Discussion
Interested in hearing the views of any legal bods in here on what BA are trying to do by making everyone redundant and re-employing most on worse contracts.
Various government websites say employees can take employer to tribunal for unfair dismissal if they don’t agree, could this open the floodgates on other companies trying this in different industries, sack everyone and re-employ on worse contracts?.
Various government websites say employees can take employer to tribunal for unfair dismissal if they don’t agree, could this open the floodgates on other companies trying this in different industries, sack everyone and re-employ on worse contracts?.
It is perfectly possible to dismiss and re-engage on new terms. Whether it is a fair process is a different question and whether the employee will object and seek recourse claiming unfair dismissal is another question. These are only ever last ditch attempts as no company really wants to go down this path.
The Mad Monk said:
Long overdue though.
The employees that have been there a while are grossly overpaid.
What's that you say? Well just have a look at how much people are paid at other airlines for work of similar value.
Are BA not asking for a 60% pay cut ? I’d wager everyone lives to the salary they earn so it’s not very easy to lose 60% income especially if day mortgage is 40% of their salary. The employees that have been there a while are grossly overpaid.
What's that you say? Well just have a look at how much people are paid at other airlines for work of similar value.
The Mad Monk said:
Long overdue though.
The employees that have been there a while are grossly overpaid.
What's that you say? Well just have a look at how much people are paid at other airlines for work of similar value.
What an absolute arse. Talk about a race to the bottom. My sister is BA cabin crew, been with them 22 years and gets paid £25k a year but you’d like to see them on £17k? She has spent the last 11 years seeing her daughter only 50% of her time growing up. The employees that have been there a while are grossly overpaid.
What's that you say? Well just have a look at how much people are paid at other airlines for work of similar value.
What WillIe Walsh is doing is nothing more than immoral. They’ve been trying to get them on low wages for years and CV19 has dropped into his lap. They (IAG) own Iberian Airlines, lufthansa etc but are not implementing the changes to any of those.
BA are the money makers of the group but he wants some of them to accept 65% LESS than they get at the moment.
Spanish owners. They should be made to drop the word ‘British’
The Mad Monk said:
Long overdue though.
The employees that have been there a while are grossly overpaid.
What's that you say? Well just have a look at how much people are paid at other airlines for work of similar value.
Very sweeping and untrue statement for many professions within the airline but as always believe what you will.The employees that have been there a while are grossly overpaid.
What's that you say? Well just have a look at how much people are paid at other airlines for work of similar value.
As for the OP’s question, yes it is legally possible.
Fastchas said:
What an absolute arse. Talk about a race to the bottom. My sister is BA cabin crew, been with them 22 years and gets paid £25k a year but you’d like to see them on £17k? She has spent the last 11 years seeing her daughter only 50% of her time growing up.
What WillIe Walsh is doing is nothing more than immoral. They’ve been trying to get them on low wages for years and CV19 has dropped into his lap. They (IAG) own Iberian Airlines, lufthansa etc but are not implementing the changes to any of those.
BA are the money makers of the group but he wants some of them to accept 65% LESS than they get at the moment.
Spanish owners. They should be made to drop the word ‘British’
Do you know anything about the short time working schemes that Germany and Spain have? What WillIe Walsh is doing is nothing more than immoral. They’ve been trying to get them on low wages for years and CV19 has dropped into his lap. They (IAG) own Iberian Airlines, lufthansa etc but are not implementing the changes to any of those.
BA are the money makers of the group but he wants some of them to accept 65% LESS than they get at the moment.
Spanish owners. They should be made to drop the word ‘British’
Looking at the pay cut request in isolation is to misunderstand the comparison.
edc said:
It is perfectly possible to dismiss and re-engage on new terms. Whether it is a fair process is a different question and whether the employee will object and seek recourse claiming unfair dismissal is another question. These are only ever last ditch attempts as no company really wants to go down this path.
That’s why I started the thread really I know it’s not a “fair” process to do it but the way the world is now I’m not suprised they are trying it on. I’m not a BA employee but I work for a company that i believe will try something similar given half a chance, I’m just wondering if it’s something more companies will start to do.
As said above if one company does it it’s bad but if all of them start doing it and it becomes the norm it would be interesting!.
moles said:
edc said:
It is perfectly possible to dismiss and re-engage on new terms. Whether it is a fair process is a different question and whether the employee will object and seek recourse claiming unfair dismissal is another question. These are only ever last ditch attempts as no company really wants to go down this path.
That’s why I started the thread really I know it’s not a “fair” process to do it but the way the world is now I’m not suprised they are trying it on. I’m not a BA employee but I work for a company that i believe will try something similar given half a chance, I’m just wondering if it’s something more companies will start to do.
As said above if one company does it it’s bad but if all of them start doing it and it becomes the norm it would be interesting!.
Fastchas said:
They (IAG) own Iberian Airlines, lufthansa etc but are not implementing the changes to any of those.
BA are the money makers of the group but he wants some of them to accept 65% LESS than they get at the moment.
Spanish owners. They should be made to drop the word ‘British’
IAG comprises of BA, Air Lingus, Iberia, Level, Vueling, IAG Cargo (although it has no dedicated Cargo Aircraft) and due to buy Air Europa. They don't own Lufthansa, who a rivals and their own Airline Group. BA are the money makers of the group but he wants some of them to accept 65% LESS than they get at the moment.
Spanish owners. They should be made to drop the word ‘British’
IAG was formed by a merger of BA and Iberia, with the Spanish in worse shape than first thought, with the Global Financial Crisis hitting Spain hard, so BA (and it's shareholders) lost out on the deal at the time. IAG was headquartered in Spain for tax reasons, but dual listed on the London and Madrid Stock Exchange, and today 25.1% owned by Qatar Airways (owned by the State of Qatar)
Fastchas said:
What an absolute arse. Talk about a race to the bottom. My sister is BA cabin crew, been with them 22 years and gets paid £25k a year but you’d like to see them on £17k? She has spent the last 11 years seeing her daughter only 50% of her time growing up.
What WillIe Walsh is doing is nothing more than immoral. They’ve been trying to get them on low wages for years and CV19 has dropped into his lap. They (IAG) own Iberian Airlines, lufthansa etc but are not implementing the changes to any of those.
BA are the money makers of the group but he wants some of them to accept 65% LESS than they get at the moment.
Spanish owners. They should be made to drop the word ‘British’
It won’t be your sister taking a cut like that. It will be the overpaid ones - the ones that held Walsh to ransom last year and rejected a 11% increase.What WillIe Walsh is doing is nothing more than immoral. They’ve been trying to get them on low wages for years and CV19 has dropped into his lap. They (IAG) own Iberian Airlines, lufthansa etc but are not implementing the changes to any of those.
BA are the money makers of the group but he wants some of them to accept 65% LESS than they get at the moment.
Spanish owners. They should be made to drop the word ‘British’
The unions have a lot to answer for - they took the pee knowing the BA employees were some of best paid in industry.
Unfortunately tables have turned.
I do have sympathy but every company needs to pay going rate in order to compete. If he cuts salaries too much the employees will just leave and go elsewhere
Fastchas said:
My sister is BA cabin crew, been with them 22 years and gets paid £25k a year but you’d like to see them on £17k? She has spent the last 11 years seeing her daughter only 50% of her time growing up.
Your sister, like all of us had to make certain career decisions as she went through life.A lot of people would have decided that having a flying career was not compatible with having children. Your sister took certain decisions.
I know a Cabin Director - I think it's called - it means he is the top steward - he is on £100,000 a year. Fly to USA, stay 4 days in top hotel, fly back to UK, another 4 days off. It's hardly work, is it?
Fastchas said:
What an absolute arse. Talk about a race to the bottom. My sister is BA cabin crew, been with them 22 years and gets paid £25k a year but you’d like to see them on £17k? She has spent the last 11 years seeing her daughter only 50% of her time growing up.
What WillIe Walsh is doing is nothing more than immoral. They’ve been trying to get them on low wages for years and CV19 has dropped into his lap. They (IAG) own Iberian Airlines, lufthansa etc but are not implementing the changes to any of those.
BA are the money makers of the group but he wants some of them to accept 65% LESS than they get at the moment.
Spanish owners. They should be made to drop the word ‘British’
There is a sWhat WillIe Walsh is doing is nothing more than immoral. They’ve been trying to get them on low wages for years and CV19 has dropped into his lap. They (IAG) own Iberian Airlines, lufthansa etc but are not implementing the changes to any of those.
BA are the money makers of the group but he wants some of them to accept 65% LESS than they get at the moment.
Spanish owners. They should be made to drop the word ‘British’
t storm going on right now that one way or another will probably hit every single person financially. The travel sector is on its arse & a lot of it simply will not exist in 12 months time. The reality is this has nothing to do with the performance or otherwise of anybody in this business. Nobody could have reasonably allowed for what is unfolding. It's harsh, people in the business can scream & scream until they are sick, but it's not going to change things. This is not about a race to the bottom, its now a battle for survival. Many companies in many industries are going to have to make similar decisions.I have sympathy for anyone who is going to have to take a drop in their standard of living as a result of what is happening in the world today, it will not be their fault & it will not fair, but it's going to happen. Unlike many on here I think BA crew are some of the best out there & yes they deserve decent pay. For many though it is a lifestyle job, rather than a career, and hence BA have little trouble filling positions. This will not change even if the do reduce pay.
It was your sisters choice regarding not seeing her daughter. She can't take a job such as crew & expect it to be 9-5, 5 days a week. My wife used to be crew. She realised she couldn't be crew, while maintaining a normal family life. She worked private business flights for while which paid better & was less frequent, but even that didn't work.
GT03ROB
You are correct so many if not all people are going to be financially impacted, be it total loss of job and unable to find any replacement work at any salary level or pay cuts in existing role and then much higher taxes for all.
I keep saying it but I’m grateful I have a job we will not be burning cash just the basics and obviously don’t go silly on birthday gifts. If things change or are not so bad hey that cash is just in the bank happy days.
You are correct so many if not all people are going to be financially impacted, be it total loss of job and unable to find any replacement work at any salary level or pay cuts in existing role and then much higher taxes for all.
I keep saying it but I’m grateful I have a job we will not be burning cash just the basics and obviously don’t go silly on birthday gifts. If things change or are not so bad hey that cash is just in the bank happy days.
The Mad Monk said:
Long overdue though.
The employees that have been there a while are grossly overpaid.
What's that you say? Well just have a look at how much people are paid at other airlines for work of similar value.
Tell me this then Mad Monk.The employees that have been there a while are grossly overpaid.
What's that you say? Well just have a look at how much people are paid at other airlines for work of similar value.
The employees are grossly overpaid?
Which employees? Some? Just crew? Or all employees then?
As a Licensed aircraft engineer with BA in my 31st year how much am I being overpaid then?
The Mad Monk said:
Your sister, like all of us had to make certain career decisions as she went through life.
A lot of people would have decided that having a flying career was not compatible with having children. Your sister took certain decisions.
I know a Cabin Director - I think it's called - it means he is the top steward - he is on £100,000 a year. Fly to USA, stay 4 days in top hotel, fly back to UK, another 4 days off. It's hardly work, is it?
I would like to call bullsA lot of people would have decided that having a flying career was not compatible with having children. Your sister took certain decisions.
I know a Cabin Director - I think it's called - it means he is the top steward - he is on £100,000 a year. Fly to USA, stay 4 days in top hotel, fly back to UK, another 4 days off. It's hardly work, is it?
t on the above. No CSD is on £100,000 a year regardless of time in the company and no crew stop overs in New York are 4 days. Normally one night and back the next day. Gassing Station | Jobs & Employment Matters | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff