Focus TDCi cutting out - thoughts?

[MajorMantra]

My 2003 Focus 1.8 TDCi has started randomly cutting out. I've been doing lots of reading, I've stuck some diesel cleaner in the tank and I've got an OBD2 scanner on order, but has anyone got any useful advice in the meantime?

Scenario is: driving/idling at steady revs, glow plug light starts flashing indicating a problem and engine cuts out more or less instantaneously. The first time this happened the car restarted immediately. On subsequent occasions it's been reluctant, but has eventually obliged.

A year ago the car cut out on me under acceleration and a mechanic diagnosed a blocked fuel filter, which fixed the problem. I think this latest issue is something else as it happens at steady revs. In fact the first time I was stopped at lights.

Any ideas? Some old threads I've read suggest it's the camshaft position sensor - does this seem likely? Will this produce a fault code and if not, should I just fit a new one to see if it helps?

(I've tried the dash diagnostic trick and it appears there are no DTCs, but I wasn't sure if the OBD2 reader would show more info.)

Cheers!

Edited by MajorMantra on Monday 3rd April 12:15

[Emanresu]

These cars have problems with faulty pumps and injectors. It really could be anything though. I wouldn't spend any money until it was properly scanned so you know what's going on. If there are no fault codes logged, don't forget to look at live data so you see what's really going on.

[PaulKemp]

Fuel pumps are a problem
On my Mondeo TDCI it was the injectors that caused the exact same problem you have

[MajorMantra]

Hmmmm.

Could it really be the pump/injectors given that it's driving completely normally the rest of the time? When it's not cutting out, the engine is behaving just like it always has - it revs out fine, never hesitates or anything.

Hopefully this scanner will show up soon...

[MajorMantra]

Bit stumped here. The scanner came and showed up one EGR related code, which I suspect is unrelated as it doesn't fit the symptoms. I've cleared it and it hasn't recurred so far.

Today I've been out in the car twice for a total of 50 miles and the damned thing is running fine. If I'm going to diagnose the cutting out I need it to do it again!

Unless the diesel cleaner I stuck in on Sunday has fixed it (highly unlikely, I imagine) I have to assume the problem is still there and I can't trust the car.

Any brilliant ideas?

[PaulKemp]

Camshaft position sensor is cheap, I tried that, and injector cleaner in the fuel, and a filter change, that left the fuel pump or injectors .
In my case it was injectors

[MajorMantra]

I've put a few more miles on the car and still no more cut-outs, very odd.

I'm having trouble deciding what to do now - don't really want to throw money at it guessing, also don't want a car I can't trust. If it's the injectors I'll likely be scrapping it as the car just isn't worth the expense of replacements.

[MajorMantra]

Update on this: after numerous short journeys with no cut-outs, it's happened again, this time halfway round a tight bend. Luckily I was travelling slowly, as losing power steering was pretty alarming this time. It restarted fine 5 minutes later and I drove it home another 12 miles without incident.

Torque Pro is still showing no fault codes despite the flashing glowplug light indicating a fault when it cut.

I'm intending to ditch the car imminently but I'd still like to know if there's anything else I can do without throwing money at it...

[DrDeAtH]

Might be worth giving the loom a quick check over to see if it has chafed through the insulation anywhere.

[MajorMantra]

DrDeAtH said:

Might be worth giving the loom a quick check over to see if it has chafed through the insulation anywhere.

There's nothing obvious. I've also tried the highly unscientific method of wiggling all the connections under the bonnet with the engine running.

I'm wondering what the least painful way to rid myself of the car is now. What's the market for highly unreliable Focuses with a year's MOT like?

[GreenDog]

My 52 plate 1.8 tdci had the same issue, tried the crankshaft position sensor first and that cured it fortunately. I don't recall it being expensive.

If after cutting out i left it for 5 or 10 mins it'd start again no problem.
A few years later when the injectors went it just wouldn't start without a squirt of easy start into the intake first.

[MajorMantra]

GreenDog said:

My 52 plate 1.8 tdci had the same issue, tried the crankshaft position sensor first and that cured it fortunately. I don't recall it being expensive.

If after cutting out i left it for 5 or 10 mins it'd start again no problem.
A few years later when the injectors went it just wouldn't start without a squirt of easy start into the intake first.

I could still change this, but the fact that there are no fault codes and the problem is so intermittent make diagnosis incredibly frustrating. Not to mention that every time I break down I risk having an accident.

EDIT: Should there be a fault code for this? One readable with a generic scanner?

Edited by MajorMantra on Monday 24th April 22:20

[russell_ram]

Intermittent crank speed sensor (heat related) fault is a good call. Won't necessarily log a fault code as no crank speed signal equals engine not rotating from the viewpoint of the ECU which then therefore stops injecting - it doesn't see it as a fault as such. Re-starts straight away when cooled down a bit?
Live reading from the OBD would see no speed signal during the period when it won't immediately re-start?

Edited by russell_ram on Tuesday 25th April 09:50

[MajorMantra]

russell_ram said:

Intermittent crank speed sensor (heat related) fault is a good call. Won't necessarily log a fault code as no crank speed signal equals engine not rotating from the viewpoint of the ECU which then therefore stops injecting - it doesn't see it as a fault as such. Re-starts straight away when cooled down a bit?

Yep. Sometimes it'll start more less immediately, sometimes it needs to sit for 5 minutes. There seem to be loads of people saying it's the cam sensor, some say crank sensor. I've ordered the former as it's only £13 and if it fixes the problem the car goes from being worthless to slightly less worthless! (I'm selling it either way, but it's much easier to sell a working car...)

[imagineifyeswill]

You said that the fault code reader threw up an EGR fault which you cleared then the car ran fine for a while, my first suggestion before you posted that was going to be an ittermittent sticking EGR valve.

[MajorMantra]

imagineifyeswill said:

You said that the fault code reader threw up an EGR fault which you cleared then the car ran fine for a while, my first suggestion before you posted that was going to be an ittermittent sticking EGR valve.

If it was that, the fault code should have reappeared though really. I assumed it was a code stored ages ago.

I've changed the camshaft sensor anyway, we'll see if makes any difference! Of course the only way to be sure it's fixed is to drive for 40+minutes and see if it dies on me...

[Kalum Hynes]

Hi I have the same sort of problem were the car was driving fine and then it just cut out and will not start i have no fault codes not the cluster changed the high pressure pump I am at a loss what it is the car is turning over prefect but just will not start any help would be greatly appreciated thank you

[MajorMantra]

Wow, old thread! Fwiw the problem seemed to go away after I changed the camshaft sensor, so worth trying as it's cheap. I think mine was failing but the problem didn't show up until it got hot.