So I just bought an M2 Comp

[Shanksy87]

kick buttowski said:

This and the kangarooing much improved by CS transmission flash.

Mine seems to be fitted with the '1982 worn out Toyota Hilux steering feel option'.

Anyone know of a fix for this? Litchfield geo improved it slightly but my god, the steering is truly appalling in this car.

Have you taken it to BMW for diagnosis, or driven another example for comparison? The steering in my M2 is very sharp and precise.

Edited by Shanksy87 on Friday 16th April 15:05

[kick buttowski]

Regarding the steering, the wandering, severe tramlining, vagueness around centre and bump steer are all characteristics of this model, apparently. Some research will reveal reviewers who comment on and criticise the steering but they tend to be the honest, proper reviewers who dont have interests to protect. BMW checked it at the RIS and said its fine, although they only drove it a total of 0.5 mile round town so not a real test. As I said before, the steering is just like a worn out Toyota Hilux. Mine is a July 2020 build and its possible that the last built models ran different steering software.

A bit of research leads me to understand that there are third party software fixes that can improve these problems but I am a bit reluctant to go down the modifying route on a three month old car knowing that I kiss goodbye to my warranty.

I had hoped that a bit more toe in (within the spec parameters) would improve the wandering and there was a very slight improvement, but its still ste.

Like everything, it all comes back to your experience and terms of reference.

I happen to strongly disagree with the often made assertion that this is one of the best M cars. This particular car replaced our 2017 Golf 7.5 R 310. I can quite honestly say that the Golf was a better car in every measurable way. Oh, and performance wise, despite giving away 100 bhp, in straight line terms it was almost as quick, and on a twisty b road the M2 wouldnt see which way the Golf went.

Had I been able to drive the M2 comp first, I would not have bought it, purely based on the appalling steering.

All my personal opinion of course and I hope other owners are delighted with their cars. If I could fix the steering, I would be a happy owner because apart from this there is much to like about the car. Steering is, however, so fundamental to the way it drives that it ruins it for me.

[Terminator X]

So the M2 steering "wanders" yet a chattering wheel on a Porsche is full of feel

Not noticed a single steering issue with mine.

TX.

Edit - KB above is talking absolute bks imho. Not as good as a Golf

[cerb4.5lee]

kick buttowski said:

Regarding the steering, the wandering, severe tramlining,

Having been away from a BMW for 3.5 years the tramlining was one of the first things I noticed about my new to me F82 M4 being fair. It isn't bad enough to put me off the car(and it is just the way beemers seem to be set up for me), plus the E90 330d and 330i I had years ago suffered from the same thing too(I always blamed the runflats mainly on those though).

[Reg Local]

Steering feel in the M2C is directly related to the active "M" differential & how you drive the car through corners. It requires an almost 911esque approach where you should sort your speed out on approach and be on the gas right at the point of turn-in. Not hard on the gas at first - just enough to maintain your entry speed, and then increase the acceleration through & out of the corner.

If you adopt this style, the car will turn in with the diff almost completely open, and then gradually lock the diff as you drive through & out of the corner. In my view, it brings the steering alive & almost feels like the car has a variable wheelbase - short on turn-in and long on exit.

I've tried to explain it & demonstrate it all here:

https://youtu.be/m_GcQvHHyRE

[ben5575]

Reg Local said:

Steering feel in the M2C is directly related to the active "M" differential & how you drive the car through corners. It requires an almost 911esque approach where you should sort your speed out on approach and be on the gas right at the point of turn-in. Not hard on the gas at first - just enough to maintain your entry speed, and then increase the acceleration through & out of the corner.

If you adopt this style, the car will turn in with the diff almost completely open, and then gradually lock the diff as you drive through & out of the corner. In my view, it brings the steering alive & almost feels like the car has a variable wheelbase - short on turn-in and long on exit.

I've tried to explain it & demonstrate it all here:

https://youtu.be/m_GcQvHHyRE

That's a great video Reg, I hadn't seen it before.

I know the roads in it well and the section where you explain the progressive braking then throttle application before, through and out of a corner and how you can feel the diff 'hook up' describes exactly how it feels to drive the car (and the inner monologue I have when I'm driving those same roads).

I now feel vindicated for waxing on about the diff now on the previous page

In that same post I also mentioned the over zealous mapping in Sport+ when initially feathering the throttle to balance the car as you turn in to a corner. Have you noticed this and how do you manage it please?

I find switching from Sport+ to Sport dulls the throttle response too much and I also suspect it dials down the e diff as well (it feels like it to me in any case) so generally detracts from the experience.

I suppose left foot braking to better blend the braking and the initial throttle application might help?

[Shanksy87]

kick buttowski said:

Regarding the steering, the wandering, severe tramlining, vagueness around centre and bump steer are all characteristics of this model, apparently. Some research will reveal reviewers who comment on and criticise the steering but they tend to be the honest, proper reviewers who dont have interests to protect. BMW checked it at the RIS and said its fine, although they only drove it a total of 0.5 mile round town so not a real test. As I said before, the steering is just like a worn out Toyota Hilux. Mine is a July 2020 build and its possible that the last built models ran different steering software.

A bit of research leads me to understand that there are third party software fixes that can improve these problems but I am a bit reluctant to go down the modifying route on a three month old car knowing that I kiss goodbye to my warranty.

I had hoped that a bit more toe in (within the spec parameters) would improve the wandering and there was a very slight improvement, but its still ste.

Like everything, it all comes back to your experience and terms of reference.

I happen to strongly disagree with the often made assertion that this is one of the best M cars. This particular car replaced our 2017 Golf 7.5 R 310. I can quite honestly say that the Golf was a better car in every measurable way. Oh, and performance wise, despite giving away 100 bhp, in straight line terms it was almost as quick, and on a twisty b road the M2 wouldnt see which way the Golf went.

Had I been able to drive the M2 comp first, I would not have bought it, purely based on the appalling steering.

All my personal opinion of course and I hope other owners are delighted with their cars. If I could fix the steering, I would be a happy owner because apart from this there is much to like about the car. Steering is, however, so fundamental to the way it drives that it ruins it for me.

That's unfortunate. Mine is an August build car and while the steering is not great on feel it doesn't wander or hunt out cambers. That's one of the main reason I like it as if you turn everything off it is just a normal no hassle car. I did however immediately swap to Cup 2 tyres so perhaps that is a factor at play. My E46 in comparison drives like a truck with a losing steering wheel.

I assume you've had the chance to swap out the tyres to make sure there isn't a carcass weakness under load, and checked tyres pressures and other basics? You really shouldn't be having this issue, especially if you're prior yard stick was a golf. That's not the say the BMW is leaps ahead, but it's certainly not miles behind.

[kick buttowski]

Shanksy87 said:

That's unfortunate. Mine is an August build car and while the steering is not great on feel it doesn't wander or hunt out cambers. That's one of the main reason I like it as if you turn everything off it is just a normal no hassle car. I did however immediately swap to Cup 2 tyres so perhaps that is a factor at play. My E46 in comparison drives like a truck with a losing steering wheel.

I assume you've had the chance to swap out the tyres to make sure there isn't a carcass weakness under load, and checked tyres pressures and other basics? You really shouldn't be having this issue, especially if you're prior yard stick was a golf. That's not the say the BMW is leaps ahead, but it's certainly not miles behind.

Wasnt using the Golf R as a yardstick but it was the previous car so a comparison is inevitable. The Golf had non existent steering feel and a horrid 7 speed dsg and it was a surprise to find the M2 even worse steering wise. We bought the Golf R to replace a 2015 F80 M3 manual, which was a great car but at the time I was racking up too many miles, got worried about depreciation / running costs and sold it privately for a good price. The Golf was a stop gap car which we ended up keeping for 3 years - longest ever I kept a car.

So I really thought the M2 comp would be similar to the M3 but smaller. Was very wrong on that. F80 steering was the usual eps lack of feel but fine in other respects, nothing untoward. The M3 was also on Supersports, like the M2. I'm tempted to try changing to the MPS4S in the hope of improving things.

[Pupp]

Maybe worth driving another M2C as a reality check? If that feels the same then it confirms you don’t gel with the car design; if it’s acceptable or good then would tend to suggest there’s an issue with yours that needs addressing.

Have to say I’m really liking the way mine handles and behaves; sure it shuffles and tramlines a touch on uneven surfaces but it’s never less than precise and predictable. On Cup 2s, which I put on right after buying so no relevant experience on more general use rubber.

Hope you resolve as I’m increasingly thinking the car is a corker.

Just need to remember how wide that rear track is however...

[Reg Local]

ben5575 said:

In that same post I also mentioned the over zealous mapping in Sport+ when initially feathering the throttle to balance the car as you turn in to a corner. Have you noticed this and how do you manage it please?

I find switching from Sport+ to Sport dulls the throttle response too much and I also suspect it dials down the e diff as well (it feels like it to me in any case) so generally detracts from the experience.

I suppose left foot braking to better blend the braking and the initial throttle application might help?

This might sound like an odd solution, but bare with me...

I’ve had several clients who have struggled with smoothly applying the gas in cars with aggressive throttle maps. The worst was a Lexus RC F which the owner complained was “impossible” to set off smoothly from stationary.

I jumped in & set off perfectly smoothly without even trying, so I was clearly doing something different, so we had to work out what it was.

I was tensing my calf muscle.

Thats it! I got the client to tense his right calf muscle and it gave him much better control over smaller & more delicate throttle inputs & it completely smoothed out his issues with the RC F.

This technique will definitely help you in sport+ mode in the M2C.

[Pupp]

So, is it right buttock clenched for left hand bends, and left for rights? With both on those ‘oh st’ moments...

Good tip ‘though; looking forward to trying that one as it catches me out in the twisties occasionally. Will be cursing you if I get cramp however!

[ChocolateFrog]

ben5575 said:

Try and get through the first 1200 miles as quickly as you can so you can enjoy it properly

Or better yet thrash it from the first time you've warmed it up and those rings properly bedded in, your engine will thank you in the long run.

The 1200 mile thing is only so you don't bin it booting it off the forecourt.

[kick buttowski]

ChocolateFrog said:

Or better yet thrash it from the first time you've warmed it up and those rings properly bedded in, your engine will thank you in the long run.

The 1200 mile thing is only so you don't bin it booting it off the forecourt.

The 1200 mile thing is apparently because the engine and diff run a different oil which is changed at the RIS.

I've often heard this view about running in, usually from people who havent spent a load of their own dosh on a new motor. If you blew your new motor up after a few thousand miles, I expect BMW could check the ECU to see what rpm was being used, and decline your warranty claim.

My S1000RR motorcycle had very specific running in requirements and needed a RIS to change the running in oil. Until that point, the rev limit was capped, and it was lifted at the RIS. IIRC the ECU increased the rev limit during the running in period as well.

We always used to run in motorcycle and car engines. Maybe if you are racing it might be different but then race engines arent usually expected to last for ten plus years.

I had high power Cosworth YB engines built back in the day by the likes of Graham Goode and Brodie Brittain Racing and was always instructed to run in carefully - ie little load, warm up gently, increase rpm gently with mileage and they always gave good power. I have too much mechanical sympathy to screw the beejesus out of a new motor. But hey, what do I know.

[Square Leg]

I have an M2C and a 2019 Golf R.
On a wet and twisty B road the Golf is indeed a fair bit better than the M2.
On a dry one though, the M is the better car but not by as much as most would like to think.

I’ve had no such issues with the steering on the M though.

Prior to both these cars had an early F80 M3. Didn’t like it much.

Edited by Square Leg on Friday 16th April 23:51

[LamedonM]

Reg Local said:

Steering feel in the M2C is directly related to the active "M" differential & how you drive the car through corners. It requires an almost 911esque approach where you should sort your speed out on approach and be on the gas right at the point of turn-in. Not hard on the gas at first - just enough to maintain your entry speed, and then increase the acceleration through & out of the corner.

If you adopt this style, the car will turn in with the diff almost completely open, and then gradually lock the diff as you drive through & out of the corner. In my view, it brings the steering alive & almost feels like the car has a variable wheelbase - short on turn-in and long on exit.

I've tried to explain it & demonstrate it all here:

https://youtu.be/m_GcQvHHyRE

I just watched it. Really informative

[survivalist]

Square Leg said:

I have an M2C and a 2019 Golf R.
On a wet and twisty B road the Golf is indeed a fair bit better than the M2.
On a dry one though, the M is the better car but not by as much as most would like to think.

I’ve had no such issues with the steering on the M though.

Prior to both these cars had an early F80 M3. Didn’t like it much.

Edited by Square Leg on Friday 16th April 23:51

Interesting you say that.

I drove DCT and manual versions of both the E92 M3 and the M2 before settling on a DCT M3. Steering feel was a big part of the decision. Would normally always choose a manual, but the DCT suits the S65 engine and the manual ratios are too long.

Now looking to replace the 335i estate family car with something a bit newer and the Golf R Estate, 340i and F80 M3 are the likely candidates, with the M3 and the Golf front runners.

What didn’t you like about the F80 M3?

[Square Leg]

I found the ride appalling- comfort mode was far removed from my idea of comfort as was possible.
I’m not adverse to hard rides - I’ve had 3 Exiges and a 4C, but the M3 was just awful.
Traction was an issue too, even in the dry.
It was used as the family car - we did 35k miles in 3 years, mainly driven by the Mrs but even the kids found it uncomfortable in the back.
This was one of the first 2014 cars, so I’m not sure if they got better.

[survivalist]

Square Leg said:

I found the ride appalling- comfort mode was far removed from my idea of comfort as was possible.
I’m not adverse to hard rides - I’ve had 3 Exiges and a 4C, but the M3 was just awful.
Traction was an issue too, even in the dry.
It was used as the family car - we did 35k miles in 3 years, mainly driven by the Mrs but even the kids found it uncomfortable in the back.
This was one of the first 2014 cars, so I’m not sure if they got better.

Thanks. How’s the golf r as a comparison. My main reason for considering one is that I Already own (and have owned) a fair few BMWs.

The golf estate seems to be about the right size, quick and still have some character.

[mr momo]

Square Leg said:

I have an M2C and a 2019 Golf R.
On a wet and twisty B road the Golf is indeed a fair bit better than the M2.
On a dry one though, the M is the better car but not by as much as most would like to think.

I’ve had no such issues with the steering on the M though.

Prior to both these cars had an early F80 M3. Didn’t like it much.

Edited by Square Leg on Friday 16th April 23:51

I traded my 2018 7.5 Golf R for my M2C and agree about wet and twisties v dry. I hated the 7spd DSG (worse than the mk7 6spd). In the dry, the grip/turn-in in the M2C is phenomenal.

Not loving the steering wheel - far too thick and leather is weirdly like PVC.

But this morning’s 70 mile ‘jaunt’ was just fun...

[Square Leg]

survivalist said:

Thanks. How’s the golf r as a comparison. My main reason for considering one is that I Already own (and have owned) a fair few BMWs.

The golf estate seems to be about the right size, quick and still have some character.

First Golf we’ve ever had - bought primarily for the Mrs to do 15k miles a year in.
I’m actually very impressed with it.
As a family car it’s great - does everything you could want, is quick, good in bad weather, economical, cheap to insure and relatively cheap to service.
We have the larger wheels but didn’t spec the super duper suspension, and whilst it’s firm it’s miles ahead of the M3 ‘comfort’ setting.
It’s also sure footed on our farmer strewn B roads, which can’t be said for the M2...