Discussion
alock said:
The forums will warn you of seized bushes. I don't know how common this is in the real world. You have to remember that a handful of people can make a lot of noise on a forum.
It is quite common (probably very), however it only becomes an issue when you want to adjust the geometry. Not all bolts seize so it may be that the bolts (seized or not) are in tolerances for the geo anyway. Half the population wouldn't notice bad geo but enthusiasts will. Many cars geo will be OK so no need to sort. Bascially, many of them WILL have the issue but is not a problem as it may not have to be fixed ( or even not looked at anyway).What IS a problem is the caster bush, this is the one bush that can fail an MOT. Mine recently did (7 years old, 46k mileage) and I had to fix. The problem is that the bolts/sleeves aren't greased from factory so over time they seize (more so here in UK as we have crappy weather) and can be right pig to get it off the car (have to cut/angle grind the bushes/bolts to get the suspension arms out of the car.
Then there's the issue that Honda do NOT sell replacement bushes, only the whole wishbone (£350/£400 EACH). So if your caster bush failed the MOT and was also seized in, you're looking at £400 (at least, more at a main dealer) in labour charges, plus cost of wishbones and new bolts/sleeves. so £1200 at least to sort. That said, you can get bushes for the car from Mugen/Spoon/Polybushes etc. and this can save cost. I got 2 caster bushes from Mugen (which improves steering feel/weight) for about £100 imported (hard to get in the UK) and spend each evening for a week cutting the old ones off. What with replacement sleeves/bushes/drop-links(which seize easily) and garage cost to push out/in bushes I paid about £300 all in. Make sure you copper grease them before putting it all back together to prevent re-occurrence.
We all wish Honda would have greased the bolts/sleeves from new but they didn't (nor do many manufacturers).
Scare story or not, it's best people are more informed. All cars have problem areas, the S2000 probably has less issues than many others though! The potential costs of running a Boxster can be much more scary
That said, this is one of the few problem areas. The 2 S2000's I've owned have been the cheapest cars to run I've ever owned. About to have a service from Honda, £97!
The fact is, they are well built and well engineered, allow for suspension fixing (if needed, or check for evidence that it's been already sorted) and it's a great buy.
alock said:
Split hood. It's a vinyl roof, it will split eventually. You either live with a couple of little holes or budget £800 every 8-10 years for a new hood.
Some tough tape/duck tape on the inside of the roof where the frame rubs when lowered can stop wear. I have done this preventative measure and my roof shows no sign of wear at all.Edited by Dracoro on Wednesday 6th April 21:29
russy01 said:
Thanks for the advice ref the roof, good idea, i like being pro-active to save cash!
Ref the seized bolts, can you tell visually whether the problem exists? Or would you only find out when you take the car to have its GEO set up.
You can't see from visually (although if they look old/corroded, chances are.....), you need to adjust them yourself (there are 2 adjusters per wheel). You'll need the car on axlestands/ramp/over pit to do this and have the the right spanners/sockets (17mm, 19mm and 24mm IIRC) and start adjusting and see if the bushes try to move with the bolt. If it does then the bush will prob be seized. Whether you can do this when inspecting the car is probably unlikely, will depend on the seller if they allow you to do this - for many people a buyer under the car adjusting the geo may seem odd so they may decline, besides would you want a stranger buggering around with the geo of a car you were trying to sell? Ref the seized bolts, can you tell visually whether the problem exists? Or would you only find out when you take the car to have its GEO set up.
So, realistically you have a few options:
1. Make a full geo a condition of sale (some bolts may still be seized but if within geo tolerances, not too much of a problem) or check that it's been done recently. Do not let a selling car dealer do this for you, have it done independently.
2. Hope for the best but budget in, say £1k or £2k to sort it after purchase - or £3/4/500 if DIY.
3. Check/Adjust when inspecting car (if seller allows it).
4. Request evidence that they are all OK.
If it has been a problem in the past for the seller and they've fixed it, they will no doubt tell you what's been done, produce recent geo printouts etc. Bear in mind, like many sports cars, a good geo setup makes the car handle so much nicer so, imo, worth getting a goodun or getting it fixed.
When you do buy one, have the geo done and ask for the garage to remove and copper grease all the bolts regardless as a preventative measure. If you're mechanically minded and have axle stands and some tools, try all the adjusters yourself to see if there any problem ones. If they all free up (the bolts, the nuts may be fine but it's the bolts that you need to move) then remove and grease up and have the geo done.
If the car is a low mileage 2/3 years old one, it's probably OK but have the bolts greased anyway.
Edited by Dracoro on Wednesday 6th April 21:36
Dracoro said:
alock said:
Split hood. It's a vinyl roof, it will split eventually. You either live with a couple of little holes or budget £800 every 8-10 years for a new hood.
Some tough tape/duck tape on the inside of the roof where the frame rubs when lowered can stop wear. I have done this preventative measure and my roof shows no sign of wear at all.I have just bought a Moonrock with Red/Black interior and stuck a supercharger on it .
Had to get the two tone interior as the red is just too well...red and the black is boring. I have just bought the OEM body kit (with low level spolier) to make it look a little different and have some black alloys which should be going on this weekend.
I will then get some photos up.
What I can say is that I am glad I never drove one without the supercharger as I would have been underwhelmed. They look good but for a 2 litre sports car do not really have much power compared to basic production cars at the moment.
.Had to get the two tone interior as the red is just too well...red and the black is boring. I have just bought the OEM body kit (with low level spolier) to make it look a little different and have some black alloys which should be going on this weekend.
I will then get some photos up.
What I can say is that I am glad I never drove one without the supercharger as I would have been underwhelmed. They look good but for a 2 litre sports car do not really have much power compared to basic production cars at the moment.
alock said:
Dracoro said:
alock said:
Split hood. It's a vinyl roof, it will split eventually. You either live with a couple of little holes or budget £800 every 8-10 years for a new hood.
Some tough tape/duck tape on the inside of the roof where the frame rubs when lowered can stop wear. I have done this preventative measure and my roof shows no sign of wear at all.I'm talking about the split/cut that appears just above your shoulder. When the roof is down the frame rubs against it, with some tape there it prevents wear, quite simple. Smoothening rough edges on the frame can help too.
JFReturns said:
I'm looking at this one tomorrow
Quite leggy (79,000) miles, but I'll check the paper work to see if the suspension has been replaced in parts. There is an s2000 buying guide in EVO issue 155, and the checkpoints seem to be half the size of other car buying guides... a good sign!
There's a few inaccuracies in that article, a bit poorly researched. For example, AP2 S2000s are the 2.2 that only sold in Japan and the US, NOT here. They seem to think 04> are AP2s which they aren't, they are just the facelifted ones which are still AP1s. There are a few other mistakes too. It makes me question their other guides too if they research that poorly, after all many of us would expect to take someone "reputable" as EVO to do their research......Quite leggy (79,000) miles, but I'll check the paper work to see if the suspension has been replaced in parts. There is an s2000 buying guide in EVO issue 155, and the checkpoints seem to be half the size of other car buying guides... a good sign!
They quote a couple of companies that have either barely been heard of in the S2000 community (they are actually a TVR specialist I think) and a used s2000 dealer that has got quite a reputation (not a good one).
That said, it's clearly one the better built and more reliable sports cars out there and cheap(ish) to run. The main cost to younger people will be insurance.
Go to www.s2ki.co.uk and check the FAQ, a very useful guide on the S2000.
Dracoro said:
There's a few inaccuracies in that article, a bit poorly researched. For example, AP2 S2000s are the 2.2 that only sold in Japan and the US, NOT here. They seem to think 04> are AP2s which they aren't, they are just the facelifted ones which are still AP1s. There are a few other mistakes too. It makes me question their other guides too if they research that poorly, after all many of us would expect to take someone "reputable" as EVO to do their research......
They quote a couple of companies that have either barely been heard of in the S2000 community (they are actually a TVR specialist I think) and a used s2000 dealer that has got quite a reputation (not a good one).
That said, it's clearly one the better built and more reliable sports cars out there and cheap(ish) to run. The main cost to younger people will be insurance.
Go to www.s2ki.co.uk and check the FAQ, a very useful guide on the S2000.
I accept your point, you seem to know more about it than I do. However, your part highlighted is not strictly true... if you search for Austec racing you do indeed hit the TVR specialist site, but their s2000 one is hondas2000tuning.co.uk/.They quote a couple of companies that have either barely been heard of in the S2000 community (they are actually a TVR specialist I think) and a used s2000 dealer that has got quite a reputation (not a good one).
That said, it's clearly one the better built and more reliable sports cars out there and cheap(ish) to run. The main cost to younger people will be insurance.
Go to www.s2ki.co.uk and check the FAQ, a very useful guide on the S2000.
Whether they are known in the S2000 community is another issue....
i dont know how good they are, but they have the servicing schedule for the s2000 wrong i believe.
pretty certain they need a service every 9k miles, not 12k as per the site.
http://hondas2000tuning.co.uk/Servicing.html
i enjoyed the Evo article.. but mainly for the pics
pretty certain they need a service every 9k miles, not 12k as per the site.
http://hondas2000tuning.co.uk/Servicing.html
i enjoyed the Evo article.. but mainly for the pics
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