Track Day Tyres

Author
Discussion

baronbennyt

Original Poster:

900 posts

95 months

Friday 26th January 2018
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Apologies fellow PH'ers if this topic has already featured at length but I wanted to gauge the opinion of this forum on track day tyres.

I understand there is now a large range of 'cup' tyres to choose from: brands, prices, dry/wet characteristics, ultimate grip, longevity, feel etc. but what do we agree is the market leader for fast road use but, more importantly, 5-10 track days a year? I don't trailer my track cars around so I need to be able drive considerable miles on public roads, sometimes in variable weather conditions from home to circuit, e.g. England to Germany - Nurburgring.

My Lotus 3-Eleven wears Michelin Pilot Sport Cup 2 boots and my Jaguar XKR-S GT is armed with Pirelli P Zero Corsas. I haven't driven the big cat yet but a previous toy, a Porsche GT3 RS came with the Pirellis and they were pretty good - if memory serves not a million miles behind the Michelin in terms of performance. I did try a set of Pirelli Trofeo Rs on my Cayman R and they were so sticky they felt like slicks (laugh-out-loud grip was on offer) but wore terribly quickly, were very sensitive to pressures and felt pretty lethal in the wet.

Any other tyre suggestions, or fans of those mentioned already?

JohnnyFive

86 posts

138 months

Saturday 27th January 2018
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How much driving do you do in the wet/winter?

If you're looking for something with year-round performance then the cup style tyres might not cut it.

I ran PS4S on a V8 Vantage with a couple of track days and about 10,000 road miles all year round. Plenty of grip on a dry track but did tend to go off towards the end of a 15-20 minute session on track. I will be replacing the P Zeros on my Mustang with PS4s shortly.

If you're less concerned with wet/cold conditions then the Cup 2 would seem to be just about every manufacturer's favorite high performance tyre for big boy cars.

baronbennyt

Original Poster:

900 posts

95 months

Saturday 27th January 2018
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Yes, very much my thinking too: Michelin PS4 for fast road driving and the occasional track day, and Michelin Cup 2 for the track day regular. But I'm not discounting the Pirelli Corsa or the more extreme Trofeo R. As said, if want ultimate dry grip at the expense of longevity and any wet weather traction, and can stomach the cost, then the Trofeo R is pretty untouchable.

This German track day tyre review makes interesting reading (content is in English):

http://www.tyrereviews.co.uk/Article/2017-Track-Da...


e30m3Mark

16,205 posts

172 months

Saturday 27th January 2018
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Just fitted Nankang AR-1 on my M3 so interested to see if they live up to the very good reviews. They're certainly competitively priced for a tyre that's reputedly a step up from the Toyo r888.

anonymous-user

53 months

Saturday 27th January 2018
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I really rate the Cup 2 - although they’re a “cup” tyre they’re perfectly fine in the wet. The only conditions they really don’t like is when it’s getting down towards freezing.

MrC986

3,481 posts

190 months

Saturday 27th January 2018
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I've a friend with an AC Schnizter Stage 2 M135i (about 390 bhp) & he has Yokohama AD08Rs on it - the car is used mainly at weekends and for the occasional track day & the tyres are pretty impressive whether wet or dry, & they wear well too.

towelie

269 posts

169 months

Wednesday 31st January 2018
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I’ve got ad08rs on a 230hp turbo Mx5, they are good tyres. They seem to lasting really well and have little signs of wear after 3 track days.

I’ve used federal 595 rsr for years on all my cars, they have more ultimate grip than the ad08rs, but they wear out a lot faster. They are also a few quid cheaper.

I don’t really see the point in the cup tyres, the sidewalls are too soft for track and then they aren’t as good in the wet compared to PS4’s. I just don’t see the point in having a very expensive compromised tyre

Dakkon

7,826 posts

252 months

Wednesday 31st January 2018
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towelie said:
I’ve got ad08rs on a 230hp turbo Mx5, they are good tyres. They seem to lasting really well and have little signs of wear after 3 track days.

I’ve used federal 595 rsr for years on all my cars, they have more ultimate grip than the ad08rs, but they wear out a lot faster. They are also a few quid cheaper.

I don’t really see the point in the cup tyres, the sidewalls are too soft for track and then they aren’t as good in the wet compared to PS4’s. I just don’t see the point in having a very expensive compromised tyre
I have cup 2 on my MX5, they are simply the best track tyre I have ever used, so I don't get your comments at all. The cup 2's are awesome wet or dry and I was at Bedford on Monday in the cold and wet and still a great tyre. After a number of trackdays including the 'Ring and Spa last year there is still loads of life left in them.

Have you actually tried them?


Edited by Dakkon on Wednesday 31st January 13:36

JohnnyFive

86 posts

138 months

Wednesday 31st January 2018
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Also worth bearing in mind that one tyre model might be 'best' on something that's sub-1000kg but may be significantly different in a size that suits a car nearing two tonnes.

I'm not aware of any heavy performance cars that ship on federals, yokohamas or toyos from the factory - but that could be because the likes of michelin and pirelli can afford to supply tyres to OEMs cheaper for marketing purposes.

towelie

269 posts

169 months

Thursday 1st February 2018
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Dakkon said:
I have cup 2 on my MX5, they are simply the best track tyre I have ever used, so I don't get your comments at all. The cup 2's are awesome wet or dry and I was at Bedford on Monday in the cold and wet and still a great tyre. After a number of trackdays including the 'Ring and Spa last year there is still loads of life left in them.

Have you actually tried them?


Edited by Dakkon on Wednesday 31st January 13:36
To be fair, I’ve only used the cup tyres on a megane 275 trophy the sidewalls were down to canvas after one track day.

They have really soft side walls compared to more track orientated tyres. I can see how you might get away with it on a light car like an mx5, but even using the federal I have to really look after the sidewall.

Tyre usage on track days is highly dependent on how hard you push the tyres, driver style, alignment and body roll. My cars get used very hard on track.

For the price difference cup tyres a waste of money IMO.

Todd Bonzalez

2,552 posts

161 months

Tuesday 6th February 2018
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Nankang AR1s are the absolute boys at the mo when it comes to M3 type stuff.
Outlapped Direzza 03Gs, R888Rs etc on a cup car we tried them on.

Garybee

452 posts

165 months

Tuesday 6th February 2018
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I think most people miss the point with track day tyres. I would take a durable tyre that wears well over something soft with stacks of grip. You'll have more fun, spend less money and be less likely to cause oil starvation issues. Lap times are meaningless on a track day.

Nickjd

207 posts

205 months

Wednesday 28th February 2018
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You realise that on the average Trackday you could be on track for easily 2.5 hours which would pretty much be a half a test day, qualifying and 3 races, so a whole race meeting. Saying 5 to 10 Trackdays means you need some pretty hard tyres. The fastest tyres are never going to give you this sort of life.

Mr MXT

7,691 posts

282 months

Wednesday 28th February 2018
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Todd Bonzalez said:
Nankang AR1s are the absolute boys at the mo when it comes to M3 type stuff.
Outlapped Direzza 03Gs, R888Rs etc on a cup car we tried them on.
just put a set on my Westfield. Hopefully as good on something lighter.

andy97

4,691 posts

221 months

Wednesday 18th April 2018
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Mr MXT said:
Todd Bonzalez said:
Nankang AR1s are the absolute boys at the mo when it comes to M3 type stuff.
Outlapped Direzza 03Gs, R888Rs etc on a cup car we tried them on.
just put a set on my Westfield. Hopefully as good on something lighter.
Would be good to get comparative feedback from someone with experience of Yoko 48s, Toyo 888s and/ or Avon ZZR to see how they compare with the AR1.

I raced a Caterham on the AR1 at Snetterton last weekend but it was my first time racing that type of car and so have no experience to compare tyre performance with.

Tyres felt good but what do I know?

The AR1 seems to be heavier than the Yoko 48 and Toyo 888.

CrashBang

225 posts

154 months

Thursday 19th April 2018
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For a multi-purpose street & track, wet and dry tyre that has a decent life I think that Yoko AD08R are hard to beat.

In terms of reference points

Trofeo R are about as good as it gets from an out and out grip perspective, but as you have stated they are soft, thus there is a strong possibility of killing them on a trackday and then not having anything to drive home on.

Cup2 quicker than Yoko AD08R in the dry, albeit marginally, I would say on a par if not a little weaker than the Yoko in the wet. - Wear a lot quicker than the AD08R.

No experience of the others mentioned.

e30m3Mark

16,205 posts

172 months

Thursday 19th April 2018
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Just been out for a few miles on the AR-1 on a genuinely warm day and they're so much better than the 888's I had been running previously. In fact, I think they're the grippiest road legal tyre I've ever used.

Franksy

137 posts

129 months

Thursday 19th April 2018
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Where are you guys buying your AR-1's?

e30m3Mark

16,205 posts

172 months

Friday 20th April 2018
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Franksy said:
Where are you guys buying your AR-1's?
Got mine directly from Nankang UK. I did have to wait a week for stocks to be replenished though.

Mr MXT

7,691 posts

282 months

Friday 20th April 2018
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Got mine from Demon Tweeks - didn’t realise you could buy them direct!