M2 test drive comments - LCI, pedal woes, thoughts...

M2 test drive comments - LCI, pedal woes, thoughts...

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Sdg1973

Original Poster:

9 posts

77 months

Saturday 28th October 2017
quotequote all
Ok - so I'm new to the forums - take it easy on me ok??

Short version - test drove pre PCI, and LCI versions. Manual vs DCT. Pedal box size/angle issue with manual. Thoughts on colours, and alternatives.

I currently drive a mk7 65 plate Golf R, 5 door, manual with DCC and a few other options. I've done about 16000 miles in it, mostly commuting, family visits and some spirited drives in the Dales close to where I live. However, I'm bored. The Golf is unbelievably practical, and probably essential in the last few years as my (now 4) daughter had a buggy etc. Now that she can do lots more things on her own, practicality isn't such a desirable quantity anymore.

What's wrong with the Golf? Well, there are too many on the roads - R or otherwise. It doesn't help to make it feel any more special (yes, a 4 pot turbo with mostly front wheel drive delivery wasn't ever going to feel special, but it also helped me get into cheap, fast, practical motoring since I messed up my NCD a few years ago when I was living abroad.) The manual, whilst more engaging than the DSG perhaps, is a bit flat and ordinary. It's super comfy with the DCC but having driven the M2 with passive setup, it shows just how the Golf's setup is lacking inspiration.

I've had a few BMWs in the past - E46 330Ci sport (owned for 5.5 years and 46000 miles from new), Z4 coupe 3.0 Si and then a 118d and 520d whilst living abroad where everyone has a diesel. The 520d is the only auto I've owned. Also had a lovely black 987 Cayman S that I had to sell prior to moving abroad. It was a peach.

So, all the rave reviews of the M2 have piqued my interest in BMWs again. I've never owned an M car but thought I'd hunt down a local dealer and test drive one.

Cue 1st test drive. DCT, black, LCI. I wasn't in the market for a DCT so told them I just wanted to drive it to get a feel for the chassis, steering, practicality, interior design/quality etc.

At this point I must say that, whilst I'm sure the M2's interior is inferior to the M3/4, given all the reviews are uncomplimentary about the M2 inside, I was pleasantly surprised. Maybe it's the LCI (although I hadn't sat in a pre LCI model at that point). Buttons are solid, carbon fibre weave around the vents is very nice, and the speedo/rev counter looked expensive. Steering wheel is fabulous with the coloured stitching. Leather seats were very comfortable. Visibility was great. My daughter's car seat went in the back just fine. So I was impressed. It certainly felt more cocooning than my Golf, where - having done a few M2 drives now, you definitely sit on the Golf rather than in it. The M2, even with electric seats, feels like you're sitting much lower. Not Porsche low, but low. The Golf has more space, front and back, without a doubt, but sitting lower in a coupe is bound to feel different.

Some reviews comment about the hard/firm suspension. It's firm, I agree, but reminds me so much of my E46. Driving on motorways or poor local roads, I never felt like the M2 crashed about. It has very compliant suspension in my opinion. It was the main reason for the drive, and didn't put me off at all. Whilst I wasn't driving it in spirited fashion much at all, my daughter feel asleep, even after I'd switched to Sport (where the exhaust goes louder as you all know!) So it passed the 4 year old daughter test (even though she said she wanted one without a roof!).

And you know what, I found myself enjoying the simplicity of the DCT. Very smooth in comfort setting, nice and sporty in other modes. It threw a big spanner in the works, but when spending that amount of money I needed to drive a manual. It was in black and looked the business, with one local guy waving for us to slow down whilst he took a good look, then gave a massive thumbs up to it.

2nd road test (different dealer who had pre LCI manual and LCI auto).

Manual first - long beach blue, pre LCI. The colour really suits the car, but not sure it's for me. Older generations (i.e. my parents) hated it in photos. I doubt they'd like it any more in person. Yes, it's my car. But having a night blue Golf R that really flies under the radar, black or grey are more appealing to me at the present time.

First impressions, even before setting off, were that I wanted the LCI version. The main air vents are just standard 2 series fare and don't look integrated into the dash like the LCI model. This one had sunroof, which made the inside feel airier for sure. The speedo and rev counter, whilst fine, just don't have the premium feel of the LCI model.

So, I knew I wouldn't be buying this particular one, which took some pressure off the trip. Just a case of driving the manual and seeing if I liked it.

First few metres, even before we left the parking lot, I knew something wasn't right. Why hadn't I felt this in the DCT? Ah, three pedals in the pedal box. And offset pedals. And seat at a slight angle. These characteristics just weren't noticeable (to me) in the DCT version with just two pedals. My heels were touching each other and making it awkward to get going smoothly. I'll point out, I don't have big feet - size 8.5 - and my trainers didn't have chunky soles or anything like that.

As a result, I spent the majority of the drive working out how to change gear without my feet being too close together. I did get some blasts through the rev range towards the end of the drive, by which point the traditional BMW "snick" of the gearshift started to come back to me. Stepping back into the Golf later on told me where the premium comes from in the BMW.

I couldn't draw a conclusion from the manual test drive - too short and was too busy worrying about the pedals. I heard the blips on downshifts a few times, but sadly hadn't realised I was also in comfort for most of the drive, so distracted had I been by the pedal issue. Sigh

On to the DCT they had, in mineral grey. Was in need of a clean but just 20 miles on the clock. LCI, and back to back with the pre LCI it was once again clear how much nicer it is in the LCI. And with only two pedals in the car, it felt more at home to me, like it had the previous day in the black one.

This time, as I was on my own, I chose to switch to sport immediately and - knowing that the drive was going to be as short as the manual one - I gave it some welly. And I tried the paddles. They felt nice. I think the use of paddles makes it feel more like a computer game, as those who desire a manual will no doubt confirm this is how they envisage it feeling (or have experienced it like this), but I didn't mind the feeling. Keeping both hands on the wheel at all times, especially coming from an all wheel drive capable car to a RWD, might make a difference. I did notice a hesitation shortly after braking heavily before a 90 degree right that made me unsure whether I'd depressed the accelerator enough or not. Don't think it was turbo lag, which I didn't really notice at all (compared to the Golf where it can be quite apparent), but maybe that's just because I've never owned a sporty auto double clutch before.

I walked away though, slightly upset at the poor trade in value (although the price of the M2 was very competitive), and also in the knowledge that there are discounts on new. But mainly I walked away because I felt like I needed to give the manual a second chance.

I know the offset pedals/seat has been mentioned in some reviews, but I really wasn't expecting it to be so noticeable. Jeremy Clarkson loved it - not sure if he drove manual or DCT, but can't see him having small feet! How big an issue to people find the pedal box? It seems pretty cramped to me, with the pedals closer together than my Golf. It's a case of use, I imagine, but the DCT felt so good to me (same pedal box, but only one foot in use)

Just wary of buying one with DCT, and in a few months time wishing I'd given the manual more air time. Or getting bored with the DCT.

In terms of my driving, I commute most days about 6.5 miles each way, not motorway. Mostly 30/40 zones with a short blast of 50. Or I drive to the local station (2 miles). Trips to my parents 35 miles away mostly complete my driving, or day trips to the Dales. I did the NC500 route a few years ago in the Golf, which was fun, but whilst the scenery was great, the sound of the Golf was really bad. I want something that looks, feels and sounds like a sports car, with a degree of practicality. The Golf isn't all that. I actually think the M2 could do with the MPE, but it still sounds so much better than everything I've driven, barring the Cayman S. Which was sublime.

Colour-wise, I think it will be black or grey. Currently it would be a black one.

For the money though, 45-50k ish, I just speculatively looked on Autotrader. M3/4 comp pack, 10k miles, are now under the £50k mark. Both look epic in black, which I've decided is a lovely, slimming but exceptionally mean colour, especially with the coupe lines. A lot more car for the money? But undoubtedly bigger and probably more GT in feeling? Noise not exceptional apparently (despite similar engine to the M2?).

What else? Ditch the practicality and go with 3 year old, flat 6, Cayman/Boxster?

So, as ever with car loving, going round in circles a bit. Will probably put mine up for sale to see what I could get privately for it, and then see what's about. One of the dealers was going to let me know what other pre-reg or build slots might be available on new, with some details on discounts available. I have at least decided that the Golf has to go!

Comments welcome!

Thanks

Sean








f1ten

2,161 posts

152 months

Saturday 28th October 2017
quotequote all
Good write up and I get exactly where you are coming from

I'm also pleased to hear how uninspiring the golf r has been. I didn't even bother testing one when we bought an m135i in January !
Ride quality was not that cars forte but then it is a short wheel base and firmly sprung.
The engine in the m2 is the same 3 l turbo which is quite easily tuneable to over 400hp which is nuts for the little hatch back. Obviously the m2 has a wider track and is superior damped etc but like you say the interior was a let down and as such I chopped my m135i in after 5 months for an m4. Having covered about 3.5k of reasonably quick miles all of which is social funndriving I am very impressed other than in sport plus where the suspension on 19inch rims struggles a bit on B roads. My god though with traction control off the 430hp m4 is a beast. Traction on The m135 didn't seem a problem but the m4 overwhelms the tyres all over the place.

I Personally would go a boxster s or gts if you can as they are much more special than even the m4 but depends what you need the car for.


Lucifer Morningstar

1,561 posts

142 months

Saturday 28th October 2017
quotequote all
Had my M2 for over a year now and still very much enjoying it.

It's a DCT because I daily it, also my previous car was an E46 M3 SMG.

If it were my weekend car or my daily commute was traffic free with a few b-roads in the mix I'd deffo opt for the manual box.

No regrets on DCT at all, suits my lifestyle but do take the time to evaluate the best transmission for you.

The engine is actually a derivative of the N55 using components from the S55 (M3/M4), I suggest having a browse through the technical manual as it explains in detail what's actually gone into the M2:

http://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/attachment.php?at...


For your M2/Cayman dilemma, this is a really good review of the two:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmKJERUYJXQ







homerdog

244 posts

230 months

Sunday 29th October 2017
quotequote all
I had a test drive in a Golf R and, while it would no doubt make a great daily, found it lacked a sense of occasion, so I can see where you are coming from.

Had my M2 for a year now and have to say that it is fantastic. I had two Boxsters before it, both 987 & 981, PDK & manual, which were also fantastic, but I don't regret the switch. Mine is DCT - I was slightly put off by reviews suggesting the manual box wasn't the best - and find it suits the car.

It's interesting that you compared the ride to your E46 sport - I had one of those and find the M2 rides a lot better than that did.

I ruled out an M3/M4 because I prefer the more compact M2.

The M2 also sounds fantastic; add a sports cat downpipe and you won't need the M exhaust. The extra 20-30 bhp is the icing on the cake!


Sdg1973

Original Poster:

9 posts

77 months

Sunday 29th October 2017
quotequote all
Yes. Agree the M2 is nice and compact, and aggressive looking.

Re E46 it wasn’t an M3 and tbh it was a 51 plate so quite a while ago. It was reminiscent rather than me being able to remember exactly what it was like. Just more alive, unlike the Golf.

M3/M4 might be out of reach in any case due to my no claims situation. Don’t much like the thought of dropping a grand or more on insurance.

Pleased you like the DCT though.

Any thoughts on colour?

homerdog

244 posts

230 months

Sunday 29th October 2017
quotequote all
My E46 was only a sport model too, but the thing I remember most about it was the harsh ride, definitely worse than the M2!

As for colour, mine is LBB - I like it, but it's not to everybody's taste! Black looked boring in the showroom, but I saw one on the road recently and it looked great. I didn't like white, seemed to hide the curves. Grey would be my second choice, nicely understated.

ST66N

72 posts

83 months

Sunday 29th October 2017
quotequote all
I went round in circles for about six months before I bought a manual M2. It took me a day or so to get used to the pedal spacing, they were tighter than my previous Civic. I don't notice it now, I've got big feet.

The M4 is a nice car and it does seem like you're getting more for your money. I was tempted but in the end when I saw them both side by side in the showroom I wanted the M2 more. I sort of knew the M2 would have plenty of power for most of the roads I drive anyway.

I liked the Cayman I drove, but for me the price of the 6 cylinder ones is getting a bit daft and I just wasn't sure about the 4 cylinder.

Manual vs DCT - I am very biased towards the manual anyway but I do think it suits the car. Most of the reviews suggest manual for the M2 and DCT for the M4. Everybody has their preferences with this.

I had a MK5 GTI for years and my dad has a MK7 R at the minute. I love Golfs and I think they are an awesome all-rounder but I do think I'd get bored of owning one. The MK7 is ridiculously quick and actually gets better and better the worse the road conditions.

The M2, especially with the manual, takes a bit more driving but it definitely has that sense of occasion that you don't quite get with the Golf. There is a bit of character about it which you'll either value or not. If you don't then the M4 is probably the better bet but if you keep going back to the M2 then go for it.

TuonoPants

276 posts

143 months

Monday 30th October 2017
quotequote all
I've had my LBB manual M2 for just over a year and have done 9000 miles and I still love it. It has more than enough power for daily use and I've also done a couple of track days and it was great fun and not scary at all which is important to me. I looked at the M3 and the M4 but the compact nature of the M2 won me over, I had a Vantage S before the M2 so had done the big GT thing and knew that what I wanted was something more fun (and also less warranty work!).

The only car on the market that would consider swapping the M2 for is a Cayman, I had one a few years ago and it was fantastic, I loved that car.

I've never noticed the off-set pedals or the angled drivers seat, some people make a massive fuss about these things and I can honestly say that I've never once thought about it when driving to M2. I'm too busy hooning about with a stupid grin on my face.

As for colour; I love LBB, second choice with be the grey.

ubbs

648 posts

216 months

Friday 3rd November 2017
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I’ve just bought my LBB dct well I’m about a month in! I absolutely love it I’ve had manual m3’s before an e36 in 96 and an e46 in 05 so I’ve always found these gearboxes agricultural and clunky can’t comment on the m2 manual i didn’t test drive it, but the last 3 cars were all dsg/dct and this beats them all.
My knees are shot now so that’s why I chose dct.

ubbs

648 posts

216 months

Friday 3rd November 2017
quotequote all
Lucifer Morningstar said:
Had my M2 for over a year now and still very much enjoying it.

It's a DCT because I daily it, also my previous car was an E46 M3 SMG.

If it were my weekend car or my daily commute was traffic free with a few b-roads in the mix I'd deffo opt for the manual box.

No regrets on DCT at all, suits my lifestyle but do take the time to evaluate the best transmission for you.

The engine is actually a derivative of the N55 using components from the S55 (M3/M4), I suggest having a browse through the technical manual as it explains in detail what's actually gone into the M2:

http://f87.bimmerpost.com/forums/attachment.php?at...


For your M2/Cayman dilemma, this is a really good review of the two:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HmKJERUYJXQ






I like the Carbon fibre mirrors which ones are they?

jock mcsporran

5,001 posts

272 months

Friday 3rd November 2017
quotequote all
Had my LBB M2 for 3 months and covered 4.5k miles. Perfect size for what I need although would be nice with a tow hook for moving the bikes around.
Wouldn't normally have a non manual sports car but works very well for what I need just now.

evilmiyagi

127 posts

108 months

Monday 6th November 2017
quotequote all
I've just bought an M4 cab.

IMO its a nice blend of GT and Sports car. stick it in D and cruise, its comfy, roomy and generally a nice place to be. Put it in Manual sports plus (chassis, engine and steering can be set separately too) and its a different animal!

In terms of noise, I quite like the sound of the M4... wasn't aware that the M2 sounded any different?

EM

ftypical

457 posts

117 months

Tuesday 7th November 2017
quotequote all
Having owned my manual M2 for just over 2 months while only test driving a DCT, my thoughts:

The pedal placement on the DCT is perfect, but while I was very aware of the pedal offset and spacing when I first got my car I no longer notice it. I do notice the ongoing improvement in the shift quality as the miles rise though.

The shifts on the DCT were everything I could wish for - quick and smooth - when driving in Sport. However, in Comfort the change was just as quick and smooth but there was a delay between pulling the paddle and the shift actually starting, while in Sport+ it seemed no quicker than in Sport but smacked the gear home with a lack a finesse that made me worry about the longevity of the transmission mounts. This was irritating. Obviously, being able to independently set the throttle and shifting so that I could have the Sport+ throttle with the Sport shifting would solve the problem.

HTH

SebringMan

1,773 posts

185 months

Wednesday 8th November 2017
quotequote all
It's funny you say that about the pedal spacing.

I have an SMG E46 M3 and a friend has an M4 manual; yup, its quite a rare beast.

Unless you need to go into first in town the manual is OK around town ; for him that's not a problem as his car never goes into neutral (I never leave a clutch open for as long as him (i.e minutes) due to previous cars I've owned with thrust bearing issues but that's for another time.

The pedal spacing got on my nerves and it did to an extent in my E36 as well.

Anyway, he had to drive my car back one day for a good 70 miles, a trip we'd taken in his M4 only months before. What was the result? He found mine comfier for long distance cruising and better! I was shocked. As a passenger I had more toys to play with in his! That was with his suspension being in comfort. But why?

I came to the same conclusion as you ; the offset pedals and spacing are the issues. You sit way more centrally in an auto/semi-auto car. You can get around it however by shifting the seat forward, which you'll need to for the clutch anyway.

It's partly one reason why we took mine abroad on a long trip.

Sdg1973

Original Poster:

9 posts

77 months

Wednesday 8th November 2017
quotequote all
Thanks to everyone who replied.

I’ve been too busy at work to go look at more cars but have given it plenty of thought.

First garage called me up to check how my manual test drive went (at a different garage). When I said I wasn’t sure about the pedals, she said “why do you want a manual anyway? Most go automatic now”. True, I know, but felt a bit pushy. She said she try to get a 240i manual so I could have a longer drive. Seemingly no demo manuals available.

Second garage also emailed to find out where I was.

And that is here - debating an M3 comp pack (pros - much more practical, nicer colours, better interior and tech, available for 5k more (sometimes less) than the M2’s I was looking at; cons - reports that it’s not as fun as the M2, would be DCT as hardly any manuals out there, bit more expensive to insure, larger).

Or a 7 year old base Carrera 997.2 manual.

Or the Giulia QV.

Or keep the Golf R and buy a lightly used, older Boxster for summer/dry fun. But two cars. Gargh......

My main worry is that most of the time I drive there are just so many cars on the road. I don’t go out for drives for the hell of it, like I used to in nicer cars I owned. I work hard and love cars.

A Porsche dealer told me that the Boxsters are generally more fun than Carreras at or within legal limits. A lot of M2 reviews talk of it being more fun than M3/4 at normal speeds. A lot of Carrera reviews talk of the base model being more fun/usable compared with the S and faster models. It is bewildering how fast modern cars are. And yes, I know one needs to stop somewhere (with self limiting finances).

I’ll test drive the M3. Absolutely love the azurite black and tanzanite blue colours. I’m sure I’ll love the HUD and other tech. But remain concerned that it will be too fast or too unusable, and not enjoyable. Buyer’s remorse on a 50k car would kill me.

I’d like to buy something that I’d be happy with for 5 years or more. Given the frost is starting to appear, also wondering about running my R through the winter and selling in Spring with 6 months left on the warranty. But that is a depressing thought....

nw942

455 posts

104 months

Thursday 9th November 2017
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You do end up going round in circles in situations like this.

Guess the key thing is whether you are going to have two cars or not. If so, something like an Elise/Exige becomes an option, although I concede it is some way from the M2 you originally posted about.

A 1M would be another option, but could become too precious for a DD.

ST66N

72 posts

83 months

Thursday 9th November 2017
quotequote all
I was convinced I was finally going to two cars and it would have been possible this time, having a 'practical' hatchback and something fun. Then I realised I was hardly ever getting the time to go for a drive for the sake of it.

If you're busy/working a lot and you want a car that you can enjoy using daily and enjoy even more when you get a chance for a proper drive then the M2/3/4 seem like the sweet spot for me. Porsches in that price range can be a wee bit leggy and even though I'm not fussy about interiors I have to admit its nice to have the latest smartphone pairing and nav when you are using the car daily.

Giulia, the thought of shelling out that money and having reliability/dealer issues just put me off. They look like awesome cars though!

TuonoPants

276 posts

143 months

Thursday 9th November 2017
quotequote all
ST66N said:
If you're busy/working a lot and you want a car that you can enjoy using daily and enjoy even more when you get a chance for a proper drive then the M2/3/4 seem like the sweet spot for me. Porsches in that price range can be a wee bit leggy and even though I'm not fussy about interiors I have to admit its nice to have the latest smartphone pairing and nav when you are using the car daily.
This captures my requirements really well, I don't have time or space for a "weekend car" so whatever I get needs to be usable every day by me and Mrs Pants but also fun when it needs to be.

The M2 is the perfect fit for what I wanted, I drove it into work today and use it for customer visits etc. and at the weekend I'll use it for a track day (snet300, anyone else going?). It's not the fastest or most powerful but it puts a smile on my face in the corners smile

If the M2 hadn't come along I'd have got another Cayman without hesitation, probably a previous generation GTS.

9k rpm

515 posts

209 months

Thursday 9th November 2017
quotequote all
This is a really nice write up and very timely for me as I’m going to be in a similar quandary in the new year.

Currently driving a 2016 335d estate and previous to that had a E92 M3 Competition Pack. No longer need the space of the estate for the sprog as the wife just got the new X1 so “Me” car time again.

Currently debating M2, M3 or M4 convertible (not coupe). All very different I know and really like the sound of the manual as it’s basically the same in all 3 although I loved the DCT in the E92 M3.

I really like the thought of the M2 although think I’ll need to put child in the back occasionally. M4 convertible is my ideal as I’ve had a folding hard top before and like the versatility and the fact it’s more GT like. I love the shape of the M3 and it would be fastest and most practical. All seem similarly priced too! Decisions decisions......

Sdg1973

Original Poster:

9 posts

77 months

Thursday 9th November 2017
quotequote all
I read a few articles on the 7 speed manual for the 991 Carrera yesterday and realised what I now hate about my Golf. The manual shift. It is lifeless.

Someone described the 991 manual as being too light and not having a very positive action. I’m sure it’s better than my Golf but I was fondly remembering the mechanism feel of my E46 as well as my Cayman.

I doubt that the Golf, as someone else described modern manuals, is much more engaging than paddles tbh. Perhaps this is why I quickly warmed to the M2’s DCT.

So it’s all very well people saying how manuals are so much better but it all depends on how good the manual is. It seems to be a very sorry state of affairs that good manuals are a dying breed.

In the M2, the manual gear change is much better than mine. So why couldn’t they put the seat and/or pedals in a better position?

Having seen the 240i review, I’m also slightly perturbed about the speed possible in a non M car. Technology has just made the speeds that were supercar territory 20 years ago available to a much wider population.

I’ll test drive an M3 and see how I like it. There are a decent number of sub 50k comp packs around, some with very few miles.

My Golf is due it’s second service in 21 days. Wonder if I will end up keeping it unti the Spring. I doubt the cars available are any different then but gives more time for endlessly thinking what I’m going to do.

What’s that line from the incredibles? When everyone is special, no one is...