Messaging outside of work
Discussion
I was surprised by the number of people talking about not responding or even switching off work comms. But then I remembered the low levels of UK productivity and it all sort of fitted.
If you want to progress in a company and become a valued resource those tactics are very counter productive and will consign you to slow lane. Or if business gets really bad, the first out of the door lane.
People talking about they would respond in an emergency does suggest they would at least look at the comms - which is really the absolute minimum a business would expect. Always interesting to see how some people think.
If you want to progress in a company and become a valued resource those tactics are very counter productive and will consign you to slow lane. Or if business gets really bad, the first out of the door lane.
People talking about they would respond in an emergency does suggest they would at least look at the comms - which is really the absolute minimum a business would expect. Always interesting to see how some people think.
Pete54 said:
If you want to progress in a company and become a valued resource those tactics are very counter productive and will consign you to slow lane. Or if business gets really bad, the first out of the door lane.
This is demonstrably untrue. I've stuck to my contracted hours for at least two decades. That didn't stop a former employer headhunting me back a decade (ish) ago. It didn't stop promotion to senior management. It didn't stop promotion to the board. Pete54 said:
I was surprised by the number of people talking about not responding or even switching off work comms. But then I remembered the low levels of UK productivity and it all sort of fitted.
If you want to progress in a company and become a valued resource those tactics are very counter productive and will consign you to slow lane. Or if business gets really bad, the first out of the door lane.
People talking about they would respond in an emergency does suggest they would at least look at the comms - which is really the absolute minimum a business would expect. Always interesting to see how some people think.
I don't disagree with you you but I think a lot depends on your role, grade, and salary. I wouldn't expect somebody who works as a till operator at Asda or McDoanlds to be getting contacted Out of Hours, however if you're the Store Manager then it's more understandable.If you want to progress in a company and become a valued resource those tactics are very counter productive and will consign you to slow lane. Or if business gets really bad, the first out of the door lane.
People talking about they would respond in an emergency does suggest they would at least look at the comms - which is really the absolute minimum a business would expect. Always interesting to see how some people think.
In terms of promotion/career progression it comes down to one thing - making your Boss's life easier.
Pete54 said:
I was surprised by the number of people talking about not responding or even switching off work comms. But then I remembered the low levels of UK productivity and it all sort of fitted.
If you want to progress in a company and become a valued resource those tactics are very counter productive and will consign you to slow lane. Or if business gets really bad, the first out of the door lane..
I’m one of those who switches off work comms. Hasn’t stopped me being regularly promoted or getting top appraisals. If you want to progress in a company and become a valued resource those tactics are very counter productive and will consign you to slow lane. Or if business gets really bad, the first out of the door lane..
To be clear I, and the others here, switch off work comms when we’re not at work. You want my time, you pay for it.
It's possible your colleague has things in his private life, about which you no nothing, which could be causing him additional stress, and it's possible that he prefers to get things off his chest asap. It's also possible he wants to know what he'll be walking into on Monday because otherwise he'll worry and not sleep.
It's possible he's looking to you for some support because he values teamwork.
It's possible that this is about him, not you.
It's possible he's looking to you for some support because he values teamwork.
It's possible that this is about him, not you.
Sporky said:
Pete54 said:
If you want to progress in a company and become a valued resource those tactics are very counter productive and will consign you to slow lane. Or if business gets really bad, the first out of the door lane.
This is demonstrably untrue. I've stuck to my contracted hours for at least two decades. That didn't stop a former employer headhunting me back a decade (ish) ago. It didn't stop promotion to senior management. It didn't stop promotion to the board. If I'm away for whatever reason, I would only expect to be contacted if there was an issue only I could resolve. When I'm away my work phone and laptop is off, but the people who need to get hold of me would be able to on my personal phone, IF they needed to.
Work phone etc has to go off for me because work bleeds into life outside of work, the temptation to read emails etc. Especially when working from home.
CheesecakeRunner said:
Pete54 said:
I was surprised by the number of people talking about not responding or even switching off work comms. But then I remembered the low levels of UK productivity and it all sort of fitted.
If you want to progress in a company and become a valued resource those tactics are very counter productive and will consign you to slow lane. Or if business gets really bad, the first out of the door lane..
I’m one of those who switches off work comms. Hasn’t stopped me being regularly promoted or getting top appraisals. If you want to progress in a company and become a valued resource those tactics are very counter productive and will consign you to slow lane. Or if business gets really bad, the first out of the door lane..
To be clear I, and the others here, switch off work comms when we’re not at work. You want my time, you pay for it.
CheesecakeRunner said:
I’m one of those who switches off work comms. Hasn’t stopped me being regularly promoted or getting top appraisals.
To be clear I, and the others here, switch off work comms when we’re not at work. You want my time, you pay for it.
All other things being equal who is more valuable to a Company; somebody who responds to out-of-hours issues or somebody who doesn't?To be clear I, and the others here, switch off work comms when we’re not at work. You want my time, you pay for it.
Is it really such a big deal to take 5 minutes out of a Sunday to make your, or someone else's Monday better?
I'm always getting messages and calls when I'm off, no issue for me. The best ones are when they call me when i'm abroad and I answer so they get charged international rates.
Sometimes I stick footy on, crack open and actually do some work on Sundays just so I can have an easy Monday.
As has been said though, if you're not willing to give a little you will find it will hold back.
I'm always getting messages and calls when I'm off, no issue for me. The best ones are when they call me when i'm abroad and I answer so they get charged international rates.
Sometimes I stick footy on, crack open and actually do some work on Sundays just so I can have an easy Monday.
As has been said though, if you're not willing to give a little you will find it will hold back.
Sporky said:
Pete54 said:
If you want to progress in a company and become a valued resource those tactics are very counter productive and will consign you to slow lane. Or if business gets really bad, the first out of the door lane.
This is demonstrably untrue. I've stuck to my contracted hours for at least two decades. That didn't stop a former employer headhunting me back a decade (ish) ago. It didn't stop promotion to senior management. It didn't stop promotion to the board. People begging employers to take advantage of them hold everyone back.
Pete54 said:
I was surprised by the number of people talking about not responding or even switching off work comms. But then I remembered the low levels of UK productivity and it all sort of fitted.
If you want to progress in a company and become a valued resource those tactics are very counter productive and will consign you to slow lane. Or if business gets really bad, the first out of the door lane.
On the contrary, I would suggest that patsies who jump to attention for non-critical out of hours work are precisely the people that you can underpay and undervalue, as they'll put up with any old sIf you want to progress in a company and become a valued resource those tactics are very counter productive and will consign you to slow lane. Or if business gets really bad, the first out of the door lane.
t.Yazza54 said:
If I'm away for whatever reason, I would only expect to be contacted if there was an issue only I could resolve.
Same here. There is a Bat-Signal that two directors have, to be used when all these conditions are met:There is a problem
The problem must be solved before I am back
Only I can solve the problem
I can solve the problem without access to my work phone or laptop
It has never been needed. Ever. And I lead the entire design division, and look after key accounts.
Pete54 said:
I was surprised by the number of people talking about not responding or even switching off work comms. But then I remembered the low levels of UK productivity and it all sort of fitted.
If you want to progress in a company and become a valued resource those tactics are very counter productive and will consign you to slow lane. Or if business gets really bad, the first out of the door lane.
People talking about they would respond in an emergency does suggest they would at least look at the comms - which is really the absolute minimum a business would expect. Always interesting to see how some people think.
Whereas I get constant emails, calls and messages outside of office hours, often late at night, weekends and holiday. to the point, where the wife jokes there are 3 of us in the relationship, me her and my laptop. If you want to progress in a company and become a valued resource those tactics are very counter productive and will consign you to slow lane. Or if business gets really bad, the first out of the door lane.
People talking about they would respond in an emergency does suggest they would at least look at the comms - which is really the absolute minimum a business would expect. Always interesting to see how some people think.
This is partly a problem of my own making, because I try to do the best for clients and colleagues, partly because it is endemic in my aggressive industry and firms I have worked for and partly because clients come to expect you to be at the end of the phone, whatever time of day. Employees have no downtime
Ultimately, you end up with burnout, and I've been/am close. .
It's not about the big corpora flex to the boss, it's about setting boundaries and making sure individuals have time for themselves, since the cemeteries the world over are filled with indispensable men.
ZedLeg said:
Sporky said:
Pete54 said:
If you want to progress in a company and become a valued resource those tactics are very counter productive and will consign you to slow lane. Or if business gets really bad, the first out of the door lane.
This is demonstrably untrue. I've stuck to my contracted hours for at least two decades. That didn't stop a former employer headhunting me back a decade (ish) ago. It didn't stop promotion to senior management. It didn't stop promotion to the board. People begging employers to take advantage of them hold everyone back.
To clarify - There's no issue with people working their contracted hours. if that works for you and your boss doesn't need you outside of work hours then it's all good. However IF your boss needs something OOH and they know you won't be responding then (hard as it might be to accept for all the Powerfully Built on here) that will count against you. It may well be that because you're totally amazing at everything else that it doesn't make any difference to your career prospects but if you're one of 5/10/50 people and others are more willing to go the extra mile then it WILL affect your career prospects.
Countdown said:
if you're one of 5/10/50 people and others are more willing to go the extra mile then it WILL affect your career prospects.
People say this a lot, but the evidence is against. I was in a team of six, some of whom did answer emails and phone out of hours. I ended up promoted, they didn't. Sporky said:
Yazza54 said:
If I'm away for whatever reason, I would only expect to be contacted if there was an issue only I could resolve.
Same here. There is a Bat-Signal that two directors have, to be used when all these conditions are met: It sounds like you work for a relatively small organisation, given you have only two directors.
I work for a multi-billion € global organisation with 300,000 people across twenty-odd countries. There’s never something come up that only I can solve. And the same goes for virtually everyone else in the organisation. So if someone is messaging me out of hours or when I’m on leave for something, it’s generally because they can’t be arsed to find the correct person who’s actually at work to deal with it.
So for clarification, if my manager or the director I know calls me out of hours for something I'll pick up the phone. Also when I had a team I would respond to them via message or call.
Anything that takes more than 5 mins to explain/resolve can wait until I'm back at my computer though, unless something has broken and needs fixed.
Which is why I said earlier that there is a bit of flexibility needed when in professional roles.
Would I do all that for £9 an hour? I would not.
Anything that takes more than 5 mins to explain/resolve can wait until I'm back at my computer though, unless something has broken and needs fixed.
Which is why I said earlier that there is a bit of flexibility needed when in professional roles.
Would I do all that for £9 an hour? I would not.
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