Golf - 2025

[DuncanM]

bodhi said:

I was going to ask how the hell you manage to shank a hybrid, but then I realised I've watched my old man shank a 3 wood on the 1st tee of the Old Course - not that I ever managed to figure out how he managed it either

I actually went the other way this season, and dropped my 3 iron for my 3 hybrid - mostly as I'd lost confidence in the iron and could rely on the hybrid more. I'd always been the same as you with hybrids until I got this one - it's an 818 H2 with an X Stiff shaft, and swings/behaves more like a long iron than a small wood as in other hybrids I've tried.

It also seems to go lower than my current 3 iron (a T200), which I wasn't expecting. I'm going to spend some time at the range this winter to see if I can get the 3 iron working properly, as it's an absolute weapon when it's on song.

Didn't pick up what shafts you'd gone for? They steel?

Ooh ok, regarding the shank, I think it's to do with the head shape, and lack of weight in the club, I tend to hold wrist angles quite late into my swing. I've decided to blame the clubs

Steel, Project X U shafts, 6.0 110g. I'll update with my progress in the new year, see if I'm right

[DuncanM]

Obviously shank isn't the exact correct term, what I feel happens, is that I hold lots of angle, and the massive heel on the hybrid, digs in at impact, and the ball slides across the open face. It's a horrible shot, confidence shattering, because I feel like I've put a good swing on it. I've had success with trying to swing it like a wood more, but the club is so light, feels like a kids club. 6i photo for comparison, same movement with the shaft.

Anyway, I'm sulking and blaming the clubs, and it's a good excuse for new toys if nothing else

[Wills2]

Anyone else noticed a big difference between top tracer and other shot tracking methods like GC quad?

My 27 degree 5 iron carry on a GC quad is 195 average, this week I was at the range and recorded the below, they have the ball comp on which I guess adjusts for temp and ball it was around 7c and the GC quad is in a studio and set up for summer conditions I believe.



There were great strikes but I remarked to my friend no wonder people complain about not being able to take their range game to the course, as it doesn't exist.

My main goal for next year is to know my numbers and also get a shot scope or watch as I've always just winged it on the course and that has to be costing me shots mentally and physically but it's no good if the tracer is way off.

[DuncanM]

Wills2 said:

Anyone else noticed a big difference between top tracer and other shot tracking methods like GC quad?

My 27 degree 5 iron carry on a GC quad is 195 average, this week I was at the range and recorded the below, they have the ball comp on which I guess adjusts for temp and ball it was around 7c and the GC quad is in a studio and set up for summer conditions I believe.



There were great strikes but I remarked to my friend no wonder people complain about not being able to take their range game to the course, as it doesn't exist.

My main goal for next year is to know my numbers and also get a shot scope or watch as I've always just winged it on the course and that has to be costing me shots mentally and physically but it's no good if the tracer is way off.

You beast you!

That's a genuine fault rather than just slightly out?

Surprised anyone is playing without either gps or a laser, both have their benefits, I prefer a laser.

[ukwill]

I'm having a bit of a nightmare. Decided to rip my old swing apart and go back to the drawing board - really want a better downswing. Have noticed (after changing the pro I use on Skillest) that my sequencing is fundamentally poor, and it's only been my sporadic ability to counter it that has allowed me to get to my current H/C. If I want to get into single figs and stay there, things have to change.

My problem (and I think this is quite common from what I see on YT), is not enough weight shift onto the front during transition (arguably more often than not, I dont move forward until I have finished my backswing). Coupled with that, my arms are firing first because my hips are not doing the right things. Consequently, I am unable to shallow correctly so have to compensate in order to try to deliver the clubface square to the ball. If this timing is off I will see pulls / pull hooks.

Trying to work on fixing this is depressingly slow going. But this time I have to persevere. Ah well, isn't this what winter is for?

[Peterpetrole]

Wills2 said:

Anyone else noticed a big difference between top tracer and other shot tracking methods like GC quad?

My 27 degree 5 iron carry on a GC quad is 195 average, this week I was at the range and recorded the below, they have the ball comp on which I guess adjusts for temp and ball it was around 7c and the GC quad is in a studio and set up for summer conditions I believe.



There were great strikes but I remarked to my friend no wonder people complain about not being able to take their range game to the course, as it doesn't exist.

My main goal for next year is to know my numbers and also get a shot scope or watch as I've always just winged it on the course and that has to be costing me shots mentally and physically but it's no good if the tracer is way off.

Discussed many times, but the biggest factor with Top Tracer, and all ranges, is not something Top Tracer can do anything about, which is the balls that are being used, and the weather, specifically wind. Top Tracer is measuring the ball a considerable distance down range, like a more basic version of Trackman. So environmental conditions affect the results CORRECTLY, because it's measuring real distances (and applies a correction for the ball type if the range sets it up that way).

We do know from this thread that some Top Tracer ranges are setup / managed / calibrated better than others, the ones I use seem to be spot on (I have a launch monitor at home and know my numbers). The technology is brilliant if used correctly. Laser the flags at your range if you want to check things properly.

GC Quad is only measuring a few inches past impact (it is most useful for identifying strike location, path and AofA of the club), it's certainly not going to give the same results as Top Tracer in an indoor studio.

[JoeMk1]

Peterpetrole said:

Discussed many times, but the biggest factor with Top Tracer, and all ranges, is not something Top Tracer can do anything about, which is the balls that are being used, and the weather, specifically wind. Top Tracer is measuring the ball a considerable distance down range, like a more basic version of Trackman. So environmental conditions affect the results CORRECTLY, because it's measuring real distances (and applies a correction for the ball type if the range sets it up that way).

We do know from this thread that some Top Tracer ranges are setup / managed / calibrated better than others, the ones I use seem to be spot on (I have a launch monitor at home and know my numbers). The technology is brilliant if used correctly. Laser the flags at your range if you want to check things properly.

GC Quad is only measuring a few inches past impact (it is most useful for identifying strike location, path and AofA of the club), it's certainly not going to give the same results as Top Tracer in an indoor studio.

Agree with the above, also were the balls/clubface wet? The difference in flight is more obvious with wedges (which generally come off super high), but wet range balls can fly a bit knuckly off longer clubs, partcularly if worn. I've developed the habit of drying range balls before I hit them, the flight isn't the most representative at the best of times, wet you might as well ignore the flight completely.

The weak loft of your 5i, the high ball speed and relatively high launch angle don't really tally up with the flat, hot flight toptracer is showing. Suggests either very low spin or a strong tailwind

Edited by JoeMk1 on Friday 5th December 11:06

[Hobo]

ukwill said:

I'm having a bit of a nightmare. Decided to rip my old swing apart and go back to the drawing board - really want a better downswing. Have noticed (after changing the pro I use on Skillest) that my sequencing is fundamentally poor, and it's only been my sporadic ability to counter it that has allowed me to get to my current H/C. If I want to get into single figs and stay there, things have to change.

My problem (and I think this is quite common from what I see on YT), is not enough weight shift onto the front during transition (arguably more often than not, I dont move forward until I have finished my backswing). Coupled with that, my arms are firing first because my hips are not doing the right things. Consequently, I am unable to shallow correctly so have to compensate in order to try to deliver the clubface square to the ball. If this timing is off I will see pulls / pull hooks.

Trying to work on fixing this is depressingly slow going. But this time I have to persevere. Ah well, isn't this what winter is for?

Give this a watch and try the drills mentioned (towel needed), as it about sequencing of the downswing and weight transfer;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AR8LoTAorMA

[bodhi]

Wills2 said:

Anyone else noticed a big difference between top tracer and other shot tracking methods like GC quad?

My 27 degree 5 iron carry on a GC quad is 195 average, this week I was at the range and recorded the below, they have the ball comp on which I guess adjusts for temp and ball it was around 7c and the GC quad is in a studio and set up for summer conditions I believe.



There were great strikes but I remarked to my friend no wonder people complain about not being able to take their range game to the course, as it doesn't exist.

My main goal for next year is to know my numbers and also get a shot scope or watch as I've always just winged it on the course and that has to be costing me shots mentally and physically but it's no good if the tracer is way off.

Top tracer is notoriously flaky in me experience - they usually have ball compensation on which can give some very weird results. The one I use has 80 percent compression balls so automatically adds 20 percent to everything, which can give some strange results.

I use a closer one with Trackman Range now and it's much better. It adjusts to tell you what the distance would be if you'd hit a Pro V1 and there was no wind, and you can turn it off as well if you prefer.

Biggest discrepancy for me is ball speed - on TrackMan I'm around 145-150 with a driver, TT has me over 160. Great for the old ego, just not accuracy...

[fourstardan]

Top tracers like using a radar camera whereas Trackman, Flightscope use Doppler.

I've got a Mevo+, absolutely love the data I get out of it even though I'm dogsht at golf lol.

Also, remember a range ball is not going to compress as much, Trackman/FS normalise the ball data to cater for Range balls.

[s94wht]

bodhi said:

Top tracer is notoriously flaky in me experience - they usually have ball compensation on which can give some very weird results. The one I use has 80 percent compression balls so automatically adds 20 percent to everything, which can give some strange results.

I use a closer one with Trackman Range now and it's much better. It adjusts to tell you what the distance would be if you'd hit a Pro V1 and there was no wind, and you can turn it off as well if you prefer.

Biggest discrepancy for me is ball speed - on TrackMan I'm around 145-150 with a driver, TT has me over 160. Great for the old ego, just not accuracy...

That WOULD give weird results - it would need to add 25%! ``

Yes, agreed about the ball speed. I was about 148 ball speed on a Trackman range, not hitting it overly well, and within a couple of shots on TT I was apparently at 158-160... Hmm, methinks not!

[ukwill]

Hobo said:

Give this a watch and try the drills mentioned (towel needed), as it about sequencing of the downswing and weight transfer;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AR8LoTAorMA

Thanks for the link, will watch it over the weekend. Really feels like I’m trying to start again but finding it hard to remove a few decades of rubbish.

[milesgiles]

ukwill said:

Hobo said:

Give this a watch and try the drills mentioned (towel needed), as it about sequencing of the downswing and weight transfer;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AR8LoTAorMA

Thanks for the link, will watch it over the weekend. Really feels like I m trying to start again but finding it hard to remove a few decades of rubbish.

Long is the road and hard that leads up into light..

Re video.. depends what you are trying to address!

[fourstardan]

Not sure I could do an hour lesson with Rachel, maybe only a full day lol.

I like Liam's, he's done some great work with guys on tour this year, he is a disciple of Gary Barter, it's good stuff but you need to really have to understand forces/torques or you'll end up hitting steep and all arms and injured lol.

[Wills2]

DuncanM said:

You beast you!

That's a genuine fault rather than just slightly out?

Surprised anyone is playing without either gps or a laser, both have their benefits, I prefer a laser.

over 10% out GC quad is 195 (and those were 3 good ones) so it's over reading, I thought it was worth posting as people often think they are blasting it at the range when the numbers are telling porkies.

I eyeball it Duncan, must be some shots to be gained next year!

Edited by Wills2 on Saturday 6th December 07:42

[Wills2]

Hobo said:

Give this a watch and try the drills mentioned (towel needed), as it about sequencing of the downswing and weight transfer;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AR8LoTAorMA

That drill feels great I tried it yesterday as I was doing a couple hours of short game practice and I'd seen the video so tried it out, going to take a towel to my lesson today and see what my pro makes of it for me.

[DuncanM]

Wills2 said:

over 10% out GC quad is 195 (and those were 3 good ones) so it's over reading, I thought it was worth posting as people often think they are blasting it at the range when the numbers are telling porkies.

I eyeball it Duncan, must be some shots to be gained next year!

Edited by Wills2 on Saturday 6th December 07:42

That's quite a skill , I'm blind, and find a laser satisfying, when you hit a green with a good shot, you can measure your exact carry via the pitchmark (in relation to flag).

Golf is fun, the Trackman range I use is acceptable for my gapping, I might go to a Toptracer for an ego massage

[DuncanM]

Meeting my brother at the range today, he's just bought some Avoda one length irons! Excited to try them

[Wills2]

DuncanM said:

Wills2 said:

over 10% out GC quad is 195 (and those were 3 good ones) so it's over reading, I thought it was worth posting as people often think they are blasting it at the range when the numbers are telling porkies.

I eyeball it Duncan, must be some shots to be gained next year!

Edited by Wills2 on Saturday 6th December 07:42

That's quite a skill , I'm blind, and find a laser satisfying, when you hit a green with a good shot, you can measure your exact carry via the pitchmark (in relation to flag).

Golf is fun, the Trackman range I use is acceptable for my gapping, I might go to a Toptracer for an ego massage

Yeah you'll hit it to the moon! No ego massage though as you know it's not the truth.

[Greenie]

fourstardan said:

Not sure I could do an hour lesson with Rachel, maybe only a full day lol.

I like Liam's, he's done some great work with guys on tour this year, he is a disciple of Gary Barter, it's good stuff but you need to really have to understand forces/torques or you'll end up hitting steep and all arms and injured lol.

She is very lovely.

I have lessons with Liam - it’s really a great method he teaches - so superior to the way a PGA pro teaches IMO. Very simple and athletic but as you say it needs to be followed correctly - it would be tough to follow from a YouTube vid.

Edited by Greenie on Saturday 6th December 09:21