Job for (soon to be?) ex cop

Author
Discussion

LeadFarmer

7,411 posts

130 months

Saturday 2nd April 2022
quotequote all
Rushjob said:
A simple bit of flexibility would have kept a cop with 27 years in, but that would be the sensible way of retaining very experienced and well trained staff.
If there is one thing the police are very very good at, and excel at beyond anything else, it's losing experienced people without any thought of retention or replacement.

Edited by LeadFarmer on Saturday 2nd April 17:32

carreauchompeur

17,830 posts

203 months

Saturday 2nd April 2022
quotequote all
LeadFarmer said:
If there is one thing the police are very very good at, and excel at beyond anything else, it's losing experienced people without any thought of retention or replacement.
And alienating their existing experienced staff with increasingly ‘deckchairs on the Titanic’ measures like using data quality, NCALT package completion and victim updates as key performance indicators for a proactive department.

Painful

LeadFarmer

7,411 posts

130 months

Sunday 3rd April 2022
quotequote all
carreauchompeur said:
And alienating their existing experienced staff with increasingly ‘deckchairs on the Titanic’ measures like using data quality, NCALT package completion and victim updates as key performance indicators for a proactive department.
I agree, and I think the HMIC have a lot to answer for with their inspections. Force priorities now seem focussed on getting the best inspection outcome for 'improvement' ratings, so more effort goes into recording data, accuracy of data, scrutinising reports to ensure certain fields are populated, victim updates etc.

New office based departments are formed so that these requirements are achieved and the force HMIC rating gets lifted, when all the victim really wants is for the cops to catch the culprit. But due to these internal procedures, it can take nearly a week from the victim reporting a crime to the report getting passed to a cop to look into.

Maybe the answer is for cops to simply accept how things are now, and blinker themselves to how it should be, as there's nothing they can do about it.

As for the OP's question, I have a few mates who joined the police but left and found work for in jobs that suit their previous policing experience. One works for the council in trading standards, investigating things like small independent shops selling counterfeit cigarettes etc. They do a sample purchase, execute a search warrant and create the prosecution file etc, only moving onto the next report when their current investigation is complete, and now work from home!! A couple of others work for the immigration service, though I'm not sure what their roles involve.

Edited by LeadFarmer on Sunday 3rd April 09:49

Maximus Decimus Meridius

1,230 posts

40 months

Monday 4th April 2022
quotequote all
Rushjob said:
1 month later having got a decent job working 4 days a week he puts his ticket in. A simple bit of flexibility would have kept a cop with 27 years in, but that would be the sensible way of retaining very experienced and well trained staff.
As someone posted earlier won't that mean a big (very big) hit to your brother's pension lump sum ?
If he served less than 30 years then the lump sum is calculated very differently ?

Rushjob

1,843 posts

257 months

Monday 4th April 2022
quotequote all
Maximus Decimus Meridius said:
As someone posted earlier won't that mean a big (very big) hit to your brother's pension lump sum ?
If he served less than 30 years then the lump sum is calculated very differently ?
It will have a noticeable effect, but having reviewed the figures, he and my SIL are willing to take the hit rather than the impact that it was having on his health. Knowing what the negative aspects of the job did to my health in my last few years, I really cannot blame him. Money really isn't everything and on reflection I wish I'd done the same....

Maximus Decimus Meridius

1,230 posts

40 months

Monday 4th April 2022
quotequote all
Rushjob said:
Maximus Decimus Meridius said:
As someone posted earlier won't that mean a big (very big) hit to your brother's pension lump sum ?
If he served less than 30 years then the lump sum is calculated very differently ?
It will have a noticeable effect, but having reviewed the figures, he and my SIL are willing to take the hit rather than the impact that it was having on his health. Knowing what the negative aspects of the job did to my health in my last few years, I really cannot blame him. Money really isn't everything and on reflection I wish I'd done the same....
Thank you for your reply. I agree that nothing is more important than your health.

Chicken Chaser

7,744 posts

223 months

Monday 4th April 2022
quotequote all
Rushjob said:
It will have a noticeable effect, but having reviewed the figures, he and my SIL are willing to take the hit rather than the impact that it was having on his health. Knowing what the negative aspects of the job did to my health in my last few years, I really cannot blame him. Money really isn't everything and on reflection I wish I'd done the same....
This in a nutshell. The money unfortunately is the dangled carrot and after so many years looking at the worst parts or society, you want to get the end reward. I understand that there will be cops with 25 years in looking to get those last few years over the line, but when you've done half or less of your service then I can't see the point in throwing half of your working life away in a job you hate for a pension that you might not reach or it might be changed before you get there.

The retention comment is another thing. I worked in a specialist post where to retrain a new incoming member of staff would take £thousands and 12 months to be competent, and a couple of years for proficient. There were some mechanisms in place which they could have used to make the lives of the highly experienced team a bit more palatable after some big changes but the management refused. In contrast to training new staff it was a drop in the ocean but for whatever reason they wouldn't run with it. As a result they lost 50% of their team in a matter of months and the succession and retention plan was non existent. The tax payer will pay for that.

LeadFarmer

7,411 posts

130 months

Monday 4th April 2022
quotequote all
Apparently retiring cops have, for decades, being telling new starters that the 'job's f***ed'.

Over their 30 yrs they will have seen changes for the worst. But I do believe that the last 10 yrs has seen negative changes of such magnitude that they dwarf anything that came before them. The last big impact that must have been PACE in 1984 which drip fed into policing over the following years. That must have been a big one, but maybe also brought some positive changes i.e less pressure from above to get prisoners charged etc? The Sheehy report would perhaps be another, which I think removed housing allowance?

But the current moral of rank & file officers must be at its absolute lowest, ever. The response cop world has seen a massive increase in demands placed on such dwindling numbers of cops, and the disbanding of departments due to spending cuts. Add to this the recent changes to their pensions and the outcome is experienced cops throwing the towel in as they have just had enough, and with many new cops not staying long either. This is evidenced by the fact that some forces have introduced mental health apps for cops to download and use when things get too bad for them (Backup Buddy etc)

Job's most certainly f***ed smile


Edited by LeadFarmer on Monday 4th April 20:58

carreauchompeur

17,830 posts

203 months

Monday 4th April 2022
quotequote all
I agree. We are at the stage where we need some major Royal Commission on Policing, with very radical changes encompassing the responsibilities of other agencies.

Mental health response units? Paramedic and AHMPS going directly to people in crisis. It’d be a start.

Trendsetter

Original Poster:

92 posts

64 months

Wednesday 22nd June 2022
quotequote all
I do like to try and keep this thread updated. I think its interesting capturing a snapshot of how things were at a particular time and seeing it later.

My first applications are now away and I have an interview lined up. All for different things I guess but the important thing for me is work life balance rather than the job itself.

There have been some interesting points made so far, especially from people with more service than me. All I can say is that my time in the job is drawing to a close and I'll be off as soon as I've gotten a suitable offer of alternative employment

Chicken Chaser

7,744 posts

223 months

Wednesday 22nd June 2022
quotequote all
Trendsetter said:
I do like to try and keep this thread updated. I think its interesting capturing a snapshot of how things were at a particular time and seeing it later.

My first applications are now away and I have an interview lined up. All for different things I guess but the important thing for me is work life balance rather than the job itself.

There have been some interesting points made so far, especially from people with more service than me. All I can say is that my time in the job is drawing to a close and I'll be off as soon as I've gotten a suitable offer of alternative employment
Well done for doing something about it. Too many are unsettled and moan about it but won't actively look outside of the job. Keep us updated

Derek Smith

45,514 posts

247 months

Thursday 23rd June 2022
quotequote all
I was approached by a well-known credit card company when I'd got about15 years in the Job. I'd done a little bit of work on a case that went through their investigation branch, which required a submission from me - CID being too busy to bother. Next thing I knew, I was asked to attend a hotel for a chat.

Three of us turned up; two DCs who were quality and me, a unformed sergeant. I expected some tough questioning, and had prepared, but I discovered they were selling something; jobs in their investigation branch. They'd prepared the main selling point just for me; equivalence in pension entitlement. It was a bit involved, but, in essence, if I didn't get promoted in their job, I'd get the same pension with just two extra years working for them. There were all sorts of ways for me to enhance pension, or at least lump sum, entitlements.

It was clear that they wanted police officers, with more or less unblemished records, a bit of experience, and tested competence.

Banks, post office, large companies, etc, all have investigation branches. I had a no worsening promise for income, which included overtime (which they didn't pay) which would be largely eroded after a couple of years.

The other two chaps accepted the offers. I spoke with one after I'd retired and he hadn't and he quite enjoyed the role. Travel wasn't as good as he thought. Going to America was exciting in anticipation, but in the evenings he was expected to have working dinners. It was a bit 'samey' wherever he went. Fewer hours than I was working at the time of my retirement.

LosingGrip

7,806 posts

158 months

Tuesday 14th March 2023
quotequote all
OP how are you getting on?

I'm having thoughts of finding something else. I love the job. Still job pissed. On traffic which was always my goal. Very lucky to have got there after three years in the job. I feel valued by the team/department/supervisors. Getting some good courses.

Why do I want to leave? The money. I knew what it was when I joined, but I was living with my parents and then partner. I'm now single (and back with parents) and in the process of getting my own place. Its going to be a real struggle for a couple of years until I'm top whack and just half looking at the moment. I'll most likely stay as I do love the job but its nice to see what there is out there.

So, what jobs for someone with a few GCSE's, a college diploma in media studies.

Chicken Chaser

7,744 posts

223 months

Tuesday 14th March 2023
quotequote all
LosingGrip said:
OP how are you getting on?

I'm having thoughts of finding something else. I love the job. Still job pissed. On traffic which was always my goal. Very lucky to have got there after three years in the job. I feel valued by the team/department/supervisors. Getting some good courses.

Why do I want to leave? The money. I knew what it was when I joined, but I was living with my parents and then partner. I'm now single (and back with parents) and in the process of getting my own place. Its going to be a real struggle for a couple of years until I'm top whack and just half looking at the moment. I'll most likely stay as I do love the job but its nice to see what there is out there.

So, what jobs for someone with a few GCSE's, a college diploma in media studies.
Train driving? A lot of the non technical skills which police use every day are well aligned for the rail industry. Good pensions, better money, less hours, shift work, don't have to take the job and all the st you deal with home. I know you say you love traffic but dealing with fatals does have its impact over many years. I've seen it with my own eyes and I've seen colleagues who have given years to it struggle as the worst jobs never leave you.


LosingGrip

7,806 posts

158 months

Wednesday 15th March 2023
quotequote all
Chicken Chaser said:
Train driving? A lot of the non technical skills which police use every day are well aligned for the rail industry. Good pensions, better money, less hours, shift work, don't have to take the job and all the st you deal with home. I know you say you love traffic but dealing with fatals does have its impact over many years. I've seen it with my own eyes and I've seen colleagues who have given years to it struggle as the worst jobs never leave you.
I've looked at train driving, but there aren't any bases nearby (I think most want you to be within an hour which I'm not) and I wouldn't want to move that far away. But if there is somewhere close I'd jump at it!

I've only been on traffic for a year, and been lucky with the jobs I've been to fatal wise. I'm also very good at dealing leaving work at work and leave the emotional stuff there. Plus if it gets too much, I can move departments. Loads that I want to do within the police over the next 27 years.

I've actually had a cracking day today so not that worried about the money side of things anymore ha.

But, I have decided if the neighbouring force open recruitment for straight to traffic, I'll do it. Can commute from home easily and a much bigger force.

nordboy

1,439 posts

49 months

Wednesday 15th March 2023
quotequote all
LosingGrip said:
I've looked at train driving, but there aren't any bases nearby (I think most want you to be within an hour which I'm not) and I wouldn't want to move that far away. But if there is somewhere close I'd jump at it!

I've only been on traffic for a year, and been lucky with the jobs I've been to fatal wise. I'm also very good at dealing leaving work at work and leave the emotional stuff there. Plus if it gets too much, I can move departments. Loads that I want to do within the police over the next 27 years.

I've actually had a cracking day today so not that worried about the money side of things anymore ha.

But, I have decided if the neighbouring force open recruitment for straight to traffic, I'll do it. Can commute from home easily and a much bigger force.
Not sure where you're based, but we've just put an advert out asking for direct RPU transferees into South Wales.

LosingGrip

7,806 posts

158 months

Wednesday 15th March 2023
quotequote all
nordboy said:
Not sure where you're based, but we've just put an advert out asking for direct RPU transferees into South Wales.
Interesting! I'll shall have a look smile.

easyhome

179 posts

122 months

Tuesday 21st March 2023
quotequote all
My brothers been in for about 20 years, hasn’t enjoyed it for a long time now due to the changes to the job.

Looked at leaving last year but ended up joining a sex offender management team. He hears some horrific stories but says that for the first time in years he actually feels like he’s doing something to protect the community, which is why he joined in the first place.

MattCharlton91

324 posts

139 months

Friday 24th March 2023
quotequote all
During my time as an undertaker, we had 3 staff members who were ex-police. X2 inspectors and a detective if my memory serves.

All took relatively early retirement, stating that the job isn’t what it once was and was effectively falling apart from the inside out. But what they had in common, is none of them ‘had’ to work, due to the pensions they were getting. The undertaker gig was basically a way of keeping them occupied and paying for a few nice holidays a year.

Biggy Stardust

6,796 posts

43 months

Monday 27th March 2023
quotequote all
LeadFarmer said:
they can't draw the pension until they are 50 yrs old.
How terrible.