Job losses at Rapha
Discussion
Go back a few years and the Rapha range was concise and consistent. There were some really well designed and made bits of kit. Now the range is so vast and quality so different across it it's hard to keep track.
The Classic Jersey is imo, a brilliant bit of kit, whether SS or LS, it's versatile, good looking and the couple I have are still box fresh.
The original Winter Jersey is another good one.
Like Idiotgap I also have an original Softshell, it's amazing, how something so light and thin can be so warm and waterproof is beyond me. The Hardshell was another great jacket, but they cut it along with the Softshell, they were stable best sellers.
The Pro Team range was initially good too, but now you've got jerseys for every degree of temperature change, through in the oil-slick Crit racing and sliders (yes Flip Flops!) and it's all too much.
If they scaled back the ranges and focused on say Core, Classic, Pro Team and Brevet and just cut all the crap they'd be in with a chance. The number of sales they run also suggests that pricing is actually too high too.
The Classic Jersey is imo, a brilliant bit of kit, whether SS or LS, it's versatile, good looking and the couple I have are still box fresh.
The original Winter Jersey is another good one.
Like Idiotgap I also have an original Softshell, it's amazing, how something so light and thin can be so warm and waterproof is beyond me. The Hardshell was another great jacket, but they cut it along with the Softshell, they were stable best sellers.
The Pro Team range was initially good too, but now you've got jerseys for every degree of temperature change, through in the oil-slick Crit racing and sliders (yes Flip Flops!) and it's all too much.
If they scaled back the ranges and focused on say Core, Classic, Pro Team and Brevet and just cut all the crap they'd be in with a chance. The number of sales they run also suggests that pricing is actually too high too.
Matt_N said:
Go back a few years and the Rapha range was concise and consistent. There were some really well designed and made bits of kit. Now the range is so vast and quality so different across it it's hard to keep track.
The Classic Jersey is imo, a brilliant bit of kit, whether SS or LS, it's versatile, good looking and the couple I have are still box fresh.
The original Winter Jersey is another good one.
Like Idiotgap I also have an original Softshell, it's amazing, how something so light and thin can be so warm and waterproof is beyond me. The Hardshell was another great jacket, but they cut it along with the Softshell, they were stable best sellers.
The Pro Team range was initially good too, but now you've got jerseys for every degree of temperature change, through in the oil-slick Crit racing and sliders (yes Flip Flops!) and it's all too much.
If they scaled back the ranges and focused on say Core, Classic, Pro Team and Brevet and just cut all the crap they'd be in with a chance. The number of sales they run also suggests that pricing is actually too high too.
Isn't that what often happens? A company has a good core product, gained a reputation, then they use the "brand" to diversify, putting their name on all kinds of things and in doing so dilute the "brand".The Classic Jersey is imo, a brilliant bit of kit, whether SS or LS, it's versatile, good looking and the couple I have are still box fresh.
The original Winter Jersey is another good one.
Like Idiotgap I also have an original Softshell, it's amazing, how something so light and thin can be so warm and waterproof is beyond me. The Hardshell was another great jacket, but they cut it along with the Softshell, they were stable best sellers.
The Pro Team range was initially good too, but now you've got jerseys for every degree of temperature change, through in the oil-slick Crit racing and sliders (yes Flip Flops!) and it's all too much.
If they scaled back the ranges and focused on say Core, Classic, Pro Team and Brevet and just cut all the crap they'd be in with a chance. The number of sales they run also suggests that pricing is actually too high too.
-German "prestige" car companies seem to have avoided this somehow, and maintain their appeal.
If the point of building the Company pay was to sell it on for £££££s, this can sometimes work for the founders.
I think the image issue is a real problem for a company like Rapha. When they were small, they were bought by cyclists who appreciated the quality and design and who didn't mind paying a little extra (i.e. riders who might usually buy Assos, Castelli). These were usually either people who did huge miles or "proper" cyclists with deep pockets.
Then Rahpa became fashionable and all of a sudden the MAMIL brigade in London had to be seen in Rapha whilst pootling about on their £8000 Italian carbon bikes or poinless fixies. So Rahpa started catering for them as well as for the "real" cyclists and grew and grew.
Unfortulately, a lot of people couldn't (or can't) see past the MAMILs and designer bikers and thus associate the brand wholly (rightly or wrongly) with the rich MAMILs and refuse to buy it. Or only on sale to they can be smug about getting one over on the designer crowd.
This has, IMHO, lead to the issue of a confused and far too broad, product selection. Combine this with growth resulting in some quality issues (maybe corner cutting, maybe new suppliers, who knows) and they could very suddenly be dropped by the fashionistas (being dropped by Team Sky can't help here) and that could be game over.
Rapha kit is good, amongst the best even but they do have an image issue which is at least partly their own fault. I have no Rapha gear. I mostly use Gore, Shimano, Castelli and Assos (and Nukeproof offroad stuff) so it's not a money issue. It's quite simply the brand identity - Rapha always appears to be a sort of clique, the stonemasons of the cycling world and I felt I was not invited.
Then Rahpa became fashionable and all of a sudden the MAMIL brigade in London had to be seen in Rapha whilst pootling about on their £8000 Italian carbon bikes or poinless fixies. So Rahpa started catering for them as well as for the "real" cyclists and grew and grew.
Unfortulately, a lot of people couldn't (or can't) see past the MAMILs and designer bikers and thus associate the brand wholly (rightly or wrongly) with the rich MAMILs and refuse to buy it. Or only on sale to they can be smug about getting one over on the designer crowd.
This has, IMHO, lead to the issue of a confused and far too broad, product selection. Combine this with growth resulting in some quality issues (maybe corner cutting, maybe new suppliers, who knows) and they could very suddenly be dropped by the fashionistas (being dropped by Team Sky can't help here) and that could be game over.
Rapha kit is good, amongst the best even but they do have an image issue which is at least partly their own fault. I have no Rapha gear. I mostly use Gore, Shimano, Castelli and Assos (and Nukeproof offroad stuff) so it's not a money issue. It's quite simply the brand identity - Rapha always appears to be a sort of clique, the stonemasons of the cycling world and I felt I was not invited.
I have a lot of their stuff, gathered over the year from a combination of sales, gifts, vouchers, and a quick trip to their sample sale.
It's my go-to treat brand, or it was until the new website landed, that doesn't look like the Jahvahaah parody site. The new one is almost unusable.
Maybe it's because my tastes have changed, but I only really like the Brevet range now. I have a few of their Sky supporter stuff that is a nod towards your team allegiance, rather than full on team kit.
The advertising has always been w
ky though!
It's my go-to treat brand, or it was until the new website landed, that doesn't look like the Jahvahaah parody site. The new one is almost unusable.
Maybe it's because my tastes have changed, but I only really like the Brevet range now. I have a few of their Sky supporter stuff that is a nod towards your team allegiance, rather than full on team kit.
The advertising has always been w
ky though!louiebaby said:
I have a lot of their stuff, gathered over the year from a combination of sales, gifts, vouchers, and a quick trip to their sample sale.
It's my go-to treat brand, or it was until the new website landed, that doesn't look like the Jahvahaah parody site. The new one is almost unusable.
Have to agree .... I think others will too. They seemed to extend their sale, emailing the closing date at every opportunity ... it almost sounded desperate! Anyway, apart from some shorts I bought over summer, I don't think I've purchased anything all year.It's my go-to treat brand, or it was until the new website landed, that doesn't look like the Jahvahaah parody site. The new one is almost unusable.
JEA1K said:
louiebaby said:
I have a lot of their stuff, gathered over the year from a combination of sales, gifts, vouchers, and a quick trip to their sample sale.
It's my go-to treat brand, or it was until the new website landed, that doesn't look like the Jahvahaah parody site. The new one is almost unusable.
Have to agree .... I think others will too. They seemed to extend their sale, emailing the closing date at every opportunity ... it almost sounded desperate! Anyway, apart from some shorts I bought over summer, I don't think I've purchased anything all year.It's my go-to treat brand, or it was until the new website landed, that doesn't look like the Jahvahaah parody site. The new one is almost unusable.
Some of the best kit I've worn has been bespoke club kit, at £30-40 a pair of shorts, not sure why anyone would pay so much more not much better?
Is this indicative of the end of the recent cycling boom? A few years ago every bloke in his forties was getting raphad up and spending thousands on road bikes. PHs was full of people arguing about whether they were worth it or whether a £10,000 bike was much faster than a £2,000 one. Triathalons has waiting lists and you had to sign up for an ironman a year in advance.
My perception is that cycling is no longer the midlife crisis activity of choice and Rapha is suffering as a result? Perhaps the midlife crisis itself has gone? Perhaps everyone’s into other stuff instead? That’s where the money is, midlife crisis activities and the pink pound. Gay blokes midlife crisis activities must be particularly profitable.
My perception is that cycling is no longer the midlife crisis activity of choice and Rapha is suffering as a result? Perhaps the midlife crisis itself has gone? Perhaps everyone’s into other stuff instead? That’s where the money is, midlife crisis activities and the pink pound. Gay blokes midlife crisis activities must be particularly profitable.
El stovey said:
Is this indicative of the end of the recent cycling boom?
I'm not convinced.I saw plenty of chaps aged 40-60, paying £25 to the local rotary club yesterday to ride their very nice carbon bikes, not very fast, round the local countryside.
But they might have all bought most of what they need now, from a kit perspective. I know I have. I don't need anything now really, other than a new bike. (obvs).
Maybe catering to mid-life crisis cyclists has just matured as an industry?
louiebaby said:
I'm not convinced.
I saw plenty of chaps aged 40-60, paying £25 to the local rotary club yesterday to ride their very nice carbon bikes, not very fast, round the local countryside.
But they might have all bought most of what they need now, from a kit perspective. I know I have. I don't need anything now really, other than a new bike. (obvs).
Maybe catering to mid-life crisis cyclists has just matured as an industry?
I'd agree - you can only sell so many pairs of expensive bib shorts. There's also a lot more competition, with brands like Ashmei making it even quicker to empty wallets - £235 for bibs or £80 for a base layer.I saw plenty of chaps aged 40-60, paying £25 to the local rotary club yesterday to ride their very nice carbon bikes, not very fast, round the local countryside.
But they might have all bought most of what they need now, from a kit perspective. I know I have. I don't need anything now really, other than a new bike. (obvs).
Maybe catering to mid-life crisis cyclists has just matured as an industry?
El stovey said:
Is this indicative of the end of the recent cycling boom? A few years ago every bloke in his forties was getting raphad up and spending thousands on road bikes. PHs was full of people arguing about whether they were worth it or whether a £10,000 bike was much faster than a £2,000 one. Triathalons has waiting lists and you had to sign up for an ironman a year in advance.
My perception is that cycling is no longer the midlife crisis activity of choice and Rapha is suffering as a result? Perhaps the midlife crisis itself has gone? Perhaps everyone’s into other stuff instead? That’s where the money is, midlife crisis activities and the pink pound. Gay blokes midlife crisis activities must be particularly profitable.
I don't think so, The CS7 from 8-9 am is like the grand depart at times.My perception is that cycling is no longer the midlife crisis activity of choice and Rapha is suffering as a result? Perhaps the midlife crisis itself has gone? Perhaps everyone’s into other stuff instead? That’s where the money is, midlife crisis activities and the pink pound. Gay blokes midlife crisis activities must be particularly profitable.
They reckon the golf clubs are losing members in their droves to mid life fellas cycling.
Rapha is losing out purely because their stuff is just too damn dear.
Black can man said:
The top tier stuff at decathlon is just as good as the Rapha stuff & it comes in at a quarter of the price.
I've always found the Rapha love in boys are just more concerned with labels TBH.
Rapha, as trendy to some as it is is just far too expensive.
I'm not sure which demographic I represent but I'm prepared to pay for performance and also very fussy about the styling. When I first started (2014) I hated all the garish options in cycling, so Rapha presented an understated style and a safe bet for set of 'best kit'. That was a pro jersey and Classic bibs, both of which are still in rotation and wearing well. Even back then I still bought the 'black logo on black' variant.I've always found the Rapha love in boys are just more concerned with labels TBH.
Rapha, as trendy to some as it is is just far too expensive.
I'm more demanding now and have tried lots of top-end kit, trying to find something for multi-week ultras. I've gone through Assos, Ashmei, Castelli, Bioracer and others but was surprised to end up back at Rapha (Cargo Shorts, of all things!). I'm really only looking at a narrow range of products but have found them to be good quality (except for the Shadow jersey, which was sent back). Where I struggle now is that I'm still keen on discrete styling and Rapha seem to have also gone full circle with shouty branding and lairy colours. I'd rather not wear anybody's logo.
I've never seen anything they make that particularly appeals to be honest, for me they seem to have associated themselves with people who grow moustaches, like fixies and are a bit weird about their coffee brands which I know is ridiculous but I can't help it. I like Ale's kit and I have a pair of Santini bips which are the comfiest pair I've ever worn. For value for money I still think DHB takes a lot to beat though, some of their Blok kit is really good.
If Gruffy rates Rapha, I reckon that’s a great endorsement.
but I totally agree about discrete branding 
Who on earth wants to wear a shouty logo?
Gruffy said:
Rapha presented an understated style and a safe bet for set of 'best kit' ... Where I struggle now is that I'm still keen on discrete styling and Rapha seem to have also gone full circle with shouty branding and lairy colours. I'd rather not wear anybody's logo.
Some of us like lairy colours but I totally agree about discrete branding Who on earth wants to wear a shouty logo?
oddball1313 said:
I've never seen anything they make that particularly appeals to be honest, for me they seem to have associated themselves with people who grow moustaches, like fixies and are a bit weird about their coffee brands which I know is ridiculous but I can't help it. I like Ale's kit and I have a pair of Santini bips which are the comfiest pair I've ever worn. For value for money I still think DHB takes a lot to beat though, some of their Blok kit is really good.
I probably shouldn't say this, but even at their decent prices, I can tell you the mark up on DHB is quite a lot. I have a friend who used to work at wiggle....the staff discount was huge! There is a big difference in quality between DHB and, say, Assos, though.I have a pair of DHB 3/4 length leggings and, whilst fine for shorter rides, on longer rides I find the pad uncomfortable, and the straps cause me nipple chafing (something I've never ever had on anything Castelli or Assos!!!) and the material doesn't feel anywhere near as nice. The Assos ones also have a very small windproof section over your bladder/lower abdomen which helps a surprising amount when it's chilly, the material feels less resistance when pedaling.
Having said that, you pays your money....not sure about others, but I can definitely tell the difference between top end stuff (and I've loads of DHB stuff which is fantastic value and great for shorter rides for me, but not long rides. It's all relative....I COULD weear DHB stuff for long rides (Assos chamois cream on your nips helps
) but when I really enjoy cycling, I figure if I spend a bit more on kit that reduces unnecessary discomfort then why not Edited by E65Ross on Monday 10th September 19:58
I bought some Assos shorts ahead of the Trans Am and I'm hugely impressed with the quality. All of the materials are superb. The chamois is the best I've ridden. The KuKu Penthouse (a suede-like pocket for your plums) is way more than just a gimmick. Sadly I found the sizing and cut just didn't work for me. Their winter tights are amazing and fit like a glove but the shorts are way too short and also ride up, so I get chafing. Fit is far and away the most important thing with shorts, in my opinion. We're all slightly different shapes so there's no universal recommendation.
Gassing Station | Pedal Powered | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff