The PH Gun Cabinet - Shooting Matters
Discussion
Went to an open day for a new shooting range opening locally to me earlier.
The positives were great new facilities and it's localish.
The negatives however:
Only open Tuesdays, Wednesdays and Thursdays + 1 Sat/Sun weekend a month 10am - 5pm.
£650 a year or £60 a month + £50 joining fee.
£500 a year or £50 a month + £50 joining fee for 'Silver Membership' that restricts you to weekday shooting.
Guests and non members can shoot for £175 a day, full day or nothing so it doesn't matter how long the guest or non member is there for, it's £175.
Fullbore must be moderated, so no service rifles.
All in all pretty disappointing, and it's a shame as the range itself has 1x50m and 2x100m that were well made with modern electronic control target systems so you can tell a lot of money and effort has been invested, and from what I gather the owner has had a real fight with the local authorities to even be able to open the place.
I went along today to fully prepared to take out early membership (prices weren't published ahead of time) to support the place despite it not actually being open yet, I could live with no service rifles but the prices along with the limited opening times just make it completely unviable.
On the plus side I met and had a great chat with Dave Walls of Accuracy International there, a very nice guy and very helpful in giving me a lot of tips once I'd told him I was a novice shooter.
The positives were great new facilities and it's localish.
The negatives however:
Only open Tuesdays, Wednesdays and Thursdays + 1 Sat/Sun weekend a month 10am - 5pm.
£650 a year or £60 a month + £50 joining fee.
£500 a year or £50 a month + £50 joining fee for 'Silver Membership' that restricts you to weekday shooting.
Guests and non members can shoot for £175 a day, full day or nothing so it doesn't matter how long the guest or non member is there for, it's £175.
Fullbore must be moderated, so no service rifles.
All in all pretty disappointing, and it's a shame as the range itself has 1x50m and 2x100m that were well made with modern electronic control target systems so you can tell a lot of money and effort has been invested, and from what I gather the owner has had a real fight with the local authorities to even be able to open the place.
I went along today to fully prepared to take out early membership (prices weren't published ahead of time) to support the place despite it not actually being open yet, I could live with no service rifles but the prices along with the limited opening times just make it completely unviable.
On the plus side I met and had a great chat with Dave Walls of Accuracy International there, a very nice guy and very helpful in giving me a lot of tips once I'd told him I was a novice shooter.
Edited by Hoppum on Saturday 9th September 15:27
Hoppum said:
Went to an open day for a new shooting range opening locally to me earlier.
The positives were great new facilities and it's localish.
The negatives however:
Only open Tuesdays, Wednesdays and Thursdays + 1 Sat/Sun weekend a month 10am - 5pm.
£650 a year or £60 a month + £50 joining fee.
£500 a year or £50 a month + £50 joining fee for 'Silver Membership' that restricts you to weekday shooting.
Guests and non members can shoot for £175 a day, full day or nothing so it doesn't matter how long the guest or non member is there for, it's £175.
Fullbore must be moderated, so no service rifles.
All in all pretty disappointing, and it's a shame as the range itself has 1x50m and 2x100m that were well made with modern electronic control target systems so you can tell a lot of money and effort has been invested, and from what I gather the owner has had a real fight with the local authorities to even be able to open the place.
I went along today to fully prepared to take out early membership (prices weren't published ahead of time) to support the place despite it not actually being open yet, I could live with no service rifles but the prices along with the limited opening times just make it completely unviable.
On the plus side I met and had a great chat with Dave Walls of Accuracy International there, a very nice guy and very helpful in giving me a lot of tips once I'd told him I was a novice shooter.
Silverstone?The positives were great new facilities and it's localish.
The negatives however:
Only open Tuesdays, Wednesdays and Thursdays + 1 Sat/Sun weekend a month 10am - 5pm.
£650 a year or £60 a month + £50 joining fee.
£500 a year or £50 a month + £50 joining fee for 'Silver Membership' that restricts you to weekday shooting.
Guests and non members can shoot for £175 a day, full day or nothing so it doesn't matter how long the guest or non member is there for, it's £175.
Fullbore must be moderated, so no service rifles.
All in all pretty disappointing, and it's a shame as the range itself has 1x50m and 2x100m that were well made with modern electronic control target systems so you can tell a lot of money and effort has been invested, and from what I gather the owner has had a real fight with the local authorities to even be able to open the place.
I went along today to fully prepared to take out early membership (prices weren't published ahead of time) to support the place despite it not actually being open yet, I could live with no service rifles but the prices along with the limited opening times just make it completely unviable.
On the plus side I met and had a great chat with Dave Walls of Accuracy International there, a very nice guy and very helpful in giving me a lot of tips once I'd told him I was a novice shooter.
John Thorne has spent a lot of time and money on this and it is commendable to build a new shooting range in the UK, especially somewhere which is close to civilisation, but I suspect he knew all along there would be quite severe usage restrictions and I wonder how much of the income from this venture will be from civilians and how much will be from Police etc. wanting to hire the ranges for training?
Bisley gets a lot more money from the Police hiring its ranges than it does from it's members, so the Silverstone business model might be similar.
There is supposed to be a mini-rifle match there in November so at least it will be possible to shoot there without paying the membership fees, but I wonder how much he's going to hire the ranges out to clubs, because if it on the same scale as you've indicated the entry fees are going to be ridiculous.
Thorney has been on here in the past, as he has a number of other car/motorsport related interests. Maybe he'll comment.
FurtiveFreddy said:
Hoppum said:
Went to an open day for a new shooting range opening locally to me earlier.
The positives were great new facilities and it's localish.
The negatives however:
Only open Tuesdays, Wednesdays and Thursdays + 1 Sat/Sun weekend a month 10am - 5pm.
£650 a year or £60 a month + £50 joining fee.
£500 a year or £50 a month + £50 joining fee for 'Silver Membership' that restricts you to weekday shooting.
Guests and non members can shoot for £175 a day, full day or nothing so it doesn't matter how long the guest or non member is there for, it's £175.
Fullbore must be moderated, so no service rifles.
All in all pretty disappointing, and it's a shame as the range itself has 1x50m and 2x100m that were well made with modern electronic control target systems so you can tell a lot of money and effort has been invested, and from what I gather the owner has had a real fight with the local authorities to even be able to open the place.
I went along today to fully prepared to take out early membership (prices weren't published ahead of time) to support the place despite it not actually being open yet, I could live with no service rifles but the prices along with the limited opening times just make it completely unviable.
On the plus side I met and had a great chat with Dave Walls of Accuracy International there, a very nice guy and very helpful in giving me a lot of tips once I'd told him I was a novice shooter.
Silverstone?The positives were great new facilities and it's localish.
The negatives however:
Only open Tuesdays, Wednesdays and Thursdays + 1 Sat/Sun weekend a month 10am - 5pm.
£650 a year or £60 a month + £50 joining fee.
£500 a year or £50 a month + £50 joining fee for 'Silver Membership' that restricts you to weekday shooting.
Guests and non members can shoot for £175 a day, full day or nothing so it doesn't matter how long the guest or non member is there for, it's £175.
Fullbore must be moderated, so no service rifles.
All in all pretty disappointing, and it's a shame as the range itself has 1x50m and 2x100m that were well made with modern electronic control target systems so you can tell a lot of money and effort has been invested, and from what I gather the owner has had a real fight with the local authorities to even be able to open the place.
I went along today to fully prepared to take out early membership (prices weren't published ahead of time) to support the place despite it not actually being open yet, I could live with no service rifles but the prices along with the limited opening times just make it completely unviable.
On the plus side I met and had a great chat with Dave Walls of Accuracy International there, a very nice guy and very helpful in giving me a lot of tips once I'd told him I was a novice shooter.
John Thorne has spent a lot of time and money on this and it is commendable to build a new shooting range in the UK, especially somewhere which is close to civilisation, but I suspect he knew all along there would be quite severe usage restrictions and I wonder how much of the income from this venture will be from civilians and how much will be from Police etc. wanting to hire the ranges for training?
I too commend the persistance in getting this facility up and running given the massive obstacles put in the way.
However, I too sadly can't see it being viable at those prices, and restrictions (especially moderated full-bore which by default excludes an awful lot of shooters)
FurtiveFreddy said:
Silverstone?
John Thorne has spent a lot of time and money on this and it is commendable to build a new shooting range in the UK, especially somewhere which is close to civilisation, but I suspect he knew all along there would be quite severe usage restrictions and I wonder how much of the income from this venture will be from civilians and how much will be from Police etc. wanting to hire the ranges for training?
Bisley gets a lot more money from the Police hiring its ranges than it does from it's members, so the Silverstone business model might be similar.
There is supposed to be a mini-rifle match there in November so at least it will be possible to shoot there without paying the membership fees, but I wonder how much he's going to hire the ranges out to clubs, because if it on the same scale as you've indicated the entry fees are going to be ridiculous.
Thorney has been on here in the past, as he has a number of other car/motorsport related interests. Maybe he'll comment.
Yes, Silverstone Shooting Centre.John Thorne has spent a lot of time and money on this and it is commendable to build a new shooting range in the UK, especially somewhere which is close to civilisation, but I suspect he knew all along there would be quite severe usage restrictions and I wonder how much of the income from this venture will be from civilians and how much will be from Police etc. wanting to hire the ranges for training?
Bisley gets a lot more money from the Police hiring its ranges than it does from it's members, so the Silverstone business model might be similar.
There is supposed to be a mini-rifle match there in November so at least it will be possible to shoot there without paying the membership fees, but I wonder how much he's going to hire the ranges out to clubs, because if it on the same scale as you've indicated the entry fees are going to be ridiculous.
Thorney has been on here in the past, as he has a number of other car/motorsport related interests. Maybe he'll comment.
Adding to what aeropilot says regarding moderators, it's quite a compact site so there isn't much scope for fire and move type training and I know Thames Valley Police at least have their own stand and shoot type ranges.
Mentioning the motorsport interests reminds me of another concern from today. The ranges back onto a dirt bike/quad/buggy circuit track and only have 5m berm to the rear. To my admittedly untrained eye it seemed worryingly possible that a negligent discharge could easily sail over the top of this berm and potentially land somewhere it could do harm. Although potentially this could be the reasoning for the limited opening times, having to alternate with the dirt track?
Hoppum said:
Yes, Silverstone Shooting Centre.
Adding to what aeropilot says regarding moderators, it's quite a compact site so there isn't much scope for fire and move type training and I know Thames Valley Police at least have their own stand and shoot type ranges.
Mentioning the motorsport interests reminds me of another concern from today. The ranges back onto a dirt bike/quad/buggy circuit track and only have 5m berm to the rear. To my admittedly untrained eye it seemed worryingly possible that a negligent discharge could easily sail over the top of this berm and potentially land somewhere it could do harm. Although potentially this could be the reasoning for the limited opening times, having to alternate with the dirt track?
I think you'll find the dirt track belongs to Thorney as well, so it will be up to him if he wants to operate them simultaneously.Adding to what aeropilot says regarding moderators, it's quite a compact site so there isn't much scope for fire and move type training and I know Thames Valley Police at least have their own stand and shoot type ranges.
Mentioning the motorsport interests reminds me of another concern from today. The ranges back onto a dirt bike/quad/buggy circuit track and only have 5m berm to the rear. To my admittedly untrained eye it seemed worryingly possible that a negligent discharge could easily sail over the top of this berm and potentially land somewhere it could do harm. Although potentially this could be the reasoning for the limited opening times, having to alternate with the dirt track?
Did he say that anything over .22 has to be moderated, or just full bore rifles?
The Police and CNC have been quite happy using Short Siberia and Butt Zero at Bisley, so a couple of fully enclosed 100 yd ranges would be quite useful to them as long as the noise of pistol and riot control rounds are OK.
Anyway, Thorney has chucked quite a lot of money at various things in the past which haven't exactly taken the world by storm, so maybe this will be just another one of his follies.
Edited by FurtiveFreddy on Saturday 9th September 17:56
FurtiveFreddy said:
I think you'll find the dirt track belongs to Thorney as well, so it will be up to him if he wants to operate them simultaneously.
Did he say that anything over .22 has to be moderated, or just full bore rifles?
The Police and CNC have been quite happy using Short Siberia and Butt Zero at Bisley, so a couple of fully enclosed 100 yd ranges would be quite useful to them as long as the noise of pistol and riot control rounds are OK.
Anyway, Thorney has chucked quite a lot of money at various things in the past which haven't exactly taken the world by storm, so maybe this will be just another one of his follies.
Was aware of the shared ownership as parking is shared with the dirt track.Did he say that anything over .22 has to be moderated, or just full bore rifles?
The Police and CNC have been quite happy using Short Siberia and Butt Zero at Bisley, so a couple of fully enclosed 100 yd ranges would be quite useful to them as long as the noise of pistol and riot control rounds are OK.
Anyway, Thorney has chucked quite a lot of money at various things in the past which haven't exactly taken the world by storm, so maybe this will be just another one of his follies.
Edited by FurtiveFreddy on Saturday 9th September 17:56
I'm not entirely sure regarding the moderation, there wasn't much info on the day. Full bore definitely has to be moderated but I'm unsure about rimfire/small bore.
Shopping for a gun for clays (sporting) on Thursday, budget £2k to £4k
Will of course be guided by what fits/feels best, but current shortlist for new is:
Beretta 692 (have shot this and like it, but I hear concerns they are a bit fragile, esp. rear tang screw)
Browning 725 II (quite Beretta-like apparently, but overbored so some say not great for fibre wads)
Blaser F16 (allegedly bomb-proof engineering, but some say too light)
CG Invictus (well reviewed, but I hear depreciation can be a bit more severe compared to Beretta/Browning/Blaser)
Probably 32inch barrels. Currently thinking I'd avoid an adjustable comb (as factory fitted ones aren't that great?) and look to get the stock fitted through reshaping/bending after having shot it for a while and settled into it, or add an aftermarket adjustable comb later on.
Will also look at s/h guns, but obviously these are harder to shortlist, as availability will be what it will be.
Any others I should be looking at?
Will of course be guided by what fits/feels best, but current shortlist for new is:
Beretta 692 (have shot this and like it, but I hear concerns they are a bit fragile, esp. rear tang screw)
Browning 725 II (quite Beretta-like apparently, but overbored so some say not great for fibre wads)
Blaser F16 (allegedly bomb-proof engineering, but some say too light)
CG Invictus (well reviewed, but I hear depreciation can be a bit more severe compared to Beretta/Browning/Blaser)
Probably 32inch barrels. Currently thinking I'd avoid an adjustable comb (as factory fitted ones aren't that great?) and look to get the stock fitted through reshaping/bending after having shot it for a while and settled into it, or add an aftermarket adjustable comb later on.
Will also look at s/h guns, but obviously these are harder to shortlist, as availability will be what it will be.
Any others I should be looking at?
chemistry said:
Shopping for a gun for clays (sporting) on Thursday, budget £2k to £4k
Will of course be guided by what fits/feels best, but current shortlist for new is:
Beretta 692 (have shot this and like it, but I hear concerns they are a bit fragile, esp. rear tang screw)
Browning 725 II (quite Beretta-like apparently, but overbored so some say not great for fibre wads)
Blaser F16 (allegedly bomb-proof engineering, but some say too light)
CG Invictus (well reviewed, but I hear depreciation can be a bit more severe compared to Beretta/Browning/Blaser)
Probably 32inch barrels. Currently thinking I'd avoid an adjustable comb (as factory fitted ones aren't that great?) and look to get the stock fitted through reshaping/bending after having shot it for a while and settled into it, or add an aftermarket adjustable comb later on.
Will also look at s/h guns, but obviously these are harder to shortlist, as availability will be what it will be.
Any others I should be looking at?
I was looking at a not to dissimilar list earlier this year, with similar budget.Will of course be guided by what fits/feels best, but current shortlist for new is:
Beretta 692 (have shot this and like it, but I hear concerns they are a bit fragile, esp. rear tang screw)
Browning 725 II (quite Beretta-like apparently, but overbored so some say not great for fibre wads)
Blaser F16 (allegedly bomb-proof engineering, but some say too light)
CG Invictus (well reviewed, but I hear depreciation can be a bit more severe compared to Beretta/Browning/Blaser)
Probably 32inch barrels. Currently thinking I'd avoid an adjustable comb (as factory fitted ones aren't that great?) and look to get the stock fitted through reshaping/bending after having shot it for a while and settled into it, or add an aftermarket adjustable comb later on.
Will also look at s/h guns, but obviously these are harder to shortlist, as availability will be what it will be.
Any others I should be looking at?
Couldn't find a Beretta that fitted me (even adjustable stock versions) and RFD let me have a go of a 692 with adjustable stock, but I couldn't hit jack with it, and it bashed the hell out of my cheek, even with stock adjusted by them to suit best.
RFD was telling me that the Blazer was a good fit, as was a Caesar Guerini, which did have a nice fit to the shoulder I must admit, but, there was just something about both that I couldn't put my finger on precisely that was making me continue to look elsewhere.
Another RFD, said that a Browning would be best fit for me, and the 725 Black Edition did seem a very good fit for me in the shop. A mate of mine had a Browning 525, and he offered to let me have a go of that. I outscored him with his gun, and so thought that maybe a Browning might be worth a second look .......... so ended up buying the 725 Black Edition in 30" (having not really liked any 32" I had tried)
Very happy with it.
chemistry said:
Shopping for a gun for clays (sporting) on Thursday, budget £2k to £4k
Will of course be guided by what fits/feels best, but current shortlist for new is:
Beretta 692 (have shot this and like it, but I hear concerns they are a bit fragile, esp. rear tang screw)
Browning 725 II (quite Beretta-like apparently, but overbored so some say not great for fibre wads)
Blaser F16 (allegedly bomb-proof engineering, but some say too light)
CG Invictus (well reviewed, but I hear depreciation can be a bit more severe compared to Beretta/Browning/Blaser)
Probably 32inch barrels. Currently thinking I'd avoid an adjustable comb (as factory fitted ones aren't that great?) and look to get the stock fitted through reshaping/bending after having shot it for a while and settled into it, or add an aftermarket adjustable comb later on.
Will also look at s/h guns, but obviously these are harder to shortlist, as availability will be what it will be.
Any others I should be looking at?
From my experience, pick a gun and get some lead down the barrel and some lessons [if you are new to this]. Then get it fitted, there is no problems with the use of an adjustable stock as some people have very odd requirements, ie with my features I have the stock skewed to the right and it was easier to have an adjustable]. Beretta and Browning are good guns and purely down to preference. The Browning, when opened has a skin trap at the hinge when opening and closing, imo anyway. I have had many painful experiences; Beretta is flat.Will of course be guided by what fits/feels best, but current shortlist for new is:
Beretta 692 (have shot this and like it, but I hear concerns they are a bit fragile, esp. rear tang screw)
Browning 725 II (quite Beretta-like apparently, but overbored so some say not great for fibre wads)
Blaser F16 (allegedly bomb-proof engineering, but some say too light)
CG Invictus (well reviewed, but I hear depreciation can be a bit more severe compared to Beretta/Browning/Blaser)
Probably 32inch barrels. Currently thinking I'd avoid an adjustable comb (as factory fitted ones aren't that great?) and look to get the stock fitted through reshaping/bending after having shot it for a while and settled into it, or add an aftermarket adjustable comb later on.
Will also look at s/h guns, but obviously these are harder to shortlist, as availability will be what it will be.
Any others I should be looking at?
I have a 30" Beretta 692 with different chokes [although I stick with 1/2 and 1/4], lovely gun, and a 33" HPX Perazzi, 3/4 fixed bore. I find the Beretta too easy to move like waggling a thin stick in the air and really depends on your style and body build. Perazzi is great, best I have had but expensive.
PS I was getting a 30" and so bought a cabinet to suit, when I got the 33" I have to break this down to fit in the cabinet. Blooming frustrating but when I can be bothered I will get a larger cabinet.
PPS get a genuine Hoppe's bore snake. Use it when you finish shooting and you'll save time when you get home and clean it.
carinatauk said:
PS I was getting a 30" and so bought a cabinet to suit, when I got the 33" I have to break this down to fit in the cabinet. Blooming frustrating but when I can be bothered I will get a larger cabinet.
PPS get a genuine Hoppe's bore snake. Use it when you finish shooting and you'll save time when you get home and clean it.
Echo those two points.PPS get a genuine Hoppe's bore snake. Use it when you finish shooting and you'll save time when you get home and clean it.
When my RFD let me borrow their 692 test gun with 32", it didn't fit in my cabinet!! So, yes, its something to consider when thinking of a 32" against your cabinet dimensions.
And yes, another vote from me for the Hoppe's bore snake
Thanks all; some great advice.
I'll definitely pick up a Hoope's bore snake and the advice to shoot (and have lessons) for a while before making radical changes is well taken. I shot a fair bit about 20 years ago, then only off and on (with borrowed guns) since then - have never had a lesson!
I will also double check that the gun will fit into my cabinet! I've got a Brattonsound extra deep RL7+ cabinet with the internal lockable cabinet; looks like the maximum length gun that would comfortably fit would be 129cm (4 feet, 3 inches) long.
I'll post pictures of whatever I end up buying...
I'll definitely pick up a Hoope's bore snake and the advice to shoot (and have lessons) for a while before making radical changes is well taken. I shot a fair bit about 20 years ago, then only off and on (with borrowed guns) since then - have never had a lesson!
I will also double check that the gun will fit into my cabinet! I've got a Brattonsound extra deep RL7+ cabinet with the internal lockable cabinet; looks like the maximum length gun that would comfortably fit would be 129cm (4 feet, 3 inches) long.
I'll post pictures of whatever I end up buying...
chemistry said:
I will also double check that the gun will fit into my cabinet! I've got a Brattonsound extra deep RL7+ cabinet with the internal lockable cabinet; looks like the maximum length gun that would comfortably fit would be 129cm (4 feet, 3 inches) long.
I've got the RD7+, which is the extra deep without the internal locking box, and the 32" Beretta 692 I borrowed didn't fit in that.I suspect, unless you are happy with splitting it, you'll be looking at getting a 30" barrel version of whatever you choose rather than a 32"?
Hoppum said:
Mentioning the motorsport interests reminds me of another concern from today. The ranges back onto a dirt bike/quad/buggy circuit track and only have 5m berm to the rear. To my admittedly untrained eye it seemed worryingly possible that a negligent discharge could easily sail over the top of this berm and potentially land somewhere it could do harm. Although potentially this could be the reasoning for the limited opening times, having to alternate with the dirt track?
You mean 5 meter height? If this is 10m behind the target, then on the 100m range shooting prone, so 110m to the barrier, then that is 2.6 degrees of elevation. Hitting stuff immediately behind isn't the problem - anything which clears that 5m obstacle will land over a mile away. Remember to hit a target 1000 yards away with a 308 you only need to elevate the barrel a bit over half a degree. Safety is ensured by never raising your barrel. =
I think it is quite commendable that somebody would open a public rifle range in the UK and I hope it works out for the owner.
Price (£650) seems not completely ridiculous considering it is a commercial range. You can't compare it with club prices which are staffed by volunteers. The operator really needs to open it every weekend, not just once a month, to make it appealing. I'd also make it cheaper than £175 to bring a guest as there are basically zero alternative ranges that I know where you can turn up with family/friends who don't have a FAC and have them shoot your own guns (unless you have hunting on your FAC and have a farm obvs). Being able to bring a guest would be great; the £175 to do so not quite so great. If I could take my daughter for a full day of blasting at stuff for say £80, that would be quite appealing.
Is "full bore" for a moderator a .38/.357 or is it a rifle caliber?
Edited by creampuff on Sunday 10th September 19:16
My main advice would probably be as follows:
Buy a secondhand shotgun if you can - there are some lovely lightly used guns out there.
Try to buy from a gun shop that has a clay school.
Or, as I did, get a gun sent from one gun shop to another which has a clay school and try it.
I was surprised how easy this way, my local shop at a clay ground simply charged me £25 to write it on to my license and were most helpful.
Buy a secondhand shotgun if you can - there are some lovely lightly used guns out there.
Try to buy from a gun shop that has a clay school.
Or, as I did, get a gun sent from one gun shop to another which has a clay school and try it.
I was surprised how easy this way, my local shop at a clay ground simply charged me £25 to write it on to my license and were most helpful.
I have a Miroku (so very like a Browning ).
I found Beretta and Browning/Miroku felt very different in the hand. I'd try them both and see which you naturally feel better with. Then stick with it until you get to be knowing what you're doing (I'm about a million miles from that point right now!).
Mine has 30" barrels. Despite being a larger athlete, I didn't like the extra weight/length of 32"s. I prefer them to be more wieldy (I actually think 28"s would probably suit me best, but am sticking with my own advice above!).
Price then depends on level of finish from there (a very nice Grade 6 was available when I bought mine so I figured if I never hit anything I could always have it "made safe" and put over the fireplace ).
A friend of my dad's had a Perazzi. Even with 32" barrels it felt lighter than my Miroku. Nice gun, but expensive. He and my dad are forever swapping their guns. Despite me shooting far, far less than them, I'm getting to be able to keep up with them on shoots and have beat both a couple of times - I think a lot of that is them buggering about with their guns rather than persevering (it's amazing how at fault a gun can be when someone's having a bad day ). But that's all part of the hobby for them.
(Also agree with bore snakes...though the Miroku is a sod to clean the barrels on even with one).
I found Beretta and Browning/Miroku felt very different in the hand. I'd try them both and see which you naturally feel better with. Then stick with it until you get to be knowing what you're doing (I'm about a million miles from that point right now!).
Mine has 30" barrels. Despite being a larger athlete, I didn't like the extra weight/length of 32"s. I prefer them to be more wieldy (I actually think 28"s would probably suit me best, but am sticking with my own advice above!).
Price then depends on level of finish from there (a very nice Grade 6 was available when I bought mine so I figured if I never hit anything I could always have it "made safe" and put over the fireplace ).
A friend of my dad's had a Perazzi. Even with 32" barrels it felt lighter than my Miroku. Nice gun, but expensive. He and my dad are forever swapping their guns. Despite me shooting far, far less than them, I'm getting to be able to keep up with them on shoots and have beat both a couple of times - I think a lot of that is them buggering about with their guns rather than persevering (it's amazing how at fault a gun can be when someone's having a bad day ). But that's all part of the hobby for them.
(Also agree with bore snakes...though the Miroku is a sod to clean the barrels on even with one).
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