Winter tyres vol 2

[Patrick Bateman]

ATM said:

Which winters?

Hankook Winter I*cept Evo 3 W330

[wiliferus]

Just a quick update - Vred Quatrac Pro+ have been absolutely unflappable on the recent cold wet roads for the morning commute. Very planted, sure footed and confidence inspiring.
Obviously no settling snow (yet) but very pleased with how they behave in the type of dominant South east winter type weather.

[Smint]

wiliferus said:

Just a quick update - Vred Quatrac Pro+ have been absolutely unflappable on the recent cold wet roads for the morning commute. Very planted, sure footed and confidence inspiring.
Obviously no settling snow (yet) but very pleased with how they behave in the type of dominant South east winter type weather.

Seconded, proving sure footed on the Forester, quiet and ride comfortably too, just like all previous Quatrac versions have on various family cars.

Have they been superceeded by Quatrac 6, yet another Cross Climate look alike?

[Bonefish Blues]

And on a Panda 4x4.

[havoc]

wiliferus said:

Just a quick update - Vred Quatrac Pro+ have been absolutely unflappable on the recent cold wet roads for the morning commute. Very planted, sure footed and confidence inspiring.
Obviously no settling snow (yet) but very pleased with how they behave in the type of dominant South east winter type weather.

I had some Wintrac 3's on an old DC2 many years ago - quite happily schlepped into and out of a work car park with about 4-5in of virgin snow. Didn't bat an eyelid.

I think the issue with the Jag above isn't the winter tyres, it's a combination of auto gearbox and excessively wide rears (i.e. too-low ground pressure to 'cut through').


I'm overdue fitting our winter tyres - the driveway's been u/s for the last two weeks because of delays, and it's finally done but it's fresh tarmac so I'm loath to use a trolley jack and axle stands on it just yet. So I might have to bite the bullet and ask the local friendly tyre fitter if they'll swap them over. Dead money, but they'll balance them within the fee and it saves me getting cold and wet.

[Speed addicted]

havoc said:

I had some Wintrac 3's on an old DC2 many years ago - quite happily schlepped into and out of a work car park with about 4-5in of virgin snow. Didn't bat an eyelid.

I think the issue with the Jag above isn't the winter tyres, it's a combination of auto gearbox and excessively wide rears (i.e. too-low ground pressure to 'cut through').

I find auto gearboxes to be fine in snow as long as they creep, you can easily modulate power depending on how much traction you re getting.

The Jag will struggle because of the wide rears, low ground clearance and high torque. Very easy to break traction or beach it.

Even BMW, king of stupidly wide tyres, have much narrower tyres specified for winter use.

Edited by Speed addicted on Sunday 23 November 20:04

[Patrick Bateman]

Yes as I mentioned, letting it creep worked just fine later on that day further back up the track.

It's still very good on snow as I've used it the last 2 winters in terrible conditions without issue.

[Downward]

Did get a good offer on some Cross Climates 3 a few weeks back at ATS.

With fitting and all charges worked out at around £87per tyre for 16 s
17” ones are over £150 each for comparison,

Edited by Downward on Monday 24th November 13:57

[ATM]

This is good

[Griffith4ever]

Speed addicted said:

havoc said:

I had some Wintrac 3's on an old DC2 many years ago - quite happily schlepped into and out of a work car park with about 4-5in of virgin snow. Didn't bat an eyelid.

I think the issue with the Jag above isn't the winter tyres, it's a combination of auto gearbox and excessively wide rears (i.e. too-low ground pressure to 'cut through').

I find auto gearboxes to be fine in snow as long as they creep, you can easily modulate power depending on how much traction you re getting.

The Jag will struggle because of the wide rears, low ground clearance and high torque. Very easy to break traction or beach it.

Even BMW, king of stupidly wide tyres, have much narrower tyres specified for winter use.

Edited by Speed addicted on Sunday 23 November 20:04

Mud tyres "cut through". Snow tyres rely on sipes - small slits all over the tread. These sipes fill with snow, and nothing grips snow like... snow . My disco ATs were hugely wide but as they had sipes the drove like the snow wasn't there (almost!). And auto boxes are made for gentle traction

Narrower tyres help of course, more squish, and sidewall grip.

Edited by Griffith4ever on Tuesday 25th November 14:59

[Konan]

Not sure what newer auto boxes do, but the ones I've had in the past with 'snow' settings generally pulled off in 2nd gear rather than 1ss and shifted up earlier.

[Davie]

wiliferus said:

Just a quick update - Vred Quatrac Pro+ have been absolutely unflappable on the recent cold wet roads for the morning commute. Very planted, sure footed and confidence inspiring.
Obviously no settling snow (yet) but very pleased with how they behave in the type of dominant South east winter type weather.

Aye, quite a fan of these too having used Quatracs on various cars almost exclusively for the past decade. Put as set of Pro's on my van last year and just replaced the fronts again a couple of weeks back as they were down to 3.5mm. Also have a set to go on the Volvo soon too, as in this weekend... had planned to swap them by now but car shuffling delayed it but it's made it quite obvious that the current Goodyear summers it's on are sketchy in the current wet / sub zero temperatures. Really can't fault them for the money as an all year round, general usage tyre.

[havoc]

Griffith4ever said:

Mud tyres "cut through". Snow tyres rely on sipes - small slits all over the tread. These sipes fill with snow, and nothing grips snow like... snow . My disco ATs were hugely wide but as they had sipes the drove like the snow wasn't there (almost!). And auto boxes are made for gentle traction

Narrower tyres help of course, more squish, and sidewall grip.

Fair point. You do, however, need enough ground pressure to push the sipes apart (otherwise most of them are just a blade-cut in the rubber).

[5s Alive]

ATM said:

This is good

I'd like to see a 4th puck with the latest ultra-low rolling resistance compound fitted to our EV. I suspect they'd need a much larger rink - the length of Edinbrgh airport's runway ought to do it... possibly ....

[E-bmw]

havoc said:

Griffith4ever said:

Mud tyres "cut through". Snow tyres rely on sipes - small slits all over the tread. These sipes fill with snow, and nothing grips snow like... snow . My disco ATs were hugely wide but as they had sipes the drove like the snow wasn't there (almost!). And auto boxes are made for gentle traction

Narrower tyres help of course, more squish, and sidewall grip.

Fair point. You do, however, need enough ground pressure to push the sipes apart (otherwise most of them are just a blade-cut in the rubber).

Small point, but I am sure you will realise it is the ground pressure that closes the sipes up to "grip" the snow in place, when the tread moves back of the ground in the sipes open back up again.

[bolidemichael]

I used the CL600 this morning on cold roads (well trodden with commuting traffic, so not too frosty) around 0 to -1°C and the CC3 Sport already a vast improvement over the CC2 for feel and grip. Whilst it broke traction a couple of times, it was not noteworthy.

[stevieturbo]

Griffith4ever said:

Mud tyres "cut through". Snow tyres rely on sipes - small slits all over the tread. These sipes fill with snow, and nothing grips snow like... snow . My disco ATs were hugely wide but as they had sipes the drove like the snow wasn't there (almost!). And auto boxes are made for gentle traction

Narrower tyres help of course, more squish, and sidewall grip.

Edited by Griffith4ever on Tuesday 25th November 14:59

Quite the opposite, they ensure the tyre does not build up with snow, and there are multiple edges to bite into the snow to try and grip, as well as rubber compound being very important.

https://www.google.com/search?q=what+do+sipes+do+o...

[ATM]

stevieturbo said:

Griffith4ever said:

Mud tyres "cut through". Snow tyres rely on sipes - small slits all over the tread. These sipes fill with snow, and nothing grips snow like... snow . My disco ATs were hugely wide but as they had sipes the drove like the snow wasn't there (almost!). And auto boxes are made for gentle traction

Narrower tyres help of course, more squish, and sidewall grip.

Edited by Griffith4ever on Tuesday 25th November 14:59

Quite the opposite, they ensure the tyre does not build up with snow, and there are multiple edges to bite into the snow to try and grip, as well as rubber compound being very important.

https://www.google.com/search?q=what+do+sipes+do+o...

I like to explain it total newbs like this - not assumin anyone here is a total newb obv -

Think of the winter tyre tread as being more like a toothbrush. As the tyre comes into contact with the road the tyre wall is softer and squirms around. The tread itself is also softer and this lets it squirm around too. This squirming around allows the bristles to dig into the surface and look for or create grip.

[ChocolateFrog]

stevieturbo said:

Griffith4ever said:

Mud tyres "cut through". Snow tyres rely on sipes - small slits all over the tread. These sipes fill with snow, and nothing grips snow like... snow . My disco ATs were hugely wide but as they had sipes the drove like the snow wasn't there (almost!). And auto boxes are made for gentle traction

Narrower tyres help of course, more squish, and sidewall grip.

Edited by Griffith4ever on Tuesday 25th November 14:59

Quite the opposite, they ensure the tyre does not build up with snow, and there are multiple edges to bite into the snow to try and grip, as well as rubber compound being very important.

https://www.google.com/search?q=what+do+sipes+do+o...

Interesting. I was under the impression it was the former.

Edit. You can literally get AI to say whatever you want to support your view.

Edited by ChocolateFrog on Wednesday 26th November 09:51

[ChocolateFrog]

Uniroyal seem to suggest it's snow on snow contact too.