Discussion
My advice would be wary of cars in the 60-70,000 mile bracket.
I've found that cars with that mileage are often due a number of expensive repairs, from discs all round to a clutch, and it's also around the time that other components can fail - from sensors to things like air pumps and steering racks.
Some cars can be found that have had all that work done, but if you bought one with no evidence of them being done, I'd say you are buying a time bomb.
It's easy to pay out £3K on an M5, just after you've bought it.
I've found that cars with that mileage are often due a number of expensive repairs, from discs all round to a clutch, and it's also around the time that other components can fail - from sensors to things like air pumps and steering racks.
Some cars can be found that have had all that work done, but if you bought one with no evidence of them being done, I'd say you are buying a time bomb.
It's easy to pay out £3K on an M5, just after you've bought it.
Trade price on these is not high at the moment, so it may be that people are looking for a quick sale with some more money that a dealer is offering.
As someone else pointed out check for evidence of being cared for and that major jobs have been done etc, but remember that it was a £60K car - servicing and parts aren't cheap, but for the money, nothing on the road comes close.
As someone else pointed out check for evidence of being cared for and that major jobs have been done etc, but remember that it was a £60K car - servicing and parts aren't cheap, but for the money, nothing on the road comes close.
I think that mileage is not really a large consideration for me when buying. That said, I'd rather have a 70K over a 100K car at the same price.
When I bought my (60K) elise I knew the fan resistor, steering rack and alternator had already been replaced.... I've still had to re-do the lot.
I think its all about condition really. Certainly checking pads/disks/tyres would be important. I'd obviously check the clutch wasn't slipping, but there is no easy way I know of to work out how much time a clutch has left. I'd also do the old fuel consumption MAF test too.
Maybe I should just hang fire a bit until I have a bit more of a war chest ready... .the only problem with this plan is a likely move to london in 8months or so, which would be the end of 'fun' car ownership for potentially a few years, I dont want to miss the chance to have a M5 for a bit....
d'oh!
When I bought my (60K) elise I knew the fan resistor, steering rack and alternator had already been replaced.... I've still had to re-do the lot.
I think its all about condition really. Certainly checking pads/disks/tyres would be important. I'd obviously check the clutch wasn't slipping, but there is no easy way I know of to work out how much time a clutch has left. I'd also do the old fuel consumption MAF test too.
Maybe I should just hang fire a bit until I have a bit more of a war chest ready... .the only problem with this plan is a likely move to london in 8months or so, which would be the end of 'fun' car ownership for potentially a few years, I dont want to miss the chance to have a M5 for a bit....
d'oh!
stuthemong said:
I think that mileage is not really a large consideration for me when buying. That said, I'd rather have a 70K over a 100K car at the same price.
When I bought my (60K) elise I knew the fan resistor, steering rack and alternator had already been replaced.... I've still had to re-do the lot.
I think its all about condition really. Certainly checking pads/disks/tyres would be important. I'd obviously check the clutch wasn't slipping, but there is no easy way I know of to work out how much time a clutch has left. I'd also do the old fuel consumption MAF test too.
Maybe I should just hang fire a bit until I have a bit more of a war chest ready... .the only problem with this plan is a likely move to london in 8months or so, which would be the end of 'fun' car ownership for potentially a few years, I dont want to miss the chance to have a M5 for a bit....
d'oh!
If youre not planning on keeping it for long why not take a punt on a 9k one? Over 100k miles probably but Im sure there are good ones, just a bit leggy. When I bought my (60K) elise I knew the fan resistor, steering rack and alternator had already been replaced.... I've still had to re-do the lot.
I think its all about condition really. Certainly checking pads/disks/tyres would be important. I'd obviously check the clutch wasn't slipping, but there is no easy way I know of to work out how much time a clutch has left. I'd also do the old fuel consumption MAF test too.
Maybe I should just hang fire a bit until I have a bit more of a war chest ready... .the only problem with this plan is a likely move to london in 8months or so, which would be the end of 'fun' car ownership for potentially a few years, I dont want to miss the chance to have a M5 for a bit....
d'oh!
I'm pretty sure 9K gets you an OK car now, hardly a leggy one at all.
http://pistonheads.co.uk/sales/781351.htm
http://pistonheads.co.uk/sales/797227.htm
http://pistonheads.co.uk/sales/796201.htm
6K is the price you can get a leggy one for
My judgement of the market is that a 2000/2001 facelift is the magic place to aim. 9K should get you a nice one, and that should be a lot easier to shift one K down, than a 6.5K dog.
There are some really nice cars at the 10K level, real nice ones !!
<no. must. keep. elise.>
http://pistonheads.co.uk/sales/781351.htm
http://pistonheads.co.uk/sales/797227.htm
http://pistonheads.co.uk/sales/796201.htm
6K is the price you can get a leggy one for
My judgement of the market is that a 2000/2001 facelift is the magic place to aim. 9K should get you a nice one, and that should be a lot easier to shift one K down, than a 6.5K dog.
There are some really nice cars at the 10K level, real nice ones !!
<no. must. keep. elise.>
This is simply fantastic. The prospect of owning a £60k+ car that I had many a dream about not six years ago is now within budget.
To the OP: if you can afford it, do it. You will love the sonorous V8, the torque, the Q-Car looks, the thrum from the quad pipes and the fact that you can light up the rears with ease in the first three cogs.
Just go for facelift, no wood and <80k with FBMWSH in a good colour that hasn't been smoked in = a very happy chappy indeed!
I have a company car and do 30k plus a year so unless I want to further boost BP's ridiculous profits then I can't have one.
Oh, look at this... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JwjMn6ltba0
To the OP: if you can afford it, do it. You will love the sonorous V8, the torque, the Q-Car looks, the thrum from the quad pipes and the fact that you can light up the rears with ease in the first three cogs.
Just go for facelift, no wood and <80k with FBMWSH in a good colour that hasn't been smoked in = a very happy chappy indeed!
I have a company car and do 30k plus a year so unless I want to further boost BP's ridiculous profits then I can't have one.
Oh, look at this... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JwjMn6ltba0
I'm not buying yet, I'd need to sell the elise first, if I can be bothered.... toughy. I'm really not sure what to do, just musing in this thread really for my amusement 
If I did sell the elise it would be for
a) a e39m5
b) cerbera
c) cheapy McCheap deisel golf or something to have some budget motoring
d) honda powered elise
Nonetheless, if I were buying a M5 right now, I'd not be paying 10K for that car. Is that yours? It's not a good deal compared to a lot of others out there;
http://pistonheads.com/sales/797227.htm
also recent new clutch and vanos, but 10K less miles, 30% cheaper...
The problem I have is that I know if I got a non-facelift one, I'd want to upgrade front xenons, steering wheel and NAV screen to the facelift versions (I think it really brings the car up to date)...... as that would cost £1-1.5K or so to do + the hassle, I'd be much better off buying a facelift car to start with, unless it was a super bargain M5 (the one above looks pretty keen, with maybe £500 off that's bargaintastic)
Still though, compared to all the other cars on my list, bar c), the e39 m5 seems to be offering tremendous value. Tremendous. If the elise sounded like the M5 I'd probably be keeping it. I need a V8 in my life, never had one
If I did sell the elise it would be for
a) a e39m5
b) cerbera
c) cheapy McCheap deisel golf or something to have some budget motoring
d) honda powered elise
Nonetheless, if I were buying a M5 right now, I'd not be paying 10K for that car. Is that yours? It's not a good deal compared to a lot of others out there;
http://pistonheads.com/sales/797227.htm
also recent new clutch and vanos, but 10K less miles, 30% cheaper...
The problem I have is that I know if I got a non-facelift one, I'd want to upgrade front xenons, steering wheel and NAV screen to the facelift versions (I think it really brings the car up to date)...... as that would cost £1-1.5K or so to do + the hassle, I'd be much better off buying a facelift car to start with, unless it was a super bargain M5 (the one above looks pretty keen, with maybe £500 off that's bargaintastic
)Still though, compared to all the other cars on my list, bar c), the e39 m5 seems to be offering tremendous value. Tremendous. If the elise sounded like the M5 I'd probably be keeping it. I need a V8 in my life, never had one
Edited by stuthemong on Sunday 23 November 13:59
What is wrong with a £6k E39 M5? Given its got history high milage isnt an issue + its only £6k so even if you had to sell it for £3k then you have hardly lost much - you could easily lost £5k in a short period of time on a £10k M5.
Provided the Tyres are fresh - discs & pads have a fair bit of life in them and its newly serviced/negotiate the service cost off the asking price then how can you lose?
Provided the Tyres are fresh - discs & pads have a fair bit of life in them and its newly serviced/negotiate the service cost off the asking price then how can you lose?
Welshbeef said:
What is wrong with a £6k E39 M5? Given its got history high milage isnt an issue + its only £6k so even if you had to sell it for £3k then you have hardly lost much - you could easily lost £5k in a short period of time on a £10k M5.
Provided the Tyres are fresh - discs & pads have a fair bit of life in them and its newly serviced/negotiate the service cost off the asking price then how can you lose?
Would you rush in and by it? Easier to tell someone to buy a car than actually do it, wouldnt you say Welsh? Provided the Tyres are fresh - discs & pads have a fair bit of life in them and its newly serviced/negotiate the service cost off the asking price then how can you lose?
Of course I woundn't rush into buying any car - but in principle what i said above stands for any car.
One area where I guess you would get wear& annoying wear is drivers seat steering wheel gear knob & dash buttons... which you wouldnt replace & can make a car look tatty/well used. New seats are a fortune.
One area where I guess you would get wear& annoying wear is drivers seat steering wheel gear knob & dash buttons... which you wouldnt replace & can make a car look tatty/well used. New seats are a fortune.
Welshbeef,
I totally agree with you, ish. The facelift cars had improved piston rings (less oil use) and a vanos accumulator pump (which reduces stress on the vanos -> longer life) - these two things are quite attractive amongst the other cosmetic improvements.
That said, a lot of the M5's had the vanos accumulator retrofitted, and that's the bigger problem solved.
I am certain there are some perfectly serviceable 6K m5's out there, but the facelifts look so much more modern though. I totally take your point about a 6K m5 having a lot less to lose than a 10K one, and that is fair. The only issue is I know that I'd definitely want the facelift wheel at a minimum, which with the correct airbag is expensive. My money would be better placed buying a facelift to begin with I Think.......
I think it entirely possible to buy a 6K M5 and run it for a year and not lose any money on it come resale. If you remember what happened to the e36M3's - they tanked down to the 6K level, then sat there for ages and were bought/sold on condition.
Of course, the 11K e46m3's haven't escaped my attention either, but perhaps further suggest I'd be better getting one of the cheaper M5's.........
If I did get a 6K M5, I could almost get a westfield aswell!
I totally agree with you, ish. The facelift cars had improved piston rings (less oil use) and a vanos accumulator pump (which reduces stress on the vanos -> longer life) - these two things are quite attractive amongst the other cosmetic improvements.
That said, a lot of the M5's had the vanos accumulator retrofitted, and that's the bigger problem solved.
I am certain there are some perfectly serviceable 6K m5's out there, but the facelifts look so much more modern though. I totally take your point about a 6K m5 having a lot less to lose than a 10K one, and that is fair. The only issue is I know that I'd definitely want the facelift wheel at a minimum, which with the correct airbag is expensive. My money would be better placed buying a facelift to begin with I Think.......
I think it entirely possible to buy a 6K M5 and run it for a year and not lose any money on it come resale. If you remember what happened to the e36M3's - they tanked down to the 6K level, then sat there for ages and were bought/sold on condition.
Of course, the 11K e46m3's haven't escaped my attention either, but perhaps further suggest I'd be better getting one of the cheaper M5's.........
If I did get a 6K M5, I could almost get a westfield aswell!
I wasnt aware of the engine differences & as you say a number of those items do make it more appealing for a face lift vs non face lift.
Ive never sat in one so (could be beneficial) given ive never seen a face lift interior I may be over the moon with what the non offers + its not far off half the money.
I think it really could be a "free motoring for a year" car at £6k - that is assuming you dont have to shell out for new discs, pads, tyres, camchains, full inspection 2, shocks, bushes etc... then clearly you'd be better off buying the more expensive newer one with that work done - or just keep looking for a better example.
I would say with cars like the M5 you really do need to see quite a few examples say 4/5 to know what is good & bad & also why not look at one double your budget to really know how a good one should be so you can then compare against cars within your budget.
For me I'd say the E36 M3 is a little too old/looks dated IMHO - and as the E46 M3 can be bought from the £8k mark its a much newer safer, better looking, better M3 in all areas I'd say try to get one of those over the E36.
But an E36 M3 at the sub £4k mark well thats tempting.
Ive never sat in one so (could be beneficial) given ive never seen a face lift interior I may be over the moon with what the non offers + its not far off half the money.
I think it really could be a "free motoring for a year" car at £6k - that is assuming you dont have to shell out for new discs, pads, tyres, camchains, full inspection 2, shocks, bushes etc... then clearly you'd be better off buying the more expensive newer one with that work done - or just keep looking for a better example.
I would say with cars like the M5 you really do need to see quite a few examples say 4/5 to know what is good & bad & also why not look at one double your budget to really know how a good one should be so you can then compare against cars within your budget.
For me I'd say the E36 M3 is a little too old/looks dated IMHO - and as the E46 M3 can be bought from the £8k mark its a much newer safer, better looking, better M3 in all areas I'd say try to get one of those over the E36.
But an E36 M3 at the sub £4k mark well thats tempting.
Have you seen a e46 at 8K?? Where? Monster!
Of course your point about big bills multiplying cost of ownership are fair, but to be honest if I bought the wrong 10K car I'd be in the same boat.
-Tyres/brakes/clutch/servicing/vanos all need to be factored in. That said, a lot of these cars, even the cheap ones, seem to tick a lot of boxes! The engine mods are supposed to improve longeivty/reduce oil usage - they do not offer more power. One could argue that if the engine has done 100K and still pulls like a train, it should do a fair few more miles before needing attention. These engines (other than oil and vanos) seem to be quite capable/happy to take high miles.
The point I failed to make
on the e36 m3 was that I think that the M5 will come down and hover around this 6K mark. I dont think it's a 4K car. Not for the forseeable. This is what happened with the e36 m3, it stuck at 6K for ages, now of course it's got quite a bit cheaper.
I A/B testdrove a £27K 2002 M5 against a 2003 £27K M3 when I bought the M3 a couple of years back, so I know what a mint condition car should look/pull/feel like. The one thing about the M5 that stood out was the suspension's ability to absorb B-road humps&bumps - it just glided over them whereas the M3 was moved around a bit.
Of course your point about big bills multiplying cost of ownership are fair, but to be honest if I bought the wrong 10K car I'd be in the same boat.
-Tyres/brakes/clutch/servicing/vanos all need to be factored in. That said, a lot of these cars, even the cheap ones, seem to tick a lot of boxes! The engine mods are supposed to improve longeivty/reduce oil usage - they do not offer more power. One could argue that if the engine has done 100K and still pulls like a train, it should do a fair few more miles before needing attention. These engines (other than oil and vanos) seem to be quite capable/happy to take high miles.
The point I failed to make
on the e36 m3 was that I think that the M5 will come down and hover around this 6K mark. I dont think it's a 4K car. Not for the forseeable. This is what happened with the e36 m3, it stuck at 6K for ages, now of course it's got quite a bit cheaper. I A/B testdrove a £27K 2002 M5 against a 2003 £27K M3 when I bought the M3 a couple of years back, so I know what a mint condition car should look/pull/feel like. The one thing about the M5 that stood out was the suspension's ability to absorb B-road humps&bumps - it just glided over them whereas the M3 was moved around a bit.
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