Braking = Intercity 125 impression

Braking = Intercity 125 impression

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Discussion

cheeky_chops

Original Poster:

1,587 posts

250 months

Friday 24th March 2023
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New winter bike - Holdsworth Corsa carbon (planet x) - SRAM Rival hydro callipers with Avid Centreline 160mm Discs. Had it end of Jan and rode while cold+dry in Feb, brakes just got noisier each week so much so a mate started commenting. Went out last week and was wet - sounded like a train coming to a halt, i mean even louder than the week before, cringe ridiculous loud!! So total of 6 rides, 5 dry, one wet, 250 miles. My benchmark is a 3yo Cannondale Synapse with 105 discs and a 10yo mountain bike (tektro iirc) and they rarely make an noise.

I contacted PX and they said this can happen - give them a clean and all be good. Hmmm. OK so i cleaned with proper bike disc fluid (i had to buy as never had issue before), rubbed down pads with 240grit sandpaper and tested outside house - within a couple of stops its back and starting to get louder each pull

Annoying and not believing "it can just happen" on a brand new bike to both wheels. The latest is "can i put the discs in the oven for 20 mins" Seriously??!

Whats others experiences and expectations here?

frisbee

4,958 posts

109 months

Friday 24th March 2023
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Is the actual braking ok? When I've had callipers leak and fluid get onto the pads the braking went to st but they also squealed all the time.

With good callipers they occasionally squeal and honk while riding in horrible conditions and on the first stop on the next ride. But other than that they are silent. Shimano pads on the front, cheapo ones of Amazon on the back.

leyorkie

1,636 posts

175 months

Friday 24th March 2023
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I’ve got a Cannondale with 105 discs. I’ve cleaned and cleaned, tried every pad type fro Shimano and other third party suppliers. Changed discs, changed pads. Still won’t stop squealing.
I now use brake disc cleaner and then Swiss stop stop squeal spray. I’ve just done them this afternoon ready for a ride. Fingers crossed for the ride. The Swissstop stuff seems to work.

GravelBen

15,656 posts

229 months

Friday 24th March 2023
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Caliper alignment can be a factor too, might be worth readjusting that if you haven't already.

But some brakes just seem to be noisy no matter what you do.

Wonder if its worth trying the old trick from car brakes, a bit of grease on the back of the pad where it contacts the piston?

Edited by GravelBen on Friday 24th March 21:21

oddball1313

1,178 posts

122 months

Friday 24th March 2023
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Had this issue on my winter Canyon with Ultegra. Tried new pads, every degreaser known to mankind, sanding the disks etc.

This was my solution - not cheap but no more squeeling, better stopping performance and with no plans to sell the bike seemed to make sense

https://www.hopetech.com/products/brakes/road/

Kawasicki

13,041 posts

234 months

Friday 24th March 2023
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If cleaning or readjusting doesn’t fix it, you need to change something significant in the system.

Try changing the type of pad?

mike9009

6,919 posts

242 months

Saturday 25th March 2023
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I had similar with my boardman hybrid.

Realign the callpers. Then you need to bed the pads in. Find a large hill, cycle down and apply the brakes sharply. Might take quite a few times before the squealing (or whatever) subsides.

leyorkie

1,636 posts

175 months

Saturday 25th March 2023
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Kawasicki said:
If cleaning or readjusting doesn’t fix it, you need to change something significant in the system.

Try changing the type of pad?
How about changing pads then discs realignment etc etc still squealing
Swiss stop brake silencer it’s a bit like graphite spray
Taken to very good local bike shop hours of cleaning still squealing

Le5 you know after tomorrow’s ride

Kawasicki

13,041 posts

234 months

Sunday 26th March 2023
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leyorkie said:
Kawasicki said:
If cleaning or readjusting doesn’t fix it, you need to change something significant in the system.

Try changing the type of pad?
How about changing pads then discs realignment etc etc still squealing
Swiss stop brake silencer it’s a bit like graphite spray
Taken to very good local bike shop hours of cleaning still squealing

Le5 you know after tomorrow’s ride
Please do. In cars brakes squeal because some part of the system is vibrating at an audible (usually annoying) frequency. The usual solution is to modify the system so that either the thing doing the excitation, the pad rubbing on the disc surface, operates at a different frequency or the thing doing the vibration response/noise making does. So a pad material change or a change in the weight of some component.

Kawasicki

13,041 posts

234 months

Monday 27th March 2023
quotequote all
leyorkie said:
Kawasicki said:
If cleaning or readjusting doesn’t fix it, you need to change something significant in the system.

Try changing the type of pad?
How about changing pads then discs realignment etc etc still squealing
Swiss stop brake silencer it’s a bit like graphite spray
Taken to very good local bike shop hours of cleaning still squealing

Le5 you know after tomorrow’s ride
Please do. In cars brakes squeal because some part of the system is vibrating at an audible (usually annoying) frequency. The usual solution is to modify the system so that either the thing doing the excitation, the pad rubbing on the disc surface, operates at a different frequency or the thing doing the vibration response/noise making does. So a pad material change or a change in the weight of some component.

President Merkin

2,703 posts

18 months

Monday 27th March 2023
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PX are a bit light on detail on their web page but pound to a penny they've fitted that thing with sintered pads. I'd swap them for resin & glide off silently into the distance.

cheeky_chops

Original Poster:

1,587 posts

250 months

Monday 27th March 2023
quotequote all
Thanks all, seems a common problem.

I will re-align callipers but they look straight and no rubbing/pulsing while on/off the brakes. PX sending me some new pads, not sure whats fitter atm but email says new ones are EBC green which google says is a resin pad.

On fitting, will disc cleaner suffice or should i follow another protocol? Is pad transfer a thing here? TBH i didnt know there was a bedding in process for new bikes, thought they were just fit and forget


President Merkin

2,703 posts

18 months

Monday 27th March 2023
quotequote all
Yep disc cleaner is fine with a clean cloth, not any old rag. With bike brakes the thing to do above all else is keep contaminants away from the disc. No GT85, WD40 or anything else like it anywhere near them.

OutInTheShed

7,374 posts

25 months

Monday 27th March 2023
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This could be just like 70s small motorbikes, disc squeal was common!

One thing to check is the edges of the pads and the part of the caliper where they exert the braking force.
Any roughness or corrosion here can cause squealing or make it worse.
The merest hint of copper grease may help.
Sometimes the edges of the metal backings of pads can have the sharp corners taken off with a fine file.

Some people suggest a slight chamfer on the leading edge of the friction material, I've never had to do this my self.

The other thing is, make sure any springy bits on top of the pads are correctly in place.

wpa1975

8,604 posts

113 months

Monday 27th March 2023
quotequote all
President Merkin said:
PX are a bit light on detail on their web page but pound to a penny they've fitted that thing with sintered pads. I'd swap them for resin & glide off silently into the distance.
Doubt Planet X would have swapped pads, it will have Resin fitted.


cheeky_chops said:
On fitting, will disc cleaner suffice or should i follow another protocol? Is pad transfer a thing here? TBH i didnt know there was a bedding in process for new bikes, thought they were just fit and forget
If you don't bed them in, they are next to useless, my guess is yours are noisy as they are glazed, you need to go out and get them hot and I mean hot.

President Merkin

2,703 posts

18 months

Monday 27th March 2023
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I didn't mention swapping? The suggestion I made was PX fitted it with sintered to start with, which would square with noisy brakes in the wet.

remedy

1,635 posts

190 months

Monday 27th March 2023
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I feel your pain. I had to swap to Hope RX4s to cure the squeal from my Shimano BR505s. No pads, sanding, heating, degreasing would work.

The Hope set up gave me blissful brakes again.

leyorkie

1,636 posts

175 months

Tuesday 28th March 2023
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Well yesterday’s ride started off ok but only lasted 45 mins. Brakes were quiet at higher speeds but slow stopping was noisy. Ride buddy said the only way to stop them squealing is swop them for SRAM!

lufbramatt

5,318 posts

133 months

Tuesday 28th March 2023
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leyorkie said:
Well yesterday’s ride started off ok but only lasted 45 mins. Brakes were quiet at higher speeds but slow stopping was noisy. Ride buddy said the only way to stop them squealing is swop them for SRAM!
Any traces of brake fluid on the back of the pads?

Shimano brakes can leak slowly from the pistons and the fluid absorbs into the porous pad material as there are small holes in the metal backing plate. I've had two shimano calipers replaced under warranty due to this.

GravelBen

15,656 posts

229 months

Tuesday 28th March 2023
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leyorkie said:
Well yesterday’s ride started off ok but only lasted 45 mins. Brakes were quiet at higher speeds but slow stopping was noisy. Ride buddy said the only way to stop them squealing is swop them for SRAM!
Funny enough SRAM are often considered to be the noisier ones in the MTB world!

I find my (MTB) brakes are more likely to squeal with light to medium braking (especially when cold and wet), and quieten down after a couple of harder stops - whether because that cleans the rotor surface or just gets some heat into them.