Fettled Evora S vs Evora 400
Discussion
Hi guys,
Looking for some input from those with Evora ownership experience.
I spend my summers participating in organised driving tours in Europe. It is all about the driving and once up in the mountain passes or deep in the wilds we drive our cars hard.
My last tour car was a 370Z. With some extensive suspension and braking upgrades it made a pretty good steer and could stay with pretty much anything in the twisties. However it was just a bit too slow for the long sweepers and steep mountain ascents, as in those situations the exotics would literally just walk away from me, often leaving the old Z puffing and panting as her oil temp topped out.
The Nissan has now been sold and I will be looking to buy a new tour car in spring with a bit more pace. I considered a GTR or R8 V10, but neither are very appealing as I would prefer something with finesse rather than outright grunt.
I have become quite fascinated with Evora 400s, but values on the used market are still pretty strong. I am hoping they will come off a bit over the next six months ready for when I want to buy.
However, I have also been looking at the older Evora S. Out of the box it wouldn't be much quicker than my old Z, but I notice that £4k of upgrades from Hangar 111 gives you a smidge more power and a chunk more torque than the Evora 400, so a real step up.
Obviously just turning the wick up on an Evora S isn't going to challenge a 400 as an overall package, but a total outlay of £40k as opposed to £60k - £70k for an Evora 400 is a significant amount.
Do any of you have any experience of either cars and of the upgrades available for the older Evora S? How do they perform/ compare? Any insight you could share in terms of the merits of each car would be really useful.
Looking for some input from those with Evora ownership experience.
I spend my summers participating in organised driving tours in Europe. It is all about the driving and once up in the mountain passes or deep in the wilds we drive our cars hard.
My last tour car was a 370Z. With some extensive suspension and braking upgrades it made a pretty good steer and could stay with pretty much anything in the twisties. However it was just a bit too slow for the long sweepers and steep mountain ascents, as in those situations the exotics would literally just walk away from me, often leaving the old Z puffing and panting as her oil temp topped out.
The Nissan has now been sold and I will be looking to buy a new tour car in spring with a bit more pace. I considered a GTR or R8 V10, but neither are very appealing as I would prefer something with finesse rather than outright grunt.
I have become quite fascinated with Evora 400s, but values on the used market are still pretty strong. I am hoping they will come off a bit over the next six months ready for when I want to buy.
However, I have also been looking at the older Evora S. Out of the box it wouldn't be much quicker than my old Z, but I notice that £4k of upgrades from Hangar 111 gives you a smidge more power and a chunk more torque than the Evora 400, so a real step up.
Obviously just turning the wick up on an Evora S isn't going to challenge a 400 as an overall package, but a total outlay of £40k as opposed to £60k - £70k for an Evora 400 is a significant amount.
Do any of you have any experience of either cars and of the upgrades available for the older Evora S? How do they perform/ compare? Any insight you could share in terms of the merits of each car would be really useful.
Edited by James Junior on Tuesday 11th September 12:58
I cant say what its like compared with the 400, but I did an extensive road trip in my Evora S last year focussing on the roads in the Pico's Europas and other parts of northern Spain. On the winding mountain roads the Evora was driven very hard mostly in 2nd and 3rd gear up to the rev limiter and then hard on the brakes for the next bend etc. I was in convoy with a Ferrari 360 and a Porsche 930 Turbo. The Porsche was left way behind and the Evora was at least as quick as the 360 and probably more nimble where the roads were narrow.
Un modified, I would suggest that the Evora would handle better and be quite a bit quicker than a 370z which on track I found to be a pretty lardy thing that really showed its weight in corners (your mods probably improved that although the 370z I drove was a track car)
Have you driven an Evora? The 400 I have only driven briefly but in reality it didn't feel much quicker (if at all) than the S, the S1 cars have more comfortable seats than the 400, so that may be a factor on road trips.
Gratuitous pic and a vid that makes driving hard look slow!
How slow?
Un modified, I would suggest that the Evora would handle better and be quite a bit quicker than a 370z which on track I found to be a pretty lardy thing that really showed its weight in corners (your mods probably improved that although the 370z I drove was a track car)
Have you driven an Evora? The 400 I have only driven briefly but in reality it didn't feel much quicker (if at all) than the S, the S1 cars have more comfortable seats than the 400, so that may be a factor on road trips.
Gratuitous pic and a vid that makes driving hard look slow!
How slow?
I’m probably as qualified as anybody to comment on this topic 
Almost all of my pleasure driving occurs in circumstances like this. I have driven in convoys all over the UK and Europe with all manner of cars. I own an Evora with the EV430 upgrade.
Firstly, FWIW once you get to a “basic” level of power it’s much more about the driver than the car. In my experience that basic level is about 220-230 bhp/tonne or thereabouts. In my experience, the very consistently quickest cars on tour tend be tuned hot hatches. The supercars are too wide to really push on in the twisties, and hot hatches are easier to drive fast. Also, the type of people who own well-tuned hatches tend to drive them quicker than supercar drivers.
Depending on the quality of the road surfaces suspension compliance and ground clearance may be a factor as well. A 996 GT3 for example does very well on billiard-smooth European main roads but show it a broken surface and its pace will inevitably struggle. (Any Evora will be fine across less-than-perfect roads.)
Anyway, back on topic. I have not driven a 400 but have convoyed with one and I reckon our cars are well matched. The 400 has the advantage of the charge-cooler which will make a difference on those challenging ascents and in the European heat: the non-charge-cooled S is notorious for losing power when the engine gets hot. The full-house EV460 conversion includes a cooler. Bear in mind you will not recoup the cost of the Komo-tec conversion when it comes time to sell on: in fact it might be harder to sell than a regular S.
In terms of raw straightline speed the EV430 is not in the same league as a GT-R or an R8 V10 (have convoyed extensively with both) however it is a sufficient step up from a 370Z that you should not feel short-changed. The relatively compact size of an Evora is a real bonus in the tight passes compared with a bus like the GT-R.
The other thing to consider with an S1 is that the pedals are heavily offset towards the centre of the car. For some folks it’s not an issue but it’s my biggest bugbear with the car particularly on long road trips as my lower leg and knee inevitably start aching after the first 100 miles or so. The 400 has much better spacing as the sills are narrower.
If your budget can stretch to the initial outlay I reckon the 400 is a better bet than buying an S and upgrading it, and won't cost any more in the long run as the depreciation won't be any more than the cost of upgrading an S (unless you find an S that's already been done...and there's not many of those). The caveat being I've not actually driven a 400 and as mentioned above have read the seats aren't as good as the superb Recaros on the S1.
I actually think an R8 V10 is a good choice for this application and have been thinking along those lines myself for my next tour mobile. It’s not as bulky as the GT-R and disguises its mass very well…you have to bully the GT-R and basically drive like you stole it 100% of the time whereas an R8 is more like the Evora in that it offers a precision experience.
Almost all of my pleasure driving occurs in circumstances like this. I have driven in convoys all over the UK and Europe with all manner of cars. I own an Evora with the EV430 upgrade.
Firstly, FWIW once you get to a “basic” level of power it’s much more about the driver than the car. In my experience that basic level is about 220-230 bhp/tonne or thereabouts. In my experience, the very consistently quickest cars on tour tend be tuned hot hatches. The supercars are too wide to really push on in the twisties, and hot hatches are easier to drive fast. Also, the type of people who own well-tuned hatches tend to drive them quicker than supercar drivers.
Depending on the quality of the road surfaces suspension compliance and ground clearance may be a factor as well. A 996 GT3 for example does very well on billiard-smooth European main roads but show it a broken surface and its pace will inevitably struggle. (Any Evora will be fine across less-than-perfect roads.)
Anyway, back on topic. I have not driven a 400 but have convoyed with one and I reckon our cars are well matched. The 400 has the advantage of the charge-cooler which will make a difference on those challenging ascents and in the European heat: the non-charge-cooled S is notorious for losing power when the engine gets hot. The full-house EV460 conversion includes a cooler. Bear in mind you will not recoup the cost of the Komo-tec conversion when it comes time to sell on: in fact it might be harder to sell than a regular S.
In terms of raw straightline speed the EV430 is not in the same league as a GT-R or an R8 V10 (have convoyed extensively with both) however it is a sufficient step up from a 370Z that you should not feel short-changed. The relatively compact size of an Evora is a real bonus in the tight passes compared with a bus like the GT-R.
The other thing to consider with an S1 is that the pedals are heavily offset towards the centre of the car. For some folks it’s not an issue but it’s my biggest bugbear with the car particularly on long road trips as my lower leg and knee inevitably start aching after the first 100 miles or so. The 400 has much better spacing as the sills are narrower.
If your budget can stretch to the initial outlay I reckon the 400 is a better bet than buying an S and upgrading it, and won't cost any more in the long run as the depreciation won't be any more than the cost of upgrading an S (unless you find an S that's already been done...and there's not many of those). The caveat being I've not actually driven a 400 and as mentioned above have read the seats aren't as good as the superb Recaros on the S1.
I actually think an R8 V10 is a good choice for this application and have been thinking along those lines myself for my next tour mobile. It’s not as bulky as the GT-R and disguises its mass very well…you have to bully the GT-R and basically drive like you stole it 100% of the time whereas an R8 is more like the Evora in that it offers a precision experience.
Interesting. I didn’t find the R8 anything like as precise as the Evora, loved the engine though.
Pedal offset issue is subjective, doesn’t bother me but does bother some people.
I agree with the thoughts about the fiscal side of modding an S.
I didn’t really notice the power drop, which is odd as last year in Spain it was pretty warm.
I agree though that the driver makes most of the difference in performance on those types of roads. I am only average, on my trips the Ferrari driver is pretty good, part skill part knowing the car inside out and part massive gonads.
Pedal offset issue is subjective, doesn’t bother me but does bother some people.
I agree with the thoughts about the fiscal side of modding an S.
I didn’t really notice the power drop, which is odd as last year in Spain it was pretty warm.
I agree though that the driver makes most of the difference in performance on those types of roads. I am only average, on my trips the Ferrari driver is pretty good, part skill part knowing the car inside out and part massive gonads.
I`m a lucky sod and have owned various S Evora`s, a 400, and driven an R8 and a GTR. I have tweaked all of my Evora`s and I found the 390hp the best compromise for the S and SR cars. I tweaked my original S to 410/430? and for some reason it did not feel so well in tune with the cars electronics, but that may have been my car? The 390 was ideal, a useful increase in torque and improved economy...and the engine just felt happier?!
The downsides with the S/SR can be the gearchange and the pedal space, but there are good ones and bad ones regarding the gearchange, and you get used to the pedal spacing, the upside is there is precious little that will handle and ride like an Evora along with the feel of connectivity you have with the cars steering and balance, its really exceptional and special, although these traits are characteristic of Lotus cars in general. The 400 is a faster car, and I tweaked mine to 430hp, which again was a good compromise, the upside/downside with the 400 is the seats are not so good and you feel like you are sitting up a little higher, although you get used to this pretty quickly, and the ride is a little stiffer, which is not always what you want on poor roads...I think the earlier cars set up is the better compromise for the road. The 400`s interior is better finished, but there is not so much storage space? They`ve both got strengths and weaknesses.
As far as performance is concerned to other high performance cars, they are very quick cars, but they do not have 500hp+ and in a straight line you`ll lose out, but what's the fun in driving in a straight line and the minute you come to a bend you`ll be all over anything like a rash? Show these cars some bends and they will carry more speed than you can manage.
As for the R8, great car beautifully built and very capable...but it`s an Audi. For me its as dull as dishwater, except the sound of the engine of course. The car I drove was my mates and he did not regret selling it one bit. I think for a day to day supercar that you can use like a Golf, then it is fine, but its just not very exciting because you are too disconnected.
As for the GTR, I am biased because it is not my cup of tea, the car I drove was about 2015/16 vintage and I came away thinking it would be fantastic for the day on a race track, and that would be it. The ride was too firm and the power train was too noisy, and the gearing for the road was too high so essentially at 70mph on the dual carriageway it was a long way from being relaxed for cruising...and the fuel consumption would be a disaster. I think on some entertaining quiet mountain roads it would be brilliant on a good surface, but really struggle on a poor surface. I`m not sure how the tyres and brakes would fair either on mountain roads? Some versions of the newer cars are improved for general road use regarding refinement.
The downsides with the S/SR can be the gearchange and the pedal space, but there are good ones and bad ones regarding the gearchange, and you get used to the pedal spacing, the upside is there is precious little that will handle and ride like an Evora along with the feel of connectivity you have with the cars steering and balance, its really exceptional and special, although these traits are characteristic of Lotus cars in general. The 400 is a faster car, and I tweaked mine to 430hp, which again was a good compromise, the upside/downside with the 400 is the seats are not so good and you feel like you are sitting up a little higher, although you get used to this pretty quickly, and the ride is a little stiffer, which is not always what you want on poor roads...I think the earlier cars set up is the better compromise for the road. The 400`s interior is better finished, but there is not so much storage space? They`ve both got strengths and weaknesses.
As far as performance is concerned to other high performance cars, they are very quick cars, but they do not have 500hp+ and in a straight line you`ll lose out, but what's the fun in driving in a straight line and the minute you come to a bend you`ll be all over anything like a rash? Show these cars some bends and they will carry more speed than you can manage.
As for the R8, great car beautifully built and very capable...but it`s an Audi. For me its as dull as dishwater, except the sound of the engine of course. The car I drove was my mates and he did not regret selling it one bit. I think for a day to day supercar that you can use like a Golf, then it is fine, but its just not very exciting because you are too disconnected.
As for the GTR, I am biased because it is not my cup of tea, the car I drove was about 2015/16 vintage and I came away thinking it would be fantastic for the day on a race track, and that would be it. The ride was too firm and the power train was too noisy, and the gearing for the road was too high so essentially at 70mph on the dual carriageway it was a long way from being relaxed for cruising...and the fuel consumption would be a disaster. I think on some entertaining quiet mountain roads it would be brilliant on a good surface, but really struggle on a poor surface. I`m not sure how the tyres and brakes would fair either on mountain roads? Some versions of the newer cars are improved for general road use regarding refinement.
Just had an interesting drive in my colleagues very new Audi RS5. Its exceptionally quick, blows my Evora S out of the water in a straight line, but although its good in corners, you can carry much more speed in the Evora. The point being that there is much more to life than BHP and 4wd
Have owned both the Evora S and 400, doing about 6k miles in each. Both great cars and took the S to Nurburgring , finding it a great mile muncher.
Both have been similar in terms of depreciation, so with money being cheap to borrow I would say an early 400 in reality would cost very little more to own. The 400 was also a lot easier on rear tyres. I had an Auto version for the 400 and loved the gearbox. Always drove it with the paddles and found it a decent fadpst gear change.
Did consider buying an R8 V10 Spyder (2011 model) m. It was disappointed with lack of sound from exhaust at low speeds, I didn’t even bother to swap seats to drive the car. For road use I want a car that has some drama at normal speeds, not just when screaming the engine and hitting highly illegal speeds,
Go test drive both models of Evora and let us know how you get on. I’ll have another one at some point, they are that good.
Both have been similar in terms of depreciation, so with money being cheap to borrow I would say an early 400 in reality would cost very little more to own. The 400 was also a lot easier on rear tyres. I had an Auto version for the 400 and loved the gearbox. Always drove it with the paddles and found it a decent fadpst gear change.
Did consider buying an R8 V10 Spyder (2011 model) m. It was disappointed with lack of sound from exhaust at low speeds, I didn’t even bother to swap seats to drive the car. For road use I want a car that has some drama at normal speeds, not just when screaming the engine and hitting highly illegal speeds,
Go test drive both models of Evora and let us know how you get on. I’ll have another one at some point, they are that good.
Edited by DaveGB on Wednesday 12th September 21:58
If cost is important, then there is no denying that a modified Evora S is going to perform at least as well as, if not better, than an Evora 400.
A mate of mine recently bought an Evora 410. Just after his initial test drive, he took my modified Evora S for a quick blast. He told me that my car was quicker than the 410.
My car (initial purchase plus mods) cost me considerably less than the cost of a secondhand 400 or 410.
A mate of mine recently bought an Evora 410. Just after his initial test drive, he took my modified Evora S for a quick blast. He told me that my car was quicker than the 410.
My car (initial purchase plus mods) cost me considerably less than the cost of a secondhand 400 or 410.
BravoV8V said:
If cost is important, then there is no denying that a modified Evora S is going to perform at least as well as, if not better, than an Evora 400.
A mate of mine recently bought an Evora 410. Just after his initial test drive, he took my modified Evora S for a quick blast. He told me that my car was quicker than the 410.
My car (initial purchase plus mods) cost me considerably less than the cost of a secondhand 400 or 410.
What mods do you have?A mate of mine recently bought an Evora 410. Just after his initial test drive, he took my modified Evora S for a quick blast. He told me that my car was quicker than the 410.
My car (initial purchase plus mods) cost me considerably less than the cost of a secondhand 400 or 410.
blueg33 said:
What mods do you have?
https://www.thelotusforums.com/forums/topic/80723-...Edited by BravoV8V on Thursday 13th September 17:33
BravoV8V said:
https://www.thelotusforums.com/forums/topic/80723-...
Quote significant in the engine department. I know it’s rude to ask, what sort of budget?Edited by BravoV8V on Thursday 13th September 17:33
blueg33 said:
Engine and brakes mainly. Thinking about giving my S a bit more power. Brake parts prices I can get from Deroure so really it’s engine work.
Brakes is the easy bit - around £2k for the E400 calipers, pads & rotors. The engine work is harder to quote on. Partly because the cost was hidden within an invoice for lots of other work and partly because there was an element of development work to the installation. Suffice to say that the work was done by a UK Lotus specialist and would cost you less than the equivalent Komotec offering. Contact Dave at ES Motorsports and tell him what you’re after.
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