not the Buick reject) - turn key 5L Ford 302 small block - £4,000 for 300BHP - http://www.britishamericanengines.co.uk/ford_price...

Snapper7

Original Poster:

990 posts

204 months

Wednesday 28th May 2008
quotequote all
//j17 said:
All this talk of 4 and 6-pots - pussies! You KNOW it wants a V8 (but make it a good one, not the Buick reject) - turn key 5L Ford 302 small block - £4,000 for 300BHP - http://www.britishamericanengines.co.uk/ford_price...
I would have thought that a V8 would be to powerful for what a GT6 Chassis could take, not to mention the issues over weight and the effect that it would have on cornering and stopping ablity.

A Zetec would have a great power to weight ability and and would also be light enough to aid the cars handling set up.

Power in nothing without control

//j17

3,282 posts

168 months

Wednesday 28th May 2008
quotequote all
I was assuming the fibreglass body and custom chassis approach for a V8, though it has been done - in fact one of the cars on the Panelcraft Trailers site is a V8.

Jonny_uk

305 posts

150 months

Tuesday 3rd June 2008
quotequote all
Plus Zetec's are ten a penny in scrapper mondeos! Ive already got 2 on the bench!

Type 9 box is around £100

You can squeeze more out of zetec easily but will need a bore, and rod bolts.

Plus with the development of the kit car market theres loads of tuning and modification parts for them,

Rover K-series is lighter by a few kilo's but some love them, some hate them

You could mount zetec+box to existing diff but they are only a modified herald unit!

Plus the advantage ov moving weight back in the car to get mopre 50/50

I cant think of a better combination..............."browse's ebay for next project car"

Leave the outside standard and what a street sleeper!



//j17

3,282 posts

168 months

Wednesday 4th June 2008
quotequote all
Jonny_uk said:
You could mount zetec+box to existing diff but they are only a modified herald unit!
No they aren't - they are exactly the same with a few different ratios!

The US is probably the best place for infor on diff. swaps (V8s eat them!) with the Toyota Supra being the preferred option. http://www.spit6.co.uk/6.html

wildoliver

8,174 posts

161 months

Wednesday 4th June 2008
quotequote all
If your serious about doing, and I mean serious then your up against a few issues. I must admit to being a classic car specialist, and we build a few outlandish cars, but (and I should maybe whisper this in here) they are usually MG based. One big benefit we have on MG's is generally the basic car is very strong, (MGB not so much midget, but all the weak parts get swapped on midgets on any upgrade anyway), so if you want to bolt a v8 in it literally is a bolt in job, very little else needs upgrading. Likewise turbo engines etc.

With a spitfire/GT6 you are going to have to overcome the rear suspension issues, personally as a standard car I think the problem is over rated, if you can drive they are responsive and fun cars, however you start doubling the power output and it will become unpleasant to drive.

If I were you I would (and if you want to talk to me about possibly doing this that is fine) Buy a gt6/spit chassis and a lotus elan scrap chassis, the elan uses the same front suspension as the triumph but has a far superior rear suspension, with inboard disks and a ford diff, I would then mate the two chassis together with possibly one of those fibreglass tubs.

I would then decide engine wise and there is a lot of choice, a 2500 engine with subtle tweaks would make a nice classic engine for the car, likewise the BMW engine would suit it very well, there are loads of options and you could spend anywhere from £2k to 20k from this project, but I would advise staying away from just buying a gt6 and plonking another engine in it as you will not only not get your cash back at the end, but it will be worth less than when you started.

Oliver

//j17

3,282 posts

168 months

Thursday 5th June 2008
quotequote all
Damn dirty cart spring/leaver arm damper loving MG driver!wink

The Triumph SC rear end is easy-enough to sort these days, and the only really killer one was the GT6 Mk 1 (95BHP through a budget rear end designed for 34.5BHP was never a very good idea). The GT6 Mk2/early Mk3 Rotoflex added a proper lower wishbone and is fine but the rubber doughnuts don't last for ever and repro ones are...variable.

One of the more popular was of sorting the bouncy bits of the rear end is a Rotoflex rear end with a set of MGF hubs and CV joints replacing the doughnuts - http://www.mikeross-dds.com/cv/CV.html.