TUPE Regulations expert
Discussion
zaphod42 said:
As an employee, call the ACAS helpline. They will be able to help, and it is free.
When I was TUPEd a couple of years ago I called ACAS and TBH they were worse than useless, spoke to a few people there and I ended up telling them the TUPE regs, got the impression they were just phone tarts in a call centre.I agree they are not a free legal helpline. But they can explain some of the basic elements in non-legal terms.
You experience may vary, but they are not a bad place for advice - it can do little harm to have a range of advice.
I know a number of people that have found them to be very good.
OP - what is the issue?
You experience may vary, but they are not a bad place for advice - it can do little harm to have a range of advice.
I know a number of people that have found them to be very good.
OP - what is the issue?
rampz said:
Hi all,
Any of you guys understand and can advise on TUPE regulations. I have a question as I am a transferring employee and am deeply worried about my job. Please contact me directly so I can explain my situation and my question.
Thanks
Welfare to work sector by any chance? Any of you guys understand and can advise on TUPE regulations. I have a question as I am a transferring employee and am deeply worried about my job. Please contact me directly so I can explain my situation and my question.
Thanks
What's the issue? I'm no employment law expert but am a general manager currently handling oversight of a large "in sourcing" TUPE process and have recently spent a fair bit of time around employment law lawyers and HR TUPE experts so may have some insight. If you don't want to post issue publicly then PM me and if I know I'll answer, or ask my TUPE HR guru for you tomorrow.
I was TUPE transferred over along with a number of colleagues over a year ago. AFAIK all your contract rights are carried over, salary, holidays, hours, sick pay etc. The only area you may get hit is pensions. Again to my knowledge the new company does not have to offer you a pension deal exactly as you had previously. I was lucky as my new company honoured even the very good pension scheme. So far no changes to any of my T&C so TUPE isnt necessarily anything to fear.
It depends if your pay rates are more than they pay their own employees,as ours are. We were TUPEd from Public to private sector so they have to honour our Final Salary pension scheme (local government act 2003)so they are not happy with that even though they were obviously aware it was the case. They have been trying to turn the screw on us so we resign but its not going to happen.
OK this is my situation.
I work in IT as a security expert. Before this role, I was looking after Treasury systems.
Part of my company is being bought, my security role is for the part that is being sold, therefore I will be TUPE'd over. Problem is that I have been asked to stop my security role for the meantime, and deliver Treasury systems for the buyer because I am the only transferring employee who knows how to do this.
At a high level:
My official job is JOB:A, but I am asked to do TASK:A which will take up 100% of my time. TASK:A is unrelated to JOB:A (I am the only person who can deliver TASK:A in the timeframe before close). The task in question will continue into my employment with the buyer post Day 1 (as I will be primary support for the Treasury applications I have just delivered), however officially I have been TUPE’d because of JOB:A. What happens if I don’t get to do my JOB:A at the buying company and maybe never get JOB:A back, but continue doing TASK:A which effectively becomes JOB:B given its taking up all my time. Does the TUPE regulations allow this and if so under what circumstances. Remember I would not be doing this TASK A if there was no sale. All i want to do is JOB A.
I work in IT as a security expert. Before this role, I was looking after Treasury systems.
Part of my company is being bought, my security role is for the part that is being sold, therefore I will be TUPE'd over. Problem is that I have been asked to stop my security role for the meantime, and deliver Treasury systems for the buyer because I am the only transferring employee who knows how to do this.
At a high level:
My official job is JOB:A, but I am asked to do TASK:A which will take up 100% of my time. TASK:A is unrelated to JOB:A (I am the only person who can deliver TASK:A in the timeframe before close). The task in question will continue into my employment with the buyer post Day 1 (as I will be primary support for the Treasury applications I have just delivered), however officially I have been TUPE’d because of JOB:A. What happens if I don’t get to do my JOB:A at the buying company and maybe never get JOB:A back, but continue doing TASK:A which effectively becomes JOB:B given its taking up all my time. Does the TUPE regulations allow this and if so under what circumstances. Remember I would not be doing this TASK A if there was no sale. All i want to do is JOB A.
If your employment transfers to the transferee you become an employee of the transferee. Your terms and conditions of employment will be preserved (I leave aside presently irrelevant issues of pension) . I am not quite sure for which of the employers you are being asked to carry out a particular task, but once you have transferred you will be working for the transferee. You could be seconded to do some work for the transferor, if that's what the parties want. I am not quite sure what your perceived problem is.
Breadvan73 said:
If your employment transfers to the transferee you become an employee of the transferee. Your terms and conditions of employment will be preserved (I leave aside presently irrelevant issues of pension) . I am not quite sure for which of the employers you are being asked to carry out a particular task, but once you have transferred you will be working for the transferee. You could be seconded to do some work for the transferor, if that's what the parties want. I am not quite sure what your perceived problem is.
Suspect the problem is that at some point previously, the OP has been a Treasury systems bod, but has managed to claw his way into the IT Security gig, breathing a huge sigh of relief.Now along comes the TUPE stuff, and all of a sudden he is the only person around with Treasury systems experience. He's been told that all of his time will be Treasury based, and understandably has the grumps.
You can object to being transferred, but if the transferor has no job for you that will end your employment, and you won't be treated as dismissed by reason of the transfer. Is this a question of assignment to a particular part of the undertaking? Do you want to argue that you are being incorrectly assigned to the transferring part, and should stay with the transferor?
(Techy note: This is known in employment law-speak as a Botzen issue, because of the leading Eurocase on the issue, Botzen v Rotterdamsche Droogdok Maatschappij BV [1985] ECR 519).
(Techy note: This is known in employment law-speak as a Botzen issue, because of the leading Eurocase on the issue, Botzen v Rotterdamsche Droogdok Maatschappij BV [1985] ECR 519).
Edited by Breadvan73 on Friday 1st July 22:27
Are directors of a company losing a contract eligible for TUPE to the contract winning company. (Assume their company only had the one contract)
I thought I read somewhere that if the director was also a 50% shareholder that may prevent the transfer?
What about t'other directors? (if the above is indeed true)
Assume they all have contracts of employment
(I know, complicated subject, no clear cut answer etc...
, but based on the above simple facts)
Thanking you
I thought I read somewhere that if the director was also a 50% shareholder that may prevent the transfer?
What about t'other directors? (if the above is indeed true)
Assume they all have contracts of employment
(I know, complicated subject, no clear cut answer etc...
, but based on the above simple facts)Thanking you
If this is an academic or hypothetical question, I don't do academic or hypothetical. If it is a real question about a real business situation, directors may be above the pay grade for getting freebies from lawyers, and, quite apart from that, they may wish to protect themselves by obtaining insured advice rather than internet car chat advice. If the advice is for one of the employers in the case, the above may apply with extra knobs on.
If the organisations are NGOs, charities, and so on, or the workers in question are downtrodden victims of the Iron Heel, freebies may be available.
If the organisations are NGOs, charities, and so on, or the workers in question are downtrodden victims of the Iron Heel, freebies may be available.
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