Mantlepiece clock parts
Discussion
Hi, my 1930s mantelpiece clock time does not work, chime does when hands are moved. I did not know where in this forum to place this advert so apologies if its in the wrong one.
I have taken it apart and tried to clean/ oil it, but still does not work. Spring barrels, there are 3 of them but don't know which ones do what.
Can anyone help or direct me to someone who can?
I have taken it apart and tried to clean/ oil it, but still does not work. Spring barrels, there are 3 of them but don't know which ones do what.
Can anyone help or direct me to someone who can?
The larger spring barrel is for the chime train. The other two are nearly always identical. If the springs are original, they will be weak, and need replacing.
If the clock was dirty, chances are the holes are worn. Bushing and broaching out to fit the pivots is the only way to fix this. Worn holes mean that the wheels and pinions won't mesh properly. If the holes are worn, some of the pivots will be rough too.
Cleaning an old clock without repairing the wear generally makes it worse, as the muck tends to take up some of the slack.
Setting up a 3 train clock can be time consuming, even when one knows where all the parts go, and how they interact. I've been repairing clocks for over 20 years, but I still make a few notes and take photos as I dismantle anything unusual.
Getting everything in sync on a Westminster can take me a couple of hours. Doing a proper job on one of these takes about 10 hours, more if the wear is extreme, or a tinkerer has been there before me.
If the clock was dirty, chances are the holes are worn. Bushing and broaching out to fit the pivots is the only way to fix this. Worn holes mean that the wheels and pinions won't mesh properly. If the holes are worn, some of the pivots will be rough too.
Cleaning an old clock without repairing the wear generally makes it worse, as the muck tends to take up some of the slack.
Setting up a 3 train clock can be time consuming, even when one knows where all the parts go, and how they interact. I've been repairing clocks for over 20 years, but I still make a few notes and take photos as I dismantle anything unusual.
Getting everything in sync on a Westminster can take me a couple of hours. Doing a proper job on one of these takes about 10 hours, more if the wear is extreme, or a tinkerer has been there before me.
Thank you for your reply. I can see where the hours would be spent as it looks a complete minefield to me. To be honest, I only bought it for £10 so don't think it would be worth the money to be sent to a specialist. I know to get it done properly would be about £150, and know why it costs so much. If it would have been handed to my by some family member or something like that I certainly would spend the money on it.
Is it worth trying to put a new spring barrel on it for the hand movements? I'm not interested in the chime part of it.
Kind regards.
Is it worth trying to put a new spring barrel on it for the hand movements? I'm not interested in the chime part of it.
Kind regards.
If you just want it to tell the time, not strike or chime, that would be a fair bit cheaper and easier.
Put the time train back into the plates, without fitting the pallet arbour or winding the spring, and see how freely it spins by hand. Look at where each pivot fits through the plates. Rock the spring barrel gently back an forth, watching to see if the pivots move sideways in the holes. Any noticeable movement means the holes are worn. It's normally the holes on the rear plate that wear the most on German and English movement time trains.
If everything spins freely, and there isn't too much wear, pop the cover off the spring barrel (screwdriver in the slot as a lever - mark the position of the slot in relation to the barrel before removal) and check how much dried grease and gunk is in there. As two of the spring barrels are normally the same, check both, and pick the one that's cleanest and has the least wear in the barrel and cover holes. Wipe off any muck that you can get to.
Using a pin or cocktail stick, put a few drops of medium clock oil on the edges of the spring coils (it will wick between the coils), and refit the barrel cover aligning it to the mark you made before removal (a few light taps with a small hammer and piece of wood to seat the cover in it's groove). Put a drop of oil on each barrel hole.
I wouldn't recommend trying to remove and refit the spring without the proper spring winding tool. They are quite strong, and will hurt!
If it's all OK so far, put the time train back together, refit the click, click wheel and retainer with a drop of oil, and fit the pallet arbour and back cock.
Put a tiny drop of light clock oil on each pivot, and a smear on each pallet face. Wind the spring a couple of turns, and adjust the back cock up and down to get the pallet lock right (a bit of a tick or tock as you move the crutch side to side, but not too much free play). All being well, the movement will run (fast) at this point. Fit the suspension, leader, and pendulum bob. Put the clock in beat (even tick-tock-tick-tock) by moving the crutch on the pallet arbour (it's a tight-ish friction fit).
If you don't have any clock oil, sewing machine oil is OK, or 3-in-one at a pinch. Don't use WD40. Engine oil is too viscous.
Put the time train back into the plates, without fitting the pallet arbour or winding the spring, and see how freely it spins by hand. Look at where each pivot fits through the plates. Rock the spring barrel gently back an forth, watching to see if the pivots move sideways in the holes. Any noticeable movement means the holes are worn. It's normally the holes on the rear plate that wear the most on German and English movement time trains.
If everything spins freely, and there isn't too much wear, pop the cover off the spring barrel (screwdriver in the slot as a lever - mark the position of the slot in relation to the barrel before removal) and check how much dried grease and gunk is in there. As two of the spring barrels are normally the same, check both, and pick the one that's cleanest and has the least wear in the barrel and cover holes. Wipe off any muck that you can get to.
Using a pin or cocktail stick, put a few drops of medium clock oil on the edges of the spring coils (it will wick between the coils), and refit the barrel cover aligning it to the mark you made before removal (a few light taps with a small hammer and piece of wood to seat the cover in it's groove). Put a drop of oil on each barrel hole.
I wouldn't recommend trying to remove and refit the spring without the proper spring winding tool. They are quite strong, and will hurt!
If it's all OK so far, put the time train back together, refit the click, click wheel and retainer with a drop of oil, and fit the pallet arbour and back cock.
Put a tiny drop of light clock oil on each pivot, and a smear on each pallet face. Wind the spring a couple of turns, and adjust the back cock up and down to get the pallet lock right (a bit of a tick or tock as you move the crutch side to side, but not too much free play). All being well, the movement will run (fast) at this point. Fit the suspension, leader, and pendulum bob. Put the clock in beat (even tick-tock-tick-tock) by moving the crutch on the pallet arbour (it's a tight-ish friction fit).
If you don't have any clock oil, sewing machine oil is OK, or 3-in-one at a pinch. Don't use WD40. Engine oil is too viscous.
Found out the springs are stuck together and boing when wound. Not sure this is the problem. Think I need a new spring and box.
There are two smaller and one larger Spring box. Larger one is to the right of the three.
Picture upside down....sorry about that.
Edited by Stevo302 on Monday 24th July 20:57
OK, I thought you had completely dismantled it already.
You can disable the chime and strike by moving the lever that pokes through the dial.
Put a few drops of oil onto the spring, put it back in the movement and see what happens.
Back in the day, it was common practice by antique dealers to chuck the complete movement in a bucket of petrol or paraffin to clean off the muck, then oil the pivots. This would often get the clock working for long enough to sell it.
You can disable the chime and strike by moving the lever that pokes through the dial.
Put a few drops of oil onto the spring, put it back in the movement and see what happens.
Back in the day, it was common practice by antique dealers to chuck the complete movement in a bucket of petrol or paraffin to clean off the muck, then oil the pivots. This would often get the clock working for long enough to sell it.
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