Career change to law, realistic?
Discussion
VRSphil said:
98elise said:
It always surprises me how little a lawyer earns (at least initially). It's one of those jobs you expect to pay well from the off.
I work in IT and you can earn a good wage without years of training.
I did look in to working in IT at great length when I was a bit younger. I sought some 'professional' careers advice on it from connexions because I didn't know anyone in IT. They said either do computing/computer science at uni and find a grad trainee job in a specific field, or do some smaller qualifications and get a job on a support desk and work up. I work in IT and you can earn a good wage without years of training.
Having browsed the IT career threads on here out of curiosity, it seems like there are some conflicting opinions. Some people say they can't break out of the low down poorly paid jobs, some say you need lots of qualifications, others don't. It leaves me a bit confused really. But it's definitely something I would enjoy learning, I was always messing about fixing the household computers when I was a kid but all that knowledge has drained away with time as I don't have to use a PC for work, so this would be starting very much from scratch!
Law degree completed and I found that the prospect of working in a high street law firm just didn't appeal so I remained in IT. I'm now the IT manager for a small-ish law firm and am happy as a pig in s
t.What surprised me, and put me off the law route was the earnings potential in the geographical area I'm in. Fee earners within high street law firms struggle to meet targets, and even if they do, their earnings barely match the IT technicians / developers I have working for me.
A head of a legal department where I work earns roughly the same as I do, but I wouldn't want to swap their stress and workload for mine!
Truffles said:
Not many people transition to patent attorney after a job elsewhere. I can only think of two to my personal knowledge (and I am in the profession).
The profession is minute compared to solicitors and barristers, around 200 in the UK.
I think you mean 2000 of us!The profession is minute compared to solicitors and barristers, around 200 in the UK.
In my experience there is a greater proportion of chemists and bio-chemists that have done something else prior to going into the profession. In-house departments are more likely to have people there who have been around the block prior to switching careers, a lot of my colleagues have done this (I'm in aerospace).
StuTheGrouch said:
Bit of a hijack, sorry.
BV- is this equally true for a career change to become a patent attorney? I work in the physical sciences, have a PhD and am good at understanding complex concepts. Such a switch would appeal in the future; I'm early 30s and often feel the need for a new challenge.
If I was still in private practice and was looking to recruit a trainee I'd be much more attracted to a candidate with both professional and life experience. BV- is this equally true for a career change to become a patent attorney? I work in the physical sciences, have a PhD and am good at understanding complex concepts. Such a switch would appeal in the future; I'm early 30s and often feel the need for a new challenge.
I think what would make a candidate stand out is firstly an ability to identify the aspects of those complex concepts which makes them special compared to what has gone before. They would then need to be able to succinctly describe and explain those aspects to a person skilled in the art (in reality, an examiner at the Patent Office), and put together structured and logical arguments in support of why a patent should be granted.
The only issue with being in your early 30s is that the salary as a trainee will be quite low compared to what I suspect you will have achieved by now.
Feel free to ask if you have any more questions - either that or post a new thread and I'm sure the other patent attorneys on here (truffles, patently, I'm sure there's probably more lurking, most of us like fast cars) could chime in.
lostmotel said:
I think you mean 2000 of us!
In my experience there is a greater proportion of chemists and bio-chemists that have done something else prior to going into the profession. In-house departments are more likely to have people there who have been around the block prior to switching careers, a lot of my colleagues have done this (I'm in aerospace).
I am interested to know more about becoming a patent attorney, however I went to an ex-polytechnic university and only managed a 2:1 MPharm degree, do I even stand a chance?In my experience there is a greater proportion of chemists and bio-chemists that have done something else prior to going into the profession. In-house departments are more likely to have people there who have been around the block prior to switching careers, a lot of my colleagues have done this (I'm in aerospace).
Plus it's one of only a few jobs that's probably brexit-proof.Breadvan72 said:
Munich fun, Hague less so?
All depends on your point of view really. The Hague has excellent links back to the UK. Germany and Belgium are an hour away by car, France only a little further. Great international food and Belgian beers. Very international.Munich is very Bavarian. Great for mountains but a bit land-locked for my taste. Lots of silly Germanic rules like no mowing the lawn or washing your car on a Sunday. Not much of an international feeling to the place.
I prefer the Hague to Munich as a place to live but Munich is great to visit. Then again, I live in Delft which is nicer than the Hague and only 5km from work.
98elise said:
It always surprises me how little a lawyer earns (at least initially). It's one of those jobs you expect to pay well from the off.
I work in IT and you can earn a good wage without years of training.
I thought the same re: lawyer salaries (for the most part) - I too work in IT, I got an apprenticeship with the Civil Service in IT on decent money, especially considering I had no prior experience. Luckily my training was oriented around Linux System Administration, which right now (and then) was the best paying OS to administer in IT. I got put on a project team for the remaining 18 months and again, luckily landed in an agile team with a bunch of contractors who were DevOps Engineers (massive buzz word of the IT world at the moment), essentially picked up everything from the best in the business who are BIG earners to add.I work in IT and you can earn a good wage without years of training.
I'm now 22 and I'm earning a nice salary (double my age and minus a bit), with amazing benefits with no real qualifications (HNC equivalent from my apprenticeship but it hasn't helped me get a job in any way shape or form, it's all down to be able to do stuff in IT).
Breadvan72 said:
Whatever the stress levels and expectations there is a massive difference in earnings of lawyers with firms like Allen & Overy and those in the High Streets.Surely young uni leavers are fully aware of what MC firms will demand of them, as they go through the rigorous selection process and so on? The carrot is the gold plated career and middle class lifestyle for evermore if you make it beyond 2 or 3 PQE. If you enter the Dragon's Den and expect endless cushions and health and safety assessments, you're maybe not thinking things through...
Breadvan72 said:
I am not sure that the applicants are quite aware of how hard they will have to work. The firms show them all the good bits and do not tell them it's a Faustian bargain. The drop out rate is quite striking, I gather.
I owned and ran a legal recruitment business. From our point of view the drop out rate was good. We even picked up some business when lawyers died young and unexpectedly, possibly due to stress / overwork.Did the LPC here, but never took it further it did open unexpected "doors" though and gave me experience in other areas.
It is stupidly competitive and yes earning potential is on average outside London not great for solicitors. Flipside it does mean when dealing with more persona legal matters you can cut the BS and get straight to the heart of things (currently buying a house in our case).
Probably a few others will agree also the "accidental types" are very common (or at least in my experience) and the most dangerous.
It is stupidly competitive and yes earning potential is on average outside London not great for solicitors. Flipside it does mean when dealing with more persona legal matters you can cut the BS and get straight to the heart of things (currently buying a house in our case).
Probably a few others will agree also the "accidental types" are very common (or at least in my experience) and the most dangerous.
Gassing Station | Jobs & Employment Matters | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff