Why get an M3 when I can get a Jag XKR?
Discussion
Quickmoose said:
I reckon M3's have better balance... because despite the Aluminum stuff, they always do get described as unwieldy when compared to similar cars.
I've no doubt at all the Jag is awesome off the line...just me personally, bored with that aspect of driving...that the quality of a car is best made obvious by mashing the throttle in a straight line.
So what if a Ford/VAG/Renault mega hatch thing can get away better or go round a corner better.... clearly if you wanted that kind of car you'd get one...if 'winning' matters.
I'd wager that a few weeks into Jag ownership your average speed reduces as you appreciate real power, comfort and the things a Jag offers that a more mass produced 'white good' doesn't/can't
...and then now and again you'll mash the throttle and enjoy the thrust...
ThanksI've no doubt at all the Jag is awesome off the line...just me personally, bored with that aspect of driving...that the quality of a car is best made obvious by mashing the throttle in a straight line.
So what if a Ford/VAG/Renault mega hatch thing can get away better or go round a corner better.... clearly if you wanted that kind of car you'd get one...if 'winning' matters.
I'd wager that a few weeks into Jag ownership your average speed reduces as you appreciate real power, comfort and the things a Jag offers that a more mass produced 'white good' doesn't/can't
...and then now and again you'll mash the throttle and enjoy the thrust...
Gemmot said:
I wouldnt say the jag is useless around a corner but its a big car, especially compared to a 130 or M3. The jag is a GT but you will be best mates with petrol stations. I remember filling up... about 80quid and put the sat nav in to scotland which was 270 miles and i got a warning on the dash... You do not have enough fuel to reach your destination.... lol
The V8 makes a sublime noise from the jag but again the BMW engines are sweet.
Maybe i just bought a dud, but... when the sun was shining and the roof was down, the jag was a lovely place to be. Forget about the rear seats for anything other than kids under 7.
The best think to do is take them both for a test drive on the same or similar roads and also roads of all kinds too.
The comfort on the jag was amazing compared to my bmw
The jag was on normal 20s but the bmw was on 18 runflats
The jaguar owners club is excellent in terms of assistance and guidance with trouble shooting so there is non dealer back up if needed. Hope this helps a bit
Yeah helpful thanksThe V8 makes a sublime noise from the jag but again the BMW engines are sweet.
Maybe i just bought a dud, but... when the sun was shining and the roof was down, the jag was a lovely place to be. Forget about the rear seats for anything other than kids under 7.
The best think to do is take them both for a test drive on the same or similar roads and also roads of all kinds too.
The comfort on the jag was amazing compared to my bmw
The jag was on normal 20s but the bmw was on 18 runflats
The jaguar owners club is excellent in terms of assistance and guidance with trouble shooting so there is non dealer back up if needed. Hope this helps a bit
Quickmoose said:
buying into the whole "Jag is pipe and slippers" suggests you're more worried about other people's opinions than your own.
It'd be a bit like not buying a BMW because they're driven by 'cocks who don't know how to use indicators lol', which is equally daft.
it's all bulls
t.
Drive/own the car you prefer, sod the blinkered opinions.
I certainly intend to test all I can....but I know personally I prefer a rarer car, even if it's slightly less capable. I'm not a racing driver, so the last 2/10ths don't concern me in the slightest. In this instance the 3 series is more common than a Mondeo, so as much as they dominate the sector for good reason, I don't warm to it....
TrueIt'd be a bit like not buying a BMW because they're driven by 'cocks who don't know how to use indicators lol', which is equally daft.
it's all bulls
t.Drive/own the car you prefer, sod the blinkered opinions.
I certainly intend to test all I can....but I know personally I prefer a rarer car, even if it's slightly less capable. I'm not a racing driver, so the last 2/10ths don't concern me in the slightest. In this instance the 3 series is more common than a Mondeo, so as much as they dominate the sector for good reason, I don't warm to it....
SimpleSam said:
See this is what I don't get.
Is there something inherent in the damping, suspension, stiffness, handling, wheelbase, engine, gears or Godknowswhat that makes one more of a track car and the other more of a distance car?
Or is it just that the Jag is longer and looks more sophisticated and more comfy inside so therefore more suited to long journeys?
I have zero interest in track days. I do £5k miles a year in town. Occasionally I may venture out into country roads that bend around a bit but not often. I want a quick beast of a car that also looks good. If the only advantage to the M3 is that it is specifically built for doing better around a track I'm not sure it's that much of a big deal. But if it means it's more versatile and will give me better safety when I do go too fast on a bendy dual carriageway or misjudge a country bend then yes that is important and I'd rather go with it. And with the Jag if it's in its element when cruising down a motorway but not so comfortable in bendier situations then perhaps it isn't for me as I won't be going anywhere far with it.
Just buy the jag then if you're not hugely interested in driving. It's a lovely car.Is there something inherent in the damping, suspension, stiffness, handling, wheelbase, engine, gears or Godknowswhat that makes one more of a track car and the other more of a distance car?
Or is it just that the Jag is longer and looks more sophisticated and more comfy inside so therefore more suited to long journeys?
I have zero interest in track days. I do £5k miles a year in town. Occasionally I may venture out into country roads that bend around a bit but not often. I want a quick beast of a car that also looks good. If the only advantage to the M3 is that it is specifically built for doing better around a track I'm not sure it's that much of a big deal. But if it means it's more versatile and will give me better safety when I do go too fast on a bendy dual carriageway or misjudge a country bend then yes that is important and I'd rather go with it. And with the Jag if it's in its element when cruising down a motorway but not so comfortable in bendier situations then perhaps it isn't for me as I won't be going anywhere far with it.
BuzyG said:
Or buy a Z4M for half the money and have more fun.
XKR might be fast on a dual carrage way but down a nice B road they are floaty boaty fat things, that a hot hatch or an Z4M will destroy. Never ever been tempted by an M3, it's a taxi IMHO, so can't comment there.
I owned a Z4M Roadster for 2 years and had my E92 M3 for 2 years. XKR might be fast on a dual carrage way but down a nice B road they are floaty boaty fat things, that a hot hatch or an Z4M will destroy. Never ever been tempted by an M3, it's a taxi IMHO, so can't comment there.
The Z4M is NOT as good a driver's car. It handled pretty terribly, no matter the tyres I put on it (very unpredictable and twitchy rear).
The M3 is much more predictive and flat-out fun.
Both great but different cars.
I was close to buying an XKR twice.. but didn't.
I bought a c63 and an e90 instead.
I am an ex racer and I prefer the steering feel and front end grip of the smaller cars. The XKR is really quick and handles ok, but just doesn't have the same handling balance on the limit.
If you never switch Traction control off and drive responsibly round corners then the XKR or XFR is a tough act to beat for the money.
Everyones opinion is just that, an opinion.
It's your money and your decision - Think you need to get on with driving both amazing cars and decide.
Good luck
Martin
I was close to buying an XKR twice.. but didn't.
I bought a c63 and an e90 instead.
I am an ex racer and I prefer the steering feel and front end grip of the smaller cars. The XKR is really quick and handles ok, but just doesn't have the same handling balance on the limit.
If you never switch Traction control off and drive responsibly round corners then the XKR or XFR is a tough act to beat for the money.
Everyones opinion is just that, an opinion.
It's your money and your decision - Think you need to get on with driving both amazing cars and decide.
Good luck
Martin
The other aspect to this thread is...
When has the XKR EVER been put up for comparison with an M3?....probably never...really very different approaches to a performance car.
So that said you can expect different results.
So why just these two OP? just two personal favourites of yours?
An M3 has always been the pinnacle of it's type...up against other family saloons that have been modded beyond recognition my master engineers, and that has a racing background.
A Jag XKR has always been at the 'comfortable cruiser' end of it's type...with a lary dark side.
But the thing is that the Jag XKR's type is more Audi R8, Maserati, Porsche 911, BMW 6 and Merc SL... not 3 series, A4 or C class...I'm guessing very few would be choosing an M3 when an R8 is offered up, yet the XKR is closer to an R8 than the M3 is...
indeed as an open top it bests a Porsche and a Ferrari.
http://www.evo.co.uk/audi/r8-spyder/14136/audi-r8-...
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-reviews/38213/aud...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hrUIRiAtGOo
Interestingly the common denominator in terms of 'competition/comaprison' between the XK and the M3 is a 911......
When has the XKR EVER been put up for comparison with an M3?....probably never...really very different approaches to a performance car.
So that said you can expect different results.
So why just these two OP? just two personal favourites of yours?
An M3 has always been the pinnacle of it's type...up against other family saloons that have been modded beyond recognition my master engineers, and that has a racing background.
A Jag XKR has always been at the 'comfortable cruiser' end of it's type...with a lary dark side.
But the thing is that the Jag XKR's type is more Audi R8, Maserati, Porsche 911, BMW 6 and Merc SL... not 3 series, A4 or C class...I'm guessing very few would be choosing an M3 when an R8 is offered up, yet the XKR is closer to an R8 than the M3 is...
indeed as an open top it bests a Porsche and a Ferrari.
http://www.evo.co.uk/audi/r8-spyder/14136/audi-r8-...
http://www.autoexpress.co.uk/car-reviews/38213/aud...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hrUIRiAtGOo
Interestingly the common denominator in terms of 'competition/comaprison' between the XK and the M3 is a 911......
The XKR 5.0 is a sublime car and for me, every bit as beautiful to look at as the equivalent DB from Aston and thats hardly a bad thing... one of my colleagues has an XKR-RS and its immense.
The problem is the e90 is also amazing but for a different reason.
The most fun cars i ever owned were my e46 m3 or my F10 m5. The best car i ever owned was my merc E55k - it was balistically fast, but for 90% of the time was a complete sleeper - very capable of getting down and dirty when needed, but that was the exception not the rule base on my driving style.. They did different things I guess and scratched the itch i had a the time.
What i would say is - if you like the thrill of driving everywhere very quickly and enjoy the mechanical sound of the engine at high revs, the M3 is hard to beat. If you like the ability to go very quickly sometimes and be comfortable the rest of the time, the XKR is among the very best.
That, or a CL63 5.5TT for me if i were in your shoes.
As remarked by an earlier reply - the only person you need to convince on the right choice is you - everyone else is just offering their opinion.
Good luck !
The problem is the e90 is also amazing but for a different reason.
The most fun cars i ever owned were my e46 m3 or my F10 m5. The best car i ever owned was my merc E55k - it was balistically fast, but for 90% of the time was a complete sleeper - very capable of getting down and dirty when needed, but that was the exception not the rule base on my driving style.. They did different things I guess and scratched the itch i had a the time.
What i would say is - if you like the thrill of driving everywhere very quickly and enjoy the mechanical sound of the engine at high revs, the M3 is hard to beat. If you like the ability to go very quickly sometimes and be comfortable the rest of the time, the XKR is among the very best.
That, or a CL63 5.5TT for me if i were in your shoes.
As remarked by an earlier reply - the only person you need to convince on the right choice is you - everyone else is just offering their opinion.
Good luck !
That's a good point about how you want/like to drive.
An M3 will be easier to extend and rev out compared to the Jaguar.
Which is exactly why the Jaguar is on my radar.
After two years of a comparatively titchy 4 cylinder with a manic 9000 red line, as wonderful as that has been and is....I'm hankering after some low down brawn/shove now....
And then a couple of years after that...I'll start to regret selling the little Honda....
An M3 will be easier to extend and rev out compared to the Jaguar.
Which is exactly why the Jaguar is on my radar.
After two years of a comparatively titchy 4 cylinder with a manic 9000 red line, as wonderful as that has been and is....I'm hankering after some low down brawn/shove now....
And then a couple of years after that...I'll start to regret selling the little Honda....
I have a current shape 650 - test drove the latest version (with nicer front lights) XKR before I bought it. The XKR is very nice - looks good, comfortable, fast, sounds great when pressing on. I didn't get one purely because the on-board technology (sat nav, etc.) is a generation behind the BMW. This is likely true in the case of E92 M3 vs. XKR as well.
Worst bit for me was the touch screen controls for everything other than heating. I don't want to have to go via touch screen to turn the heated seats down, I want to be able to do that sort of thing on a button without having to look at what I'm doing... Small stuff really, but I decided it would annoy me too much in the long term.
Worst bit for me was the touch screen controls for everything other than heating. I don't want to have to go via touch screen to turn the heated seats down, I want to be able to do that sort of thing on a button without having to look at what I'm doing... Small stuff really, but I decided it would annoy me too much in the long term.
Edited by DanL on Thursday 13th April 13:25
Its a choice to make but to write a care off due to last gen satnav (its pretty slow) is a bit of an odd ball reason but that's in my mind, I understand someone else going BMW.
Jag though, hands down, is much better built than modern BMWs, much nicer place to be. Friends F82 feels like a cheap toy in comparison.
You cant really compare the Jag to the M3, two very different cars as probably discussed at length. I recently took a new F80 M3 out for consideration, lovely car to drive but didn't give me any fizz in the old gentleman vegetables. Someone mentioned waft to Italy or go to the ring, took the Jag to Italy last year. With the top down its just an absolute joy but as good as it handles, and it really does, it isn't really for the track. For that reason I didn't bring it on this weekends trip to the ring, instead though I brought my old e39 m5, I actually have more confidence in the m5 but that's probably due to it being less electronically controlled and I have never gelled with e-diffs.
Of the two, every day of the year I would take the XKR over the e92 but then I am biased as an owner, but before purchase and during have written off replacing it with many cars including the current gen M3. 25k is going to be a very early 5.0 too, not that its a bad thing but it still sounds cheap as you look at 2013 cars onwards and they are asking near 40 at dealers (whether they sell is another thing).
Only doing the 1 lap tomorrow as driving from Brussels down to the ring then back to blighty, if anyone sees a LM Blue English M5 on the way there, back or stuck in a ditch near Adenau, give me a wave.
Jag though, hands down, is much better built than modern BMWs, much nicer place to be. Friends F82 feels like a cheap toy in comparison.
You cant really compare the Jag to the M3, two very different cars as probably discussed at length. I recently took a new F80 M3 out for consideration, lovely car to drive but didn't give me any fizz in the old gentleman vegetables. Someone mentioned waft to Italy or go to the ring, took the Jag to Italy last year. With the top down its just an absolute joy but as good as it handles, and it really does, it isn't really for the track. For that reason I didn't bring it on this weekends trip to the ring, instead though I brought my old e39 m5, I actually have more confidence in the m5 but that's probably due to it being less electronically controlled and I have never gelled with e-diffs.
Of the two, every day of the year I would take the XKR over the e92 but then I am biased as an owner, but before purchase and during have written off replacing it with many cars including the current gen M3. 25k is going to be a very early 5.0 too, not that its a bad thing but it still sounds cheap as you look at 2013 cars onwards and they are asking near 40 at dealers (whether they sell is another thing).
Only doing the 1 lap tomorrow as driving from Brussels down to the ring then back to blighty, if anyone sees a LM Blue English M5 on the way there, back or stuck in a ditch near Adenau, give me a wave.
The Z4M is certainly edgier than the M3. Much more engaging car to drive IMHO and harder to get the best out of it. Had mine 5 years now. No plans to sell it. Most buy an M3 because they need 4 seats and a boot. Most buy an XKR or an Z4M because they want a good looking fun car that's reasonably quick. The fact that a Z4M is quicker than a comparable M3 on track, is just a nice bonus.
The Z4M is NOT as good a driver's car. It handled pretty terribly, no matter the tyres I put on it (very unpredictable and twitchy rear).
The M3 is much more predictive and flat-out fun.
GroundEffect said:
BuzyG said:
Or buy a Z4M for half the money and have more fun.
XKR might be fast on a dual carrage way but down a nice B road they are floaty boaty fat things, that a hot hatch or an Z4M will destroy. Never ever been tempted by an M3, it's a taxi IMHO, so can't comment there.
I owned a Z4M Roadster for 2 years and had my E92 M3 for 2 years. XKR might be fast on a dual carrage way but down a nice B road they are floaty boaty fat things, that a hot hatch or an Z4M will destroy. Never ever been tempted by an M3, it's a taxi IMHO, so can't comment there.
The Z4M is NOT as good a driver's car. It handled pretty terribly, no matter the tyres I put on it (very unpredictable and twitchy rear).
The M3 is much more predictive and flat-out fun.
I would say the 4.2 engine on the XKR is pretty bombproof and isn't expensive to maintain at an Indie
By the stage they went into the X150 model all the problems with cylinder liners ,supercharger moutings ,water pump impellers ,footwell floorpan rot -had all been sorted ie that was the end of the evolution .
I had an X100 model 4l XKR conv which was very fast -as quick as my Z4Mr in a straight line and not too slow in the twist bits either
I think the newer ones have the adaptive dampers as well
Ive recently driven a 2007 X150 4,2 XKR coupe which just felt a bit tighter than the old model X100 with the same engine -but that could simply be age related -obviously the coupe is a lot stiffer than the convertible
Still a nice car and you can pick up a decent low miler with 45k miles for circa 22k privately -or from a dealer with a Jag warranty it would be nearer 25K
I would say the bills are going to be a lot less with the Jag than the M3
Only down side is the old man image of the Jag but then im an old man so that suited me well
The Jag a car to be wafted along in rather than trying to push hard -it actully encourages you to sit back and relax and let other idiots go on by -thats quite relaxing actually
Also most of the X100 will have done 90% of their depreciation as long as you dont put a lot of miles on as a daily driver
More depreciation still to go in X150 though
Both nice cars IMHO -cant go far wrong
By the stage they went into the X150 model all the problems with cylinder liners ,supercharger moutings ,water pump impellers ,footwell floorpan rot -had all been sorted ie that was the end of the evolution .
I had an X100 model 4l XKR conv which was very fast -as quick as my Z4Mr in a straight line and not too slow in the twist bits either
I think the newer ones have the adaptive dampers as well
Ive recently driven a 2007 X150 4,2 XKR coupe which just felt a bit tighter than the old model X100 with the same engine -but that could simply be age related -obviously the coupe is a lot stiffer than the convertible
Still a nice car and you can pick up a decent low miler with 45k miles for circa 22k privately -or from a dealer with a Jag warranty it would be nearer 25K
I would say the bills are going to be a lot less with the Jag than the M3
Only down side is the old man image of the Jag but then im an old man so that suited me well
The Jag a car to be wafted along in rather than trying to push hard -it actully encourages you to sit back and relax and let other idiots go on by -thats quite relaxing actually
Also most of the X100 will have done 90% of their depreciation as long as you dont put a lot of miles on as a daily driver
More depreciation still to go in X150 though
Both nice cars IMHO -cant go far wrong
Gassing Station | M Power | Top of Page | What's New | My Stuff