Jag Mark 2 front springs
Discussion
barefoot said:
I am nearly finished with restoring the car and the with new shocks and springs it looks like it is sitting on it's rear I realise it will settle a bit at the front but does anyone know if there are lower front springs available for them it is a 1961 3.8.
That's an awful pretty motor you have barefoot.There are several spring ratings on Jaguars of this era; looks like you have the wrong ones.
For example the front springs from a much heavier 420 saloon will look similar off the car and will fit into place, but the result will be what is in your picture. You have to get the correct rating from a reliable source.
Hi Barefoot, leave it as is for the time being. You will find the spring will settle down after a few miles, then re check, set your geometry. I see you have 6 inch comp wires on the front. Jaguar stipulated only ever fit on the rear, though they will work it will be woolly on the front end due to the large soft sidewall and the weight transfer on cornering. It will handle far better with the correct size rims and tyres on the front, vredestiens or Michelins 185/15.
have the suspension bolts all been tightened while the suspension is on droop? this will make any car sit high as the bushes are twisted. plus the bushed will fail quickly anyway. all suspension bolts should be done up with the suspension at ride height.
also getting custom coil springs made is straight forward and can be done for any height and stiffness.
also getting custom coil springs made is straight forward and can be done for any height and stiffness.
Yes the guy who has done the work for me (Michael Fare) holds the record for the highest price an Etype sold at a public auction in France that he restored from scratch:
Translated.....
The price of Quality
68 000 € at the hammer, which makes 80 200 € including fees, is the price paid for this 1963 OTS E-Type 3.8L…..A record price in a public French sale that is justified by an irreproachable presentation of the car registered across the channel amd coming out of a high level Franco-British restoration. Interior and mechanical part is the British specialist Michael Fare’s masterpiece while the body work has been done by the Troyen Carrosserie du Faubourg.
He only lives 3 miles from my house and works out of his Dad's farm in an old shed! He wants the car left and as RW says give it time to settle and the lower profile tyres make it look worse. I originally took it into him 2 years ago to have an engine rebuild that has sort of developed, the car now has a 3.8 engine all balanced with a 4.2 head and triple SU's. Electric windows all round, remote central locking, cruise control, rear bumper is the reverse sensor, electric seats, Becker Sat Nav, heated front/rear screens etc etc. As I said once finished I will post a topic on the car, some things I have tried to save money on as it has run away a bit but can't wait to use it soon!
Translated.....
The price of Quality
68 000 € at the hammer, which makes 80 200 € including fees, is the price paid for this 1963 OTS E-Type 3.8L…..A record price in a public French sale that is justified by an irreproachable presentation of the car registered across the channel amd coming out of a high level Franco-British restoration. Interior and mechanical part is the British specialist Michael Fare’s masterpiece while the body work has been done by the Troyen Carrosserie du Faubourg.
He only lives 3 miles from my house and works out of his Dad's farm in an old shed! He wants the car left and as RW says give it time to settle and the lower profile tyres make it look worse. I originally took it into him 2 years ago to have an engine rebuild that has sort of developed, the car now has a 3.8 engine all balanced with a 4.2 head and triple SU's. Electric windows all round, remote central locking, cruise control, rear bumper is the reverse sensor, electric seats, Becker Sat Nav, heated front/rear screens etc etc. As I said once finished I will post a topic on the car, some things I have tried to save money on as it has run away a bit but can't wait to use it soon!
Edited by barefoot on Tuesday 16th March 19:37
Edited by barefoot on Tuesday 16th March 20:01
Really sorry about this barefoot, but the rack conversions available just do not work and never will.
Bumpsteer, track changes with load( I have seen a fully loaded Mk2 with a rack, toe out 3/4 of an inch from the straight ahead position ) a customer took some friends with luggage, touring Europe and the new tyres were scrubbed out to the cords after 2000 miles. You could really do with the 420 front beam, that way the geometry can be set correctly. No matter what you do with this set up , it will never be right.
Bumpsteer, track changes with load( I have seen a fully loaded Mk2 with a rack, toe out 3/4 of an inch from the straight ahead position ) a customer took some friends with luggage, touring Europe and the new tyres were scrubbed out to the cords after 2000 miles. You could really do with the 420 front beam, that way the geometry can be set correctly. No matter what you do with this set up , it will never be right.
5 rack changes later speaks for itself.I keep 420 beams and assemblies in stock, but no rack conversions , only those I`ve changed. I`ll have a few at stoneleigh if you want some more. Ask Ken Jenkins of the JEC if you doubt my integrity, or further go a field, Mike Roddy, Australian Jaguar engineer. You will get the same answer re the racks, crap.
I`ve had this arguement more times than I can remember.I can understand you doubting my integrity. One Australian guy even sent through a plaster cast of his tyres! and they too showed evidence premature scrub, but He was happy with that.
I am alarmed at the total lack of understanding out there and its` world wide.
If you don`t understand my arguement, try jacking the car up and down, comparing the droop/track and camber changes between a rack coversion and a standard car.Sort of simulated load changes. You will be alarmed. The relationship between the rack and the steering arms is totally wrong cmapred to the standard set up. There should be a line drawn throw the lower wishbone pin , converging at the centre of the back axle.This imaginary line should travel through the inner ball joint on a standard car, or the ball link to rod( inner ) on a rack for correct geometry. Well on a rack it dog legs at the inner rod pivot.the rack needs to be around 2.3 inches further back.
I`ve had this arguement more times than I can remember.I can understand you doubting my integrity. One Australian guy even sent through a plaster cast of his tyres! and they too showed evidence premature scrub, but He was happy with that.
I am alarmed at the total lack of understanding out there and its` world wide.
If you don`t understand my arguement, try jacking the car up and down, comparing the droop/track and camber changes between a rack coversion and a standard car.Sort of simulated load changes. You will be alarmed. The relationship between the rack and the steering arms is totally wrong cmapred to the standard set up. There should be a line drawn throw the lower wishbone pin , converging at the centre of the back axle.This imaginary line should travel through the inner ball joint on a standard car, or the ball link to rod( inner ) on a rack for correct geometry. Well on a rack it dog legs at the inner rod pivot.the rack needs to be around 2.3 inches further back.
paul
I cerainly do not question your knowledge of these cars! Michael totally agrees with you but my car had this system on it and as I was trying to keep costs down I wanted it left but it is something I will have done next winter. AS I said it went to Michael for an engine rebuild and went on from there. His friend that owns Vicarage mentioned this 2 years ago to me on a visit there and I totally forgot about it!
I cerainly do not question your knowledge of these cars! Michael totally agrees with you but my car had this system on it and as I was trying to keep costs down I wanted it left but it is something I will have done next winter. AS I said it went to Michael for an engine rebuild and went on from there. His friend that owns Vicarage mentioned this 2 years ago to me on a visit there and I totally forgot about it!
No Probs barefoot( interesting title !) just keep an eye on the tyres,and another for a 420 beam. Correctly set up with decent dampers,a decent steering shaft, progessive springs and my own geometry settings they can handle better than any german junk currently available, rest assured.
RW774, interesting. The car is currently awaiting restoration so isn't on the road but I will certainly remember this and check at some point when it's accesible.
Just out of interest, what involvement do you have with the scene? (meant from a pure curiosity POV, I'm assuming it's Jag not Daimler related).
Just out of interest, what involvement do you have with the scene? (meant from a pure curiosity POV, I'm assuming it's Jag not Daimler related).
Hi Task, many many years of sorting out Jaguar problems,poor upgrades that don`t work and poor maintenance.The biggest are not always the best, if you get my point. I run a business in Jaguar service, repair and restoration ranging from the 1930s to 2010,SS to XF. I started a post `whats in the workshop` but this was deemed advertising.`Slapped wrists`and had to be withdrawn.I`m proud of our work though and like to share it.I offer advice when I can
Just had uprated front springs fitted to my '65 3.8 Mk2. WotJag were very helpful and provided appropriate shims (different on each side by the way) plus written instructions for my local garage.
I too thought it looks a bit high now with the new springs. I can fit a whole hand between the top of the tyre and the wheelarch. Ken Jenkins from the JEC reckons that you should just be able to fit three fingers between tyre and arch. Some mechanics (like RW774) have said that the springs will settle down after a while (I take this to mean that they will compress slightly, thus lowering the overall ride height), but others have said that springs don't do this.
Confused? Oh yes! But I'm riding it out for a while to see if it settles down. It certainly handles better and is fantastic to drive!
I too thought it looks a bit high now with the new springs. I can fit a whole hand between the top of the tyre and the wheelarch. Ken Jenkins from the JEC reckons that you should just be able to fit three fingers between tyre and arch. Some mechanics (like RW774) have said that the springs will settle down after a while (I take this to mean that they will compress slightly, thus lowering the overall ride height), but others have said that springs don't do this.
Confused? Oh yes! But I'm riding it out for a while to see if it settles down. It certainly handles better and is fantastic to drive!
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