Why not a Jag V8?

[ps1 and swordfish]

I have an engineless project that is nowhere near commencing, so I have a lot of time to think about an engine.. I am NOT at all interested in an LS whatsoever. They're not smooth and sound like simultaneous farts and burps, really every USDM engine I've driven feels like a shaking a trash can full of bricks. And although I do like that revvy, snarling TVR AJP8, I'm not sure I wanna deal with the maintenance of it (especially because I'm not in Europe). I currently have a 2018 Land Rover V8 and quite like the engine in it. For those who don't know, it's a Jaguar V8. The motor feels nice, UK pride, reliable, better price to LS, has a 6 speed manual, and in supercharged form has 550HP! So why is the LS everyone's go-to?

[RobXjcoupe]

Jag v8 is wide due to twin cam heads.
Factory ecu is electronically connected to the auto box. It uses limiters so full power is never realised due to transmission weakness. Remove the auto box and you need a very good auto electrician to bypass those controls.
Great engine otherwise

[Tyre Smoke]

Surely that can all be mapped out? Mine has the lambda readings and speed limiter mapped out. Plus I think there are some other bits that have been done too.

[Boosted LS1]

They go for the LS because it's a fantastic motor with huge tuning potential. 500 hp is barely tickling it's tummy normally aspirated.

You must have been shown some bangers or the volume of your hearing aids is wonky ;-) (just kidding). A CTS, Monaro or Vette doesn't bang and fart as you've described. They are production smooth engines.

What about a jag v6? Could that work?

Edited by Boosted LS1 on Monday 14th March 20:27

[magpies]

Which body/chassis are you building?
What bhp are you expecting?
Does it have to be V8 or could a V6 be acceptable?
Normally aspirated or forced?

[ps1 and swordfish]

It's a crashed Tuscan that will need a TON of work... chassis will get cut up anyway so my mind is just going wild day-dreaming ideas. I was actually originally looking at AM V12 as it's only 2X the price of the Jag setup. Like I said, nowhere near commencing any time soon, just day-dreaming.

[RobXjcoupe]

Day dreams are good .
Just thinking perhaps use a Volvo straight 6 or the 5 pot. Fantastic strong crankshaft as original fit, lots of tuning potential with it being a turbo. Lots about as they went in focus st and rs models. Just a thought though

[mk1fan]

Lexus V8 twin turbo is being installed in a TVR S at the moment.

How about a GTR 6 in line six?

[ps1 and swordfish]

ACTUALLY, I've decided to use a Jag i6 with a tremec for the time being... I haven't used a manual in some years and the Jag AJ16 has a nice sound/feel to it and a cheap motor to use while i get reacquainted with manual trans. In the meantime, I plan to build/tune an Aston Martin V12 on the side for the next few years to swap in later (an AM V12 is way too expensive to blow up re-learning manual)

Edited by ps1 and swordfish on Saturday 9th April 00:45

[alabbasi]

LS is perfectly fine and smooth with a proper cam and exhaust system. That's why they use them in Cadillacs

[Caddyshack]

ps1 and swordfish said:

ACTUALLY, I've decided to use a Jag i6 with a tremec for the time being... I haven't used a manual in some years and the Jag AJ16 has a nice sound/feel to it and a cheap motor to use while i get reacquainted with manual trans. In the meantime, I plan to build/tune an Aston Martin V12 on the side for the next few years to swap in later (an AM V12 is way too expensive to blow up re-learning manual)

Edited by ps1 and swordfish on Saturday 9th April 00:45

It would take about 15 mins of driving to re-learn a manual and you would only blow it up if you wrong slotted it and over revved it.

[350Matt]

The Aj16 is a bit of a plodder for a sports car to be honest
its got a very long stroke ( to give good low end torque) but this means its uncomfortable revving past 6K rpm and far happier if you shift up at 5K

its also 220Bhp in NA form and reached the heady heights of 340Bhp with a bar of supercharged boost
so its a far lesser engine than the original TVR 6 (admittedly the AJ16 will last a lot longer)

the Jag V8 is a too wide to fit which is why the LS is a popular as its quite compact

I'd say to take a look at the BMW M3 straight 6 perhaps

or the old Ford Smallblock even as you can get a 450+ Bhp with ally heads for less than 7K
see here
https://www.ebay.com/sch/creb_engineering/m.html?_...
or
https://roadcraftuk.co.uk/index.php?route=product/...

not as heavy as you might think as its 220 kg with the iron heads so will be well under 200kg ( and so a lot lighter than the TVR 6) with ally heads

Edited by 350Matt on Wednesday 11th May 21:13

[magpies]

Have a browse on locostbuilders - andygtt = he has extensive knowledge of the AJ30 and turbo installation (in his Noble?) over 500bhp and 8000rpm.

[DodgyGeezer]

ps1 and swordfish said:

...why is the LS everyone's go-to?

you probably already know but....

it's light
it's not very tall
it's plentiful (IIRC the most common engine in the world?)
it's got a HE-UGE aftermarket
it's insanely tunable
it's (relatively) affordable
it can be fixed with a mallet
they can sound great (though I do prefer my hemi)

there are several more reasons but

[300bhp/ton]

350Matt said:

the Jag V8 is a too wide to fit which is why the LS is a popular as its quite compact

I'd say to take a look at the BMW M3 straight 6 perhaps

or the old Ford Smallblock even as you can get a 450+ Bhp with ally heads for less than 7K
see here
https://www.ebay.com/sch/creb_engineering/m.html?_...
or
https://roadcraftuk.co.uk/index.php?route=product/...

not as heavy as you might think as its 220 kg with the iron heads so will be well under 200kg ( and so a lot lighter than the TVR 6) with ally heads

Edited by 350Matt on Wednesday 11th May 21:13

Is the Jag all that wide? I thought it had a rep of being very compact for a DOHC. A mate is fitting one in an 80” Land Rover trials motor. It certainly looks narrow. Also been mated to a 6 speed manual.

As for the old Ford blocks. No offence. But I bet those HP claims are more akin to the 1960s Gross HP ratings. As that is how most engine dynos will be setup. Just watch Engine Masters or similar on YouTube. Ultimately Gross HP is radically different to SAE Net or DIN HP that car manufacturers use.

Those Ford engines are still good….. for a 1960’s engine. But you probably need to take 70-90hp off for a comparable modern figure. For instance a stock 5.7 LS1 will make comparable Gross HP figures on an engine dyno. And we know they make in the region of 320-360bhp SAE Net.

[300bhp/ton]

ps1 and swordfish said:

I have an engineless project that is nowhere near commencing, so I have a lot of time to think about an engine.. I am NOT at all interested in an LS whatsoever. They're not smooth and sound like simultaneous farts and burps, really every USDM engine I've driven feels like a shaking a trash can full of bricks. And although I do like that revvy, snarling TVR AJP8, I'm not sure I wanna deal with the maintenance of it (especially because I'm not in Europe). I currently have a 2018 Land Rover V8 and quite like the engine in it. For those who don't know, it's a Jaguar V8. The motor feels nice, UK pride, reliable, better price to LS, has a 6 speed manual, and in supercharged form has 550HP! So why is the LS everyone's go-to?

What Land Rover do you have with a 6 speed manual either a naturally aspirated or supercharged V8?

To my knowledge Jaguar never built a production manual AJV8. The Jaguar XK 180 concept car being the closest.

Personally I like the Jag engine. But would require a lot of R&D to get it in. Tuscan with a manual. Possible if you are doing the work yourself. Else it’ll be a st ton of cash.

As for the LS engine. Wtf??? They should be smooth. Something wrong with it otherwise. Not the cheapest engine to buy in the U.K. But easily the best blend of size, weight, packaging, power and tuning.


These guys specialise in putting LS engines into TVR’s. So all the R&D is done. Might be worth giving them a call.

https://topcatsracing.com/

[Tyre Smoke]

Bowler used the Jag V8 didn't they? What gearbox did they use?

[300bhp/ton]

Tyre Smoke said:

Bowler used the Jag V8 didn't they? What gearbox did they use?

The ZF autos as far as I can recall.

[alabbasi]

300bhp/ton said:

Is the Jag all that wide? I thought it had a rep of being very compact for a DOHC

It's still a DOHC which is wider than an OHV because the cams sit over the heads. The LS is an amazing engine. You can buy a truck 5.3 for $600 all day or rebuild one for $1500 including labor. It's hard to choose anything else.

[300bhp/ton]

alabbasi said:

300bhp/ton said:

Is the Jag all that wide? I thought it had a rep of being very compact for a DOHC

It's still a DOHC which is wider than an OHV because the cams sit over the heads. The LS is an amazing engine. You can buy a truck 5.3 for $600 all day or rebuild one for $1500 including labor. It's hard to choose anything else.

Not in the U.K. you won’t get an LS engine for that kind of money. Also if in lightweight sports car. You’d probably want the aluminium block not the cast iron variants.

Still reckon the Jag unit it pretty compact. Will fit where a Rover V8 fits.