What Track Day Car for £27k?

[MR2_SC]

Vx220 2.2 with supercharger and 250bhp is a great choice if you want a one car solution and well under budget. As a 1000cc bike rider, the vx still feels nippy too (for a car).

However, for pure track fun a race Caterham, tow car and trailer wins....

P.S £27k is a very specific amount!

[Ahbefive]

nickfrog said:

Current Focus RS apparently is the track car to go for, 1.7t and 4wd. Job done. ;-).

Is 1500kgs 1.7t? Well who'd have thunk it?

It's certainly more fun than a megane R26 on track but also much heavier on consumables. Great for a 30min session or 2 but too pricey to run in terms of consumables for full sessions. My meganes tyres are still almost like new after a session at Donington, 7 laps of the 'Ring, session at Brands Hatch and 1.5k of road miles. Back to Donington today too.

For £27k and light on consumables an Exige S must be in with a shot. The Ginetta feels a bit feminine compared. A stripped out Cayman S with mods thrown at it could be quite good but maybe still a bit too heavy. Caterhams are good if you get a fast one, even the Megane upsets the low powered ones..

[MG CHRIS]

Why not get something disposable but quick say turbo mx5 for under 10k keep the rest for nice tow car/trailer and use the rest on as many trackdays for the next few years.

Or go racing which is what I'm doing after 5 years of track days and sprints.

[anonymous-user]

MG CHRIS said:

Why not get something disposable but quick say turbo mx5 for under 10k keep the rest for nice tow car/trailer and use the rest on as many trackdays for the next few years.

Or go racing which is what I'm doing after 5 years of track days and sprints.

Yes. I can't see the point of a Megane, not a nice one anyway as it'll just get trashed. Mate of mine swears by MGTF's, cheap and disposable. It all depends on budget but the heavier it is the harder it'll be on consumables, still say a Caterfield is best option overall.

[Oilchange]

Renault Sports are some of the most capable track cars out there, did my ARDS in a Megane, bloody fast.

[MR2_SC]

Ahbefive said:

.... Caterhams are good if you get a fast one, even the Megane upsets the low powered ones..

A lower powered Caterham is plenty quick enough.... if driven properly. And that's part of the attraction - learning to drive it properly.

Anything from a 1.6 with 125bhp and upwards can be pedalled at a good pace and should show a Megane a clean pair of heels...

Example lap times here, all are 1.6. Even the sigmax only has 145bhp: https://www.graduates.org.uk/lap_records.asp

[Ahbefive]

Maybe lots are just poorly driven on trackdays then as I have been past several in my totally road spec megane on recent track days.

[Oilchange]

It's not a race!

MR2_SC said:

Anything from a 1.6 with 125bhp and upwards can be pedalled at a good pace and should show a Megane a clean pair of heels...
Example lap times here, all are 1.6. Even the sigmax only has 145bhp: https://www.graduates.org.uk/lap_records.asp

[RobM77]

Ahbefive said:

Maybe lots are just poorly driven on trackdays then as I have been past several in my totally road spec megane on recent track days.

The standard of driving on track days varies enormously. I've instructed with a couple of guys in former racing Caterhams and both were around 10 seconds off the back of the grid in their respective championships, with and without me on board. There's nothing wrong with that of course, the aim of a track day is merely to enjoy yourself!

[HustleRussell]

Ahbefive said:

Maybe lots are just poorly driven on trackdays then as I have been past several in my totally road spec megane on recent track days.

'Poorly' or 'slowly'?

[Ahbefive]

Pass on the exact reason why they were so slow, possibly a confidence thing I guess but it seems odd to have such a track based car but to drive so slowly.

[MegaCat]

Ahbefive said:

Pass on the exact reason why they were so slow, possibly a confidence thing I guess but it seems odd to have such a track based car but to drive so slowly.

Exactly why people should join a single make race series! I joined the Caterham Academy after mucking around in Karts for a while (social & corporate); yes I thought I could be Senna (too early to be Lewis!). I thought I would be ok, I was sort of upper half but essentially wandering around the 8-14 space. I loved it and got some tuition and got better. Did I win, no but I led races, passed people in brilliant moves and got to share stories with people I had the greatest respect for - some were millionaires, some barely had a few pennies, but we all raced farely, raced well and had the greatest of times! Give Caterham acing a try (Graduates - not affiliated as I haven't raced for 2 years!) and you will have the most amazing time! I'd go back tomorrow if I had the time... : (

[anonymous-user]

As someone who used to race I shy away from track days. Too many people feel the need to dumb things down and confuse fun with times? If you want to measure yourself get onto a grid, otherwise save your armchair racing for your mates down the pub

[RobM77]

yonex said:

As someone who used to race I shy away from track days. Too many people feel the need to dumb things down and confuse fun with times? If you want to measure yourself get onto a grid, otherwise save your armchair racing for your mates down the pub

I recently had a break from racing and spent three years doing track days. There were a number of things that disappointed me.

Firstly, having an open car, if the weather wasn't guaranteed then I usually hired a garage, but usually it got filled with other cars, often to the point where I couldn't get in it! That would never happen on a test day. I'd go out for a fifteen minute session, come back, and there would be someone sat in my garage! Once when I was instructing, rather than driving, a guy with a Radical and a team of people filled this guy's garage and we had to walk in there and extract our stuff from amongst all their tools! The Radical owner clearly had money coming out of his ears, but he chose to not pay for a garage, just to steal one instead. Again, that just doesn't happen in the racing world.

Secondly, whilst I met a number of really nice people, I did meet an awful lot of egocentric testosterone fuelled idiots, who alternated between strutting their stuff in the pitlane and holding you up on track. In fact, on my first track day at Brands Indy my wife and I spent about five laps of Brands Indy stuck behind a guy in a Caterham who blatantly refused to let us past and drove really slowly around all the corners. Obviously overtaking in corners is not allowed, but on the straights his car was very similar to mine (CSR260 vs 2-Eleven) and we needed his co-operation to pass, but he refused. He was blue flagged for about four of those five laps, then black flagged, although before he could come in he ended up spinning off.

Thirdly, the other thing I used to get a lot of was people jumping in for passenger rides; I don't mean the usual friendly chat followed by an offer or request of a ride (that's really nice), I mean just jumping in my car whilst I was queuing up to get out on track! The previous owner wanted to sell me a single seat conversion kit, and I now understand why she had it.

Fourthly, track days just didn't seem as friendly as the racing world. Club track days were great, and I went to some brilliant ones organised by my Lotus dealer, but the general days at my local circuits had a really odd atmosphere about them that's generally not present in the racing world.

[likesachange]

Not sure how you got on with the hunt....

Worth trying a lower powered car such as a ginetta G40 on track... Speed is certainly not as important on track as something that takes a lot of balancing and is very rewarding when you perfect a corner...

I had had an Atom 300 (loved it) and currently have a 700+bhp M5. However I recently have went to a couple of track days with Track67 using there Ginetta and loved it. Pretty gutless but so much fun trying to get the best out of it. Also agree with getting a tutor.

I am booked on again for the 5th next week at Silverstone with them, they provide tuition and all data/video logging.
Spaces left too I believe....

[upsidedownmark]

RobM77 said:

recently had a break from racing and spent three years doing track days. There were a number of things that disappointed me.

Firstly, having an open car, if the weather wasn't guaranteed then I usually hired a garage, but usually it got filled with other cars, often to the point where I couldn't get in it! That would never happen on a test day. I'd go out for a fifteen minute session, come back, and there would be someone sat in my garage! Once when I was instructing, rather than driving, a guy with a Radical and a team of people filled this guy's garage and we had to walk in there and extract our stuff from amongst all their tools! The Radical owner clearly had money coming out of his ears, but he chose to not pay for a garage, just to steal one instead. Again, that just doesn't happen in the racing world.

Secondly, whilst I met a number of really nice people, I did meet an awful lot of egocentric testosterone fuelled idiots, who alternated between strutting their stuff in the pitlane and holding you up on track. In fact, on my first track day at Brands Indy my wife and I spent about five laps of Brands Indy stuck behind a guy in a Caterham who blatantly refused to let us past and drove really slowly around all the corners. Obviously overtaking in corners is not allowed, but on the straights his car was very similar to mine (CSR260 vs 2-Eleven) and we needed his co-operation to pass, but he refused. He was blue flagged for about four of those five laps, then black flagged, although before he could come in he ended up spinning off.

Thirdly, the other thing I used to get a lot of was people jumping in for passenger rides; I don't mean the usual friendly chat followed by an offer or request of a ride (that's really nice), I mean just jumping in my car whilst I was queuing up to get out on track! The previous owner wanted to sell me a single seat conversion kit, and I now understand why she had it.

Fourthly, track days just didn't seem as friendly as the racing world. Club track days were great, and I went to some brilliant ones organised by my Lotus dealer, but the general days at my local circuits had a really odd atmosphere about them that's generally not present in the racing world.

Wow.. That's some experience, not surprised you're off track days - In all the days I've done, I've never seen or heard of 1 or 3.
4 - not having raced, I can't comment, but it's not *that* friendly (not unpleasant either, mostly just everyone going about their own day).
2 - yes, it happens. Most often it's someone with a 'fast' car in terms of horsepower and an inability to corner. It's one reason to go to bigger more open circuits than brands, but you can also back off, run through the pits / whatever to make space - it isn't a race. Perhaps topically the worst offender I've encountered was a megane (?260 something?) that would pull over on the straights while accelerating away, then crawl round the corners. I won't lie, it made me mad, but I got over it

For my part, I'd love to race. I'm sure it's better. However I can't afford to dedicate the time and particularly the money - even graduates isn't cheap, assuming you manage to keep your nose clean.. I rather suspect going racing and *not* dinging something is rather hopeful.. whereas a trackday sets me back considerably less than 500 quid for a day, all in.

[RobM77]

upsidedownmark said:

RobM77 said:

recently had a break from racing and spent three years doing track days. There were a number of things that disappointed me.

Firstly, having an open car, if the weather wasn't guaranteed then I usually hired a garage, but usually it got filled with other cars, often to the point where I couldn't get in it! That would never happen on a test day. I'd go out for a fifteen minute session, come back, and there would be someone sat in my garage! Once when I was instructing, rather than driving, a guy with a Radical and a team of people filled this guy's garage and we had to walk in there and extract our stuff from amongst all their tools! The Radical owner clearly had money coming out of his ears, but he chose to not pay for a garage, just to steal one instead. Again, that just doesn't happen in the racing world.

Secondly, whilst I met a number of really nice people, I did meet an awful lot of egocentric testosterone fuelled idiots, who alternated between strutting their stuff in the pitlane and holding you up on track. In fact, on my first track day at Brands Indy my wife and I spent about five laps of Brands Indy stuck behind a guy in a Caterham who blatantly refused to let us past and drove really slowly around all the corners. Obviously overtaking in corners is not allowed, but on the straights his car was very similar to mine (CSR260 vs 2-Eleven) and we needed his co-operation to pass, but he refused. He was blue flagged for about four of those five laps, then black flagged, although before he could come in he ended up spinning off.

Thirdly, the other thing I used to get a lot of was people jumping in for passenger rides; I don't mean the usual friendly chat followed by an offer or request of a ride (that's really nice), I mean just jumping in my car whilst I was queuing up to get out on track! The previous owner wanted to sell me a single seat conversion kit, and I now understand why she had it.

Fourthly, track days just didn't seem as friendly as the racing world. Club track days were great, and I went to some brilliant ones organised by my Lotus dealer, but the general days at my local circuits had a really odd atmosphere about them that's generally not present in the racing world.

Wow.. That's some experience, not surprised you're off track days - In all the days I've done, I've never seen or heard of 1 or 3.
4 - not having raced, I can't comment, but it's not *that* friendly (not unpleasant either, mostly just everyone going about their own day).
2 - yes, it happens. Most often it's someone with a 'fast' car in terms of horsepower and an inability to corner. It's one reason to go to bigger more open circuits than brands, but you can also back off, run through the pits / whatever to make space - it isn't a race. Perhaps topically the worst offender I've encountered was a megane (?260 something?) that would pull over on the straights while accelerating away, then crawl round the corners. I won't lie, it made me mad, but I got over it

For my part, I'd love to race. I'm sure it's better. However I can't afford to dedicate the time and particularly the money - even graduates isn't cheap, assuming you manage to keep your nose clean.. I rather suspect going racing and *not* dinging something is rather hopeful.. whereas a trackday sets me back considerably less than 500 quid for a day, all in.

I must admit, I nearly didn't post as I didn't want to put anyone off track days. Racing has its downsides too, mainly based around money. No matter whether you race a Mini or a Formula One car, you will always be up against people who test, can afford new tyres, engine rebuilds etc, or simply own a better car that's running in the same class as you. You'd think that a one make series would minimise this, but nope, if anything it's worse. Setup knowledge is the other thing; people are very guarded about what they'll share, and even if you get someone's winning setup, it may feel awful to you. With next to no books on setup and no courses to attend, it's a black art, but one that's necessary for success. You also obviously need expensive testing time to develop a setup, even if you do read up no it as much as you can. Hence I only go racing on the understanding that it's not a sport, it's just a whole load of fun driving the sort of car that I race (they're not allowed on track days) and a much better social scene than track days.

[anonymous-user]

RobM77 said:

yonex said:

As someone who used to race I shy away from track days. Too many people feel the need to dumb things down and confuse fun with times? If you want to measure yourself get onto a grid, otherwise save your armchair racing for your mates down the pub

I recently had a break from racing and spent three years doing track days. There were a number of things that disappointed me.

Firstly, having an open car, if the weather wasn't guaranteed then I usually hired a garage, but usually it got filled with other cars, often to the point where I couldn't get in it! That would never happen on a test day. I'd go out for a fifteen minute session, come back, and there would be someone sat in my garage! Once when I was instructing, rather than driving, a guy with a Radical and a team of people filled this guy's garage and we had to walk in there and extract our stuff from amongst all their tools! The Radical owner clearly had money coming out of his ears, but he chose to not pay for a garage, just to steal one instead. Again, that just doesn't happen in the racing world.

Secondly, whilst I met a number of really nice people, I did meet an awful lot of egocentric testosterone fuelled idiots, who alternated between strutting their stuff in the pitlane and holding you up on track. In fact, on my first track day at Brands Indy my wife and I spent about five laps of Brands Indy stuck behind a guy in a Caterham who blatantly refused to let us past and drove really slowly around all the corners. Obviously overtaking in corners is not allowed, but on the straights his car was very similar to mine (CSR260 vs 2-Eleven) and we needed his co-operation to pass, but he refused. He was blue flagged for about four of those five laps, then black flagged, although before he could come in he ended up spinning off.

Thirdly, the other thing I used to get a lot of was people jumping in for passenger rides; I don't mean the usual friendly chat followed by an offer or request of a ride (that's really nice), I mean just jumping in my car whilst I was queuing up to get out on track! The previous owner wanted to sell me a single seat conversion kit, and I now understand why she had it.

Fourthly, track days just didn't seem as friendly as the racing world. Club track days were great, and I went to some brilliant ones organised by my Lotus dealer, but the general days at my local circuits had a really odd atmosphere about them that's generally not present in the racing world.

That does sound odd

I've never experienced any of those disappointments on a track day, especially the passengers just jumping in.

Yes, there is the odd pillock in a C63 or something blasting down the straights and blocking in the corners but they're usually put straight fairly quickly or sent home by the organisers.

[RobM77]

REALIST123 said:

That does sound odd

I've never experienced any of those disappointments on a track day, especially the passengers just jumping in.

Yes, there is the odd pillock in a C63 or something blasting down the straights and blocking in the corners but they're usually put straight fairly quickly or sent home by the organisers.

I'm surprised, but glad that my experiences are in a minority.

I agree with your second comment. Most track days seem to have a few super saloons that turn up (M3, RS4, C63 etc), lap really slowly, and then go home at lunch time I'm completely serious - happens all the time!

[CABC]

RobM77 said:

REALIST123 said:

That does sound odd

I've never experienced any of those disappointments on a track day, especially the passengers just jumping in.

Yes, there is the odd pillock in a C63 or something blasting down the straights and blocking in the corners but they're usually put straight fairly quickly or sent home by the organisers.

I'm surprised, but glad that my experiences are in a minority.

I agree with your second comment. Most track days seem to have a few super saloons that turn up (M3, RS4, C63 etc), lap really slowly, and then go home at lunch time I'm completely serious - happens all the time!

i don't mind the super saloons. it's fun chasing them down. to be fair they're often just turning up to try their road car out on track, a natural thing to do. by lunchtime they've enjoyed unfettered acceleration and realise the limitations of heavy road cars on track, and of course their tyres are probably quite worn! They've paid up but left early, all good. many are friendly enough too.
however, the race teams turn up en masse, with entourages, ignore the rules and strut around in nomex all day. I think they should be charged double.