Opinions... Trackday, was I treated fairly?
Discussion
Kellerman said:
The whole point of a trackday is to learn the handling of your car, to push it harder than you do on the road. Why would you turn up and drive slowly? Imagine being that risk-averse! 
I'm putting this one down to marshalling. Blue flagging would have solved all of this.
As would an improvement in your attitude & driving standards. You do know you can't win a track day don't you.I'm putting this one down to marshalling. Blue flagging would have solved all of this.
Kellerman said:
Nevermind.
I won't get any joy discussing this with risk-averse killjoys.
Track days also aren't about putting people at risk, which you clearly don't have an issue with!I won't get any joy discussing this with risk-averse killjoys.
Risk comes (IMO) from being out of control, being unaware of your surroundings and by not doing the easy thing and letting people through.
I was well within my driving limits. I have driven much, much quicker in normal cars and quicker still in cars with power. This was absolutely dull by comparison.
I'd expect people turning up in track-focused cars to at least be able to use their mirrors and move over, or drive quicker than a diesel estate. Is that too much to ask?
I was well within my driving limits. I have driven much, much quicker in normal cars and quicker still in cars with power. This was absolutely dull by comparison.
I'd expect people turning up in track-focused cars to at least be able to use their mirrors and move over, or drive quicker than a diesel estate. Is that too much to ask?
Blue flags 
Guy thinks he’s Sebastian Vettel.
Guy thinks he’s Sebastian Vettel.
Kellerman said:
Nevermind.
I won't get any joy discussing this with risk-averse killjoys.
What’s ‘risk’ got to do with anything? If you were driving around other cars in a way which was ‘risky’ by your own admission then I’m afraid it is probably you who is the dick (I haven’t watched the video). I won't get any joy discussing this with risk-averse killjoys.
Henz said:
You overtook a lot of those cars in or shortly after corners as they were held up by traffic but respecting the track day rules. Doesn't mean you were faster than them and if they then caught you up once they'd cleared the traffic then let them back through.
A lot of drivers, with a total lack of awareness - of self and other drivers - make this mistake. Not assessing the 'why' you have arrived behind cars and what they are all doing and assuming you can barge through, rather than join the queue waiting to safely pass slower car(s).I’m not going to pile in on the OP but speaking as someone with very limited trackday experience (I think I have done three in total), it looks to be more about etiquette than anything else - a couple of the overtakes in the short right/left section looked a touch sketchy and probably took the other driver(s) by surprise.
As you said in the video ‘safety first’ - of course you want to have some fun and go fast but everyone wants to be able to drive home at the end of the day
As you said in the video ‘safety first’ - of course you want to have some fun and go fast but everyone wants to be able to drive home at the end of the day
You’ve asked for opinions but you aren’t willing to accept other peoples views. I agree with the others, you’re treating it like you’re in a race which you aren’t. You’re overtaking on the entry to corners which is way too aggressive for what you’re doing. Just calm down and you’d be fine.
You’re current mindset of I’m right and everyone else is wrong is only going to get you kicked off. It doesn’t matter whether you think you are right as it’s the TDO’s choice whether you stay on track. Certainly there’s many people here who think your driving wasn’t at the high standard you think it was.
I think the TDO was pretty fair, no real b
king just a quick chat.
You’re current mindset of I’m right and everyone else is wrong is only going to get you kicked off. It doesn’t matter whether you think you are right as it’s the TDO’s choice whether you stay on track. Certainly there’s many people here who think your driving wasn’t at the high standard you think it was.
I think the TDO was pretty fair, no real b
king just a quick chat.pincher said:
Would you say he was wrong about what he said immediately before that?
Looking back at the session and his comments, it doesn't seem like he knew what was going on. The facts of the situation eluded him somewhat. So I'd treat all his comments with a bit of skepticism based purely on that.That aside, yes, some people will have the opinion my driving is aggressive and they are entitled to that opinion.
Just look at the section 9.55 onwards. It is truly awful behaviour on a track day.
You bully the Porsche - there is absolutely no need to late brake yourself right up his bum in the first corner, he's likely going to be fast in that car and is sat at the back of a train of 4 cars waiting for a safe place to pass. Give him space.
You then pass him on the next corner (against the rules) - you acknowledge this by saying "that was a straght mate" which you only said because you knew it wasn't. Clearly too aggressive here.
You then try and go three abreast on a short straight and pass the black car right in the middle of a corner. !!
100% terrible driving on a trackday and you need to have a good hard look at yourself if you think that this is what trackdays are about - they are not.
If I was the TDO - I would have had the same word that they did to you and if it didn't change, I'd have no hestiation in sending you home for the day as you don't want somebody putting others at risk, which is what you are doing in the above 30 seconds of video.
When on a trackday, you need to remember it's not a race, and you need to be thinking that just because a car looks like it should be fast, it doesn't mean that it is going to be - It's an amateur day and many people may be there for the first time in a car they can't afford to crash.
My own approach is to stay away from following people too closely in a corner - As you don't want somebody in front of you to panic, lift off, and spin when you are 1m off their rear bumper. This will only end badly for everyone.
Also, if I can see traffic ahead like this, I tend to drop back to make space. You are better off dropping back and finding a nice gap and working on your lines through the corners (which looking at the rest of the video, you need to spend more time on, because they are not very good)
You bully the Porsche - there is absolutely no need to late brake yourself right up his bum in the first corner, he's likely going to be fast in that car and is sat at the back of a train of 4 cars waiting for a safe place to pass. Give him space.
You then pass him on the next corner (against the rules) - you acknowledge this by saying "that was a straght mate" which you only said because you knew it wasn't. Clearly too aggressive here.
You then try and go three abreast on a short straight and pass the black car right in the middle of a corner. !!
100% terrible driving on a trackday and you need to have a good hard look at yourself if you think that this is what trackdays are about - they are not.
If I was the TDO - I would have had the same word that they did to you and if it didn't change, I'd have no hestiation in sending you home for the day as you don't want somebody putting others at risk, which is what you are doing in the above 30 seconds of video.
When on a trackday, you need to remember it's not a race, and you need to be thinking that just because a car looks like it should be fast, it doesn't mean that it is going to be - It's an amateur day and many people may be there for the first time in a car they can't afford to crash.
My own approach is to stay away from following people too closely in a corner - As you don't want somebody in front of you to panic, lift off, and spin when you are 1m off their rear bumper. This will only end badly for everyone.
Also, if I can see traffic ahead like this, I tend to drop back to make space. You are better off dropping back and finding a nice gap and working on your lines through the corners (which looking at the rest of the video, you need to spend more time on, because they are not very good)
This sort of thing, in part, explains why owners of more exotic and expensive stuff like Ferraris and Lamborghinis are reluctant to go one track. The potential of some 'have a go' in a cheaper car that wants to get at least right up behind them, if not past.
Buying an expensive car does not make you a driving god, but they still have a right to track space. everyone following the rules in both letter and spirit does; whether you're in a stbox, a homemade track special, or a car worth seven figures.
Buying an expensive car does not make you a driving god, but they still have a right to track space. everyone following the rules in both letter and spirit does; whether you're in a s
tbox, a homemade track special, or a car worth seven figures.Kellerman said:
Thanks for that.
Few points:
I am an amateur. I don't pretend otherwise.
I have an injury, I can't hold the wheel as I'd like to. And don't particularly care how it "looks", so long as I'm in control of the car.
I wasn't fast. It's an A4 diesel for christs sake. Other people were just rather oddly deciding to drive even slower than me.
There was no marshall in the video, that was a TDO. And he was objectively wrong about much of what he said so I won't pay too much attention to it. I also think you're similarly out of your depth (no offence).
Remember I wrote my post after you deleted it.Few points:
I am an amateur. I don't pretend otherwise.
I have an injury, I can't hold the wheel as I'd like to. And don't particularly care how it "looks", so long as I'm in control of the car.
I wasn't fast. It's an A4 diesel for christs sake. Other people were just rather oddly deciding to drive even slower than me.
There was no marshall in the video, that was a TDO. And he was objectively wrong about much of what he said so I won't pay too much attention to it. I also think you're similarly out of your depth (no offence).
Take the advice we are all telling you and sort it out before you write your car off and possibly someone else’s… or worse.
I think the main problem is you think you are racing, as backed up by your video title. You aren't. Do a race day experience if you want that, alternatively have a think about what track days really are about and relax more and enjoy the experience. It comes across you are trying to prove you are better than everyone else, when the reality is they aren't even trying to race you, and when they have better/more capable cars maybe they don't want to wreck them and are just having fun.
'battle' it is not.
'battle' it is not.
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