"Air hunger" when running, anybody else had this?
Discussion
philcray said:
Hi
The air hunger actually got worse, if anything, so a couple of weeks ago I went to a&e to hopefully fast track a few checks. I was taken straight for an ecg & blood checks and then through to resuss where I was put on a bed and, cutting a long story short, told by the young doctor that I had either had or was about to have a heart attack. That certainly took the edge off my afternoon.
Cutting the story short again, I was kept there about 3 hours. I had a chest & lung xray, was kept on the ecg and also had an echocardiogram. Eventually as I had no actual pain, the blood tests came back clear, my pulse was steady at c.55 and 100% oxygen in the blood stream, they decided I wasn't having a heart attack and I was allowed home.
Since then I have been to see the Cardiologist (who I was already booked in to see) and my GP again to get some further tests. Nothing specific has been identified yet and my breathing is more or less now back to normal. I have done a few very slow runs which felt ok but legs do ache a bit after.
Due to speak to GP again next wk as he is reviewing xrays etc taken by a&e and also booked to see cardiologist later in November. All a bit ironic really given I have never smoked, am not overweight and have exercised regularly my whole life...!
How scary for you! Sorry to hear you went through that and also that there's no answers as yet. Did they leave you with any thoughts as to what it could have been at all? Some sort of temporary coronary artery spasm or something? The air hunger actually got worse, if anything, so a couple of weeks ago I went to a&e to hopefully fast track a few checks. I was taken straight for an ecg & blood checks and then through to resuss where I was put on a bed and, cutting a long story short, told by the young doctor that I had either had or was about to have a heart attack. That certainly took the edge off my afternoon.
Cutting the story short again, I was kept there about 3 hours. I had a chest & lung xray, was kept on the ecg and also had an echocardiogram. Eventually as I had no actual pain, the blood tests came back clear, my pulse was steady at c.55 and 100% oxygen in the blood stream, they decided I wasn't having a heart attack and I was allowed home.
Since then I have been to see the Cardiologist (who I was already booked in to see) and my GP again to get some further tests. Nothing specific has been identified yet and my breathing is more or less now back to normal. I have done a few very slow runs which felt ok but legs do ache a bit after.
Due to speak to GP again next wk as he is reviewing xrays etc taken by a&e and also booked to see cardiologist later in November. All a bit ironic really given I have never smoked, am not overweight and have exercised regularly my whole life...!
The GP thought he could hear a slight hear murmur which could be due to aortic valve stenosis, other possibility is hypertrophic cardiomyopathy (thickening of wall in the heart), both of which would reduce the ability to efficiently circulate oxygen. Hopefully on going tests will provide some answers.
A quick update is anyone is interested. The slight breathlessness has continued, seems to be less of an issue but I cannot be sure if this is just because I have got more used to it.
I saw the cardiologist who did another ecg a couple of weeks ago, the suspect was aortic stenosis which is not good news as this can require replacement of the heart valve (channel 5 aired a programme last week showing a live operation doing just this). I then had an echogram this morning and the nurse said that the valves all looked ok to her, the suspicion now is on hypertrophic cardiomyopathy (HCM) which is a thickening of the heart muscle.
The cardiologist still has to review the results but if it is HCM rather than AS, then that is "relatively" good news as it is less dangerous and I may be able to get back into exercise (I have a place in the London Marathon next year through the ballot so that is my target, which may or may not be realistic). In the meantime, I have bought myself a motorbike (a 67 reg KTM Duke 390 if interested) as still need to get out into the countryside!
The downside of HCM is that it is hereditary so there is a 50% chance of my kids having it. They will have to be checked as it can be a cause of sudden death in the young.
Anyway, this could all change when I have the cardiologists report so I am continuing to take it easy.
I saw the cardiologist who did another ecg a couple of weeks ago, the suspect was aortic stenosis which is not good news as this can require replacement of the heart valve (channel 5 aired a programme last week showing a live operation doing just this). I then had an echogram this morning and the nurse said that the valves all looked ok to her, the suspicion now is on hypertrophic cardiomyopathy (HCM) which is a thickening of the heart muscle.
The cardiologist still has to review the results but if it is HCM rather than AS, then that is "relatively" good news as it is less dangerous and I may be able to get back into exercise (I have a place in the London Marathon next year through the ballot so that is my target, which may or may not be realistic). In the meantime, I have bought myself a motorbike (a 67 reg KTM Duke 390 if interested) as still need to get out into the countryside!
The downside of HCM is that it is hereditary so there is a 50% chance of my kids having it. They will have to be checked as it can be a cause of sudden death in the young.
Anyway, this could all change when I have the cardiologists report so I am continuing to take it easy.
Another update in case anyone interested.
I had feedback from the cardiologist following on from the echo cardiogram, this all looked quite normal for my age. Mild left ventricular hypertrophy (thickening of wall of heart) conducive with doing a lot of exercise, aortic valve mildly thickened but no significant stenosis (narrowing), normal left ventricular systolic function (pumping blood pressure).
I also had a 24 hour ambulatory blood pressure monitor and this came back satisfactory at an average of 132/77.
I was then booked in for an Exercise Tolerance Test (ETT) which involved being attached to an ECG machine while on a treadmill. This was surprisingly hard word work and much more intense than I would normally experience on a run. It basically consisted of 3 minute intervals building up in speed and incline. I lasted 14 minutes and by the end felt I was pretty much running flat out. The monitoring then continues as you recover. Following this I was fitted with a 24 hour ecg monitor to check the heart under normal conditions.
I met with the cardiologist again yesterday, the ETT had shown some arrhythmia (irregular heart beat) at the extreme end of the exercise when I was going at full chat. The 24 hour ecg monitor did not show anything untoward.
His diagnosis as it stands is Atrial Fibrillation (irregular and fast heart beat) but only happening under very high "revs". He has now booked me in for an MRI scan in case they are missing anything and referred me to a specialist surgeon to discuss whether I may benefit from having a Catheter Ablation, where a catheter is passed through a vein and used to destroy the diseased part of the heart.
He did say he will consider prescribing low dosage beta blockers which slow the heart rate but was not sure if these would help given my normal heart rate at rest is around 55. In the meantime, he has said it should be ok to begin running again, although taking it easy.
I still have the air hunger at times and feel that my basic stamina is well down, I have done a couple of 6 mile runs and averaging around 8,30 to 9,00 minute miles which is a lot slower than I was 3 months ago, even taking it easy.
Anyway, I will see what the MRI discovers and what the heart surgeon recommends. Ironically I looked back at my results for the NHS over 40's Health Check which I did in Nov 16, my risk of CVD (Cardiovascular Disease) was rated at 8.6%, which just goes to show that you never know...
I had feedback from the cardiologist following on from the echo cardiogram, this all looked quite normal for my age. Mild left ventricular hypertrophy (thickening of wall of heart) conducive with doing a lot of exercise, aortic valve mildly thickened but no significant stenosis (narrowing), normal left ventricular systolic function (pumping blood pressure).
I also had a 24 hour ambulatory blood pressure monitor and this came back satisfactory at an average of 132/77.
I was then booked in for an Exercise Tolerance Test (ETT) which involved being attached to an ECG machine while on a treadmill. This was surprisingly hard word work and much more intense than I would normally experience on a run. It basically consisted of 3 minute intervals building up in speed and incline. I lasted 14 minutes and by the end felt I was pretty much running flat out. The monitoring then continues as you recover. Following this I was fitted with a 24 hour ecg monitor to check the heart under normal conditions.
I met with the cardiologist again yesterday, the ETT had shown some arrhythmia (irregular heart beat) at the extreme end of the exercise when I was going at full chat. The 24 hour ecg monitor did not show anything untoward.
His diagnosis as it stands is Atrial Fibrillation (irregular and fast heart beat) but only happening under very high "revs". He has now booked me in for an MRI scan in case they are missing anything and referred me to a specialist surgeon to discuss whether I may benefit from having a Catheter Ablation, where a catheter is passed through a vein and used to destroy the diseased part of the heart.
He did say he will consider prescribing low dosage beta blockers which slow the heart rate but was not sure if these would help given my normal heart rate at rest is around 55. In the meantime, he has said it should be ok to begin running again, although taking it easy.
I still have the air hunger at times and feel that my basic stamina is well down, I have done a couple of 6 mile runs and averaging around 8,30 to 9,00 minute miles which is a lot slower than I was 3 months ago, even taking it easy.
Anyway, I will see what the MRI discovers and what the heart surgeon recommends. Ironically I looked back at my results for the NHS over 40's Health Check which I did in Nov 16, my risk of CVD (Cardiovascular Disease) was rated at 8.6%, which just goes to show that you never know...
Yep, cheers for update. Looks like you are not going to keel over anytime soon. My brother is law competes with some success in triathlons, adventure races and road and mtb bike races. He was diagnosed with cardiac arrhythmia about 8 years ago, when he was in the middle of a phase of decent wins/podium finishes. Everyone he knows, except me, acted as if he was doomed. He still trains now and he still has success.
I honestly think cardiac arrhythmia is not a particularly unusual phenomenon, it is just rarely detected.
Best of luck!
I honestly think cardiac arrhythmia is not a particularly unusual phenomenon, it is just rarely detected.
Best of luck!
OP - has anyone mentioned or discounted a Heart Block (bradycardia). Symptoms fit this and the block can be irregular. If you are fairly fit you may not even notice a period of blocking under normal activity as you will have enough "in reserve" but it will become apparent during higher intensity exercise.
Everything is going fine then there is some blocking and as you have noted it is like someone has flicked a switch and turned off your heart and lungs.
Everything is going fine then there is some blocking and as you have noted it is like someone has flicked a switch and turned off your heart and lungs.
over_the_hill said:
OP - has anyone mentioned or discounted a Heart Block (bradycardia). Symptoms fit this and the block can be irregular. If you are fairly fit you may not even notice a period of blocking under normal activity as you will have enough "in reserve" but it will become apparent during higher intensity exercise.
Everything is going fine then there is some blocking and as you have noted it is like someone has flicked a switch and turned off your heart and lungs.
He's had ECGs which would have shown this. Everything is going fine then there is some blocking and as you have noted it is like someone has flicked a switch and turned off your heart and lungs.
Quick update in case anyone is interested. As a quick refresh, symptoms of "air hunger" and large reduction in stamina came on during a hard 10k last September and have not fully gone away since.
I have now had the results back from my MRI, along with numerous other tests, ECG, blood pressure, echocardiogram etc etc. I have met with the cardiologist and he has summarised that everything with the heart looks pretty much normal in line with my age and health profile.
The only issue detected is the Atrial Flutter, which has only been picked up during the Stress ECG, and then just when I was giving it full beans on the treadmill. I have also met with the Electrophysiologist (Catheter Ablation specialist) who said it was worth having the operation (apparently it is very low risk) to hopefully cure the flutter and potentially ward off future problems...
However my stamina level is still down (since the 10k last September) so I have been back to the GP. Have now done a Chest X-ray (all normal), a spirometry test to check lung capacity, asthma etc (all normal) and have just had a blood test (awaiting results).
All in all still a mystery....
On a more positive note, and I know this makes it sounds like I may be imagining the symptoms, I did the London Marathon at the weekend in 4hrs 6 mins (the cardiologist had said it should be safe to go back to running and I had done a steady training programme). Not really complaining but it is all relative, my last marathon a year ago was a comfortable 3hr 44m.
Will see what if anything comes from blood tests and if GP has any more ideas...
I have now had the results back from my MRI, along with numerous other tests, ECG, blood pressure, echocardiogram etc etc. I have met with the cardiologist and he has summarised that everything with the heart looks pretty much normal in line with my age and health profile.
The only issue detected is the Atrial Flutter, which has only been picked up during the Stress ECG, and then just when I was giving it full beans on the treadmill. I have also met with the Electrophysiologist (Catheter Ablation specialist) who said it was worth having the operation (apparently it is very low risk) to hopefully cure the flutter and potentially ward off future problems...
However my stamina level is still down (since the 10k last September) so I have been back to the GP. Have now done a Chest X-ray (all normal), a spirometry test to check lung capacity, asthma etc (all normal) and have just had a blood test (awaiting results).
All in all still a mystery....
On a more positive note, and I know this makes it sounds like I may be imagining the symptoms, I did the London Marathon at the weekend in 4hrs 6 mins (the cardiologist had said it should be safe to go back to running and I had done a steady training programme). Not really complaining but it is all relative, my last marathon a year ago was a comfortable 3hr 44m.
Will see what if anything comes from blood tests and if GP has any more ideas...
Good result on the Marathon, that is still a very decent time. Easy to get hung up on absolute timing, when the real question should be did you enjoy it ?
Over 39000 lost to Kipchoge, so you shouldn’t feel bad about not winning it.
It’s a fabulous day out, and such brilliant support so I hope you didn’t suffer too much
If anyone is interested, the symptoms of fatigue, slight breathlessness, aching legs have continued since last September, they come and go, never very bad but also never perfect and nothing like the energy levels I had.
As the heart checks came back clear the GP has referred me to the Pulmonary/Respiratory specialist whom I met the other day. He has booked me for a CT scan and for checks at the Full Lung Function with Reversibility clinic. I understand these checks will look for Pulmonary fibrosis or clots in the lungs, apparently these can cause symptoms similar to heart disease, so we shall see if they find anything.
In the meantime, I continue with my gentle jogging and dog walking. Not given up hope completely and have entered the ballot for London Marathon next year, will see if I can fluke a place in there again....!
As the heart checks came back clear the GP has referred me to the Pulmonary/Respiratory specialist whom I met the other day. He has booked me for a CT scan and for checks at the Full Lung Function with Reversibility clinic. I understand these checks will look for Pulmonary fibrosis or clots in the lungs, apparently these can cause symptoms similar to heart disease, so we shall see if they find anything.
In the meantime, I continue with my gentle jogging and dog walking. Not given up hope completely and have entered the ballot for London Marathon next year, will see if I can fluke a place in there again....!
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