HELP determining WHEN M2 has been chipped/remapped/dme unit

HELP determining WHEN M2 has been chipped/remapped/dme unit

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Discussion

Jon Man

Original Poster:

7 posts

57 months

Thursday 4th July 2019
quotequote all
Hello,

I am looking for help to gather evidence of when my M2 (2017) has had its DME unit modified, aka when it was remapped / chipped.

I am very much looking to understand the details around how to evidence WHEN it has been modified. Not IF it has, as I have already discovered it has been modified.

The reason I ask is that my M2 is a used car, and the previous owner is not taking responsibility for selling it to me having been modified, and not announcing it had been modified at the point of sale.

I have not had any luck when speaking to private garages nor BMW dealerships / service centres

Thank you for any help!

This is my first post on the forum, apologies if this topic has already been raised as I could not see it.

Jonathan M

UPDATE:
I should have mentioned originally, the car is from an approved used BMW dealership, so BMW have been unhelpful in helping provide such evidence of when it occurred!

Edited by Jon Man on Sunday 7th July 13:16

BFleming

3,599 posts

143 months

Thursday 4th July 2019
quotequote all
Not that many people are going to comment, but these cars don't like being remapped & will usually throw an error code to the same effect - it's a case of hoping no-one has erased the original error code, so you can log in with some specialist code reading software & read the code - complete with a date, time & mileage. However if this code has ever been erased, it'll throw again as soon as the car is restarted - but the original occurrence will be deleted.
I use INPA for this, followed by Ediabas. Other options are available.

M5 London

259 posts

101 months

Friday 5th July 2019
quotequote all
Jon Man said:
Hello,

I am looking for help to gather evidence of when my M2 (2017) has had its DME unit modified, aka when it was remapped / chipped.

I am very much looking to understand the details around how to evidence WHEN it has been modified. Not IF it has, as I have already discovered it has been modified.

The reason I ask is that my M2 is a used car, and the previous owner is not taking responsibility for selling it to me having been modified, and not announcing it had been modified at the point of sale.

I have not had any luck when speaking to private garages nor BMW dealerships / service centres

Thank you for any help!

This is my first post on the forum, apologies if this topic has already been raised as I could not see it.

Jonathan M
Try and call Imran at Evolve to discuss.

He may be able to determine the timing of the first Over Boost event in the logs of the DME.

Just a thought, mind you !

nw942

456 posts

105 months

Friday 5th July 2019
quotequote all
Maybe something like Carly will give you the information you want: https://www.mycarly.com/en/app/bmw/.

Bit easier than IPNA.

meady100

9 posts

104 months

Saturday 6th July 2019
quotequote all
BFleming said:
but these cars don't like being remapped & will usually throw an error code to the same effect.
I'm in all the M2 clubs, and have mine remapped for two years and never heard this opinion. Sure, the N55 doesn't see great gains, but any proper map on ANY car isn't going to throw a CEL as they are coded out.

BFleming

3,599 posts

143 months

Saturday 6th July 2019
quotequote all
meady100 said:
BFleming said:
but these cars don't like being remapped & will usually throw an error code to the same effect.
I'm in all the M2 clubs, and have mine remapped for two years and never heard this opinion. Sure, the N55 doesn't see great gains, but any proper map on ANY car isn't going to throw a CEL as they are coded out.
It's a tamper feature of the ECU; my F11 was remapped just fine, no codes, my F20 has a code to the effect of 'non factory map on ECU'. It's not an opinion, it's literally the way my car is - and my remapper (very knowledgeable & reputable) says it's a feature of the F20. Don't get me wrong, there's no warning light (CEL) or compromised performance (quite the opposite) but when you do a code read, there's always that one lingering code in there.

Jon Man

Original Poster:

7 posts

57 months

Sunday 7th July 2019
quotequote all
Thank you all for the responses! Much appreciated!

I called Imran from Evolve, he says only BMW can access the information, known as 'faster data'. Which is unfortunate because my car came from an approved BMW dealership! So BMW have been unhelpful is sharing this evidence! (I'll update my OP with this, I should have mentioned).

Appreciate the DIY suggestions with apps/software, I'm looking into this.

Also, interesting to read the discussions about remapping.

Max Maxasson

410 posts

183 months

Sunday 7th July 2019
quotequote all
This story amply demonstrates why these kind of cars should be bought directly from an authorised BMW dealership. Any warranty compromising tuning that occurred before you bought the car would then be down to the selling dealer, with him most likely being required to buy the car back.

Jon Man

Original Poster:

7 posts

57 months

Sunday 7th July 2019
quotequote all
@Max, it is from a bmw dealership! That's what I meant by approved used BMW car. They claim that it went through the pre sale BMW checks but obviously that's not the case hence why I'm trying to gather evidence

Edited by Jon Man on Sunday 7th July 21:50

Heartworm

1,923 posts

161 months

Sunday 7th July 2019
quotequote all
Max Maxasson said:
This story amply demonstrates why these kind of cars should be bought directly from an authorised BMW dealership. Any warranty compromising tuning that occurred before you bought the car would then be down to the selling dealer, with him most likely being required to buy the car back.
Which is exactly the problem the OP is having, but having to prove it was there before purchase.

Max Maxasson

410 posts

183 months

Sunday 7th July 2019
quotequote all
Heartworm said:
Which is exactly the problem the OP is having, but having to prove it was there before purchase.
"the previous owner is not taking responsibility for selling it to me having been modified"
I read that to mean he didn't buy it from a BMW dealer...but if he did then he has zero problems.

cuprabob

14,602 posts

214 months

Sunday 7th July 2019
quotequote all
Max Maxasson said:
Heartworm said:
Which is exactly the problem the OP is having, but having to prove it was there before purchase.
"the previous owner is not taking responsibility for selling it to me having been modified"
I read that to mean he didn't buy it from a BMW dealer...but if he did then he has zero problems.
It could be that he now has an issue and the dealer is refusing to resolve it due to it being mapped and the dealer is saying it was mapped under the OP's ownership and it was standard when sold.

I guess the OP is trying to ascertain evidence of when it was mapped to prove to the dealer it was mapped when they sold it.

Max Maxasson

410 posts

183 months

Monday 8th July 2019
quotequote all
The OP needs to chip in to clarify....but I reckon:
He bought it privately and has since found out its been modified.
The guy he bought it from, got it from a BMW dealer.

The OP now wants to figure when it was ECU modified.....during the ownership period of the guy he bought it from or was it already modified when the previous owner bought it from a BMW dealer.
BMW probably don't want to help in case it puts the liability on them.

M5 London

259 posts

101 months

Monday 8th July 2019
quotequote all
Max Maxasson said:
The OP needs to chip in to clarify....but I reckon:
He bought it privately and has since found out its been modified.
The guy he bought it from, got it from a BMW dealer.

The OP now wants to figure when it was ECU modified.....during the ownership period of the guy he bought it from or was it already modified when the previous owner bought it from a BMW dealer.
BMW probably don't want to help in case it puts the liability on them.
I think the OP has now made it very clear that he purchased this car as a BMW Approved Used Car from a BMW Dealership, himself.

Jon Man

Original Poster:

7 posts

57 months

Monday 8th July 2019
quotequote all
Apologies for any lack of clarity from my posts.

It is as M5 and cuprabob understood, I purchased a BMW approved used car (M2) from a BMW dealership. The dealership denies any responsibility, including claiming to have asked the previous owners if they modified it.

A bit more information if interesting/relevant, which I didn't want to over complicated the initial request with at the start:
2 weeks after purchase (june 2018) my M2 broke down in dangerous conditions (drive train and cruise control failure on the motorway, leading to power completely cutting off). In short, my local bmw service centre didn't find anything wrong (not the same place I purchased the car from).
The same issue reoccured in exactly the same way around 10 months later, my local bmw service centre then discovered the DME was modified.
Skipping ahead of everything I've gone through with BMW (and the many departments), here I am, trying to gather evidence.

Edited by Jon Man on Monday 8th July 14:24


Edited by Jon Man on Monday 8th July 14:25

Max Maxasson

410 posts

183 months

Monday 8th July 2019
quotequote all
A BMW with a modified ECU should not be sold by a BMW dealer as an AUC car....as it invalidates the drivetrain warranty.
There has been a previous case (noted on M3cutters) where in a similar case an M3 was found by a dealer to have a modified ECU and its drivetrain warranty was invalidated. The owner went back to the supplying BMW dealer and got his money back.

autohead

88 posts

106 months

Monday 8th July 2019
quotequote all
You need to go to the selling dealer and demand a refund or the very least fitting of a new standard engine control unit if the warranty is not void.

If the car is under finance speak to the finance company or ombudsman if you get nowhere with BMW.

The used approved pre-delivery check done by BMW will not show if a remap is installed unless it brings up a fault code which in unlikely as the issue would of been found at the first breakdown diagnosis.

I think you will struggle to find out when the map was uploaded unless you find the tuner who fitted it.

helix402

7,859 posts

182 months

Monday 8th July 2019
quotequote all
No need for a new DME, just put the current BMW software on the existing one. (Sorry no answers for fixing the OP’s issue)

autohead

88 posts

106 months

Monday 8th July 2019
quotequote all
helix402 said:
No need for a new DME, just put the current BMW software on the existing one. (Sorry no answers for fixing the OP’s issue)
True, but sometimes a chip is soldered into the DME.

BFleming

3,599 posts

143 months

Monday 8th July 2019
quotequote all
autohead said:
helix402 said:
No need for a new DME, just put the current BMW software on the existing one. (Sorry no answers for fixing the OP’s issue)
True, but sometimes a chip is soldered into the DME.
I haven't come across a soldered in chip yet, just a remap of existing hardware. But agreed, plenty of places will revert the software to the factory spec. Even BMW themselves did it on my previous car (fixed price of £120 to upgrade the software on all modules).